Crackdown On "farang" Teachers

[bodhran]

....and whilst we're at it how about background checks on politicians?

known criminal associations

fraudelent business transactions

evidence of corruption

Lets sweep the country clean of "undesirables"

If this were to happen Thailand would be empty.

[Silvercharm]

Screening of alien teachers to be tougher

JonBenet Ramsey case arrest prompts rethink

POST REPORTERS

The Education Ministry next week will discuss with the International Schools Association how to toughen the screening of foreigners who apply for teaching jobs following the detention of a suspect in a high-profile murder, says education permanent secretary Kasama Varavarn. The move follows the arrest of John Karr, an American school teacher alleged to have murdered child beauty queen JonBenet Ramsey in 1996.

Karr had worked as an English teacher at a school in Sathon district before leaving the job about two weeks ago.

Currently, schools need to check only the qualifications of foreign applicants and are required to refer them to the Office of the Private Education Commission which then does the cross-checking with overseas universities where the foreign applicants graduated.

The agency will also ask Special Branch police and the National Intelligence Agency to investigate the backgrounds and history of the applicants.

I'm rather confused about this, especially the first paragraph in this section. Every applicant is checked for qualifications and another cross-check given by the PEC? If this is true, how could backpackers possibly be employed who have earned their "degree" from Kao San University. Regarding the NIA investigations, while it looks good on paper, the expense for each and every applicant and the monumental process involved would take a very long time for an applicant to be hired.

Once they have been cleared, the Office of Private Education will give their employment the go-ahead.

However, after the arrest of Karr, schools will be instructed to deal directly with Special Branch police in examining the foreign applicants' backgrounds, Khunying Kasama said.

Anusorn Thaidecha, director of the Office of the Private Education Commission, said he will ask the Immigration Office and the Foreign Ministry to tighten the process of issuing visas to foreign nationals and will request blacklists of dangerous people to check.

Great idea and in the end a small percentage will be refused entry. There still remains a smaller percentage of foreign nationals who have not committed crimes in their home country, who possess the required credentials, education, and experience and might be here for more sinister reasons. There is no sure way to keep these people out. By all means, this does not only apply to teachers.

Jakkrapob Penkair, deputy secretary to the prime minister in charge of education, said a lot of foreigners holding tourist visas prefer to apply to become school teachers in Thailand. They make money out of teaching English as a sideline to pay for expenses during their stay in Thailand, he said.

Immigration chief Suwat Thamrongsrisakul said international schools can check the backgrounds of foreigners applying for teaching jobs themselves by searching the Internet for the names of suspects in child sexual abuse cases provided by the US.

Very true. There are numerous ways to check sexual predators in the states. California, for example, has an extensive website that allows anyone to search for registered sex offenders in California. Other states also have websites that allow the public to search these records. Again, not everyone has been caught and for a person to be on these websites, they must have a conviction first.

Pol Lt-Gen Suwat also ordered two policemen to stay with Karr in prison to prevent him committing suicide.

Education Minister Chaturon Chaisaeng said the international school in Sathon district should not be faulted for accepting Karr as a teacher as it had had no in-depth information of the man.

Panicha Tulwattana, a personnel officer at Bangkok Christian College, said Karr had taught lower primary students for a month before he was asked to resign. He looked suspicious and was always too strict with his students. A teacher said Karr behaved abnormally in class. He punished students unable to finish in-class assignments by forbidding them to go to the toilet.

Unfortunately, there is no 100% safeguard anywhere in the world to keep sexual predators out of not only classrooms, but any society as a whole. It has been suggested that applicants have a degree in education, have a teaching license, have the proper credentials, and maybe the problem will go away. This holds no water and is totally absurd. When looking back within the past few years at the foreign nationals who have been arrested for crimes against children, the majority had the education degrees, the teaching license and credentials. The problem as it relates to child abuse/exploitation is not relative as to whether or not someone is qualified or not; they come in all walks and styles of life, and it is not only teachers. IJWT stated this is another knee-jerk reaction, and I must agree with him. They are confusing and compounding two totally unrelated areas; sexual abuse and qualifications, into one category. I cannot find any correlation between the two.

Edited August 19, 2006 by Silvercharm

[PeaceBlondie]

After reading about the first 40 posts in this topic, I'm bursting to say something:

No, Thailand does not need to install a system where EVERY farang teacher-tutor-babysitter needs a B.Ed. and a teacher's license. Universities and rajabats don't even need those. International schools, fine (they already have high requirements). Other Thai schools, absolutely not. All over BKK and the provinces, teachers without B.Ed. or teacher's licenses from their home country, teachers even without a bachelor's degree, often do quite well teaching English as a foreign language. And the amazing Mr. Carr, who appears to be insane and a liar, seems to have met the requirements (without being able to last more than a few weeks at any school throughout his questionable resume).

