Russian Currency Tumbles As Investors Panic

[F430murci]

Putin is devious, but smart. Obama tries to do good things to help people, but he s stupid and thin skinned (i.e., he takes everything personally). Which type of person do you want leading in you and making difficult decisions in a time of crisis.

Edited November 19, 2014 by F430murci

[Publicus]

Bye bye Russia

After a long, hard winter the Russians will hopefully come to their senses and it's bye bye, Putin.

Scuttlebut has it PM Demitri Medvedev and Putin's past stand in as president has secretly hired a food taster

Unfortunately, you understand Russians and their mind set about as well as our idiot President. I seriously think Obama is acting childish now trying to press for more sanctions and cause more harm to innocent people simply because Putin has repeatedly showed him up as a man and a strong leader.

The reality is Russians have endured some very difficult times including Stalingrad and 50 years of isolation after WW2 and hyper-inflation. Russian pride is digging in and they are blaming the US, not Putin, for their current difficult economic times. Support for Putin is actually growing stronger than ever.

So back to our numb nutz President. Russians are suffering enough. He needs to get over his little personal issues and control problems and stop with his sissy boy sanctiins. I suppose it is a bitter pill to swallow being the President of the US and having so little control over anything because no one respects you.

Fact is, Putin and Russia won't blink and Obama's legacy will be that of a weak man that tried to exert control to get his way and severed economic ties with several countries that will have lasting economic impacts.

The sad part is that you, Publicus, seem to relish in the suffering of a lot of good am innocent people in Russia and make light of a sad situation.

U.S. politics and the focus of rantings on Prez Obama are a sideshow being put on by those who find themselves on the margins of both American and global opinion concerning Russia and Putin even as those same people make points at home domestically. I know you aren't saying the American people support Putin and instead of supporting Europe and U.S. and Nato policy, they support Putin and the Russians...I know you aren't saying that.

Putin is talking nuclear weapons while imposing the first change of borders by force in Europe since World War II and the leadin to it.

Europe and the West are united in this campaign to neuter the wild Russian bear. The ruble is a rubble and Russia is in the tank because the Nato countries are prepared to implement and increase sanctions through 2017 if necessary. That's a long time to have one's head underwater with all of Europe and North America sitting on it.

When Canada tells you you're in over your head as PM Stephen Harper indicated to Putin at the G-20 meeting then maybe a reasonable person might give it a listen and some thought. But not Putin, no, not Vladimir Putin. Indeed, while Harper offered a suggestion, Putin put hostile foreign warships and menacing submarines off the coast of Australia for the first time since World War II.

We recall Putin fled the G-20 meeting before the Nato and EU countries could confront him at the final session on Sunday. Putin's Brics are falling besides as they stood aside to watch Putin excluded, marginalized, put on the run.

Western leaders confront Putin at G20 with threat of more sanctions

"I guess I’ll shake your hand but I have only one thing to say to you: you need to get out of Ukraine," Prime Minister Stephen Harper of Canada told Putin as Putin approached him at the summit in Brisbane, Australia. , according to Harper's spokesman Jason MacDonald. Putin's response to the comment was not positive, MacDonald said in an email, without elaborating.

German Chancellor Angela Merkel said the European Union was considering further financial sanctions against Russian individuals because of the crisis in Ukraine. "The present situation is not satisfying," she told reporters. "At present the listing of further persons is on the agenda."

Putin's isolation was evident with his placing on the outer edge for the formal G20 leaders' photograph. While Obama and Chinese Premier Xi Jinping were met by Australia's governor general and attorney general when they arrived in Brisbane, Putin was greeted by the assistant defense minister.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/15/us-g20-summit-idUSKCN0IZ03C20141115

Edited by Publicus for spacing

Edited November 19, 2014 by Publicus

[Publicus]

Some people around here believe Barack Obama can learn from Vladimir Putin which makes them hardly any better than either Obama or Putin.

Others adore and admire Putin because he is convinced he can defeat and destroy the United States, when the fact is all the NATO allies are, well, united to shut down this little rat bestard and his constant mad talk of nuclear weapons.

