Thai PM plays down British offer of help in beach murder probe

[Sviss Geez]

That statement is rather telling and almost threat-like:

"Anyone can come to Thailand, but don't forget that what is our issue, is our issue," he said of British offer of help.

Can you imagine the UK allowing Thai help in their country?

Or what about the US lol

If another country wanted to see the evidence they would be welcome in the US. Can't say about the UK. But the investigation would be transparent, expertly done, and there would be nothing to hide.

ALL of the evidence would also become public at the trial.

This is about something to hide and it's being hidden from Burma who is complaining and from the UK who is complaining. If the Thais really have proof they need to show the world because they are quickly losing all credibility. Period.

"ALL of the evidence would also become public at the trial."

But for some reason you expect Thailand to show all it's evidence before the trial? Very odd logic.

[Sviss Geez]

Actually, according to the news, 4 days after the murder, RTP was looking in bkk for the son of a local business owner where the victims spent the night with friends. Then they suddenly changed direction and started looking for scapegoats. Not sure if this change was independently taken by RTP or was ordered by a pm that is seeing tourism fall over 10% yoy for its martial law and unacceptable coup.

You'r OT, so Iam

the coup was more than acceptable - it was necessary

Subjective and totally unrelated to the topic.

Try to keep it on track.....

Every opinion on here is subjective! He was responding to another poster's comment, why didn't you admonish lucpez as he was the one who mention the coup first?

And who are you to tell anyone else to "keep it on track"?

[smokie36]

Actually, according to the news, 4 days after the murder, RTP was looking in bkk for the son of a local business owner where the victims spent the night with friends. Then they suddenly changed direction and started looking for scapegoats. Not sure if this change was independently taken by RTP or was ordered by a pm that is seeing tourism fall over 10% yoy for its martial law and unacceptable coup.

You'r OT, so Iam

the coup was more than acceptable - it was necessary

Subjective and totally unrelated to the topic.

Try to keep it on track.....

Every opinion on here is subjective! He was responding to another poster's comment, why didn't you admonish lucpez as he was the one who mention the coup first?

And who are you to tell anyone else to "keep it on track"?

Behave yourself.

[concernedintheUS]

I have been following this case since it appeared on MSN news the day of the murders. I felt so sad for those British kids.. This article / reaction from the PM is by far the most disturbing yet.I am in the US and have been considering a trip to Thailand over the next year or two. Watching this case play out has me convinced that as a foreign woman, I am not safe in Thailand (especially not because I am in decent shape and therefore unsafe in a bikini per the man in charge). The thai police do not even PRETEND to have integrity while Thailand is on the world wide stage for something other than "ping pong shows." I think that Thailand should be more receptive to foreign assistance because of the fact that its police force is so incredibly corrupt that it has to bribe the police officers NOT to steal from tourists. You can not trust the police not to rob a tourist to get his passport back, but we should have faith in their ability to honestly and properly handle a muder investigation of a tourist? This whole thing has me thinking about that movie with Clare Danes and Kate Beckinsale - Broken down Palace..wasn't that about Thailand.. Fictional, I'm sure but based loosely on the reality of Thai treatment of foreigners. This case has so many holes.. and the biggest thing for me is that if the DNA truly was a match and not swapped, why is that not the first and most important retort from the Thai government. They rarely mention it and when they do it is an after thought and not accompanied by any conviction. DNA does not lie, but clearly the people charged with protecting the public in Thailand do. I plan to email every major blog / news site in the US. I would like the US to strongly advise against Thai travel or at least warn of the deplorable prison conditions and ineptitude of the corrupt police force. Someone on here yesterday said that the US isn't interested in world news...we are interested and we care. RIP Hannah and David and thoughts of hope for Zaw and Win. Anyone who has a friend, child, neighbor traveling to Thailand please take note at how unsafe you are there should anything happen to you. I hope it increases in international coverage - The Thai people in charge of this case deserve to hang their heads very very low and tourists (and any human) deserve better.

[Jay Sata]

No matter how the court cases go this story will wash around for years.

For all the land of smiles guff Thailand has a dirty underbelly of crime and corruption.

