Muslim man hailed for life-saving courage during Paris siege

[slipperylobster]

If only there were a way to give the radical guys their quota of virgins, in advance.

Maybe they would be too worn out and laid back to wreak havoc.

[i claudius]

Robblock

Yes I assimilated,I married one of them,your comparisons are the same old tired ones,always used,I,me bored now so I am off to demonstrate outside Tesco because they are out of marmite

[Zob65]

Who cares if it was a muslim, why not just state "a man", just because its a muslim does it make us all feel better? The problem will cease when Islamic leaders and followers turn the situation around from within.

[Choctastic]

Even by the standards of left wing tinfoil hatters loonwatch is about as credible as a comb over in a gale.

Or Netenyahu leading a 'unity' march.

[tezzainthailand]

Good man and I am glad he is alive and well,unfortunately,one swallow does not make a summer,and there are so many of his faith that are far from being like him

Many? More like a tiny minority. It was great to see Muslims come out with their fellow Parisians and denounce the barbarity of these thugs who used a religion to justify their acts. Muslims in Spain came out under the 'Not In My Name' theme in support of France. You can sense a change in mood with the world's Muslims who have had a gutful of terrorism every bit as much as non-Muslims. Terrorism from extremists isn't going away soon, but the positive mood shown in Paris could make the difference between a young impressionable Muslim mind going to the extreme or avoiding that life altogether. If it can happen in Northern Ireland it can happen in the Middle East. The real concern is that another screwball republican President will come to power in America, revisit the Middle East and start the whole cycle again.

[arjunadawn]

A very good man and real example to the rest of us. I'm sure there are lots more like him in the Muslim community, but their voices are drowned out by the violent scumbags.

I wanted to re-post your post above. This is a most excellent story of a most righteous man. He reflects well upon his faith, and upon all humanity.

[arjunadawn]

Good man and I am glad he is alive and well,unfortunately,one swallow does not make a summer,and there are so many of his faith that are far from being like him

Many? More like a tiny minority. It was great to see Muslims come out with their fellow Parisians and denounce the barbarity of these thugs who used a religion to justify their acts. Muslims in Spain came out under the 'Not In My Name' theme in support of France. You can sense a change in mood with the world's Muslims who have had a gutful of terrorism every bit as much as non-Muslims. Terrorism from extremists isn't going away soon, but the positive mood shown in Paris could make the difference between a young impressionable Muslim mind going to the extreme or avoiding that life altogether. If it can happen in Northern Ireland it can happen in the Middle East. The real concern is that another screwball republican President will come to power in America, revisit the Middle East and start the whole cycle again.

It is absurd to appropriate for a convenient point of view that the silence of this mysterious silent majority is allied with your peaceful perception. You've simply no data to suppose there are not "many" who support islamic jihad when they are after all, silent. Yet you imply this silence supports your point of view that a "tiny minority" is reflected in the global watershed of violence. However, various polling data does suggest a profound number of this "many" do support such violent actions as in Paris. When we are discussing a body of over 1,400,000,000 muslims, 300-600,000,000 is a very large number, and the data consistently suggest such numbers when considering overt or sympathy for shar'ia like acts upon/toward the west. I wish I had the ability to do a metadata analysis of this silent moderate majority because I refuse to believe it exists; you have either muslims or apostates, by muslim's own liturgical definition, but you do not have moderates and radicals- period! Islam has no place for moderation. "Moderate"was anticipated and highly evolved means of dissuasion and prevention are inherent in the faith to prevent apostasy=moderation.

Your post begins with an objection- basically, that there are not "many" like the bad Paris people; one bad apple fallacy. You then generalize this "change in mood" argument sensed subjectively by you by no more than the scope of a few days, a rally, and a few marches, and perhaps a "Not in my Name" commercial. Whereas 1,400 years of (now) Three Great Jihads, with only one period of break after the debacle of defeat at Vienna, suggests its way too soon to suggest a "change in mood." You are probably correct that a great many muslims have had a "gutful" [sic] of terrorism (most people just want to live peaceful healthy lives) and you are correct, muslims slaughter muslims, but they do this because there is a formula for addressing apostates before unbelievers. (This policy is quite similar to Cicero's admonition regarding "No nation... can survive a traitor within."). Apostates pose a greater threat than unbelivers and this is why muslims are targeted first. Many are sick of this, yes, but this does not make the "change in mood" you assert. You just cannot connect those dots when the evidence suggests otherwise.

