Director defends 'Hitler scene' in Thai govt film

[mojorison]

My point was that they could have chosen any bad guy from a shortlist of about a million bad guys... but instead they chose the bad guy who carries a mountain of controversy and raw disdain in every corner of the (educated) world. A modicom of intelligence and good judgement would have suggested they select a slightly less offensive character, and still achieve equal impact. So once again, it shows a complete lack of comprehension for them to do it in this scenario. All the cases you mention may be grounds for using his image... but not this one. It makes light of his crimes, and basically makes a mockery of Thailand to boot. These people should be charged for bringing Thailand into disrepute.

Indeed, why did they choose Hitler?

Perhaps because of the previous cases of tone deaf students/schools doing things like Nazi themed parades or painting murals of Hitler? That is the beheaviour that is criticized in this film, which is exactly what you are doing, except you are one step behind.

Oh right... they need to do it as an example of what not to do... brilliant. Are they going to show pornography and say this is not what we do? What about re-enacting domestic violence scenes just so the audience understands that it is this they are against. Your justification is laughable. They could have picked a million other examples... this one is just too hot... and they had no idea there would be blow back. They are naive... that is my point.

Have any Thai schools/students been in the news for staging pornography or domestic violence themed parades? No? then it's irrelevant.

Hitler/Nazism themes have been used by oblivious school children in Thailand (among other people), that is what the film denounces in that brief scene.

I am impressed that you share the same ignorance as the director... maybe they are looking for extras?

[AleG]

Have any Thai schools/students been in the news for staging pornography or domestic violence themed parades? No? then it's irrelevant.

Hitler/Nazism themes have been used by oblivious school children in Thailand (among other people), that is what the film denounces in that brief scene.

I am impressed that you share the same ignorance as the director... maybe they are looking for extras?

So, you don't agree with the director denouncing the use of Hitler and Nazi imagery by tone deaf students?

Instead of calling me ignorant, why don't you take the time to understand what you are arguing against?

[casualbiker]

zaza9 i agree with you abou Londoners are thr most tollerent i showed my mum the photo and she did laugh.

i just wish everyone would show respect. wether Thai or farrang

Thank you for being honest.

My Dad and large family had houses in a row near to the gas tanks next to The Oval.

Grandads job was to shut down the gas supply during bombing raids and all the family told hair raising stories of near misses and losses , including 4 of 5 homes. The irony was that they related all this privation with a laugh!

Their reasoning was that Hitler could never dampen their spirits , and an image of him was a something to poke fun at ... or laugh at just like your Mum.

Getting upset and intimidated about his image was what Hitler wanted , staring his image in the eye and smirking was the Englishmans reply!

Whats changed?

Why are we so precious about a picture?

My Grand parents would say we are missing the point!

The best way to 'respect' those who I personally knew who had suffered is to do it as they would , look at a picture and see it as a picture .

Laugh at the ogre and know he was defeated by ordinary people.

Yes I can see where you are coming from. All very well at home in the UK,as we are all educated in that way, But my view is that in a country that (as someone said) lives in a insuler bubble not a good Idea. Also please remember the expats,that come from not only Germany but other nations that forbid by law

even the showing of such a symbol. This in my eyes is gross disrespect to other nations.

History teaches us what has gone before so that we don't do it again (hopefully)

If this video makes even one Thai think about history and the evil that has happened previously then it's good.

We in the west use Asian images in advertising a lot. Take the Buddha for example. Thais and Buddhists dislike that BUT the difference is THIS use of the Hitler image seems to be part of the story, a reason to be present. The idea that having it in the video makes the video fascist is laughable.

This has nothing what so ever,to do with artifacts to do with religion. Budder is used as a advert for Thailand in the western world,and the symbol of the cross

used in asia,by pop groups somtimes. We are talking about something very differant, The people and the policys that this symbol represents

Killed over 11 million Jews plus plus

We do not want this symbol to be used. This is a disgrace and an insult to all the nations that had to fight for freedom This is not a subject that shoud ever be used for such a film. Just to finish with,I know a lot about the concentration camps and the things that took place there.As it was part of my job in the late 60s

Just one thing to get your blood up. In one camp they used razor blades set in wood on the floor to stop little children from escaping from certain buildings

They had no shoes.