[thesetat2013]

"I consider Koh Tao case to be reliable," Prayut told reporters, adding there were several pieces of evidence to charge the migrant workers.

"Anyone can come to Thailand, but don't forget that what is our issue, is our issue," he said of British offer of help.

How can this be true when it was British citizens who were killed and Burmese citizens who are accused to be the killers?

This should be a matter that these 2 countries have an interest in Thailand and should be granted the courtesy of being given the proof at the very least.

If the police had not made such a mess of this matter during their investigation and if they had not kept feeding the news with contradictory statements then the British Gov would probably have more faith in their arrests.

But for the little Burmy men to show their Embassy the marks left by the police when they beat them was enough to make their respective Gov want to be involved as well.

I think the World is going to be looking at why the Gen. is SO opposed to outsiders wanting to be involved in this case.

Perhaps the good Gen is merely stating his confidence in the RTP but perhaps he is worried as well the RTP DID do something bad to those Burmy men and the world will find out he is not in total control as much as he would like the world to believe.

[tbthailand]

"Anyone can come to Thailand, but don't forget that what is our issue, is our issue," he said of British offer of help.

it seems like it is Britain's issue, too, dear General

[isnakebite]

If this whole fiasco gets any worse, It wouldn't surprise me if next year BBC's Panorama run a special on corruption in Thailand.

[Beetlejuice]

Oh YES. In the US the accused have a right to an attorney at government expense if they can't afford one. The defense attorney would have a right to "discovery" meaning a right to see all of the evidence before the trial. The defense would have a RIGHT to independent expert witnesses who would have a RIGHT to samples of the evidence for independent testing.

The defense attorney would have the RIGHT to determine who his expert and independent investigators and witnesses would be, and if he had offers from places with more expertise than he could muster, he could use them.

He could drill down as far as needed and the government would have to cough up anything he wanted before trial.

It's called a right to discovery.

Thailand's system STINKS of secrecy and corruption.

But what if for example a French couple were murdered in the USA? And then 2 poor illegal immigrant Mexicans were arrested and charged with their murders, the police claiming they have all the evidence against them. And then the French Government gives out a hint that they think the United States police force has a dubious reputation or are incompetent and only charged the Mexicans to save face as a cover up for something and probably would not trust the evidence even if the USA police were completely open with it, and then asks if it can send in their own French detectives to investigate the case? How do you think the United States government would respond to that?

Edited October 14, 2014 by Beetlejuice

[JohnThailandJohn]

DNA is a match and their lawyers can certainly have it retested if they believe there is concern or conspiracy.

Of course the British are going to offer assistance it was UK Citizens and you have a group of conspiracy folks who came up with idiotic theories of police planting a phone they found outside the suspects place that they showed to press the day after the murders. And of course Thailand is not going to ask the UK to get involved in their legal process as this is not the UK and clearly they don't need any help with convicting these guys with the evidence they have.

I find it more concerning the reports of torturing of others who say they were burned with boiling water (anyone see any photos?) than I am with these two accused murderers and rapists who seem clear to be the guilty ones and who showed absolutely no signs of being tortured during their reenactment. Of course the doctors who checked them upon their arrest and after the confusion could be part of the conspiracy along with numerous police officials, the suspects themselves and the universities labs comparing samples and of course the son of a rich Thai who was in Bangkok at the time of the murders.

And absolutely no reliable info these two ever retracted their confessions. This all came from on paper in Myanmar who stated the lawyer who visited them stated this but the same lawyer previously reported they confessed to him during the meeting and their Embassy officials confirmed this. But even if they did, the DNA matched but I doubt they will retract given this evidence and their likely desire to try to avoid the death penalty.

These guys will almost surely be convicted as a result of their pleasing guilty.

While I would not be surprised the police were rough on these two given the horrible crime, there really was no reason to beat them to confess. Simply telling them the DNA matched or will match would be enough combined with the fact telling them the only chance of avoiding the death penalty would be for them to cooperate.

At this point it is in the Courts hands -- I have little doubt these two are responsible for the brutal and savage murder of these two UK citizens but no matter what proof or admission or outcome, some people will never change their mind that it was a rich Thai kid. Me, I will accept the courts verdict.