I lived through the Cold War from its beginning when I was a boy to its end when my children married, and now Putin and his country are trying to come back around at us again, which is why Putin and his people are being smacked back to where maybe they won't be in a position to try yet a third time.

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MOSCOW (AP) — Russian President Vladimir Putin accused the United States Tuesday of trying to make Russia submissive; an effort he said won't succeed.

Speaking at a televised meeting with pro-Kremlin activists Tuesday, Putin said that Washington "wants to subdue us, wants to solve its problems at our expense."

"No one has succeeded in doing so in the history of Russia, and no one will," he added.

He said U.S. allies in Europe were trying to "protect others' national interests" for reasons that were unclear.

The sanctions over Moscow's annexation of Crimea and support for a pro-Russian insurgency in eastern Ukraine have exacerbated Russia's economic problems and contributed to a sharp devaluation of the Russian ruble.

He also voiced confidence that the current Russia-West tensions would abate, saying that "no one wants to exacerbate the situation in the world."

http://news.yahoo.com/putin-says-us-wants-subdue-russia-181333501.html

Edited November 19, 2014 by Publicus

[Publicus]

Prez Obama might offer Vlad a penny for his thoughts but then at the current exchange rate Putin might not have enough rubles on him to cover the penny.

Prez Obama in 2008 chose Sen Joe Biden to be his vice president because Biden had served something like 30 years on the Senate Foreign Relations committee to include having been chairman of the committee. Obama's foreign policy team includes many global diplomats, Russian experts, corporate ceo's and other interested parties that are experienced, savvy, knowledgeable They work in partnership with the EU.

Putin has no foreign policy experience and is a leftover from the discredited and failed KGB of the vanished Soviet Union. Putin is beholden to the CCP Boyz in Beijing to buy Russian natural gas and oil and is trying to build a Brics axis of countries that are backward, have no common currency and which are mired in a permanent recession. Russia hasn't any actual or real working partners, allies, supporters globally or regionally.

Nato under the leadership of Prez Obama and Chancellor Merkel are taking Putin and his obstinate puffed up people back down to earth so they can learn to live with present and future realities. In other words, Russia is an outsized has been that never was and it's time Russia learned that that is simply the natural order of things.

Investors Say ‘Nyet’ to Russian Bond Sales

The Russian Finance Ministry went to the markets Wednesday morning....the Finance Ministry had been forced to withdraw five consecutive debt offerings for lack of investor interest. The sixth time wasn’t exactly a charm – but with the markets in need of a benchmark rate, the Finance Ministry allowed the auction to proceed and wound up selling just under 10 percent of the total amount on offer, reflecting a lack of investor interest at rates the government found acceptable.

Russia’s troubles reflect investors’ lack of confidence in the ruble, which is has lost a third of its value this year against other currencies. The question isn’t whether Russia will pay its debts – the Kremlin prints rubles, after all. It’s whether the rubles it pays investors will be worth anything when they are delivered.

The ruble’s decline has already started to affect Russian consumers, who are paying higher prices for imported goods, particularly food, and are watching the value of their savings erode at an alarming rate. How long Russian President Vladimir Putin’s popularity can endure with the increasing economic privation is the big question.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/investors-nyet-russian-bond-sales-174900162.html

Edited November 20, 2014 by Publicus

[F430murci]

Well there you are. The point was Russians have a history of enduring difficult times, much worse than we in the US have ever had to endure.

Wife said again at dinner tonight, everyone in Russia is really suffering and scared. She does not talk about it much because it is upsetting. Her brother lost his job and her retired mother is worried because the Ruble was crashing. We in America have it so well, even the non working poor in US gave it well compared to what is happening to the common Russian right now. Are we any more hardworking and deserving, no. Just lucky to be in a better system.

Edited November 20, 2014 by F430murci

[F430murci]

Pub:

You make excuses for the lazy losers drawing welfare in the states that have more opportunities than anyone else in the world, but you make that kind of statement about Russians who have little or no chance to better themselves or rise above. Sometimes you just gotta turn off the political blinders and exercise some common sense.

[F430murci]

In the world chess match, which is not a game, Putin is up on Obama considerably. Lets say Obama down two knights and a rook. Putin down a rook. No queens yet, but knights are my favorites for creating havoc.

