Russian economic crisis hits Pattaya, Phuket

[easybullet3]

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A few less Russians could be a good thing. Ever noticed the state of beaches every morning littered with alcohol bottles, rubbish and cigarette butts.

What ????

Russians are no worse than any other drunk foreigner !!! have you seen the drunk Foreigners dropping cigarette butts, beer cans and plastic wrappers on the pavement or beach ?
you are really wrong to blame Russians for that.
the beaches were bad WAY BEFORE Russians started coming to Thailand.
i am from England,, and I often see drunk, frighting, littering people with shirts off at night from my own country.
Russians are no where near as loud and sarcastically rude as the UK holiday people.

- And both nationalities are EQUALLY messy and responsible for dirty beaches.

Edited December 29, 2014 by easybullet3

[hgv driver]

This is good news to me

[DLock]

I think the reason for the downturn in tourist arrivals is this: most tourists are fed up with the way they are treated in Thailand, and what they get for their hard earned money. It's not only the Russians who are staying away ! And it's not only the Russians who Litter the beaches, it's the Thais who leave litter everywhere, even on pavements, in buses and planes! Yesterday evening around 8 pm, I took a bus back to Jomtien. It wasn't that busy. Imagine the disgust and dismay of all waiting, when one large and older Thai man started screaming 6 , sit 6, meaning 6 on each side of the song thaew , and then began pushing and finally hitting one man trying to get him to move up when there was obviously no room ! Everyone was stunned! I couldn't understand the comments around me, but I can assure you they weren't complmentary! This is the behaviour that puts off tourists forever coming back to Thailand, not all the other excuses the TAT think up !!!!!

Ps. To the people who suggest violence, this area has seen some serious fights with tourists getting hurt!

I think overall tourist numbers are up as indicated in this newspaper article. It's just that Russian tourists are down, not because they are not treated well in Thailand but because the Ruble lost about 50% of its value vs Thai baht in the last 6 months.

.actually, the Russian RUB lost 50% in really the last 2 months.

The russians you are seeing now are the ones that probably paid in advance, so decided to come and probably spend less.

It's the new and future russian bookings that will take a severe downturn.

...be careful what you wish for.

[Just1Voice]

Tourism is just a blip to Thailand GDA

I dunno why most foreigners jump on the bandwagon and think they are gods gift to the Thai Economy.

Thailand baht is still strong, no recession looming yet, and if there was - it certainly wouldnt be due to some tourists that stopped coming.

Tourism is about 7-8% of GDP.

Tourism is about 7-8% of GDP. Wrong! You really need to read more. According to recently released reports, both Thai and foreign, when you figure in all the "fringe" businesses who depend on the tourism money, it actually accounts for up to 16% of GDP. Twice what you stated. Please try to keep up with the real world.

[taipan1949]

I will have to watch what I say not to offend anyone or will get another suspension. I have found the Russians to be ignorant, pushy and with no manners. I hope their Ruble drops out of sight and with them right after.

Edited December 29, 2014 by metisdead
Bold font removed.

[EyesWideOpen]

Tourism is just a blip to Thailand GDA

I dunno why most foreigners jump on the bandwagon and think they are gods gift to the Thai Economy.

Thailand baht is still strong, no recession looming yet, and if there was - it certainly wouldnt be due to some tourists that stopped coming.

Tourism is about 7-8% of GDP.

Officially........Many long term expats think the number is closer to 20 % . I can assure

you that all the two story homes built in Nakon Nowhere by farangs, and the millions

of baht sent to support their darlings, is certainly not a part of the official tourist income.

Nor is the umpteem million baht paid to girls for sex a part of that 7% number. In fact

I am not even sure where that number comes from....

[ggt]

Tourism is just a blip to Thailand GDA

I dunno why most foreigners jump on the bandwagon and think they are gods gift to the Thai Economy.

Thailand baht is still strong, no recession looming yet, and if there was - it certainly wouldnt be due to some tourists that stopped coming.

The tourism and travel sector contributed Bt825.6bn ($27.99bn), or 7.3%, directly to Thailand’s GDP in 2012, according to the World Travel & Tourism Council (WTTC). Once direct, indirect and induced impact on the economy were taken into account, the sector’s value rose to Bt1.8967tn ($64.3bn), or 16.7% of GDP. Tourism and travel employed just over 2m people directly in 2012, while generating around 4.8m jobs on a broader level. The sector also proved to be a magnet for investment, attracting Bt227.5bn ($7.71bn) in 2012, or 6.8% of the national total for the year.

16.7 % of GDP...employing 4.8m people...is a bit more than just a blip...(2012 figures)

http://www.oxfordbusinessgroup.com/news/thailand-record-arrival-numbers-bode-well-tourism

[Sviss Geez]

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The Russians have chosen an other destination, as numbers show the travel agencies in Russia showing no changes in travelers.