Over 90% of Thai schools and private language centers would never pay more than 40K/month for a teacher, if he had an Ed.D. from Harvard or Oxford. Hardly any farang professional educator would work here for less than 100K/month.

Many farang teachers of EFL in Thailand are from the UK, and we've already heard that it's not as easy as it sounds for a Thai school to verify the CRB of a UK worker. Then there's the USA, Ireland, Canada, Singapore, South Africa, and several more that each of us always forgets, not to mention teachers from Sierra Leone, Austria, Netherlands, etc.

I can't imagine a major education reform in Thailand that would take less than 5 years to do halfheartedly, even if the MoE, the prime minister's cabinet, and the majority of the schools wanted it.

Please, my fellow farang: the way Mrs. Kinsman was certified to teach me kindergarten when she finished university in 1922, or my daughter was certified in 1988 in Texas, is not the way it's going to be done in Thailand. The system is not that thorough or pedantic; they don't really want to have to hire teachers who demand triple the average salary that's currently being paid.

Speaking of salaries, many Thai teachers earn more baht in a year than the average farang teacher, if you deduct the farang teacher's additional expenses, and add in the value of the Thai teacher's pension and other benefits.

[thaigene2]

Incidentally, it seems from the articles that it isn't the qualifications of the guy that should have been an issue, but his criminal record. Why isn't there a call for police background checks? Answer: It simply wouldn't work in the "plan at the last minute" world of Thai schools.

Yes..ironic isn't it. The people who own and run the schools come from an education system where they weren't taught to think - just to copy notes from a book or blackboard - and then regurgitate. So then they have to hire teachers from countries where they were taught to think, who then have to leave the country because no one 'thought' to check on their qualifications in the first place. TOT.

[aussimike]

All I can say is that this is already in place - the MoE introduced stiffer regulations about 2 months ago. I can quote from experience that there are a lot of teachers here working or applying for jobs with no experience or qualifications apart from the fact that they can speak englilsh = not necessary to even be able to write properly, just as long as you can speak the native tongue. I am responsible for employing native and local teachers at my school and the quality of some amazes me, and its no wonder that the Thai students have problems learning english and let alone speaking as the accent as so strong with many teachers from the Phillipines teaching english here.

Good case in point is those out there with qualifications from Trinity College - located in Spain and where you can get any degree online for the small sum of about 25 pund UK -- anything you like except MD, amazing.

Then there are the local english schools who have teachers working for them who have no experience apart from being an English speaker, and these guys use there positions as teachers to find ladies either thru the classroom or online and offer them private lessons in their own rooms, my lady friend has had this experience with Brit Council where she contacted a teacher from this organization and he tried to convince her to take private lessons with him, but she is a little smarter than that. Also some of the religious schools who conduct English lessons but use Missionaries from the US to conduct classes and teach just from the book, no experience, and some very young.

[PeaceBlondie]

Checking a Teachers Certificate in Texas is free for anyone to access in Texas at the State Board for Teacher Certification (SBEC) Website. https://secure.sbec.state.tx.us/SBECONLINE/virtcert.asp Just input a name such as Jane A Smith and click on the name for details. Forge all you want...if your not listed you don't have a real Texas certificate.... Texas alone has over 4.4 million students and 300,000 teachers so it takes something like this to keep out the bad apples.

Stroke of genius! My daughter has a unique name, and I typed it in, and bingo -

Texas Educator Certificate

This certifies that - M------ R------ PeaceBlondie

has fulfilled requirements of state law and regulations of the

State Board for Educator Certification

and is hereby authorized to perform duties as designated below:

PROVISIONAL

Description Effective Date Expiration Date Status

Secondary Science Composite 05/14/1988 Life Valid

Grades (6-12)

Official Record of Certification

Friday, August 18, 2006

But there are 50 states of the USA, over a dozen provinces of Canada, lots of states or provinces of Australia and NZ, etc.

Notice, also, that my daughter's details include the speciality for which she's qualified (by subject and age of students), date issued, etc.

Let's hear it for Texas.

[Beavis and Butthead]

I have to say this is a good move... teachers with no qualfications have no business working in Thailand.. it's about time they cleaned this up.