It wasn't just Jews.. Hitler wanted to annihilate all Jews but the Nazis actually killed more gentiles than Jews.

http://www.ukemonde.com/holocaust/victims.html

Many despots from around the world have done terrible things AND it SHOULD be remembered so it doesn't happen again. The image within the video was a poor choice but it seems that it was used as a warning NOT as a celebration of Hitler and fascism. I think the main problem was misunderstanding about it's use!

I will say again painting Hitler doesn't make you a fascist.

[kblaze]

Why are Brits so insensitive about what the rest of the world thinks. They let their royalty dress up like a nazi. Have they learned nothing. I don't understand the Brits. Seems tame compared tot the Thais (nice isn't it generalizing putting a whole nation down for the faults of a few)

The Brit's have a very close connection with the Germans, and the pommy king that abdicated was very close to siding with the pig Hitler.

the problem is that most Thais just don't know the truth as they are not educated in the history of the second WW 11, most don't even know that they were at war with America.

Seems to me your not educated either the US wasn't only party involved in the war, and they were late as well, your being rather hypocritical suggesting people are not educated

I'm only 7 pages into a thread on Thailand + Nazis and already read 3 Soutpeel off-topic digs at the US....typical I suppose.

[CantSpell]

They just don't get it do they ?

So many Thais know nothing about the Second World War as it related to their own country so what happened else where is a likely combination of don't know and don't care.

Can understand, WW2 was like 50 years ago....

Tried asking some people (not in BKK) about Vietnam War: they had no clue what I was talking about either...

"You know, when USA attacked Vietnam in the 60-70's"

They don't know either.....

Not like USA R&R center was in Thailand

[ThaiUser]

First of Thai people must understand that Hitler was a animal had millions killed, Believed the the white race was superior of all races. If he had won the war the world would have been very different and not in a good way.

Good job Hitler lost?

True, but a few TV members would disagree.The ones coming out with lame excuses for fascism (again) on this thread.

First of all Hitler didn’t believe in the white race but the Arian race and secondly Hitler believed that there was a struggle ongoing for centuries between the Arian race and race the Jewish people belonged too (which funny enough is the same race the Palestinian people belong too) and that he was going to decide which race would gain the upper hand. If you read his book carefully you will find that he regarded the Jews as equal opponents and that only one of the races should survive (shows how crazy he was). As far as he cared for the white people, he showed when he moved into Poland and the former Soviet Union (Belarus, Ukraine etc) and how he regarded the white population of Slavic origin.

The worrying aspect of it all is that his ideas seem to creep up again but this time not only in his Arian race but on a world scale and everybody declaring that they are different and better as other roots of the Homo sapiens.

[thailiketoo]

They just don't get it do they ?

So many Thais know nothing about the Second World War as it related to their own country so what happened else where is a likely combination of don't know and don't care.

Can understand, WW2 was like 50 years ago....

Tried asking some people (not in BKK) about Vietnam War: they had no clue what I was talking about either...

"You know, when USA attacked Vietnam in the 60-70's"

They don't know either.....

Not like USA R&R center was in Thailand

They are not the only ones who don't know. WW2 70 years ago. Vietnam 50 years ago. Thailand and the US and the Vietnam war - Google Thais to 'request' U.S. assistance under the SEATO Treaty.

[Fab5BKK]

We should, may be, keep in mind that Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933 because people voted for his ideas, his party. His ideas were fully disclosed in his book (my kampf) published in 1925...

[lovelomsak]

They just don't get it do they ?

So many Thais know nothing about the Second World War as it related to their own country so what happened else where is a likely combination of don't know and don't care.

Can understand, WW2 was like 50 years ago....

Tried asking some people (not in BKK) about Vietnam War: they had no clue what I was talking about either...

"You know, when USA attacked Vietnam in the 60-70's"

They don't know either.....