Your later comments actually need to be undressed in reverse, from your closing points: you object to republicans in America, suggest they are responsible for the morass in the world, clearly implying that muslims are put "on the fence" for what terrorist acts they may commit in response to America, but this could be mitigated by the "positive mood shown in Paris." This of course reveals your hand as far from objective. This is the logic of enablers who continue to imperil the west by suggesting in various forms that the west is responsible for its own infection or attacks.

The "Not in my name" silliness means nothing though you are welcome to see it as a hopeful sign. I do not. "Not in my name" just states "we muslims, who choose an unorthodox life, in opposition to the prophet's concerns about Hijrah (migration), protest terrorists claiming islam supports their actions." (My paraphrase) The problem is, they are incorrect; totally! Islamic scripture anticipates muslims who migrate and become enamored by the host country or its ways and have highly developed liturgy and exegesis over 1,000 years in development about how to stay amongst infidels, and when to leave to return to muslim fold- but never to co-opt their ways or allow islam to to subsume into a kafir culture. Having said that, what "Not in me Name" also over looks is that IS and other terrorists generally cite correct scriptural authority for their actions. There are zero "Not in my Name" speakers that can cite correct or even any scriptural authority for their apostate argument. They are apostates to their faith! Period! Being an apostate is not bad, from my point of view- I applaud them. But this is the correct language; not "moderate," and this is why there is so much deafening silence.

http://chersonandmolschky.com/tag/hirjah/

Edited January 12, 2015 by arjunadawn

[uptheos]

A very good man and real example to the rest of us. I'm sure there are lots more like him in the Muslim community, but their voices are drowned out by the violent scumbags.

I wanted to re-post your post above. This is a most excellent story of a most righteous man. He reflects well upon his faith, and upon all humanity.

It's the story of a Muslim man, who if he had been found working in a kosher shop would have had a bullet in his head!

It's a story of helping others whilst helping yourself, the sort of thing most people would do.

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed.

[Jingthing]

I want to give this Lassana Bathily a big kiss!

He should have been leading the parade right next to the PM Hollande.

[JOC]

I want to give this Lassana Bathily a big kiss!

He should have been leading the parade right next to the PM Hollande.

I want to give this Lassana Bathily a big kiss!

Why are we not surprised??

[Jingthing]

Israel needs to exist besides also obviously for her millions of citizens who were mostly BORN there, but also for diaspora Jews who want to move there by choice AND for Jews who want to move there to escape peril. Many from Ukraine escaping now to Israel for that reason. Some French Jews feel they are no longer safe in France. Being murdered just for shopping at a Kosher grocery (there have been numerous other Islamic Jihadist attacks on French Jews) and you can't blame them for feeling that way.

Edited January 12, 2015 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

I want to give this Lassana Bathily a big kiss!

He should have been leading the parade right next to the PM Hollande.

I want to give this Lassana Bathily a big kiss!

Why are we not surprised??

I actually don't think he's very attractive but he is a righteous hero and an example for ALL HUMANITY.

[cup-O-coffee]

A human being did a good deed, not a Muslim. Being a Muslim is incidental and not paramount.

Turning this into a religious, "Lookee what a Muslim did!" only makes matters worse. Truthfully, it is pathetic and rather disgusts me. Celebrating mediocrity by attributing this deed to his religion, or even feeling compelled to identify his religion... to me, is simply a disingenuous media angle to focus attention on good Muslims rather than instead a good human being.

He did not shout "Alla Akbar" when he helped them, and hence I suspect he did it without thinking about his religion, and moreover his natural instincts kicked in and the rest is history. He is no different than any other hero out there, who does not get identified by his or her skin color, race, religion, or even the town where they were raised.

