Cultural Crossroads - Thai Partners Abroad

[smotherb]

I tend to agree with Ayjaydee and Craigt3365. I have brought two Southeast Asian wives to the States. One, the Vietnamese, was older and well educated. She was set in her ways; however, her ways amounted to business and success. My father got along with her much better than did my mother. She was an economist educated at the Sorbonne, she got good jobs and maintained her circle of Vietnamese friends, culture and foods; but she also developed a circle of American friends, and American foods and entertainment--she loved ice hockey. She had money and had traveled the world before I met her. She spoke English, French, and Vietnamese fluently, so she was able to communicate without issue, drive without having to learn, work without training; in essence to exist on her own, even without me. She became the VP of Finance for an American manufacturer of plastics. She organized a firm which develops and builds housing areas. In short, she achieved the American dream, mostly on her own. We divorced because she wanted white-picket fence suburbia and I wanted to travel the world--our divorce was consensual, we had no children, we simply split the assets; most of which came from her investments and earnings.

The other, a Filipina, was young and not set in her ways. She wanted to learn. So I took her everywhere, showed her everything, encouraged her to finish college, to learn to drive, to get a job. She immersed herself into American culture. She became very close to my mother and father and other relatives. She went almost without eating rice--except when we went to Asian restaurants. We went out to restaurants, clubs, sporting events, concerts, etc., frequently. In fact, we ate out ten or more times a week, every week; mostly American, European, and South American restaurants. She learned to cook American food. She made friends with Americans and other nationalities--easy because we were in the Washington, D.C. area. She had few Filipino friends, not necessarily by choice, but by circumstance--we went few places Filipinos gathered. She read voraciously, learned so much so fast. She worked as a travel agent and became a project manager for the public works department of our county government--she now has a pension, not I.

The short of it is, both women were outgoing and intelligent self-starters who wanted to succeed. One of them at least, didn't need me to do so. I simply gave them the opportunity to stay on in the States. Of course, we also had sufficient funds to live well. The Vietnamese had her own money, she bought our cars and made the down payment on our house and she earned a good salary which helped as I progressed as a software engineer. By the time I brought the Filipina to the States, I earned a good salary and had investments and property.

Of course, interaction with both the the Vietnamese and Filipino communities did occur. Most of the wives I saw, from both groups, were merely existing in the States. They had no connection with America, except for their husbands, and maybe the kids. They suffered homesickness, culture shock and the only circle of friends they had were from their home countries and they all seemed to suffer from the same maladies. Many could not wait for the trips back home. However, many of the husbands had poor paying jobs, which meant trips home were few and far between. Many of the husbands did not, or could not, encourage the wives to better themselves, and knew little more than the limited life they lived.

You have to motivate your spouse to build a better life in a new place. However, like all of us, our women are different; some will make it with ease, others will make it with setbacks, and some will never make it.

[David48]

Some truly excellent, thought provoking posts and advices above.

Each member, I thank you ...

Have run out of likes ... back soon.

[In Search of Space]

Got married in 1988 & wifie came to UK, she prefers it in UK, I prefer Thailand. After 26 years my poor tips are,

Plenty of Asian food shops about, no problem

I live in the countryside, so driving is essential

There seem to be tons of Thai women about, so she should make friends easily

If she wants to work, her English will improve tremendously, as long as it's not a Thai restaurant

No gambling

Try to educate on the cost of living & things, as they assume Thai prices

If necessary ensure she attends adult English classes

If you have young kids, then make sure she makes friends with other mums in school - best way to learn English & not only mix with Thais

Needless to say I failed in most of these

[Mudcrab]

We are an older couple...me 58..her 49. I have been to Thai many times and she has been to Oz 4 times in the last 3 years for 3

months each time. She has now moved here and we married in August. Now going for the permanent visa and citizenship although that is still 2 years away.

Things she likes (needs) :

Thai tucker - no problem at the Asian supermarkets.

Contact with her family and friends - we got a VOIP phone bundled in with the internet - 10 cents a call unlimited time to Thai.

She also watches ALL the Thai soaps on Youtube, as well as the Thai news live over the internet (ch 3 and 7).