Not like USA R&R center was in Thailand

It really doesnot matter how long ago it was. What does matter is you have freedoms now that if the war had gone the other way you wouldnot have. LIfe would have been a lot different if Hitler hadnot been defeated. Those of us with half a brain will never stop remembering,the sacrifices many people gave during that war,for the freedoms we have today. All people should respect that fact. Ignorance only opens the door for it to happen again. As you stated no one you ask people here and none knew anything about the war.And here is where the video was made,do you see the logic there.Makes many others think perhaps it could happen again if uneducated brainwashed people are lead by same minded leaders. Lets just hope we never have to repeat history.If we do you may have to be one defending freedom next with only your life to give.

[thailiketoo]

We should, may be, keep in mind that Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933 because people voted for his ideas, his party. His ideas were fully disclosed in his book (my kampf) published in 1925...

Why it has nothing to do with this thread? This thread is about a Thai director who underestimated the impact of a 3 second negative image clip of Hitler and as a result made Thailand the laughing stock of the world again.

The director thought that everyone in the world speaks Thai and would understand his subtle message about the spoiled child. Wrong big time. Most of the international media only saw a 3 second clip out of 660 seconds of video and based an opinion on that 3 second clip.

If anything has been learned it's that 3 second sound bites are easier to sell than 660 second videos.

[lovelomsak]

We should, may be, keep in mind that Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933 because people voted for his ideas, his party. His ideas were fully disclosed in his book (my kampf) published in 1925...

Why it has nothing to do with this thread? This thread is about a Thai director who underestimated the impact of a 3 second negative image clip of Hitler and as a result made Thailand the laughing stock of the world again.

The director thought that everyone in the world speaks Thai and would understand his subtle message about the spoiled child. Wrong big time. Most of the international media only saw a 3 second clip out of 660 seconds of video and based an opinion on that 3 second clip.

If anything has been learned it's that 3 second sound bites are easier to sell than 660 second videos.

Maybe it just shows that the rest of the world can be sensitive about somethings as much as Thais are sensitive about Thainess.

[chotthee]

To be honest, Thai people like the German/Austrian more than the Jews of the West. Jews of the East (aka Chinese is OK)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/indonesia-crisis-chinese-suffer-for-their-success-as-mobs-target-the-jews-of-the-east-1159353.html

[ThaiUser]

We should, may be, keep in mind that Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933 because people voted for his ideas, his party. His ideas were fully disclosed in his book (my kampf) published in 1925...

Why it has nothing to do with this thread? This thread is about a Thai director who underestimated the impact of a 3 second negative image clip of Hitler and as a result made Thailand the laughing stock of the world again.

The director thought that everyone in the world speaks Thai and would understand his subtle message about the spoiled child. Wrong big time. Most of the international media only saw a 3 second clip out of 660 seconds of video and based an opinion on that 3 second clip.

If anything has been learned it's that 3 second sound bites are easier to sell than 660 second videos.

Maybe if the Thai director would have known about the past we wouldn’t have the discussion on this forum right now! As a Thai I think it has a lot to do with the article.

[thailiketoo]

We should, may be, keep in mind that Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933 because people voted for his ideas, his party. His ideas were fully disclosed in his book (my kampf) published in 1925...

Why it has nothing to do with this thread? This thread is about a Thai director who underestimated the impact of a 3 second negative image clip of Hitler and as a result made Thailand the laughing stock of the world again.

The director thought that everyone in the world speaks Thai and would understand his subtle message about the spoiled child. Wrong big time. Most of the international media only saw a 3 second clip out of 660 seconds of video and based an opinion on that 3 second clip.

If anything has been learned it's that 3 second sound bites are easier to sell than 660 second videos.

Maybe if the Thai director would have known about the past we wouldn’t have the discussion on this forum right now! As a Thai I think it has a lot to do with the article.

You wrote, "Maybe if the Thai director would have known about the past we wouldn’t have the discussion" Do you mean the past as regards the Western reaction to the Nazi chic fashion statement?

I think that's more in the present as the reaction ot the Western folk has been the same every time a story is published dealing with clothes worn in cosplay or any form of Nazi chic. I'd say the director was uniformed about current events. From wax museums to sports days when a Thai dresses up like a Nazi the press has a field day.

[anon022]

Exactly right.