The only people who should be scared are the ones with no real degree and no formal teaching qualifications.. about time they sorted out the backpacker teachers here.

Bingo dude, I couldn't have said it better myself

[Beavis and Butthead]

I am writing from Boulder, Colorado, where the locals are all rejoicing in the recent arrest.

What I think is being overlooked- unless I didn't read so carefully- is that background checks are useless when the police don't know who committed the crime. The police had a much more difficult time solving this case, then in reeling in the accused.

So, the only answer to this issue, in my eyes, is acceptance that the world isn't always a safe place. Acceptance that the guy next door, or the teacher of your kids, might have done something "bad" or "wrong" in the past. And simply hope that such behavior doesn't continue. We can try to protect ourselves, yet all attempts will be truly limited.

I bet if even the most perceptive parents had met this guy they would never have thought what he could do wrong. And, I suspect that this was a one-time crime for this guy. He wasn't exactly some psycho pedophyle who enjoyed playing with kid's private parts, cutting them up, and eating them for dinner. He was just a stupid-arse criminal who was looking for easy money and panicked when his plan didn't unfold the way he expected. More than likely he learned his lesson, which is why he was in BKK working rather than making a living off of kidnapping foreigners in Thailand (which would probably be easy enough to do).

Final analysis: Don't panic. Everything is fine.

They might be rejoicing in Boulder but this guy had nothing to do with the murder. He is just obsessed with the Jonbenet case and no doubt seriously mentally ill. This guy needs help. The guy is not a killer. Their is no evidence whatsoever linking this guy to the crime. His is guilty of being a pathological liar however. We've all known people like this, Bangkok is full of them as is the world

Edited August 19, 2006 by Beavis and Butthead

[johnwills]

I have to say this is a good move... teachers with no qualfications have no business working in Thailand.. it's about time they cleaned this up.

The only people who should be scared are the ones with no real degree and no formal teaching qualifications.. about time they sorted out the backpacker teachers here.

Why do you think having a degree is necessary??? I do not have a degree but I am more than qualified to teach English as a second language. I have met many stupid degree educated people in my time, it is just a piece of paper saying that you spent 3 years partying and managed to fit in some study around that time :c).

[BlackJack]

Thailand has become a haven for foreign criminals and sexual deviants.

I would like to see the visa amount substantially increased for those acquiring one year visas, a termination of the visa runs and government agencies established for those wishing to apply to stay in the Kingdom short term maybe excluding those on holiday. Companies, schools being fined or closed down if discovered employing illegal stayers, criminals and sexual deviants. Employers knowing or not knowing.

From each home country a special document is available from police confirming there is nothing or something on file about applicants. I have one myself, from Scotland Yard London police. Cost £10, 40 days for issue.

yes Koh sarn road has them too

[Thaible]

Great! I don't have to worry about my future kids being taught by criminals.

Why would any farang be against that? Hmmm....

[GoodHeart]

There is also a big resentment from Thai teachers as the farang get mega-wages like 30,000 a month.

Mega-wages? In that case, what would you call the teachers at Intl. schools I know of raking in 145,000 Bt a month?

No wait, lemme guess- mega-mega-mak-mak-mak-wages

[littlebritain]

So let me get this straight ! According to the new laws they are 'going' to impose if you have qualifications,it means you are less likely to be a sex offender ? If you have a fake degree then you could be a danger to children ?

Yes I agree a lot of 'Brits' do have fak credentials but this guys credentials were good but yet again...he is American !

[littlebritain]

I have to say this is a good move... teachers with no qualfications have no business working in Thailand.. it's about time they cleaned this up.

The only people who should be scared are the ones with no real degree and no formal teaching qualifications.. about time they sorted out the backpacker teachers here.

Bingo dude, I couldn't have said it better myself

Sorry BB I have to slightyly disagree with you.IF they ever decide to get rid of all the teachers without qualifacations then they would be without about 60% of the teachers they have now.I worked in a school a few years ago and one of the teachers was a prof from America and another one a butchher from Birmingham.......and by far the butcher was the best teacher in the school.Which goes to show that just because you do not originally come from a teaching background does not mean you can't learn.Everyone needs a chance to better themselves and the only people in the wrong are not the ones with fake qualifications but the craved creatures who come here for sexual pleasure......with children ! I think you would find that a lot of backpackers are not here for that reason. Also I have the required qualifactions and if we go your way then I also think if you do not have a teaching related degree then also you should be not allowed to teach...Just my opinion

[GoodHeart]

Background checks are a waste of time - it's so easy for a criminal to get a new passport and identity.