This people know exactly what dictatorship and military ruling ! This is why they will not choose a destination with martial law in place.

The only ones responsible for les economics and tourism was at first Suthep and now the Junta.

Outbound travel from Russian is increased by 23 % to $ 14.8 million.

The five most popular destinations in the period from January to September were Turkey ( 2.7 million , + 20% ), Egypt ( 1.4 million , 17 %) , Greece ( 1.1 million , 69 %) , Spain ( 887,1 thousand , 29 ), China ( 787.2 thousand , -20% ),

Totally wrong .I saw a report on the BBC saying Russians are mostly staying at home for Holidays now ,as their currency is worth less than 40% of its value in a year .

Totally naive, you seriously think that just because the BBC reported it that it must be correct?

[Phuketboy]

Thailand should be blaming Thailand for the decline in tourist numbers. They shot themselves in the foot on more than one occasion, but they are always right and never listen to others. Secondly, stop talking about Russian and Chinese tourists, yes they may come here, but they spend very little (<deleted> all really) in local businesses, so they do not make a difference anyway other than make the place look busy. It's the other tourists from Europe, Australia, America etc that are the ones who generally spend up while visiting, therefore Thailand should be focusing on trying to get more of them here.

[paddyjenkins]

I don't understand why these businesses in Pattaya etc, the bars, restaurants, street ladies, didn't hedge their indirect Ruble exposure by selling Ruble futures. It beggars belief that these people don't even get the basics of financial hedging. Idiots.

[empireboy]

Makes my week!

[Robert24]

Tourism is just a blip to Thailand GDA

I dunno why most foreigners jump on the bandwagon and think they are gods gift to the Thai Economy.

Thailand baht is still strong, no recession looming yet, and if there was - it certainly wouldnt be due to some tourists that stopped coming.

Tourism is about 7-8% of GDP.

Officially........Many long term expats think the number is closer to 20 % . I can assure

you that all the two story homes built in Nakon Nowhere by farangs, and the millions

of baht sent to support their darlings, is certainly not a part of the official tourist income.

Nor is the umpteem million baht paid to girls for sex a part of that 7% number. In fact

I am not even sure where that number comes from....

agree that the overall contribution from foreigners to the GDP from Thailand is more than 7-8%. But bear in mind that contribution of foreigners to Thai GDP is not equal Tourism in Thailand. There are many foreigners in Thailand who have invested in business here, built factories here, retire here or just live here, all of that is not counted as tourism in the GDP numbers.

[Robert24]

Thailand should be blaming Thailand for the decline in tourist numbers. They shot themselves in the foot on more than one occasion, but they are always right and never listen to others. Secondly, stop talking about Russian and Chinese tourists, yes they may come here, but they spend very little (F%$K all really) in local businesses, so they do not make a difference anyway other than make the place look busy. It's the other tourists from Europe, Australia, America etc that are the ones who generally spend up while visiting, therefore Thailand should be focusing on trying to get more of them here.

agree with you that the money spent per tourist is probably lower for a Chinese tourist than a Western tourist. But bottom line is that the growth of Chinese tourists is huge globally and it is only normal that Thailand is trying hard to get a good share of that. Also bear in mind that you see also growth from other Asian countries, i.e. Korea etc.

If you look at tourists in Europe you see the same trend. The biggest growth is in tourists from China.

I'm not in this business but if I were in the tourist business, I definitely focus on the growth of Chinese tourists.

[EyesWideOpen]

Tourism is just a blip to Thailand GDA

I dunno why most foreigners jump on the bandwagon and think they are gods gift to the Thai Economy.

Thailand baht is still strong, no recession looming yet, and if there was - it certainly wouldnt be due to some tourists that stopped coming.

Tourism is about 7-8% of GDP.

Officially........Many long term expats think the number is closer to 20 % . I can assure

you that all the two story homes built in Nakon Nowhere by farangs, and the millions

of baht sent to support their darlings, is certainly not a part of the official tourist income.

Nor is the umpteem million baht paid to girls for sex a part of that 7% number. In fact

I am not even sure where that number comes from....

agree that the overall contribution from foreigners to the GDP from Thailand is more than 7-8%. But bear in mind that contribution of foreigners to Thai GDP is not equal Tourism in Thailand. There are many foreigners in Thailand who have invested in business here, built factories here, retire here or just live here, all of that is not counted as tourism in the GDP numbers.

I understand. But whether you spend one week, one month, one year, or ten years , in the eyes of Thailand. you are in fact just a tourist , albeit a long term one, unless you become a citizen here.... I suppose that if the TAT wanted to sharpen their numbers, they could attempt to make some distinction between tourists and long term stayers. For years their tourist arrival numbers included all guys doing border monthly visa runs, so I have little faith in their numbers.