Despite what some may feel, this film is not making any meaningful attempt at condemnation of the horrors of nazi rule, but rather trivializes what the swastika represents to get across a point on youth culture and the director was seriously misguided in his attempt to do so.

Of course not. You also missed the point of Nazi chic. It is an Asian fashion statement that the film was opposed to. Try google. You may not like the fashion statement but it is what it is and not what you want it to be. You are talking about the Holocaust and some Asian people are talking about T-shirts and fried chicken.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_chic

Because you don't "get it" does not mean it does not exist.

I wish it were that innocent, but I know from experience, that Hitler and Nazi regime adoration is alive and kicking among Thai youth, and they know p e r f e c t l y well what they are talking about. They watch his speeches on Youtube, and read about it online. They know about the massacres, but they seem to have adopted the hatred towards the minorities that were targeted. They showed me pictures of piled up bodies in concentration camps, and they seemed to get a kick out of it, I do not kid you. I have tried to talk sense in some of them, but these kids whom studied English with me, remained adamant in their convictions.

These kids aged 16 to 17 had very radical ideas about what the future of Thailand should look like, and needless to say, had little respect for those who cannot be named. A year after I had left the school, their home room teacher told me one of them had drowned after he had been pushed in the nearby drinking water reservoir - bor nam prapah - during an argument. He couldn't swim, but none of the others apparently bothered to save him.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Impossible

[ThaiUser]

We should, may be, keep in mind that Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933 because people voted for his ideas, his party. His ideas were fully disclosed in his book (my kampf) published in 1925...

Why it has nothing to do with this thread? This thread is about a Thai director who underestimated the impact of a 3 second negative image clip of Hitler and as a result made Thailand the laughing stock of the world again.

The director thought that everyone in the world speaks Thai and would understand his subtle message about the spoiled child. Wrong big time. Most of the international media only saw a 3 second clip out of 660 seconds of video and based an opinion on that 3 second clip.

If anything has been learned it's that 3 second sound bites are easier to sell than 660 second videos.

Maybe if the Thai director would have known about the past we wouldn’t have the discussion on this forum right now! As a Thai I think it has a lot to do with the article.

You wrote, "Maybe if the Thai director would have known about the past we wouldn’t have the discussion" Do you mean the past as regards the Western reaction to the Nazi chic fashion statement?

I think that's more in the present as the reaction ot the Western folk has been the same every time a story is published dealing with clothes worn in cosplay or any form of Nazi chic. I'd say the director was uniformed about current events. From wax museums to sports days when a Thai dresses up like a Nazi the press has a field day.

I mean the past in regards what Hitler stood for and that it is not acceptable to use him or images and signets in a film that are about Thai values if not explicitly explaining what they actually stand for. I don’t mind to show Hitler or swastikas in films as long as it made clear that they represent the lowest level of humanity and into what abyss we can sink if we not remember what they stood for.

[thailiketoo]

Of course not. You also missed the point of Nazi chic. It is an Asian fashion statement that the film was opposed to. Try google. You may not like the fashion statement but it is what it is and not what you want it to be. You are talking about the Holocaust and some Asian people are talking about T-shirts and fried chicken.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_chic

Because you don't "get it" does not mean it does not exist.

I wish it were that innocent, but I know from experience, that Hitler and Nazi regime adoration is alive and kicking among Thai youth, and they know p e r f e c t l y well what they are talking about. They watch his speeches on Youtube, and read about it online. They know about the massacres, but they seem to have adopted the hatred towards the minorities that were targeted. They showed me pictures of piled up bodies in concentration camps, and they seemed to get a kick out of it, I do not kid you. I have tried to talk sense in some of them, but these kids whom studied English with me, remained adamant in their convictions. A year after I had left the school, their home room teacher told me one of them had drowned after he had been pushed in the nearby drinking water reservoir - bor nam prapah - during an argument. He couldn't swim, but none of the others apparently bothered to save him.

I agree with you and that is what the director was aiming at when he included the 3 second clip it was a morality play about not adopting those ideals. I think you are missing the central idea that the film clip was showing Thai children what not to do. Not what to do. And there in lies the whole mess of the situation. The media and most of the posters in this thread think the 3 sec film clip was telling kids to paint Hitler but it was telling kids not to paint Hitler.