We live on a rural block so not too many other Thais (none) around here, but she has made friends with a couple of ladies in a nearby (50K away) town who we see occasionally. Neither of the two seem to be the "typical" gold-diggers that people warned me about

i.e. the bad habits rubbing off on the missus. So far.

Consequently she has made friends with my friends and is fitting in really well.

She is growing pretty well all the Thai/Asian veggies she wants (we live in North Queensland) and the climate is pretty similar, although without the 40+heat - 35 is a big day here.

We will see how she handles the first cyclone!! We flew out for Songkran the day before the last one hit last April.

[1FinickyOne]

My wife barely spoke any English at the time and she was a good sport abt things, helpful where she could be, often bored when out with family and friends - we did spend some time with thai people in the area as they got together osmewhat regularly - we found a couple of tv shows she enjoyed and I searched out Thai radio on the internet which also kept her in touch with home. We went to oriental grocery stores… I guess last trip was 10 years ago and I know she enjoys living in Thailand - more so, but so do I. good luck.

[khunPer]

David, I have had my GF visiting my home country four times, three times each staying there three month, worked out great – she even sometimes talks about “missing Denmark” – but there is a major difference from being there a limited time knowing you are going back “home” to Thailand, and settling there for long time or forever...

We, my GF and I, have many friends who have relocated their Thai spouse, and all the ladies seems like going there for money (work and save) with the intention of coming back as soon as they can afford it – or their husband is old enough to retire – many buy land and even build a house at home from the money they earn abroad; that can be both for future senior-life, and as a security backup in case something goes wrong in the marriage (and don’t forget “face”).

One very important thing for girls/ladies living abroad – even only for some few months – is the Thai network (other Thai girls/ladies as friends) and the access to “real” Thai food, like a good Thai-shop; just like a Western guy may be in need of the pals and a beer in the pub, and sometimes a good steak or well-known food. In my case I had friends who told me about that before, so I was prepared and could introduce my GF to other Thais living abroad, and we had a good selection of genuine Thai-shops to choose from. Another thing is that where we Westerners often are grown up with “privacy” as a priority, Thais have grown up with a huge network and lots of gossip – don’t think the word “privacy” has much meaning to a Thai – met many ladies who feel too lonely...

Among our many Thai girl/lady friends settling abroad – not only in Denmark, but also England, Italy, Switzerland and France – I cannot name one who do not aim to come back to Thailand as soon as possible; however most are happy abroad, a few not, and take some “hard years to make the money”. Most, if not all, of our farang-Thai-couple friends have in mind to settle in Thailand, when they are old (or rich) enough. Some may stay abroad – for a period – because of child, preferring school or education there. A few married-to-farang ladies have returned on their own, giving up for reasons that of course can be a lot others than just living abroad.

We have also meet a number of sad Thai-girls abroad (seems like Thai ladies can spot another Thai lady on long distance, miles away, and become “sisters” in no time), telling that it was not the life they thought it would be – not at all what they dreamed about – but they may not speak about to their husband, not making him sad also; and eventually Luk keung-kids makes their situation even more difficult.

A few stories:

I have one friend married to a Thai, who made the agreement that she can work and the money she earns, she can keep – he provides home and food, she clean and cook – however when eating Thai-food (that can be quite expensive to buy abroad), she pays herself; and when going to Thailand for holiday she pays her own ticket from her salary. No common children, they both have enough grown ups from previous marriages. She is working hard, often overtime, to save money to buy (more) land at home, have already built a house and bought car from her savings. She work so much and so hard, that he now tours Thailand on his own on extended holidays (think we all know what that may include), whilst she is saving the ticket and rather save up for her own permanent move back, one day in the future.