[MJP]

^^JohnThailandJohn, can you understand why many people are not confident of a safe conviction without independent review of the evidence and confirmatory independent DNA testing?

I don't find this unreasonable at least given the reporting of the case to date.

[MAJIC]

Priorities in solving this case.

1: keep tourist revenue coming in.

2: face.

3: make sure someone who doesn't matter did it.

4: deny any flaws in case.

5: justice and the truth or at least an acceptable form of both to ensure 1-4 happen.

6: well number 1 at the very least.

.

1. Face

2. Face

3. More Face

4. Even more Face

5. Get out of my face.

And finally Face up!

[MAJIC]

The General is shooting for a record breaking low high season. I guess saving face has more value than all else.

"I guess saving face has more value than all else"

And that is the root of the main problem, i.e no one wants to take responsibility for their own actions! it's much easier to blame someone else! I seem to remember this behaviour from Junior school days!

[hellyes2oo2]

jtj,"no need to beat them, simply tell them the dna matched or WILL MATCH" So how would the police know before hand that the dna will match. Sounds like fit up to me.

Edited October 15, 2014 by metisdead
Bold font removed again. Please stop using bold font when posting.

[bigjules007]

Does anyone really think that the General will allow an independent investigation?? Why would he make his police force look officially, incompetent? As we all know this is all about losing face, and the thing is they have already lost face and are trying to get this swept under the carpet as quick as possible, unfortunately for them, the damage has been done already and no matter what the outcome is in this case, the RTP have changed the way tourists look at Thailand, and by there complete underhanded investigation techniques have made potential tourists question weather or not to come and visit Thailand at all.

So this is a small positive to take out of all this.

[jaidam]

Seeing as he didn't even bother to have the original KT police removed from the island, there is little hope. The police that fubar'ed this investigation are still at the station 50 meters from the crime scene to make sure alternate evidence and theories are suppressed. Islanders that with-held information will be thanking their lucky stars, they and their sons,daughters and family will live to see the next day.

[SteveFong]

DNA is a match and their lawyers can certainly have it retested if they believe there is concern or conspiracy.

Of course the British are going to offer assistance it was UK Citizens and you have a group of conspiracy folks who came up with idiotic theories of police planting a phone they found outside the suspects place that they showed to press the day after the murders. And of course Thailand is not going to ask the UK to get involved in their legal process as this is not the UK and clearly they don't need any help with convicting these guys with the evidence they have.

I find it more concerning the reports of torturing of others who say they were burned with boiling water (anyone see any photos?) than I am with these two accused murderers and rapists who seem clear to be the guilty ones and who showed absolutely no signs of being tortured during their reenactment. Of course the doctors who checked them upon their arrest and after the confusion could be part of the conspiracy along with numerous police officials, the suspects themselves and the universities labs comparing samples and of course the son of a rich Thai who was in Bangkok at the time of the murders.

And absolutely no reliable info these two ever retracted their confessions. This all came from on paper in Myanmar who stated the lawyer who visited them stated this but the same lawyer previously reported they confessed to him during the meeting and their Embassy officials confirmed this. But even if they did, the DNA matched but I doubt they will retract given this evidence and their likely desire to try to avoid the death penalty.

These guys will almost surely be convicted as a result of their pleasing guilty.

While I would not be surprised the police were rough on these two given the horrible crime, there really was no reason to beat them to confess. Simply telling them the DNA matched or will match would be enough combined with the fact telling them the only chance of avoiding the death penalty would be for them to cooperate.

At this point it is in the Courts hands -- I have little doubt these two are responsible for the brutal and savage murder of these two UK citizens but no matter what proof or admission or outcome, some people will never change their mind that it was a rich Thai kid. Me, I will accept the courts verdict.

they "allegedly" confessed to an interpreter,

you have no idea what they said,

you do not know if the interpreter is lying

as soon as they felt safe and had someone to speak to in their own language,

you saw how fast that "confession" unraveled,

and if you think there is a DNA match, you are intellectually no different that a sewer cap

[HiSoLowSoNoSo]

So if they are so sure that they got the correct killers what could they lose by accepting help from UK ? No, this sends out a signal to the world that they are hiding something, something very bad, that will make them lose face big time.

