Why is Thailand such a success compared to the Philippines?

[slipperylobster]

... Plus many more Filipinos can speak and understand proper English than Thais... and Filipinos don't demand tips for helping you like I found most Thais do.

One man's meat is the other man' poison... I got the opposite experience.

Yes, in tourist areas it might be comparable. However, if you travel in the province, I never had that experience in TH - quite the opposite, people working their ass off to find someone, who could translate and help. In Phils, it often starts with addressing you as "friend" - I hate this phrase in the meantime, because it literally translates into "ATM" and the expectation for money. No matter,where you go, once you step out of your car, you are immediately targeted by beggars and kids for money. As always, there are exemptions, but in general, the "rich Kano" is seen as a source to get money.

Agreed. definitely 3rd world poor. Cambodia, Africa are other examples.

[bangon04]

I've only spent ten days in the Phils but my impression was way too many people, so many men sitting around everywhere I went doing SFA, and an economy that is unable to support such a large population. I have Filipino friends and from what they say the level of corruption is in a higher league altogether than Thailand, difficult as that may be to believe.

The Catholic Church must bear great blame and responsibility for encouraging population growth through their inhumane dogma on birth control, but then the Catholic Church thrives most where there is poverty, hopelessness and poor education - it is not in their interests to change. They have much to answer for in so many parts of the world. Don't get me started!

Yes if you have 8 kids the chances are none of them will get a good education. And uneducated people are more easily browbeaten into dropping money they cannot afford into the collecting plate.

The country exports its people - OFWs prop up the economy to the tune of 20 per cent in remittances. Where is the incentive to provide world-class education or invest in national infrastructure? The ruling families spend most of their time collecting money and filing lawsuits against each other accusing each other of corruption. The press reports all this, but do any of the cases get finished? Do any rich people go to jail? Sound familiar?

Phils also has third world police force which is an international joke - ask the HK people what they think...

Phils also has third world transport infrastructure - of course you cannot connect 7000 islands, but a working train sefvice across the main islands? Bridges are built by the Japanese,

Phils has a third world education system which pretends it is a US clone. Ask universities in the west what they think of Phil. diplomas... (sounds familiar)

Ask hospitals in the west what they think of Doctor's quals... Why do doctors get employed as nurses?

As for the advantage of speaking English -(American) that used to be the case, but gradually the Phils are losing ground to other ASEAN countries. Phil workers are more expensive than Myanmar, Indonesian, etc. The education system is failing even in this one area.

The rich continue to send their kids overseas for education (as they do in Thailand too), so where is the incentive to improve local schools and colleges? Where will the maids and taxi drivers come from if you educate too many people?

And the employment law - employers in the Phils are allowed to advertise for a cashier who is female, pretty and under the age of 26. Women who have started to learn to do a reasonable skilled job are then thrown out in favour of the new young cheap bimbo. At the age of 30 many (most?) are unemployable.

Tourist industry was mentioned.... Manila is regularly voted as the worst airport in the world. This is probably unfair - I am sure there are many worse, but perhaps not representing the capital city gateway of a developing nation. For 40 years the politicians have been promising a new airport......

[BernieOnTour]

....To say that Thais have a stronger work ethic than Philipinos is stunningly ridiculous. I've spent a lot of time in both countries and worked a lot with Philipinos and seen Thais "hard at work." The adult thai male is a study in laziness. ...

I also worked with Thai and Filipinos abroad and with Thai in Thailand. From what I experienced, they are both hardworking and I am even tending to rate Thai higher (also those in Thailand !).

Whereas in the countryside in Phils, I experienced an attitude, which I can only describe as a role model for the picture so often drawn here in TV of the typical Isaan male.

Maybe, this is also an effect of the OFW phenomenon, leading to an enourmous outflow of investment in training, intellegence, knowledge and those industrious people, who could drive the country further forward.

Sometimes, one is getting the feeling, the underdogs, trash and corrupts stay, whereas all of those, who could change the situation have been driven abroad.

[slipperylobster]

Craziest thing I seen in this thread is how people Judge the Philippines based on a short trip to Manila...or perhaps it was a stopover at the airport. As in anyplace all over the world, Get away from the big city. There are good and bad people everywhere. I met plenty of both, all over the world (ok just 40 countries that I have been to). Does not seem to matter if you are in London, Hamburg, Athens, Osan, Tokyo, Manila, Bangkok, Hongkong.....NEW YORK....detroit... I think you see the point.