[Gunna]

The Russians have chosen an other destination, as numbers show the travel agencies in Russia showing no changes in travelers.

This people know exactly what dictatorship and military ruling ! This is why they will not choose a destination with martial law in place.

The only ones responsible for les economics and tourism was at first Suthep and now the Junta.

Outbound travel from Russian is increased by 23 % to $ 14.8 million.

The five most popular destinations in the period from January to September were Turkey ( 2.7 million , + 20% ), Egypt ( 1.4 million , 17 %) , Greece ( 1.1 million , 69 %) , Spain ( 887,1 thousand , 29 ), China ( 787.2 thousand , -20% ),

What a load of rubbish - nothing to do with martial law.

Russians know what it's like living under a Dictator,ie Stallin to Putin with an all powerful military, so they are happy visiting Thailand.

Plus you are quoting old figures, ie the Rubles dramatic loss in value has happened mostly since October. A lot of Russians come to Pattaya & Phuket on package deals which were paid for months before. The regular Independent travelers will have paid for their tickets early to get cheap prices.

Several large Russian Travel agencies have collapsed due to the drop in numbers and Russian Airlines are in financial strife.

So the figures will drop even more over the next 6 months when the Russians are forced to travel inside their own country by the low Ruble, unless they have foreign bank accounts or earnings from outside Russia.

An interesting article if you want the truth

http://www.businessinsider.com/afp-ruble-fall-creates-turbulence-for-russian-airlines-2014-12

[risky11]

The Russians have chosen an other destination, as numbers show the travel agencies in Russia showing no changes in travelers.

This people know exactly what dictatorship and military ruling ! This is why they will not choose a destination with martial law in place.

The only ones responsible for les economics and tourism was at first Suthep and now the Junta.

Outbound travel from Russian is increased by 23 % to $ 14.8 million.

The five most popular destinations in the period from January to September were Turkey ( 2.7 million , + 20% ), Egypt ( 1.4 million , 17 %) , Greece ( 1.1 million , 69 %) , Spain ( 887,1 thousand , 29 ), China ( 787.2 thousand , -20% ),

Thank you for the facts. However, I disagree with your interpretation of those facts. I visited Thailand In November. Dictatorship and military rule did not influence my decision at all. Why would it? As a tourist, it changed nothing about my experience. From what I have read in this forum, the military govt is cleaning up some of the corruption. That's a good thing! Democracy has a pretty dismal record.

[green job]

A few less Russians could be a good thing. Ever noticed the state of beaches every morning littered with alcohol bottles, rubbish and cigarette butts.

Agree. But I have seen beach in Ko Pha Ngan in the morning few years ago and it didn"t look different. And there were mostly western people there. How that?

Every beach that the Russians used in numbers has been ruined,including the beautiful beach located in the Thai navy camp near Pattaya,as they started to bring them in by speed boat,without control

[Expat Brad]

Indeed, and in terms of volume of rubbish deposited the Thais are world leaders. Even with large and visible rubbish containers within 50 meters they will just get up and leave the mess behind. I have even been castigated by Thais for picking up other peoples' rubbish when I leave.

"No! Leave it, it is not ours".

That's because if YOU a farang cleans up the rubbish, they will lose face. Go to pretty much any lovely location you will see &lt;deleted&gt; everywhere left by Thai

s more than anyone else.

[zydeco]

So, the 7-11s in Pattaya will not need to employee as many bouncers as usual for this time of year.

[ikke]

Tourism is just a blip to Thailand GDA

I dunno why most foreigners jump on the bandwagon and think they are gods gift to the Thai Economy.

Thailand baht is still strong, no recession looming yet, and if there was - it certainly wouldnt be due to some tourists that stopped coming.

Tourism is about 7-8% of GDP.

Tourism and related business is about 24% of the GDP.

In the 8% you mention is not included infrastructure works and long time visitors due to their first visit as tourist.

Also money brought in cash and spend in the bars , after that spend by the bar girls to build houses up country and supporting local economy over there is not included in you 8%.nor is the building and construction of condo's included.

So if you do the full mats, i think its even more than 24%.

[green job]

Every year we visit, kaibae in Koh Chang 4 years ago we met for the last time the great German and Itailian friends we made. They said they would never return

due to the Russian piss artists,and filth makers.

We have just returned,this year it is empty,hardly any Russians and very few others. I must admit I feel sorry for the hotels etc,but they were all trying to make a quick buck,so they only have them selves to blame.