Have another friend who got married to a Brit about same age and moved to England. The marriage agreement was that he should build her a house up Isaan village on a small plot of land she got from her mum; then they had a place to stay when visiting Thailand on vacation. He had expected 1 million baht, but it ended up with a total cost of 2 million baht, so he had to take out additional mortgage on his house back home to pay for it – the first million was also based on a mortgage. Anyway they got a nice house with a lot of Western comfort, but staying there for more than a few days made him crazy – no pals, no pubs, no farangs to mingle with – so they hardly use it. She have two teen Thai sons from previous marriage who should stay in the house, but that also ended up as a disaster with the house being used for parties and looking like a mess when mum and step dad came; so the house ended up abandoned except for a few days during their vacations. He quickly found a half-day job for his Thai wife in his favorite local pub, very successful with an always smiling Thai waitress, and she was so happy making four-and-a-half quit an hour – woow some 200 baht, a whole days pay; she already counted hours and money converted to Thai baht – however when she got her first paycheck something was wrong. She asked her husband why she got too little money and showed him her salary statement; »no, that’s all right, you see, here they deduct social security and tax…!« A while into the financial depression he lost his good job in the harbor as there now was not that many containers to be shipped, only some call-in part-time-job paid per hour. With the extra mortgage on the house she needed to help paying – in fact she now worked to pay for her marriage gift. No vacations to Thailand, as they could not afford it – however they did make one only during some years and came down to see us, the village was too boring for him. She talked to my GF and me about being unhappy – she had promised him a child and talked about taking pills secretly – was crying and wished to leave him and return to Thailand, would break up within a few month when back in England. Big surprise when “home”, she found out she was pregnant, and suddenly it was not that easy to split up. They are still together – moved house, no money for Thai holidays, she have a baby to take care of and cannot work for a while – and she often fell more sad than happy.

A successful story is about a friend who got married to a bit younger Thai girl. They got a baby and as he had a very good job in the financial sector, he could afford to buy a nice fairly big house (with pool). She quickly learned the Danish language and got a job in the company he worked, think as receptionist, and she took extra educational courses and moved up in position. Some changes due to recession and he lost his job, but could relocate to a well-paid position in Luxemburg – and the plan seems like Singapore next time, and then Thailand.

A serious talk about what life may be like and what might be very different, I believe is necessary for success, combined with preferably a couple of test trips of some three month duration or more each. Many Thais knows little about the big World outside – “Thailand number one” – and there is a huge difference from something you see in TV or hear about, and then actually being living there.

A very good help for preparation in my opinion may the book “Thailand Fever” by Chris Pirazzi and Vitida Vasant (Paiboon, thailandfever.com), as it’s written simultaneously in English and Thai, and explains very well about farang life-style and how he thinks, as well of course about Thai life-style. When I was reading the book I reached points where I said: yes that’s my limit – and I know Thais (I’ve been giving the book to a number and my own edition is number three, as two have already been borrowed out so much that they have expired their lifetime) saying exactly the same when reading about the farang...

In our case – my GF and me – it was no big deal, as I preferred Thailand from the beginning of our relationship, and she knew that; and I rather wished to relocate on a bit early retirement instead of taking a few more years with hard work to save up little more. Reminds me of the King’s wise words: »When is enough, enough…?«

Wish you good luck with your plans...

[khunPer]

Just to add a few positive items that made my GF’s limited stays abroad very successful, apart from having contact to a few other Thai girls/ladies and the food, if that may help in making decision and preparation.

My GF told me from the beginning, that she did not want to go with me to Denmark, if she was going to sit home alone all day, when I was working. No problem, as I was self-employed and “worked from home” – i.e. had my company in a separate building next to the home and we were a small number of people working there, so she was never alone. That also gave me an opportunity to offer her a work and a salary, she could keep as her own – she did manage to save up quite a bit as part payment for a car.

Access to communication to her family, at that time (2004-2006) it was telephone and a subscription for affordable overseas calls. Today Internet, Scype, and smart-phones with Facebook and Line may do wonders.

My GF quickly adapted with my friends and few relatives, and they instantly became her friends also, and we did spend much time mingling and dining out, also invited friends for BBQ evenings at our home (it was summertime). Also sightseeing to many attractions in “my country” – I was careful to choose something a bit different from Thailand, so not “same-same, but different” – also cinema-tours, theater and a number of other events, so we had something planned for every week.