And when they outlaw guns- only criminals will have guns, right?

Background checks certainly ARE valid because the vast majority of applicants will be honest individuals applying with valid documents. If it is easy for criminals or socially deviant persons to acquire false documents that is an issue for law enforcment agencies to address.

( the 'hush hush' topic of whether the teacher is lusting after students.

I'm glad you addressed that. I believe there is a psychlogical test, similar in nature to a polygraph, that can identify paedophiles by means of showing them images of children in various states of play and dress, this is done while monitoring the adults vital signs. Does anyone know the name of this test?

I do not have a degree but I am more than qualified to teach English as a second language. I have met many stupid degree educated people in my time, it is just a piece of paper saying that you spent 3 years partying and managed to fit in some study around that time :c).

Why not tone down your rhetoric. Since without the degree you're not qualified to posit on the merit of your innate abilities, or lack thereof.

Which, coincidentally, is so evidently lacking in your "partying for 3 years" comment. Perhaps YOU were so busy doing just that that you burned out in year 3 and faded away. That may explain why you never realised- or can acknowledge- the people continuing on to years 4 or 5 who WERE applying themselves seriously to their academics. Normally, people holding degrees are proud of the efforts they made in acquiring them, the virtues embodied in them, and the value of holding them. Just a thought.

Party on, dude...

Edited August 19, 2006 by GoodHeart

[billzant]

The UK have only just started to get to grips with the background checks on staff in schools following some high profile lapses (knee & elbow jerk I think). All staff now have to have Crminal Record (CRB) checks, for which you are given a certificate if passed. It would certainly be easy enough for the Thai's to insist upon production of this certificate and make follow up checks in the UK if required. Not sure what systems are in place in US or Oz etc. Only this robust approach will prevent undesireable individuals fleeing to Thailand to find a safe teaching haven.

Dear Charma,

Robust approach?? It is my view that these checks in the UK are a money-making operation for the outside consultancy that is charged with doing them, and are just part of the general meaningless "watch-your-back" cover-all solutions that exist in the UK. In the case of Soham was the check robust?

I agree that it is not good for Thailand to become a dumping ground for western paedophile teachers, but how much evidence is there of that? One American teacher caught for an act he committed outside of Thailand. In this case doesn't it appears that the Thai proceedures have worked?

From what little I know there are some western teachers in Thailand especially in language schools for whom a quaification check might be in order but a rose-coloured view of apparently robust Britih proceedures would do nothing but create worse bureaucracy.

It is a difficult problem with no easy solution.

Hope you are keeping well,

All the Best

Bill Z

[souldesire]

So there is to be a full check on all teachers because of one guy who,as far as we know, committed no crime ? Will bar owners be next?

What about minor offences in the past(obviously not sexual) like drunk and disorderly,

driving offences (not me of course )?

Yes, a lot of people came over here to start new lives and 'better themselves' so why should someone be refused a job because of a traffic offence years ago?(in a country where a 'traffic offence' is non-existent)

It could happen

The words nut, hammer and crack spring to mind

[mijan24]

"All teachers in Thailand must have the same career standard, no matter what nationalities they are.

I wonder what that will result in!?!!?!?!

The result is that many Thais & Farangs will jump on the "Teacher" bashing bandwagon without understanding the situation.

Please note I said "Teacher" do not for one moment think this will be limited to "TEFL Teachers/Instructors?Coaches" or whatever they are called to circumvent the "Qualification Requirements" (Whatever they may be)?

You have all sorts of odd characters here in Thailand and now all of a sudden everyone is screaming for "better" checking or at least some checking - is this to apply to "Bar Owners" too - of course don't be daft - who could they possibly corrupt/abuse/influence ? - Yet this "guy" who has done what in Thailand? - is being vilified by all and sundry for something that he may or maynot have been involved in.* - Which of course begs the question - Do Thais have to undergo a criminal/background check - Which is not such a silly question when you think of the "Thais" that were red carded for false qualifications after the elections several years ago - and Mr Chuwit what a wonderful resume he must have presented (do not forget he was the one who alleged he was bribing the police) oh sorry he is not a teacher so thats probably OK.

Behind this mask lays a ???? - who really knows what the next person has or has not to hide????

Is this the end of the TEFL schools? Visa run businesses?

[richard10365]

I had a 45 year old Thai teacher introduce me to his 26 year old wife and his 11 year old son. I wonder what his background check looked like.

[animatic]

Kozi,

so you're saying,

if a school employs someone with forged credentials,

that is a peadophile, but they don't know it,

because he passed background checks,

then that school should be closed down.