[zydeco]

Thailand has made a deliberate policy of choosing as its dance partners two devils, Putin and Xi Jinping. The former is already on its knees. The latter is in control of a massive empire of hidden debt, corrupt infrastructure projects, and thieving business and government bureaucrats. I suspect both Putin and Xi Jinping soon to be in the front lean and rest position. Meanwhile, Thailand has rebuffed some of its longest term friends and allies--and investors--all because they have made a horrendous mistake in reading the way the wind blows. Betting your future on Russia and China is like hiring Al Capone to audit your books.

[GinBoy2]

I like this thread, first one where the Americans aren't somehow to blame!

Fantastic LOL

[northengr]

The Russians have chosen an other destination, as numbers show the travel agencies in Russia showing no changes in travelers.

This people know exactly what dictatorship and military ruling ! This is why they will not choose a destination with martial law in place.

The only ones responsible for les economics and tourism was at first Suthep and now the Junta.

Outbound travel from Russian is increased by 23 % to $ 14.8 million.

The five most popular destinations in the period from January to September were Turkey ( 2.7 million , + 20% ), Egypt ( 1.4 million , 17 %) , Greece ( 1.1 million , 69 %) , Spain ( 887,1 thousand , 29 ), China ( 787.2 thousand , -20% ),

While your analysis is satisfying and your statistics are very interesting, I have to question if a Junta is the cause, because The top two other destinations are defacto Juntas also, and Greece seems to have no functioning govt. I would suggest arrogance and incompetence since Thailand and China seem to have the common link of Juntas and reductions in tourism from Russia. Not that Russians should be surprised by govt with arrogance and incompetence.

[Expat Brad]

bangkokheat, on 29 Dec 2014 - 09:19, said:

immigration, poolice, tat and the government have been making it difficult for expats and tourists, pushing them away, bet thats not helping the cash flow

Nonsense! The only people effected by the recent crackdown have been foreigners living here on multiple VOA's.

Don't post drivel.

Sorry but this post is correct, I mean like it or not there are a lot less farang here now due to the crack down by immigration on those supposed undesirables. The thing is......they spent locally, they certainly didn't put money into their bank accounts they spent every baht. That had a ripple affect across every type of business. So a bucket load less money in the economy.

[Expat Brad]

Probably not.

Thai logic has it to increase prices to compensate for low custom.

T.I.T.

Thai logic OMG........I had a discussion with the manageress of a small but up market bar/restaurant in CM. Business was down so what did they do, put the price up from 60-80 baht for a Chaang. At the time this increase made it the most expensive in the area. So what happened???.....even less customers. By the way the manageress has a dip. hotel management.

[Thai at Heart]

So, the largest single group of tourists will be down significantly in 2015 and tourism is still expected to grow 13%? Interesting logic.

The Thais complained about Russian tour guides taking their jobs. You have your wish. No more tour guides. Happy now?

Thailand needs the reality check thats about to smack them right in the face. When tourism is down 10% in 2015 on this years lower number, shit's gonna get real.

Then watch them blame and panic.

Didn't they shut down some Russian tour and travel agencies a few years ago also. Karma is a bitch.

I guess the taxi mafia that had a great moan about foreign tour buses are overjoyed now. There is nonbusiness at all to fight over.

[Thai at Heart]

Tourism is just a blip to Thailand GDA

I dunno why most foreigners jump on the bandwagon and think they are gods gift to the Thai Economy.

Thailand baht is still strong, no recession looming yet, and if there was - it certainly wouldnt be due to some tourists that stopped coming.

Tourism is about 7-8% of GDP.

Tourism and related business is about 24% of the GDP.

In the 8% you mention is not included infrastructure works and long time visitors due to their first visit as tourist.

Also money brought in cash and spend in the bars , after that spend by the bar girls to build houses up country and supporting local economy over there is not included in you 8%.nor is the building and construction of condo's included.

So if you do the full mats, i think its even more than 24%.

I can easily believe it. Do you have a stat reference for this, because 8% always seemed low and that even before measuring the black economy around tourism.

[sgtsabai]

Where did the tourists come from 10-15 yrs. ago? Did they disappear? Did Thailand not make money off them? While admittedly time does educate some of us, I enjoyed my early years here. Little or no Chinese in their tour groups, few or no Russians, the Mid-East stayed in the "Arab quarters" and there were none of those smelly pipes. Very few farang couples with a downbeaten husband trying his best to not look at what he was missing...lol. Even the football hooligans had not arrived in numbers. Best I remember, there were lots of farangs around then. Even so, memory is select and tends to remember the good and it takes awhile to learn things, or did it all just change?

[jpeg]

I've often wondered why posters are so interested in the decline of tourism here. They are either people who derive their living from their Thai fronted bars/restaurants OR hoping the decline in tourism, will indirectly affect the exchange rate. If the former I for one, sh!t not give. If the latter, one can hope. But experience proves the baht has been protected to the death since 1997. And no, very wealthy expat businesses are already pulling out.

Edited December 29, 2014 by jpeg