[bobthomas]

A geographically disparate group of islands with little durable imperial control, mired by anti-colonial sentiment, and stifled by the restrictions of the Catholic demagoguery. Historically factionalized under the leadership of over 500 different warring chieftains, falling prey to Colonial expansion, and having repelled their former masters, strained to find homogeny in a region in which people ultimately reverted back to being factionalized (not so much along different ideologies but rather), lost in a vacuum between the older indigenous pantheon and the restrictive nature of Catholicism.

This post colonial sentiment may or may not have been the impetus for not renewing the leases on the US Military bases after the volcanic eruption of Mt. Pinatubo.

Mired in a seemingly never ending cycle of poverty, corruption, and soaring population figures, the geographically disparate archipelago is host to a population that remains transfixed between an ultra prideful National identity that often masks their pervasive and deep seated lack of a cohesive and valued identity. This precarious cognitive position remains static in part because of the strict confines of the Catholic canon, whereas, Buddhism in Thailand has various interpretations in which casing harm to, (or taking advantage of) another individual, for instance, can be explained away by such convenient excuses as, “must have done something bad in a former life!”

This cognitive “superposition” leaves many Pinos trapped in an ethical paradox, lacking a true identity they can be proud of yet straining to avoid anything remotely resembling bowing to colonial intervention- this ultimately limits and confuses the opportunity to nurture the ascendant personality and still allow for a National and cultural Identity they can be proud of.

Uncle Bob

Edited December 28, 2014 by bobthomas

[slipperylobster]

Philippines sufferd under Spain then America as a colony.

You mean benefited.

Once the gringos left .it turned to hell...true to Quezon's words.

http://getrealphilippines.com/legacy/1-00_intro.html

Very frustrating to hear that people actually believe the Philippines would have been better off, without American intervention (Spanish American War) and without clearing out the Japanese. ("I will be Back"). Almost every family in the Philippines has at least one Relative in America. You will find some who want Americans to stay out...but many more who feel close to us.

As far as the bases being closed, after Pinatubo, the savvy would know enough about the number of American ships that port way down south near General Santos City. A few go up to Cavite and Subic as well. There are "Support Facilities" down south, joint exercises (to the extreme), and Operations down in the Sulu Sea that only a few know about. Clark and Subic provided jobs and income for the surrounding communities, but the USA did not pay enough rent to make it profitable. Clark and Subic are now "Freeports" drawing in pretty much the same amount of jobs and cash. Examples of our ties are provided.

https://www.google.co.th/search?q=phil+american+friendship&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=h4-fVPqoFoP_ugSjioKACg&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ

My Son and one of my daughters are both US Citizens, as well as Filipino/Filipina...and one other daughter is Filipina only. They are well treated.

Edited December 28, 2014 by slipperylobster

[AYJAYDEE]

Philippines sufferd under Spain then America as a colony.

You mean benefited.

Once the gringos left .it turned to hell...true to Quezon's words.

http://getrealphilippines.com/legacy/1-00_intro.html

Very frustrating to hear that people actually believe the Philippines would have been better off, without American intervention (Spanish American War) and without clearing out the Japanese. ("I will be Back"). Almost every family in the Philippines has at least one Relative in America. You will find some who want Americans to stay out...but many more who feel close to us.

As far as the bases being closed, after Pinatubo, the savvy would know enough about the number of American ships that port way down south near General Santos City. A few go up to Cavite and Subic as well. There are "Support Facilities" down south, joint exercises (to the extreme), and Operations down in the Sulu Sea that only a few know about. Clark and Subic provided jobs and income for the surrounding communities, but the USA did not pay enough rent to make it profitable. Clark and Subic are now "Freeports" drawing in pretty much the same amount of jobs and cash. Examples of our ties are provided.

https://www.google.co.th/search?q=phil+american+friendship&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=h4-fVPqoFoP_ugSjioKACg&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ

My Son and one of my daughters are both US Citizens, as well as Filipino/Filipina...and one other daughter is Filipina only. They are well treated.

http://www.worldfuturefund.org/wffmaster/Reading/war.crimes/US/U.S.Philippines.htm

[bangon04]

....To say that Thais have a stronger work ethic than Philipinos is stunningly ridiculous. I've spent a lot of time in both countries and worked a lot with Philipinos and seen Thais "hard at work." The adult thai male is a study in laziness. ...

I also worked with Thai and Filipinos abroad and with Thai in Thailand. From what I experienced, they are both hardworking and I am even tending to rate Thai higher (also those in Thailand !).

Whereas in the countryside in Phils, I experienced an attitude, which I can only describe as a role model for the picture so often drawn here in TV of the typical Isaan male.

Maybe, this is also an effect of the OFW phenomenon, leading to an enourmous outflow of investment in training, intellegence, knowledge and those industrious people, who could drive the country further forward.

Sometimes, one is getting the feeling, the underdogs, trash and corrupts stay, whereas all of those, who could change the situation have been driven abroad.