[thailiketoo]

It was far less obvious what Mao and Stalin were doing at the time. They were killing there own behind closed doors. I agree they are just as bad but not really known to people (Taught in school) unless they go out of their way and read a book

Good point, I don't agree but that's not the topic. To steer back to the topic do you think the Thai director was trying to insult Jewish people by his 3 second clip? I'll assume no. If the director was trying to insult people based on misdeeds of a leader Mao and Stalin would be the obvious choices because their death count make Hitler look like a novice.

If the director was not trying to insult people this only leaves that he was trying to make a statement of morality and the cluelessness of spoiled Thai children drawing Hitler.

I still don't see what is wrong telling Thai children not do draw Hitler?

[anon022]

Of course not. You also missed the point of Nazi chic. It is an Asian fashion statement that the film was opposed to. Try google. You may not like the fashion statement but it is what it is and not what you want it to be. You are talking about the Holocaust and some Asian people are talking about T-shirts and fried chicken.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_chic

Because you don't "get it" does not mean it does not exist.

I wish it were that innocent, but I know from experience, that Hitler and Nazi regime adoration is alive and kicking among Thai youth, and they know p e r f e c t l y well what they are talking about. They watch his speeches on Youtube, and read about it online. They know about the massacres, but they seem to have adopted the hatred towards the minorities that were targeted. They showed me pictures of piled up bodies in concentration camps, and they seemed to get a kick out of it, I do not kid you. I have tried to talk sense in some of them, but these kids whom studied English with me, remained adamant in their convictions. A year after I had left the school, their home room teacher told me one of them had drowned after he had been pushed in the nearby drinking water reservoir - bor nam prapah - during an argument. He couldn't swim, but none of the others apparently bothered to save him.

I agree with you and that is what the director was aiming at when he included the 3 second clip it was a morality play about not adopting those ideals. I think you are missing the central idea that the film clip was showing Thai children what not to do. Not what to do. And there in lies the whole mess of the situation. The media and most of the posters in this thread think the 3 sec film clip was telling kids to paint Hitler but it was telling kids not to paint Hitler.

As pointed out earlier, the subtle hint might not have come across with Thai youth as such, iow, the overall majority might miss the point just as most of the rest of the world. Perhaps even more so in a movie theatre.

Isn't there a possibility that Hitler was chosen because the message really is to obey your superiors and follow orders just like the sheeple of Nazi Germany who unconditionally adapted the fuehrer's ideology? Aren't these 12 directives and its concept of forced implementation eerily similar to Hitler's?

[thailiketoo]

As pointed out earlier, the subtle hint might not have come across with Thai youth as such, iow, the overall majority might miss the point just as most of the rest of the world. Perhaps even more so in a movie theatre.

Isn't there a possibility that Hitler was chosen because the message really is to obey your superiors and follow orders just like the sheeple of Nazi Germany who unconditionally adapted the fuehrer's ideology? Aren't these 12 directives and its concept of forced implementation eerily similar to Hitler's?

Do you mean, the Thai director was bright enough to use a 3 second clip to control children with an effective subliminal advertising message? You gotta be kidding me.

[mataleo]

The Thais collective IQ gets lower by the minute.

Judging by some posts made by one poster late last night I'd say it's a worldwide phenomenon

You just got 0 knowledge thats where we different. Too much bbc mate

[Bluespunk]

The Thais collective IQ gets lower by the minute.

Judging by some posts made by one poster late last night I'd say it's a worldwide phenomenon

You just got 0 knowledge thats where we different. Too much bbc mate

No, too little thinking on your part.

Too much conspiracy theory.

Too much hate.

P.S. I am not, never have been and never will be your mate.

[Fab5BKK]

"Nazi chic" reflects a certain kind of ideology anyway...

BTW I invite you to read about the "Lebensraum" as it was developed by Hitler.

Lots of commonalities with the current situation.

