Man Detained In Thailand Over Jonbenet Death

[MissAnge]

Did he have a job here in Bangkok? If so, does anyone think that this might be enough to convince schools to do background checks of their teachers?

Then again, who am I kidding....

[sonnyJ]

Hope the DNA tests will be conducted reliably.

SJ's conclusive post seems to point to a sertain profile, also Karr had a previous sexual offence charges/sentence in USA?

Still there's many things very uncertain. Did he do it, did he do it alone???

[sonnyJ]

Police probably have already done DNA tests. They have known about this guy since at least June. There has been plenty of time to do a couple of DNA tests to confirm he is the murderer.

If so, why not get him before. Why not to confirm positive tests to media?

Maybe George gave one point to Taxin?

[sonnyJ]

Did he have a job here in Bangkok? If so, does anyone think that this might be enough to convince schools to do background checks of their teachers?

Then again, who am I kidding....

According FOX, Karr had applied for a teaching position and had interviews arrangent in Thailand. He had recently arrived from Malaysia. This is the main news on FOX today, very big, first time I found that channel a bit usefull atleast..

Yes you have a point there about the schools.

[Thai-Spy]

The Seoul-based GnB English institute said it never employed Karr and that the Web page on which he posted his resume was open for postings by anyone looking for teaching jobs.

"We have never even interviewed him," said Um Dae-jin, an official at GnB in Seoul.

The resume was posted June 22, 2005, and has a photo of Karr in a blue and yellow sweater crouching down at a table next to a young girl.

Indeed you can find the page if you so desire. Do a search on Google for:

"John Karr" GnB

Trying to access the page directly from here doesn't seem to work. Either the content has been hastily taken down or the server is swamped with requests.

You may however view the page as it appears in Google's cache.

[sriracha john]

'Hundreds of e-mails' led to Karr arrest

The investigation that led law enforcement to John Mark Karr can be traced to a single e-mail, sent some four years ago.

Karr sent the correspondence to University of Colorado journalism professor Michael Tracey after viewing the first of three Tracey-produced documentaries on the JonBenet Ramsey case.

Apparently, Karr was intrigued by what he saw and wanted to talk things over with Tracey, a man whose rigorous documentaries have challenged conventional police theories about the case and criticized what he saw as a rush to convict John and Patsy Ramsey in the court of public opinion.

Since then, Karr and Tracey swapped hundreds of e-mails in an exchange that led the Boulder County District Attorney's Office on Wednesday to name Karr as the prime suspect in the murder of 6-year-old JonBenet almost 10 years ago.

"Michael Tracey was instrumental in this investigation," said Susan Stine, a close and longtime Ramsey family friend who spent considerable time with them through Patsy Ramsey's losing battle with cancer.

"He was instrumental in flushing this person out in the sense of getting him to talk," Stine added. "(The suspect) was in e-mail communication with Michael over a period of (time), and that helped to develop the case."

Stine's description of Tracey's role in the case was confirmed by Ollie Gray, a private investigator who was hired by the Ramseys and has worked on the case for years alongside retired Colorado Springs homicide detective Lou Smit.

Tracey, closely aligned with Smit and Gray, was disturbed by the e-mails from Karr and brought the two into the loop on their exchanges, according to Gray.

"We encouraged (Tracey) to continue to communicate with him on it," Gray said.

Gray said he was in possession of a "three-quarter-inch" stack of the e-mails and characterized them broadly: "(The suspect) talked about being there, about doing this and doing that, and knowing this and knowing that - he had a whole bunch of things that didn't come out before. It wasn't part of what the media was allowed to get at before."

Smit, in keeping with his generally by-the-book approach to cases, declined to comment Wednesday, deferring questions to the Boulder DA's office.

"Mary Lacy's in charge of this case," he said.

But Stine said it was Tracey, along with Smit, Gray and their colleague, John Sanagustin, who played a major role in the case long before the Boulder District Attorney's office was involved.

"Lou . . . never stopped looking for the killer," Stine said of the man recently credited with helping reveal that a convicted Colorado Springs killer, Robert Browne, appears to be responsible for perhaps dozens of murders in several states.