Yes the ones with drive and ambition are forced abroad to improve their lot. Shameful really, but then the ruling families don't really care either way. If the remittances suddenly dried up, the Philippines would be a failed state in a very short time.

[slipperylobster]

One look at the Map would tell you why the Philippines will eventually succeed.

China is breaking out to the sea. We have read the news.

the term the military uses is......"Strategic".

It will always be that...just because of it's position on the China Sea and Pacific. Deep Water Ports, coves, are excellent. Airports, refueling Logistics (refuel and resupply) adequate. Alliances with the West ....solid.

It will not become another Taiwan....Ever.

[daveAustin]

I don't know very much of the Philippines, but I know in South East Asia only Malaysia (which is by the way another relatively successful economy) have a "Chinese factor" which is comparable to the Thai one (excluding countries which are basically China's satellites, such as Singapore and Hong Kong).

Good post. Regards Sing and HK, I think one should not overlook the fact they were British colonies, which was a massive influence in getting them up to speed.

I reiterate a previous post, Thailand is basically just very lucky in the way it has carried itself (though it would likely be more successful had it been colonised... not by the French ), such as with the worming it did during WWII and also, of course, in where it sits in SEA. But take away the sun, beaches and totty and it'd just be another Mongolia, from a tourist point of view anyway.

[AYJAYDEE]

I don't know very much of the Philippines, but I know in South East Asia only Malaysia (which is by the way another relatively successful economy) have a "Chinese factor" which is comparable to the Thai one (excluding countries which are basically China's satellites, such as Singapore and Hong Kong).

Good post. Regards Sing and HK, I think one should not overlook the fact they were British colonies, which was a massive influence in getting them up to speed.

I reiterate a previous post, Thailand is basically just very lucky in the way it has carried itself (though it would likely be more successful had it been colonised... not by the French ), such as with the worming it did during WWII and also, of course, in where it sits in SEA. But take away the sun, beaches and totty and it'd just be another Mongolia, from a tourist point of view anyway.

burma , kenya and zimbabwe kinda put the lie to that theory.

[Altalake]

No point, Richard Thailand has said it all!

Even the grenade-shaped San Mig is not very good now, and that was just about the ONLY saving grace of the Philippines.......

[poweratradio]

Ask again in 5 years.

Well I'm more interested in what allowed Thailand and Philippines to get to where they now are over the last 20-30 years. I realize there are corruption and political issues and perhaps some issues with education in both countries but they seem much the same to me. If I recall recently both countries scored exactly the same on an international corruption index.

It all boils down to American Influence in Philippines and a lack of it in Thailand excepting the R and R from the Viet G I's related to tourism

[TechnikaIII]

Catholicism :-( .. Catholics live with guilt, and forever in darkness about the after life.

Buddhism is about this life, and getting on with it.

Thais smile more because of this philosophy.

[ATF]

One look at the Map would tell you why the Philippines will eventually succeed.

China is breaking out to the sea. We have read the news.

the term the military uses is......"Strategic".

It will always be that...just because of it's position on the China Sea and Pacific. Deep Water Ports, coves, are excellent. Airports, refueling Logistics (refuel and resupply) adequate. Alliances with the West ....solid.

It will not become another Taiwan....Ever.

You have very positive things to say about PH. I'm not trying to wind you up here but why don't you live there if you like it so much.

I find people vote with their feet and Taiwan is an economic miracle. One that can be contributed to the US because they "acquired" IBM tech.

[inxuinxu]

And why the English of people in the Philippines are better in general compared to the English of thais despite the fact that their education system along many other things are of lower standard? Or maybe i just spend too much time with prostitutes whose English tends to be better.

From 1898 to 1946 Philippines was almost like U.S. state similar to Hawaii and still today English is an official language of the Philippines.

If you go to Hamburger restaurant like Jollibee menu is written only in Enlgish.

Maybe because of only 50% of inhabitants speak Tagalog as their native language.

[metisdead]

Off topic inflammatory posts and replies have been removed.

[slipperylobster]

One look at the Map would tell you why the Philippines will eventually succeed.

China is breaking out to the sea. We have read the news.

the term the military uses is......"Strategic".

It will always be that...just because of it's position on the China Sea and Pacific. Deep Water Ports, coves, are excellent. Airports, refueling Logistics (refuel and resupply) adequate. Alliances with the West ....solid.

It will not become another Taiwan....Ever.

You have very positive things to say about PH. I'm not trying to wind you up here but why don't you live there if you like it so much.

Been there...done that. Eighteen years straight. (Read my first post). Actually. I have since moved on. I do visit, but I also find positive things in Thailand. I do not choose one or the other. Isn't that great.?