We should, may be, keep in mind that Hitler became Chancellor of Germany in 1933 because people voted for his ideas, his party. His ideas were fully disclosed in his book (my kampf) published in 1925...

Why it has nothing to do with this thread? This thread is about a Thai director who underestimated the impact of a 3 second negative image clip of Hitler and as a result made Thailand the laughing stock of the world again.

The director thought that everyone in the world speaks Thai and would understand his subtle message about the spoiled child. Wrong big time. Most of the international media only saw a 3 second clip out of 660 seconds of video and based an opinion on that 3 second clip.

If anything has been learned it's that 3 second sound bites are easier to sell than 660 second videos.

Maybe if the Thai director would have known about the past we wouldn’t have the discussion on this forum right now! As a Thai I think it has a lot to do with the article.

You wrote, "Maybe if the Thai director would have known about the past we wouldn’t have the discussion" Do you mean the past as regards the Western reaction to the Nazi chic fashion statement?

I think that's more in the present as the reaction ot the Western folk has been the same every time a story is published dealing with clothes worn in cosplay or any form of Nazi chic. I'd say the director was uniformed about current events. From wax museums to sports days when a Thai dresses up like a Nazi the press has a field day.

[thailiketoo]

"Nazi chic" reflects a certain kind of ideology anyway...

BTW I invite you to read about the "Lebensraum" as it was developed by Hitler.

Lots of commonalities with the current situation.

Nazi Chic is a clothes fashion style it contains no ideology at all. It is a fashion statement. Not an ideological statement. Its use began in the mid-seventies with the emergence of the punk movement in London: the Sex Pistols' first television appearance occurred with a person of their entourage wearing a swastika. Nazi chic was later used in the fashion industry in various occasions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_chic

[Fab5BKK]

"Nazi chic" reflects a certain kind of ideology anyway...

BTW I invite you to read about the "Lebensraum" as it was developed by Hitler.

Lots of commonalities with the current situation.

Nazi Chic is a clothes fashion style it contains no ideology at all. It is a fashion statement. Not an ideological statement. Its use began in the mid-seventies with the emergence of the punk movement in London: the Sex Pistols' first television appearance occurred with a person of their entourage wearing a swastika. Nazi chic was later used in the fashion industry in various occasions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_chic

If you say so....

Anyway the way you dress does reflect the way you are...

And, obviously, you have no clue re. the Lebensraum. I feel quite sad for you

[craigt3365]

Please stay on topic. An extremely inappropriate post has been removed from view.

[mitsubishi]

This is why Thailand urgently needs a decent educational system

Don't you mean a culturally marxist system?

[chotthee]

This is why Thailand urgently needs a decent educational system

Don't you mean a culturally marxist system?

The 12 Thainese values is all Thai needed for their education.

Farang just don't understand Thai people, because Thai people are more advance and sophisticated.

[mitsubishi]

This is why Thailand urgently needs a decent educational system

Don't you mean a culturally marxist system?

The 12 Thainese values is all Thai needed for their education.

Farang just don't understand Thai people, because Thai people are more advance and sophisticated.

Really? How many inventions have the Thais made in the past 500 years then? A lot less than the farang that's for damned sure.

[thailiketoo]

"Nazi chic" reflects a certain kind of ideology anyway...

BTW I invite you to read about the "Lebensraum" as it was developed by Hitler.

Lots of commonalities with the current situation.

Nazi Chic is a clothes fashion style it contains no ideology at all. It is a fashion statement. Not an ideological statement. Its use began in the mid-seventies with the emergence of the punk movement in London: the Sex Pistols' first television appearance occurred with a person of their entourage wearing a swastika. Nazi chic was later used in the fashion industry in various occasions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_chic

If you say so....

Anyway the way you dress does reflect the way you are...

And, obviously, you have no clue re. the Lebensraum. I feel quite sad for you

Below is an example of two mindless Korean teenagers who don't have a clue what German living space is and it has nothing to do with this topic. It is an Asian fashion and is for sale at any mall or market in Asia.

Cosplay is an adolescent dress and game playing culture from Japan and that has far more to do with this thread than anything that ever happened in Germany in the 1930's. Google is your friend try, "Nazi Cosplay."