"Lou Smit is the hero in all this," Stine said. "Lou Smit stood up against an onslaught of foolish people in Boulder and suffered the consequences for many years.

"Ollie was a big part of this," Stine added. "He and Lou worked together for all this time. They collaborated, they shared ideas, they brainstormed together."

Gray said he and his associates initially struggled to get officials at the Boulder DA's office interested in pursuing the suspect.

It wasn't until he and his associates considered going to Paris - where Karr apparently was sending e-mails at some point - and confronting the suspect themselves that prosecutors "got interested," Gray said.

Boulder prosecutors formally interviewed Tracey sometime in June, Gray said in an interview late Wednesday.

"Then they got ###### serious in a big hurry," Gray added. "I would characterize it this way: I think the DA's office did a great job when they finally got started working on the case, which is what we said needed to be done all along."

Lacy has said she will discuss the details of the case during a news conference today.

- Rocky Mountain News

[jomama]

Did he have a job here in Bangkok? If so, does anyone think that this might be enough to convince schools to do background checks of their teachers?

Then again, who am I kidding....

Typical poor reporting by the Thai press. He arrived in Thailand in June and reportedly sought work as a teacher. BKK TV reporting he worked as a teacher, BBC reporting he appplied for a job at an international school. Which do you believe?

Also, immigration police say he confessed, yet on tape from the immigration detention center shown on CNN, he said he was there when she died. That doesn't mean it was necessarily he who killed her. I am from Colorado (Boulder, actually) and we know this story too well. I agree with another poster about the "kidnapping note" that said the kidnappers were terrorists holding her. In all a very strange note that the FBI and police said closely resembled the mother's handwriting. The day after the child was "kidnapped" the mother was still wearing the formal dress she wore to a dinner party the night before, yet she was known for her fastidiousness. She claims she got up that morning and put the formal dress back on -- is that what you would wear Christmas morning? A dirty, formal dress from the night before? It had all the appearances that she was up all night the night JonBenet died. And on and on.

I think this recent development is curious indeed, but we'll just have to wait and see.

[corkscrew]

PETALUMA, California (AP) -- John Mark Karr displayed a deep fascination with JonBenet Ramsey for years before he was arrested in her death on Thursday in Thailand.

Karr, who told reporters Thursday that he was "with JonBenet when she died" but that "her death was an accident," began teaching children in Georgia and Alabama before he became a substitute in Petaluma, a wine country town where he lived until 2001 with his wife and three sons.

The Denver Post reported that Karr, 41, had faced child pornography charges. His father, Wexford Karr of Atlanta, told the newspaper his son had told him he was behind bars in connection with the Ramsey case.

Sonoma County Chief Deputy District Attorney Joan Risse confirmed the pornography charges and an outstanding arrest warrant against a John M. Karr, though she said she didn't know if he was the same person held in JonBenet's 1996 death in the child's Colorado home.

Lara Karr of Petaluma, who divorced Karr in 2001, told KGO-TV in San Francisco that he often spent time reading up on the cases of Ramsey and Petaluma resident Polly Klaas, who was abducted and slain in 1993.

His father told The Denver Post that while Karr was in college as an adult, a professor encouraged him to write a book about the Ramsey case after being impressed with a school paper.

"He researched everything he could about her," Wexford Karr said.

John Karr spoke with JonBenet's grandparents, but the Ramseys refused an interview, Wexford Karr said.

He said he feared his son may have been dead before hearing about the arrest in Thailand because he hadn't heard from him in several years.

John Karr declined Thursday to say what his connection was to the Ramsey family.

An attorney for the Ramseys said Karr once lived near the family in Conyers, Georgia, but the Ramseys moved to Colorado when JonBenet was a baby.

The head of Thailand's immigration police, Lt. Gen. Suwat Tumrongsiskul, quoted Karr as saying that he tried to kidnap JonBenet for $118,000 ransom but that the plan went awry and he strangled her. "He said he was in love with the child, she was a pageant queen," Suwat said. (Watch police say Karr confessed -- 14:54)

Two resumes posted online with Karr's name and picture offered possible clues to his whereabouts after he left California.