I guess you didn't read the topic of this thread or look at the markets this year.

Unless currency tumbling is not the topic of this thread?

Economics has zero to do with what I said. Russian will go isolationist and survive. Just responding to Pub's comment.

Obama backed down in Syria after drawing his line in the sand about chemical weapons because he was a afraid of Putin. Obama looked like a weakling jack arrrssee in dealing with the Snowden situation. Obama tries to impose sanctions to force Putun to stay out of Ukraine and Putin does not care and will do what he wants.

Obama has only crushed and hurt the innocent common Russian, not Putin or his Oligarchs. Congrats Obama. Must be a proud moment causing hardship upon innocent Russian commoners who did nothing. Congrats to Obama for causing untold long term impacts to US economy with his personal vendettas. Please tell me where Obama's moves have really accomplished something positive.

The topic of this thread is, "Russian Currency Tumbles As Investors Panic" What does anything you wrote have to do with the topic.

Lol. why do you care so much. I was just responding to Pub's comment. It's a stupid forum to talk about things. Why be so regimented and serious about something with so little significance?

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies about WW2 have been removed.

[Publicus]

Pub:

You make excuses for the lazy losers drawing welfare in the states that have more opportunities than anyone else in the world, but you make that kind of statement about Russians who have little or no chance to better themselves or rise above. Sometimes you just gotta turn off the political blinders and exercise some common sense.

My heart doesn't bleed for the perpetual losers that have populated Russia for 1000 years and who wear their suffering as a noble badge of honor of some kind because those who revel in their suffering and that boast of it as a matter of a mangled pride invite no sympathy. They are eternal wimps and whiners, period.

My absolute allegiance is to the country of my birth, the United States, and its constitution to which I have attested an oath on several different occasions in several different capacities to include as a voluntary member of the armed forces of the United States.

Your characterizations of loser Russians or of disadvantaged Americans are your own mischaracterizations. They are not my characterization of either or both. I support globalization and its socio-economic uplifting of a billion people on all continents to include Russians insofar as Russians have gained from it.

Russians who support Putin and his gang, however, and Americans who say Prez Obama has much to learn from a tyrant neo-tsarist dictator in Moscow who is brandishing his nuclear weapons are wrong, wrong, wrong -- backwards, upside down, inside out.

Perpetually suffering Russians who are bizarrely loud and proud of their suffering are of far less importance to me than are suffering Americans who aspire, no matter what the condition or circumstance of either may be. My loyalties are clear in these respects.

[thailiketoo]

Economics has zero to do with what I said. Russian will go isolationist and survive. Just responding to Pub's comment.

Obama backed down in Syria after drawing his line in the sand about chemical weapons because he was a afraid of Putin. Obama looked like a weakling jack arrrssee in dealing with the Snowden situation. Obama tries to impose sanctions to force Putun to stay out of Ukraine and Putin does not care and will do what he wants.

Obama has only crushed and hurt the innocent common Russian, not Putin or his Oligarchs. Congrats Obama. Must be a proud moment causing hardship upon innocent Russian commoners who did nothing. Congrats to Obama for causing untold long term impacts to US economy with his personal vendettas. Please tell me where Obama's moves have really accomplished something positive.

The topic of this thread is, "Russian Currency Tumbles As Investors Panic" What does anything you wrote have to do with the topic.

Lol. why do you care so much. I was just responding to Pub's comment. It's a stupid forum to talk about things. Why be so regimented and serious about something with so little significance?

Without rules such as staying on topic the forum becomes anarchy and impossible to post anything. You agree to the rules when you post. Stay on topic or post in another forum.

[Pakboong]

It is very difficult, if not impossible to consider objective macro-economics in the context of national loyalty. What is going on in Russia is something that could happen anywhere. Just so happens it is happening in Putin's Russia and has nothing to do with whether or not anyone likes or dislikes Putin the Slav.

I have been a benefactor of my country's 17% of the IMF vote. Many of us have and we need to fight to keep it but first we must understand why it matters.

[Publicus]

I think “ The Pariah “ is just letting the west know they can crush the price of oil and he'll still be standing.