Finding no reason to demonize either....I am hopeful for the future of the Philippines, and Thailand as well. I love the Philippines, but Thailand is just more comfortable..... Personal choice. I may end up back in the Philippines in the future, but I now have a beautiful relationship with my wife.....here. Children grown etc.

Quite personal to ask...

Edited December 28, 2014 by slipperylobster

[bangmai]

www.tabaqueria.com great cigars....great prices....similar to Cuban. A small package has a good chance of getting through tax-free....better to put "cigars" on it than nothing.

[balo]

Here must be some local food that is tasty in the Philippines? All I hear about is how bad it is.

[slipperylobster]

I've only spent ten days in the Phils but my impression was way too many people, so many men sitting around everywhere I went doing SFA, and an economy that is unable to support such a large population. I have Filipino friends and from what they say the level of corruption is in a higher league altogether than Thailand, difficult as that may be to believe.

The Catholic Church must bear great blame and responsibility for encouraging population growth through their inhumane dogma on birth control, but then the Catholic Church thrives most where there is poverty, hopelessness and poor education - it is not in their interests to change. They have much to answer for in so many parts of the world. Don't get me started!

Phils also has third world police force which is an international joke - ask the HK people what they think...

P.N.P. Philippine National Police. Better known as Pay n Pay.

[CrazyNowLazy]

When Thailand can not face the truth because the truth hurts...

[slipperylobster]

Here must be some local food that is tasty in the Philippines? All I hear about is how bad it is.

Pancit Canton...better known as Pancit Kantootan (they love a play on words...it means boomboom)

[louse1953]

In spite of what people may think, there are islands where rich Westerners go to. Boracay is an example.

I remember Boracay from when it was the archetypal beach paradise for backpackers, with only buildings without foundations and no electricity, and the accommodation was beach huts for few tens of pesos.

It has changed somewhat since then.

I hear ya. There are still affordable lodgings for us budget guys. Not saying it is not affordable. You can go low or high..... Many more high dollar places going up all the time. Naturally....and now it is an international destination.... in fact, many international sailing/windsurfing events are going on.

Not quite as it used to be.

5555,reminds me when i was on the 1st windsurfer there,last century,and got blown nearly to Panay,i could only go one way.Luckily Charlie came and got me.

[tookwan cottage]

"Okay" infrastructure? I think it is excellent -- in BKK, anyway.

Edited December 28, 2014 by tookwan cottage

[louse1953]

As one who has lived in Asia for the last 25 years its nothing more than a way of speaking

Doesn't matter how many years you've lived in Asia. (Not enough, clearly.) Filipinos don't like it, and there's no reason not to respect that.

Really, which Flippers are you referring to?

The TEFLR types now to be found in Thailand that think they are better than their Pinoy counterparts?

Jesse my Pinoy foreman when I told him I wanted the job done properly he said, no problem boss, no Pakis no Bangla, Flippers ok?

Ask those same Flippers why they refer to me as a "Cano"?

Because you refer to them as flippers,personly i think your just a common ol chuck wower.

[RichardThailand]

"Okay" infrastructure? I think it is excellent -- in BKK, anyway.

I guess we all view things differently but as a pedestrian I don't find BKK very easy to navigate and for drivers the roads are not at all adequate.

Edited December 28, 2014 by RichardThailand

[CrazyNowLazy]

I moved to Thailand to retired three years ago after ten years in Philippines. Now I’m planning to moving back to Philippines. Because the average Filipino is not narcissist and/or bipolar as I have found most Thais to be. Worst I found most Thais I’ve met are egotistical, not truly loving, caring or affectionate toward their Children, each other and especially not toward Foreigners. As for Thais low unemployment rate, of course the powers that be does not count or pay out any unemployment benefits to most Thais. I was shocked to find out that Foreigners are required to hire four unqualified and usually over paid Thais first before Foreigners can hire one qualified Foreigner.

[ultimate weapon]

Maybe it's due to race? As you know thailand has many thai chinese and many thais have east asian genetics since they originated from china but are not chinese but it's still similar. It's not a pc to say but think about it well does it always seem to be that way in countries say china,japan vs say indonesia. Even in thailand where the darker skinned thais aka the issan, mon, khmer peoples who are similar to the dark skinned filippino natives seem poorer than the lighter skinned thais.

[Ulysses G.]

Here must be some local food that is tasty in the Philippines? All I hear about is how bad it is.

Pancit Canton...better known as Pancit Kantootan (they love a play on words...it means boomboom)

I really like Adobo, but, I must admit, I've had better quality in other countries. The New Orleans Cafe in Pattaya used to do it well, but I have not been down there for a few years.