Starting in 2001, one resume said, Karr was a private teacher and caregiver in Germany, the Netherlands, South Korea, Costa Rica and Honduras, almost always working with young children. The other resume was less detailed.

The longer resume said that in Germany he cared for two girls, ages 5 and 8, and a boy, 10, getting them ready for school and helping with homework.

"At days end, I made sure the children had their evening bath, then put them to bed and read to them before they went to sleep," the resume said.

From 2004-05, the resume said, he worked as a second-grade teacher in Honduras.

The authenticity of the resumes could not be confirmed. An English institute removed the shorter resume from its Web site Thursday in response to a reporter's query, citing concerns about bad publicity. A call to the administrator of the site with the longer resume was not immediately returned Thursday.

Karr, a short, thin blond with a Southern accent, had a valid California teaching credential and passed the background check that included submitting his fingerprints to the Department of Justice to make sure he had no criminal record, Sonoma County school officials said.

But his desire to teach didn't translate into ability, according to one administrator.

Bob Raines, superintendent and principal at Wilson Elementary School outside Petaluma, twice hired Karr as a substitute in second- and fourth-grade classes in 2001. After observing him, Raines said he concluded Karr hadn't been trained, had poor skills keeping classes focused and was ineffective.

"He just seemed like somebody who thought he wanted to be a teacher," Raines said. "After a few days, I could see it just wasn't for him."

He instructed his secretary not to call Karr again unless they were desperate.

A couple months later, Sonoma sheriff's officials sent a letter to school officials saying Karr had been arrested, said Carl Wong, the Sonoma County superintendent of schools.

John and Lara Karr's former Petaluma neighbor, Sylvia Ross, said she occasionally asked him over to her house to fix her computer.

"Personality-wise, I think there was a little kink that I saw," said Ross, a retired schoolteacher and real estate agent. He was "too friendly, too talkative, too inquisitive."

A law enforcement source, speaking on condition of anonymity, told the AP that while overseas Karr had been communicating periodically with somebody in Boulder who was cooperating with law enforcement officials.

A spokesman for the University of Colorado, Barrie Hartman, confirmed that journalism professor Michael Tracey, communicated with Karr over several months and contacted police.

[sriracha john]

John Mark Karr, 41, served for 11 days as a substitute teacher for Petaluma City Schools from Dec. 8, 2000 to April 2, 2001, said Steve Bolman, the district’s deputy superintendent of business and administration.

Karr taught at several district schools, and in 2001 was charged with five counts of possessing child pornography. His teaching credential was suspended and then revoked for violating the education code, according to KGO-TV in San Francisco. He is still wanted in California for failing to appear on those charges.

Karr and his wife at the time, Laura, married in 1989 and lived in Alabama before moving to Petaluma in 2000. He began teaching in Petaluma and Napa, and Petaluma City Schools received no complaints about his work. Laura Karr filed for divorce in 2001, after he was charged with possessing pornography.

- Petaluma Argus Courier

[sonnyJ]

- Rocky Mountain News

Seems very indicting, if correct.

Problem is that nobody in the family ever said he had ever visited the home. Most did't even know him. That would have required more than one intrusions for him to know the building to do what police seems to think he did perform there. If he acted alone.

DNA will be so simple in this case. Total match. -And closed.

[ChiangMaiThai]

that pic is kinda creepy - looks like a bobble head.

listening to this story now in the US is a bit sickening. "Thailand,

notorious for sex and child trafficing....". Geeze - this guy and

Thailand are both being protrayed as guilty until proven innocent.

It's sick how the US media portrays Thailand. Always notorious for prostitution and child trafficking. When they report on a domestic story, they should begin by reminding us that the US is notorious for the world's highest incarceration rate, the home of the world's sickest serial murderers and rapists and the home of the highest rates of drug use in the history of mankind. Oh I forgot, America is superior to all.

In my haste, I forgot the highest rates of obesity in the history of mankind, the most medicated population in the history of mankind and I would venture to say the highest rates of depression in the history of mankind. Prostitution and a problem with people trafficking pales in comparison.

Edited August 17, 2006 by ChiangMaiThai

[sonnyJ]

that pic is kinda creepy - looks like a bobble head.

listening to this story now in the US is a bit sickening. "Thailand,

notorious for sex and child trafficing....". Geeze - this guy and

Thailand are both being protrayed as guilty until proven innocent.