I feel almost as if the media wants me to be persuaded that Muslims are OK people, and pretty cool to be around, when in fact I see him as a human being who did a courageous and heroic deed in the name of his fellow brothers and sisters being in need.

I really hate the mainstream media these days. They are arrogant, manipulative scum, who take a good opportunity to be objective and spoil it with their sick and twisted greediness to promote falsehoods.

Edited January 12, 2015 by cup-O-coffee

[transam]

[Jingthing]

Oh please.

So the media shouldn't report the Islamic Jihadist murder in the grocery was a Muslim and he was there specifically to MURDER JEWS!?!

That's daft.

Of course it is very relevant that the hero in this tragedy which was perpetrated by a Muslim was ALSO a Muslim.

That MUST be told.

[Jingthing]

Less IMAGINE.

More ACTION.

[transam]

Less IMAGINE.

More ACTION.

Perhaps planting a seed leads to something.............Difficult for sure but we must try or just send killers of innocent people to have a chat with "Their" maker.

[orosee]

Its funny to see immigrants complain about other immigrants in their home country. Did you convert to Buddism ? Do you speak the language ? Do you live in a farang getto like Pattaya ?

So many similarities with immigrants in your own country, but its better to put them down of course. I begin to see the English as some of the most racist countries in the world. Next time the Germans must help us beat the English when set up the camps. How the world can change.

I wont bother to argue with you ,your replies are not inteligent enough ,no one cares about a few immegrants in a country i and my fellow English/American ,ect are not settling here in our millions ,demanding special privalages most of us are married to local women ,(who do not have to convert to our faith to be with us) we build a few churches ,but the priests in many of them do not preach hate against Thailand and Bhuddist ways, i dont demand that Stores sell only meat killed in a certain way(by the way neither did the Jews who came to Britain years ago) i had no problem when a small amount of Muslims came to my country and just blended in ,but if you cannot see what is happening in the west then ,what can i say? sorry but people like yourself have nothing to discuss so best we dont.

You seriously didn't know that when you accuse someone of not being "inteligent" (sic), you absolutely must get this one word right. If you do, people will ignore whatever you say about "immegrants", "privalages" and focus on your arguments - which unfortunately you forgot to include in your little rant here.

What nationality are you really?

[cookee68]

He managed to sneak out through a fire escape, why didn't the others just do the same as he did, and why does it have to say Muslim hero, that does not alter anything in my books, about the Muslim religion, what was the hero business mans religion in the other store,

[Jingthing]

He managed to sneak out through a fire escape, why didn't the others just do the same as he did, and why does it have to say Muslim hero, that does not alter anything in my books, about the Muslim religion, what was the hero business mans religion in the other store,

You ask a good question about why others couldn't escape. It should be asked. I am guessing with so many people that they were safer hiding in the storage area and that lots of people trying to escape would actually have been riskier and more likely to be noticed by the terrorist. Also another thought, probably some of them were elderly or weren't really fit enough for such an escape attempt ... traditional European Jewish cooking is not the healthiest way of eating.

Edited January 12, 2015 by Jingthing

[i claudius]

Its funny to see immigrants complain about other immigrants in their home country. Did you convert to Buddism ? Do you speak the language ? Do you live in a farang getto like Pattaya ?

So many similarities with immigrants in your own country, but its better to put them down of course. I begin to see the English as some of the most racist countries in the world. Next time the Germans must help us beat the English when set up the camps. How the world can change.

I wont bother to argue with you ,your replies are not inteligent enough ,no one cares about a few immegrants in a country i and my fellow English/American ,ect are not settling here in our millions ,demanding special privalages most of us are married to local women ,(who do not have to convert to our faith to be with us) we build a few churches ,but the priests in many of them do not preach hate against Thailand and Bhuddist ways, i dont demand that Stores sell only meat killed in a certain way(by the way neither did the Jews who came to Britain years ago) i had no problem when a small amount of Muslims came to my country and just blended in ,but if you cannot see what is happening in the west then ,what can i say? sorry but people like yourself have nothing to discuss so best we dont.