[NeverSure]

But what if for example a French couple were murdered in the USA? And then 2 poor illegal immigrant Mexicans were arrested and charged with their murders, the police claiming they have all the evidence against them. And then the French Government gives out a hint that they think the United States police force has a dubious reputation or are incompetent and only charged the Mexicans to save face as a cover up for something and probably would not trust the evidence even if the USA police were completely open with it, and then asks if it can send in their own French detectives to investigate the case? How do you think the United States government would respond to that?

This is the stark difference between Thailand and a Western country. In Thailand it's obvious that the government has total control with no transparency.

In the US, the French would bypass the government and contact the defense attorney. The defense attorney has a right to what's called "discovery" which means the prosecutor has to cough up all evidence to be examined before the trial. The defense attorney would have a right to the DNA from all parties and would have it independently collected and tested. If the French could offer any assistance the defense would jump at it.

The Mexicans would have DNA tests done at least twice; at least once by the defense. Everything would be transparent.

In the end, all records would be public records that any of us could go get copies of. The differences are over the moon.

[SteveFong]

Does anyone really think that the General will allow an independent investigation?? Why would he make his police force look officially, incompetent? As we all know this is all about losing face, and the thing is they have already lost face and are trying to get this swept under the carpet as quick as possible, unfortunately for them, the damage has been done already and no matter what the outcome is in this case, the RTP have changed the way tourists look at Thailand, and by there complete underhanded investigation techniques have made potential tourists question weather or not to come and visit Thailand at all.

So this is a small positive to take out of all this.

Because,

if he was legitimate, which as a leader, seizing power via a coup means you are already illegitimate,

he could have the foreign investigators uncover the crime and corruption for him,

and then get rid of all of them, in one move,

but he is a military coup leader, and, everyone was fooled by his soft tone

[JacknDanny]

DNA is a match and their lawyers can certainly have it retested if they believe there is concern or conspiracy.

Of course the British are going to offer assistance it was UK Citizens and you have a group of conspiracy folks who came up with idiotic theories of police planting a phone they found outside the suspects place that they showed to press the day after the murders. And of course Thailand is not going to ask the UK to get involved in their legal process as this is not the UK and clearly they don't need any help with convicting these guys with the evidence they have.

I find it more concerning the reports of torturing of others who say they were burned with boiling water (anyone see any photos?) than I am with these two accused murderers and rapists who seem clear to be the guilty ones and who showed absolutely no signs of being tortured during their reenactment. Of course the doctors who checked them upon their arrest and after the confusion could be part of the conspiracy along with numerous police officials, the suspects themselves and the universities labs comparing samples and of course the son of a rich Thai who was in Bangkok at the time of the murders.

And absolutely no reliable info these two ever retracted their confessions. This all came from on paper in Myanmar who stated the lawyer who visited them stated this but the same lawyer previously reported they confessed to him during the meeting and their Embassy officials confirmed this. But even if they did, the DNA matched but I doubt they will retract given this evidence and their likely desire to try to avoid the death penalty.

These guys will almost surely be convicted as a result of their pleasing guilty.

While I would not be surprised the police were rough on these two given the horrible crime, there really was no reason to beat them to confess. Simply telling them the DNA matched or will match would be enough combined with the fact telling them the only chance of avoiding the death penalty would be for them to cooperate.

At this point it is in the Courts hands -- I have little doubt these two are responsible for the brutal and savage murder of these two UK citizens but no matter what proof or admission or outcome, some people will never change their mind that it was a rich Thai kid. Me, I will accept the courts verdict.

Total nonsense, which you insist on repeating, again and again, each post getting longer and longer!!

Anybody who has been following this case from the beginning, probably suspects you have an ulterior agenda.

Your first sentence, "DNA is a match"........................... Are you sure? How do you know?

The 2 suspects were amongst the first to be tested for DNA (photographed and videoed and posted on news sites). The Police then issued a statement that none of the DNA of the people tested, matched the DNA found on the victims.

So I would like to know how you can be so sure that your statement is correct?