It's sick how the US media portrays Thailand. Always notorious for prostitution and child trafficking. When they report on a domestic story, they should begin by reminding us that the US is notorious for the world's highest incarceration rate, the home of the world's sickest serial murderers and rapists and the home of the highest rates of drug use in the history of mankind. Oh I forgot, America is superior to all.

In my haste, I forgot the highest rates of obesity in the history of mankind, the most medicated population in the history of mankind and I would venture to say the highest rates of depression in the history of mankind. Prostitution and a problem with people trafficking pales in comparison.

Yep

FOX the guy was talking to the reporter in London. You know Bangkok is the worlds center of sex crimes, the FOX lady in London said, No, I didn't.

I'm stuck with FOX, what can I do, well the Indian news channel usually has english news and not only "around the world in 80 secs" ones per day.

Edited August 17, 2006 by sonnyJ

[dotcom]

I completely agree that this is a horrendous murder but it's imposssible to call the arrested man a murderer before he has been tried...I was referring to the fact that he is wanted on other sex-related charges..

The A hole has confessed. He did it. Case solved.

[sonnyJ]

PETALUMA, California (AP)

Would have some value, if the peoples comments are not from today/strongly biased.

Just wondering?

[John K]

Ahhh a twist in the story as the plot thickens. Did he want to take a fall?

Ex-Wife Gives Alibi for JonBenet Suspect

BANGKOK, Thailand (AP) - A former American school teacher said publicly Thursday that he was with JonBenet Ramsey when she died in what he called ``an accident,'' a stunning admission after a decade without answers in the 6-year-old girl's murder. But the suspect's ex-wife said she was with him in Alabama at the time of JonBenet's 1996 death.

John Mark Karr, 41, will be taken within the week to Colorado, where he will face charges of first-degree murder, kidnapping and child sexual assault, Ann Hurst of the Department of Homeland Security told a news conference in Bangkok.

``I was with JonBenet when she died,'' Karr told reporters afterward, visibly nervous and stuttering. ``Her death was an accident.''

Asked if he was innocent of the crime, Karr said: ``No.''

As he was escorted to his guesthouse to pick up his belongings, Karr told The Associated Press: ``I am so very sorry for what happened to JonBenet. It's very important for me that everyone knows that I love her very much, that her death was unintentional, that it was an accident.''

Asked what happened when JonBenet died, he said: ``It would take several hours to describe that. It's a very involved series of events that would involve a lot of time. It's very painful for me to talk about it.''

He told the AP he made ``several efforts to communicate with Patricia before she passed away,'' referring to JonBenet's mother, who died in June, ``and it is my understanding that she did read my letters.''

No evidence against Karr has been made public beyond his own admission. U.S. and Thai officials did not directly answer a question at the news conference Thursday about whether there was DNA evidence connecting him to the crime.

Karr's ex-wife, Lara Karr, told KGO-TV in California that she was with her former husband in Alabama at the time of JonBenet's killing and she does not believe her former husband was involved in the homicide.

She said her ex-husband spent a lot of time studying the cases of Ramsey and Polly Klaas, who was abducted from her Petaluma, Calif., home and slain in 1993.

Karr on Thursday refused to say what his connection was to the Ramsey family. An attorney for the Ramsey family said Wednesday that Karr once lived near the family in Conyers, Ga.

Lt. Gen. Suwat Tumrongsiskul, head of Thailand's immigration police, said Karr confessed to the killing after his arrest by Thai and U.S. authorities Wednesday at his downtown Bangkok guesthouse.

Suwat said Karr insisted that JonBenet died during a kidnapping attempt that went awry.

``He said it was second-degree murder. He said it was unintentional,'' Suwat said. ``He said he loved this child, that he was in love with her. He said she was very pretty, a pageant queen. She was the school star, she was very cute and sweet.''

Suwat quoted Karr as saying he tried to kidnap JonBenet for a $118,000 ransom but that his plan went awry and he strangled her.

JonBenet was found beaten and strangled in the basement of the family's home in Boulder, Colo., on Dec. 26, 1996.