You seriously didn't know that when you accuse someone of not being "inteligent" (sic), you absolutely must get this one word right. If you do, people will ignore whatever you say about "immegrants", "privalages" and focus on your arguments - which unfortunately you forgot to include in your little rant here.

What nationality are you really?

I am so sorry when typing fast my spooling goots very bad

[cookee68]

He managed to sneak out through a fire escape, why didn't the others just do the same as he did, and why does it have to say Muslim hero, that does not alter anything in my books, about the Muslim religion, what was the hero business mans religion in the other store,

You ask a good question about why others couldn't escape. It should be asked. I am guessing with so many people that they were safer hiding in the storage area and that lots of people trying to escape would actually have been riskier and more likely to be noticed by the terrorist.

True, but adding to the fact that they will probably all be killed if found, knowing what happened the days before, me I would have tried to escape as well, because surely had a gunman gone to the freezer, they would have had no where to hide and death would have been the result, and surely that Muslim man would have told them that, my instinct is to survive, and to fight to survive, so I would have tried to escape as well.

[cup-O-coffee]

Oh please.

So the media shouldn't report the Islamic Jihadist murder in the grocery was a Muslim and he was there specifically to MURDER JEWS!?!

That's daft.

Of course it is very relevant that the hero in this tragedy which was perpetrated by a Muslim was ALSO a Muslim.

That MUST be told.

It almost seems like you want them to be Muslim and Jews, when I am pointing out that they are all human beings.

When the adrenaline kicks in, a person becomes very human, and invisible friends, religions and labels are the last thing on ones mind, ...I guarantee it! Only after the dust settles do people hand out credits.

If someone is pumped up on adrenaline, and acts human in a very insanely courageous and brave manner and afterwards, when they come out of shock or the effects of the adrenaline wear off, and only then wants to credit the Sun or the Moon or the stars, then that is their personal choice.

But my point being, the murderers went in with premeditation and a goal. They were braced to do this beforehand, and I don't care that they were thinking they were doing this for Allah or Muhammad. The fact is, when the adrenaline kicked in, they were acting purely on instinct, BUT with the reason being religious.

The hero, on the other hand, did not have time to be briefed on this, or to brace himself. He was hit hard and fast with a situation and when that adrenaline hit him he acted, I submit, purely out of human decency, courageousness and whatever other human characteristics he has which DO NOT come from religion, but are inherently born in all of us.

When the adrenaline hits, we are all human. It is always when the dust settles that the truth gets twisted and credit where credit is due gets misplaced under false pretenses and misguided understanding.

If you want to dismiss that we are all human beings and we all share the common traits and characteristics which, when engaged, consciously and subconsciously send us into a headlong rush towards danger and unimaginable odds... and rather instead credit this all to religion, or race... then I submit you are giving credit where people have to take sides.

When people act out humanely in the name of their fellow man, I have hope... because we can all get along if we think of each other as human. Only then can we judge acts against each other on a common basis.

It is when we give focus to religion and fail to point out the acts of human decency, which transcends all religious bigotry and racism, that we give focus to an inevitable dead end. That is when we judge with error and discriminate against our innate human characteristics.

In summary, this man acted out as a human being, and he happened to be a Muslim... BUT that is not the reason he acted out, in my view. He did not do what he did because he is a Muslim, but because he is a decent human being, pumped up adrenaline... being placed in a high stress and deadly confrontation and not having any time to think about a verse or a prayer.

The murderers, on the other hand, are human beings who forsook their human characteristics and acted out of a perceived ideal, briefings, being able to brace themselves in advance from the religion they embraced. Big difference, here.

Actors on one hand and real people on the other.

The media needs to point out these two differences, and not just one. The media, as the audience, is not affected by this, and as the unaffected audience, uses this human act as a podium to twist the truth and confuse the issue I am on about. They focus on religion being the issue only, instead of the power of humanity overcoming religion.