Being Europe and having Schengen Visa we each time, in total my GF was there 4 times, took a vacation trip to another country worth visiting, like France, Italy, England (extra Visa), Austria and of course neighboring Sweden; quite easy in Europe with fairly short distance to a number of little different countries (and it don’t need to be expensive trips). That was from my side as much a kind of education in the odd farang-culture as the excitement of visiting other places – amazingly how she for example favored classical music and opera, and even European circus – and luckily she enjoy reading, so combined with Dan Brown’s thrillers Paris and Louver fitted with the story she read, and next year Rome and the Vatican.

Even we planned to live in Thailand, and of course she has shown me her country and we have visited other Southeast Asia countries together, that “culture shock” from “Farang World” was an almost unplayable investment in better understanding in a cross cultural relationship, together with meeting ordinary people there – and some of her friends married to farangs – and also understand how farangs live and actually “do work (hard) for having their money”...

I’m pretty sure, after “the learning period”, we would have managed staying together in Denmark or Europe also – at least for some time – and now living permanently in Thailand I will never have a second chance for preparing another GF in the same way (so better stick to the good “old” one I already have)...

The open question about children – in my case one child – and school and future possibilities, I think is pretty much a question of how lucky one be can be in finding a fair school in Thailand, as well as finding a good one abroad, and of course also being able to afford some kind of fees, being EP or IS, if staying in Thailand. There seems to be quite different opinions – and experiences – but I fell the opportunities here are fairly all right, and my child’s future may even be better here than in the country I originates from.

[krisb]

Some great posts here.

I have a feeling MFG will do fine mate. She's a smart cookie.

The worst case scenario is you end up living on a prawn farm, watching great sunsets everynight.

[truckerjoe]

In my experience of two marriages to Thai ladies, who both settled in England with me, I would have have to say the biggest problems she will face will be other Thai women,

There is often a lot of jealousy and back stabbing from other Thais, especially if you are seen to be doing well,

many Thais love to visit the Casinos as often as they can, and I have seen this destroy quite a few marriages,

So I would advise keeping your eyes on who your wife befriends, I have with my wives owned and operated a couple of Thai restaurants in the UK and have had many Thai female staff over the years,

I have seen many seemingly nice quiet girls have marriage and financial problems because of the company they kept.

My ex wife and my current wife are both still in the UK and love it, they holiday occasionally in Thailand but have told me they could never live there again.

[rgs2001uk]

In my experience of two marriages to Thai ladies, who both settled in England with me, I would have have to say the biggest problems she will face will be other Thai women,

There is often a lot of jealousy and back stabbing from other Thais, especially if you are seen to be doing well,

many Thais love to visit the Casinos as often as they can, and I have seen this destroy quite a few marriages,

So I would advise keeping your eyes on who your wife befriends, I have with my wives owned and operated a couple of Thai restaurants in the UK and have had many Thai female staff over the years,

I have seen many seemingly nice quiet girls have marriage and financial problems because of the company they kept.

My ex wife and my current wife are both still in the UK and love it, they holiday occasionally in Thailand but have told me they could never live there again.

Aint that the truth.

[thailiketoo]

It's not just Thai women abroad but Thai women with men from abroad. It only took me a couple of times

of telling a significant other that I was not as dumb as my friend Oliver, Fenton or Rupert and I cut all my

ties with Farang men. Which is not difficult here.

[i claudius]

My wife came to the UK and was there for 12 years ,then packed up and came home ,oh forgot to tell you so did me and our son mind you he cried his eyes out at leaving , but now 9 years later she misses the UK and i dont ,our son ? well he is in university

Your son is in Uni in the UK or Thailand?

Thailand

[wooloomooloo]

I don't think you can generalize on this.

My wife was fresh out of university when we married in LOS four and a half years ago and moved to the UK to be with me four years ago. We've no children and an age gap of seventeen and half years, not that that matters.

She settled into life here as expected. Her English was/is excellent and sure this helped immensely.

We have many Anglo-Thai couple friends, but no horror stories, and why should there be. My wife also has European, English and other nationalities as friends. No Queen Bees, whatever that means.

We visit LOS twice a year to see her folks and we're here now for our second and last visit of the year. She cooks and eats Western food and makes the best job she can of cooking Thai food with the available ingredients at hand. She also makes a decent version of Som Tam.

She's no requirement for Thai TV and listens to Thai, Korean and Western music through the internet. She likes UK TV, particularly the cooking shows, i.e. Jamie 'bleeding' Oliver, Gordon Ramsey and suchlike.