Patsy Ramsey reported finding a ransom note in the house demanding $118,000 for her daughter.

Images of the blonde girl competing in child beauty pageants helped propel the case into one of the highest-profile mysteries in the United States.

DNA was found beneath JonBenet's fingernails and inside her underwear, but Lin Wood, the family's longtime attorney, said two years ago that detectives were unable to match it to anyone in an FBI database.

A law-enforcement source told the AP on condition of anonymity that Karr had been communicating periodically with somebody in Boulder who had been following the case and cooperating with law-enforcement officials.

A University of Colorado spokesman, Barrie Hartman, said journalism professor Michael Tracey communicated with Karr over several months and contacted police. The university spokesman said he didn't know what prompted Tracey to become suspicious of Karr.

Tracey produced a documentary in 2004 called ``Who Killed JonBenet?'' A woman who answered the phone at a number under his name said he didn't live there anymore; his office phone mailbox was full.

Investigators said at one point that JonBenet's parents were under an ``umbrella of suspicion'' in the slaying, and some news accounts cast suspicion on JonBenet's older brother, Burke. But the Ramseys insisted an intruder killed their daughter, and no one was ever charged.

Over the years, some experts suggested that investigators had botched the case so thoroughly that it might never be solved. The Ramseys moved back to Atlanta after their daughter's slaying.

``It's been a very long 10 years, and I'm just sorry Patsy isn't here for me to hug her neck,'' Wood said.

``John and Patsy lived their lives knowing they were innocent, trying to raise a son despite the furor around them,'' he told MSNBC.

The Ramseys learned that police were investigating Karr at least a month before Patsy Ramsey's death from ovarian cancer, the family said.

In a statement Wednesday, John Ramsey said that if his wife had lived to see Karr's arrest, she ``would no doubt have been as pleased as I am with today's development almost 10 years after our daughter's murder.''

Bob Raines, principal at Wilson Elementary School outside Petaluma, said he twice hired Karr as a substitute in second- and fourth-grade classes in 2001. After observing him, Raines said he concluded Karr hadn't been trained, had poor skills keeping classes focused and was ineffective.

A couple months later, Sonoma County sheriff's officials sent a letter to school officials saying Karr had been arrested, said Carl Wong, the Sonoma County superintendent of schools.

Sonoma County Chief Deputy District Attorney Joan Risse confirmed the child pornography charges and arrest warrant against a John Mark Karr, though she cautioned that she didn't know if he was the same person held Bangkok. State records show Karr lost his teaching credential in 2002.

Police said Karr had been living in a dormitory-style guesthouse called The Blooms in a neighborhood of massage parlors and travel agents that cater to expatriate residents and sex tourists.

Suwat said U.S. authorities informed Thai police on Aug. 11 that an arrest warrant had been issued for Karr on charges of premeditated murder. The warrant was sent to Thai police on Wednesday.

``Through investigation we were able to determine where his residence was and the Thais arrested him,'' Hurst said. ``He did not resist. He did express surprise.''

Hurst said Karr has been ``very cooperative'' with authorities and that he's shown a ``variety of emotions.''

Suwat said Karr arrived in Bangkok on June 6 from Malaysia to look for a teaching job. It was not clear whether he had gotten a job, the police officer said.

Karr's visa has been revoked for being an ``undesirable person'' after the accusations against him, and U.S. authorities were expected to take him to the United States in the next few days, Suwat said.

Hurst, with U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement in Bangkok, said that Karr had left the United States several years ago and had not returned.

[rijkard]

http://www.job4teacher.com/Candidates/JohnKarr.html

Here is his resume and I know I saw this back when I was hiring

teachers. Even made a comment then that I thought it was a bit odd:

[space cowboy]

somethings smells about this guy. First impression is a weirdo that might not have done it. I hope he is the guy but early reporting is a bit strange, typical perhaps but if it is possible to be too weird to have done this then this guy fits the bill.

[onlooker]

It'll be interesting to see if the Christian school on Sathorn Rd where he was apparently working manages to come out of this unscathed.

[dotcom]

Wonder if we will ever find out: a) When was this guy arrested? & B Arrested for what? Radio Thailand reporting he might be wanted for some crimes in Calif.