I cant be bothered picking holes in the rest of your erroneous post. It will just appear argumentative. But I think anybody with even a single brain cell can see that this investigation is devoid of transparency, was corrupted from the start and is highly probable that the real culprits are still on the loose.

[Fred Flinstone]

As terrible as it will be for the families of the victims and the dubiously accused, the trial and execution of these men , and denial of justice to the UK Government , will ultimately be Thailand's undoing.

Even local gagged media are questioning whats on the line and how far is Thai obedience expected to go?

Meaning the current position might be getting intolerable to Thais too.

Most depend on the west in their daily lives who are associated with retail and Hotels, service industry , transport and travel and so on.

Few believe the figures being flung around of slight drops in numbers -

Staff are being shown the door , businesses closing , and its forecast to get far worse if the UK with support of major countries like European states like Germany and France, Italy, etc along with America - Australia -New Zealand label Thailand as ""Rogue".

And clearly ignoring repeated requests and offers and executing men who most perceive as not the culprits under a marshal law type agenda will back fire extremely badly.

A lot of people had booked their holidays months ago and many will for the financial penalties involved in cancellation still go.

But the following year will see the true extent of the wests concerns.

The murdered tourists without Justice, and the sheer breath taking arrogance in fixing things, will prove in time to be the straw that broke the camels back.

I feel sorry for the poor thais in a way - but in the long run after 32 military coups .the thais might learn whats acceptable to Thais is indeed their right-

It might not be to our likely though.

However, threats made to us to even be silent or "else'.. doesn't cut.

$$$$ So please get those bug farms going- you may well need them in future

Edited October 14, 2014 by Fred Flinstone

[SteveFong]

But what if for example a French couple were murdered in the USA? And then 2 poor illegal immigrant Mexicans were arrested and charged with their murders, the police claiming they have all the evidence against them. And then the French Government gives out a hint that they think the United States police force has a dubious reputation or are incompetent and only charged the Mexicans to save face as a cover up for something and probably would not trust the evidence even if the USA police were completely open with it, and then asks if it can send in their own French detectives to investigate the case? How do you think the United States government would respond to that?

This is the stark difference between Thailand and a Western country. In Thailand it's obvious that the government has total control with no transparency.

In the US, the French would bypass the government and contact the defense attorney. The defense attorney has a right to what's called "discovery" which means the prosecutor has to cough up all evidence to be examined before the trial. The defense attorney would have a right to the DNA from all parties and would have it independently collected and tested. If the French could offer any assistance the defense would jump at it.

The Mexicans would have DNA tests done at least twice; at least once by the defense. Everything would be transparent.

In the end, all records would be public records that any of us could go get copies of. The differences are over the moon.

let's not forget,

the two burmese boys were tortured, as were several others

[casindonet]

That statement is rather telling and almost threat-like:

"Anyone can come to Thailand, but don't forget that what is our issue, is our issue," he said of British offer of help.

Can you imagine the UK allowing Thai help in their country?

Or what about the US lol

But what help or expertise can Thailand offer to UK & US....lessons in making songtham or pad thai?

[Mosha]

Don't forget the DNA tests according to 1 famous Thai, were done by unqualified people.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Mosha

[EddieHaskel]

It must be shocking for people like the General to have their actions questioned.

In Thailand, if you have the status, nobody asks.

[EddieHaskel]

Since our Police force is corrupt to the bone and has a worldwide reputation as an organized criminals, I welcome the British to come review the case.

That's what he should say.

[kaobang]

Since our Police force is corrupt to the bone and has a worldwide reputation as an organized criminals, I welcome the British to come review the case.

That's what he should say.

indeed they let the boss of the island on the crime scene as the pics prove seriously does anybody think thats a real investigation?

but they insist and they are so persistent and stubborn in their farce

[Living in a cartoon]

I fear this could blow up into an international diplomatic incident

IMHO I rather doubt it

It certainly has a lot of potential. The UK has seen this Thai movie so many times over the years they have decided it is time to throw down the gauntlet. I suspect the UK are at least four chess moves ahead of the Thais, who are checkmated at will, and have already made that decision.

Once that happens, well, the Blue Diamond affair comes to mind.

[jdinasia]

"they have decided..."

Again quite unlikely