The message here should be that we, as human beings, need to unite and do some serious cleaning of our deep down, deep seated religious bigotries and racism; ...and what this man did proves that this is possible.

If religions can't support the cause of human survival, and want to make it into an us against them confrontation, then those religions need to be burned to the ground in the name of mankind, and not some sick and twisted invisible imagination.

Just my take on the situation, and it would not have to be so long winded were the media to report things objectively. They are no better than I in this respect.

[cookee68]

Thats the kind of attitude that keeps the haters hating.

And so it should, maybe if all the so called good Muslims were to help with who many of their faith are no good, instead of choosing to remain silent, we would think different, until then they will remain the most hated religion on earth. so add your reply it will make no difference to how people feel

[Jingthing]

He managed to sneak out through a fire escape, why didn't the others just do the same as he did, and why does it have to say Muslim hero, that does not alter anything in my books, about the Muslim religion, what was the hero business mans religion in the other store,

You ask a good question about why others couldn't escape. It should be asked. I am guessing with so many people that they were safer hiding in the storage area and that lots of people trying to escape would actually have been riskier and more likely to be noticed by the terrorist.

True, but adding to the fact that they will probably all be killed if found, knowing what happened the days before, me I would have tried to escape as well, because surely had a gunman gone to the freezer, they would have had no where to hide and death would have been the result, and surely that Muslim man would have told them that, my instinct is to survive, and to fight to survive, so I would have tried to escape as well.

Look the guy had to act quickly. He went with his gut. He's not a trained terrorism response expert. He's just a civilian. Based on all of his actions it is very clear his intentions were to help save those people. It worked out. It may have not worked out but it did. It's so easy to second guess such quick decisions but I don't think that's fair.

[samran]

Thats the kind of attitude that keeps the haters hating.

And so it should, maybe if all the so called good Muslims were to help with who many of their faith are no good, instead of choosing to remain silent, we would think different, until then they will remain the most hated religion on earth. so add your reply it will make no difference to how people feel

A reminder that the cop who got shot in cold blood on the street was also a muslim doing the exact thing you ask. For sure there are many like him.

Undoubtedly there are under cover agents in various countries of the muslim faith also trying to infiltrate these groups to undermine them.

Unfortunately it sounds like nothing short of self flagellation in the town square will be enough for some critics.

Edited January 12, 2015 by samran

[Scott]

Some off-topic posts and replies have been removed.

I don't know that it is constructive to relive the Iraq war or the Israeli/Palestinian situation.

[cookee68]

Thats the kind of attitude that keeps the haters hating.

And so it should, maybe if all the so called good Muslims were to help with who many of their faith are no good, instead of choosing to remain silent, we would think different, until then they will remain the most hated religion on earth. so add your reply it will make no difference to how people feel

A reminder that the cop who got shot in cold blood on the street was also a muslim doing the exact thing you ask. For sure there are many like him.

Undoubtedly there are under cover agents in various countries of the muslim faith also trying to infiltrate these groups to undermine them.

Unfortunately it sounds like nothing short of self flagellation in the town square will be enough for some critics.

I am not saying there isn't, just like the boys who joined the ISIS who came from Cardiff in wales where I come from, their friends and family knew what they was up to, but did they say anything, NO. and they went on to behead westerners, so it could have stopped at home had their friends and family here said something, so we can go around all day, that's my opinion, and many others, and we are entitled to that

[F4UCorsair]

Not at all, but the the perpetrators of such atrocities still represent a minority. Hate terrorists, for they are sullying the faith. Don't tar everyone with the same brush

OK, so when was the last occasion that any of us remember when a Jew, Christian, Hindu, or any religion other than muslim, massacred people IN THE NAME OF RELIGION. I don't recall any, though plenty of crazies did kill people. Charlie's cartoons may have been offensive to members of the religions portrayed, but only those from one religion reacted violently.

The 'religion of permanent offence' is also the religion of permanent intolerance, and has a propensity for unspeakable violence.