Russia bought 1.2 million ounces of gold in September, spending $1.5B

I would just be interested to know why you believe that the history of gold over 6000 years has suddenly become inapplicable and that " its different this time ", which would mean that not only Russia but China ( and India) are also wrong?

I am certainly no expert but if the price oil is going down and the price of gold is going down when Russia bought a million onces of gold I'd say the market does not give a poot about Putin.

The market doesn't give a chit about China buying 1000 tons of gold since 2010 either. And the market does not care about India's recent gold purchases. There could be several reasons for this but there may be one reason in particular.

The US is believed to be buying gold in even larger amounts but no one will or can confirm this. So the fact the price of gold remains low makes sense only in the context of the markets knowing the Fed before too long will revalue gold to somewhere around $3000 an ounce. It would seem that the markets are not only aware of this, but are preparing for it. Dreams of dethroning the USD will be dashed.

The Swiss gold referendum coming at the end of the month is the most recent attempt by the radical right that sponsored it to jack up the price of gold, so the Franc is presently verging on receiving some of the same treatment from the currency markets as the ruble is getting. It's getting time to check the surveys of Swiss voter preference to see whether the yes vote might prevail. If it looks that way, it will be a green light to the currency markets to drive on over the Franc

There anyway isn't enough gold in the universe to cover the present global GDP of $100 Trillion dollars nevermind going forward. If God had that much gold he'd be a happy man. So any kind of gold standard is obsolete, passe', irrelevant and immaterial to the contemporary global economy and systems of finance. (Revaluation does not establish a gold standard.)

The best one can do is toward this end is to revalue gold but even at $10,000 an ounce the existing and known volume of gold would cover only 6% of global GDP. How high does one want to go in revaluing of the price of gold, $100,000 an ounce? Revaluing does have its crippling limitations so any revaluation would need to be as realistic, exact, precise and as targeted as possible and then some. It also would have to be unannounced.

“ It would seem that the markets are not only aware of this, but are preparing for it.”

Can you please provide at least one source to confirm this because I have not read anything that even hints at this?

The Fed represents the US on the G-10 Gold and Foreign Exchange Committee which is generally an unknown entity that has much to do with the price of gold.

The committee meets privately (the member Finance Ministers only), says it keeps no minutes and it never announces its proceedings, deliberations, agreements.. This is unlike the gold bugs, their mass media, or the governments of Russia or China which continually announce and boast of their gold holdings, purchases, reserves, grand designs, intents, purposes.

The G-10 operate in strict confidentiality so the public have to watch the gold markets to try to identify events and developments. The G-10 member states are France, Germany, Belgium, Italy, Japan, the Netherlands, Sweden, the UK, the United States and Canada, with Switzerland attached as observer.

The committee's secrecy however was broken in one particular instance by the goldbug organization, The Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee in the US which successfully filed suit in US District Court in Washington to require the Fed to provide documents. The goldbug anti trust committee got one of the four documents it sought that dovetailed to a Wikileaks US diplomatic cable from Beijing that confirmed positively that the US and EU cooperate to keep the price of gold low despite high demand that should be running the price up.

The belief is that the US buys gold cheap so it can and will increase its present gold supply of 231 million troy ounces to between 750 million to 1 billion oz. The goal is for the Fed to revalue the dollar to gold at $3000 oz.

At the new price enabled by the radical increase of US gold holdings, the U.S. gold reserves will be valued at $3 Trillion. Consequently, this would provide a 50% gold backing to the USG's public debt of $6 Trillion.

Confidence in Washington's ability to pay all creditors will be restored thus allowing the USG to further increase the national debt to resolve many upcoming funding demands or requirements from social programs to military ones. Foreign governments could then retain their USD and continue to buy them with a new confidence going forward.

Moscow, Beijing, the Brics et al will be screwed out of their insidious designs and their purchasing of gold during recent years. As it presently stands anyhow, the US itself owns or possesses 70% of the gold held by central banks.

http://www.gata.org/node/10387

http://www.gata.org/search/node/china+wikileaks+price+of+gold

Edited November 20, 2014 by Publicus

[Naam]

The belief is that the US buys gold cheap so it can and will increase its present gold supply of 231 million troy ounces to between 750 million to 1 billion oz. The goal is for the Fed to revalue the dollar to gold at $3000 oz.