She phones her mum everyday for as long as she wants, though her full-time job takes priority.

I had some reservations before she arrived, but we're both level-headed (she more than I) and I was certain as I could be that she'd give life in the UK a fair crack of the whip.

My only advice would be to not try too hard and relax. It'll all pan out itself, good or bad.

[khunpa]

I think it is a very individual thing. Some will fit in and others will not.

My wife loves to travel and also visit my home country, but when we first met and was planning to live together her only condition was that she would never want to leave Thailand. And looking back on our time here and knowing her, I also am sure that she would feel miserable if she had to live in my home country.

However, It sounds to me like your wife could fit in and fell at home, but only time and trying will tell. A good thing is that she seems willing to try it.

[smokie36]

Funny David....I suspect you will have less trouble than most...but she isn't going to like winter much lol.

You will have more trouble hiding your secret beer fridge.. .I reckon she'll bust you inside a week.

[stat088]

David my situation is similar to yours.

We are also condidering relocating to Australia.

I want my boy and girl to study in an Austraian school for maybe 2-3 years.

I have had good jobs on the Thai borders for the last 16 years but the last 6 years have had to work away from home.

I am getting a bit tired of my current job and am seriously considering moving to Australia be we all have huge reservations.

I cannot earn the good salary i earn here in Thailand in Australia.

I am concerned mostly for my wife because of strong family ties.

I think my kids will adapt because they are healthy and bright.

I am not sure how easily i will reintegrate back into western life.

There are some good tips on this thread already and i hope more people can contribute.

[sipi]

And now for a few of my mistakes.

I stocked the pantry and freezer with Asian food before she arrived. As much as it looked similar to the food we eat in Thailand, it was all the wrong stuff. Better Mrs David do her own food shopping.

We set up satellite TV, including later bringing a dish from Thailand. There is no need unless you watch DMC live all day. Mrs Sipi has the big screen on all day, using the internet. We never use Sat TV now. So much available online. Our Wifi is 100gb per month which covers all her TV, Skype, Facebook etc.

This didn't happen to me, but I have heard about this first hand 3 times. Keep Mrs away from the poker machines. There is something about Thais and flashing lights and the chance to win money. 3 marriages stuffed.

Another mistake I made. I took Mrs sipi to the snow, the Gold Coast, the big smoke, the bush. Hey she enjoyed it but it wasn't a priority. She still prefers a picnic at the botanical gardens, lunch at the beach etc.

I'm sure Mrs David and the boys will fit in well and have a ball.

[benalibina]

It is difficult to give advise as i do not know anything about the 2 of you. This apart from the fact that she is a farmgirl with strong familyties and that you have lived and worked in different parts of the world.

It all depends your gf's mindset how it will work out. Does she go because she feels she has to (kids)or because she wants to (you) ? This can be known already now by you. Is she interested in Australia, does she ask questions on a regular basis about your country, has her english improved significantly since you met etc etc...

It also depends on your own mindset of what you expect from a relationship where you must take the leading role as you 4 gonna live in a country where you most of the ins and outs.

Social circle is important for her i guess but the main thing is that you must be the only one she can 100% rely on. So be consistent, honest and straightforward to her. This because there is a chance that she will be confronted with thai women of a shady character by lack of better hopefully, where you live. Queen bee.....as RGS mentioned before. They can pump her head full with various,

incorrect, thoughts and info related to things Aussie. Your knowledge, honesty and consistency must prove them wrong.....always.

Best of luck with whatever you decide.

[MAJIC]

Best advice? don't move to an area with a lot of Thais,unless you want to live your life through her friends,under such circumstances integration with your own countrymen is very slow or non existant!

Whereas the children soon forget Thai Culture and adapt very quickly!

Edited November 18, 2014 by MAJIC

[smokie36]

Thing is I guess David....you have a fantastic girl who will adapt with no trouble at all to life in Australia....I feel for the poor grandparents and the kids who will lose out on that day to day interaction.

In my opinion they should spend lots of time in Thailand...at least until they are approaching double figures.