Edited August 17, 2006 by dotcom

[sonnyJ]

It'll be interesting to see if the Christian school on Sathorn Rd where he was apparently working manages to come out of this unscathed.

Can you let us know the name of this school? Being some new information. Source if possible?

[peterjackson]

Hey

I just hope his DNA matches the 'foreign DNA' left at the crime scene.

I can see some Defence Attorney, turning this into a 'bravado' defence, given the research that Mr Karr did on this case.

I can't believe the covert surveillance operation didn't give them rise to 'capture' some DNA for testing prior to this arrest and what is now turning into an international media circus.

His ex-wife has nothing to gain by saying that he has an alibi for the night in question.

The way the US media are portraying Bangkok is a disgrace.

If it is proved conclusively that he committed this horrendous crime, he certainly deserves the death penalty, but I want to see the DNA comparison as a matter of urgency.

Kind regards

Peter

[fruittbatt]

somethings smells about this guy. First impression is a weirdo that might not have done it. I hope he is the guy but early reporting is a bit strange, typical perhaps but if it is possible to be too weird to have done this then this guy fits the bill.

His ex-wife claims that he was with her at the time the little girl was murdered

[JimsKnight]

somethings smells about this guy. First impression is a weirdo that might not have done it. I hope he is the guy but early reporting is a bit strange, typical perhaps but if it is possible to be too weird to have done this then this guy fits the bill.

His ex-wife claims that he was with her at the time the little girl was murdered

Took em long enough to get him! How long has he been in Thailand for? since 1996???!

[GoodHeart]

that pic is kinda creepy - looks like a bobble head.

listening to this story now in the US is a bit sickening. "Thailand,

notorious for sex and child trafficing....". Geeze - this guy and

Thailand are both being protrayed as guilty until proven innocent.

It's sick how the US media portrays Thailand. Always notorious for prostitution and child trafficking. When they report on a domestic story, they should begin by reminding us that the US is notorious for the world's highest incarceration rate, the home of the world's sickest serial murderers and rapists and the home of the highest rates of drug use in the history of mankind. Oh I forgot, America is superior to all.

In my haste, I forgot the highest rates of obesity in the history of mankind, the most medicated population in the history of mankind and I would venture to say the highest rates of depression in the history of mankind. Prostitution and a problem with people trafficking pales in comparison.

Right on! I'm sick, too, of how the media's been so quick to roll the beauty pagent reels of this child.

[jdinasia]

somethings smells about this guy. First impression is a weirdo that might not have done it. I hope he is the guy but early reporting is a bit strange, typical perhaps but if it is possible to be too weird to have done this then this guy fits the bill.

His ex-wife claims that he was with her at the time the little girl was murdered

Took em long enough to get him! How long has he been in Thailand for? since 1996???!

or since June if you had read any of the stories

Edited August 17, 2006 by jdinasia

[ronz28]

His ex-wife has nothing to gain by saying that he has an alibi for the night in question.

Purpose of the alibi- a partner in the crime trying to cover her tracks?

[divndave]

this is a link to the story from MSNBC with Pictures

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14379566/?GT1=8404

[sonnyJ]

somethings smells about this guy. First impression is a weirdo that might not have done it. I hope he is the guy but early reporting is a bit strange, typical perhaps but if it is possible to be too weird to have done this then this guy fits the bill.

His ex-wife claims that he was with her at the time the little girl was murdered

Well not on FOX, yet. We've been waiting for that.

[fruittbatt]

His ex-wife has nothing to gain by saying that he has an alibi for the night in question.

Purpose of the alibi- a partner in the crime trying to cover her tracks?

she claims to have divorced him after he was charged with possession of pornography, so that doesn't sound much like a "partner in crime": more like a partner in disgust and disbelief...

[sriracha john]

http://www.job4teacher.com/Candidates/JohnKarr.html

Here is his resume and I know I saw this back when I was hiring

teachers. Even made a comment then that I thought it was a bit odd:

That IS odd that he claimed to hold all these positions at one school simultaneously:

1. Grade 2 Homeroom Teacher

2. Computer Technology Teacher

3. Director of English

4. Librarian