Just my thoughts mate....your life is about to change yet again mate.....great stuff!....I hope you keep a sofa bed free for me and my lass when we are visiting.

[fey]

not sure of your financial means, but a move could diminish your spending power and the lifestyle she's used to here with you.

[moojar]

Best advice? don't move to an area with a lot of Thais,unless you want to live your life through her friends,under such circumstances integration with your own countrymen is very slow or non existant!

Yeah, I think that is good advice.

Many of the Thai wives you will meet are ex-bargirls, with heads full of bargirl thoughts - how best to extract maximum return on investment etc.. My wife has met plenty and doesn't let on that she is not of that ilk, some sort of defence against the Thai version of the 'tall poppy' syndrome. These "girls" like to gossip, share their ideas and knowledge, their goals. And they have a better knowledge of Australian divorce / property laws than most of us, I promise you. Some of the things my wife has repeated back to me ... I feel so sorry for those Farang husbands.

Two things worked in my favour on that front I believe:

- my wife has that Thai hierarchical attitude, and those "whores" (her word, usually almost spat out) are far down the hierarchy.

- we are not in an area (of Sydney) with many Thais. Her close friend that lives nearby is Laos, came here as a refugee as a small child - pretty much an Aussie with Laos heritage. We socialise with her and her extended family, who are a typically mixed Aussie family - partners of various races. I think this has demonstrated to my wife what the norm is. We do have Thai friends in Australia, but get to choose them.

The biggy is having a balanced partnership, equal say in decisions etc.. But I can tell you have that one sown up David.

Ha ha, one of the first things I did when we moved back here was get my wife her own car - a bit of a banger. She was so proud, so pleased. And then of course drove my nice new car everyday, let me take the banger.

[moojar]

Final thought ...

Buddhism is important to my wife, and tolerance of that is key - as I am sure you have figured out with your wife. On one trip back to Thailand I was the "three day monk" for my wife's Grandma's 'go to heaven' ceremony. This happened by chance - the whole thing was organised last minute as they do in Thailand, and no-one in the family was available to take the role. So I put my hand up, much to my wife's amazement - still remember the incredulous look on her face. And the pride. My integration into the family moved up a notch after that, and looking back I can see this was a critical event in our marriage. She got to bank the merit, I got to bank the kudos.

So, if you haven't already done something like this, something to think about before you leave...

[simple1]

David, most matters have been covered, but not racism / discrimination. My wife (good looking) has experienced racist comments in Oz, usually by older / middle aged Oz women in public places when travelling alone such on busses and trains. Not often, but every 3 / 6 months.

First few times wife was naturally shocked & very upset. I suggest it is a good idea to gently prepare wife in case she experiences such an event.

Edited November 19, 2014 by simple1

[thailiketoo]

David, most matters have been covered, but not racism / discrimination. My wife (good looking) has experienced racist comments in Oz, usually by older / middle aged Oz women in public places when travelling alone such on busses and trains. Not often, but every 3 / 6 months.

First few times wife was naturally shocked & very upset. I suggest it is a good idea to gently prepare wife in case she experiences such an event.

Tell her to read the Thai Visa News and General Forum for a while.

[sipi]

Hey David. Here is my wifes "Welcome to Australia". Her first time on a plane, and first time in another country.

We flew into Sydney Kingsford Smith International airport, 2006. We caught the train to the domestic terminal. On the the train we sat next to each other with few seats remaining. Down the aisle came a heavily tattooed gent, with arms as big as my chest. The only vacant seats were opposite Mrs Sipi and I, where he made himself comfortable..

My wife, having been in Australia for maybe 30 minutes looked at him, pointed to his tattoos, and said "Nice cartoons"

Oh shit, I nearly died on the spot.

His reply, with a smile..."Thank you Dear"

And it only got better from there..

Welcome "Down-under"!

[girluk77]

Me and my thai husband moved back to the UK, we ended up splitting up after a few years and a child. He's quite happy in the UK, I'm the one that's planning a move back to Thailand

Sent from my C5303 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[fey]

we ended up splitting up after a few years and a child.

why?

[girluk77]

we ended up splitting up after a few years and a child.

why?

Domestic violence

Sent from my C5303 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app