Seems to me that most schools are given little enough

budget, for teaching and materials, let alone that

they really can afford the intensive, international

background checks needed to meet this standard.

So if they can't do it, close'm down.

Of course the students are left out in the cold.

But at least they ain't being diddled, by some scumbag.

I agree with the PM sneezes and the rules change comment.

It IS so sad that one bad farang seems to reflect

so strongly on ALL farangs.

When in reality, this individual is a true aberation in the farang

community in THEIR opinion

As far significantly raising year visa fees, to keep out criminals,

well that dog don't hunt.

moderate income honest people will no longer afford coming,

and criminals by their nature will have more money...

since they stole it... this won't solve that problem.

I dislike the 3 month visa runs,

BUT it does bring undesirable's movements, internationally,

into the public record for Interpol to peruse.

It does have a silver lining, as agravating as it is

for us straight shooters.

[johnwills]

.

I do not have a degree but I am more than qualified to teach English as a second language. I have met many stupid degree educated people in my time, it is just a piece of paper saying that you spent 3 years partying and managed to fit in some study around that time :c).

Why not tone down your rhetoric. Since without the degree you're not qualified to posit on the merit of your innate abilities, or lack thereof.

Ah, you must have a degree, but as I say this means nothing. Rhetoric and innate, must have taken you some time to find those in your Theasurus Dude, ah get a life.

[aqua4]

Speaking of salaries, many Thai teachers earn more baht in a year than the average farang teacher, if you deduct the farang teacher's additional expenses, and add in the value of the Thai teacher's pension and other benefits.

Well done you must be the first personwho brought that up! Nobody thinks of that do they?

[VanZam]

.

I do not have a degree but I am more than qualified to teach English as a second language. I have met many stupid degree educated people in my time, it is just a piece of paper saying that you spent 3 years partying and managed to fit in some study around that time :c).

Why not tone down your rhetoric. Since without the degree you're not qualified to posit on the merit of your innate abilities, or lack thereof.

Ah, you must have a degree, but as I say this means nothing. Rhetoric and innate, must have taken you some time to find those in your Theasurus Dude, ah get a life.

A degree shows that you have reached a certain level of education. How can you pretend to be an educator when you have not been educated? What standards are you teaching to?

The 8 years that I spent university were not spent at parties as one of your previous posts suggests.

Rhetoric and innate are words in common usage, as a self-proclaimed english teacher it surprises me that you were not aware of this.

[Ijustwannateach]

Steven, I have no sympathy for the Thailand schools. Background checks should be conducted on all teachers -- not just Farangs. Running criminal history checks are not that difficult and can be run through Interpol. Too bad that some teachers will be inconvenienced and even possibly discharged. This is a small price to pay for the safety of the children in Thailand, don't you think?

I don't mind at all if every single teacher (foreign or Thai) undergoes background checks. But pragmatism must be considered.

If you are going to prevent them from working until they pass such checks- as some on this thread have suggested- and which can take, according to the reports of teachers who have actually requested them, up to 4 months- who will teach the thousands of children? If they have to stay home due to lack of staff, will you be able to arrange daycare? Is that too great a price to pay? And will you have to wait for background checks to be finished on the daycare providers? As you can see, this becomes a very big net if you want everyone who contacts your children to be carefully vetted, and Thailand simply doesn't work that way yet, though it wouldn't be *impossible*. Just difficult and highly unlikely. I think it is a better idea, as someone said above, to make sure there are references and that they are checked- something which also rarely happens here.

Frankly, I find that frequently parents don't want to pay a large price at all for their children's care- or at least the administrators who pay for the teachers on their behalf don't want to pay a high price. At the same time, they want to demand greater and greater standards and practices in the schools and among teachers. These things have costs, which schools don't want to pay. If schools don't pay them, and parents don't pay them, then the teachers are forced to pay them- by suffering from low wages and high bureaucracy. This discourages quality people from working or staying in the teaching field.

I believe (if you look elsewhere in this subforum) you will find another article complaining about a teaching shortage in Thailand. But let's panic and put lots of pressure on teachers, now. I'd say let's take a good long look at the SCHOOLS in this case and ask them about their administrative practices. Put the blame where it belongs and don't drag all of us through the mud because of the inability of an administration which is well known for its incompetence and high staff turnover to keep all of its balls in the air.

On the other hand, if you want to say the teachers can work on probation until they pass their police checks, then fine. I have no arguments with that; it would make me happy, in fact. But you are still not addressing the VAST MAJORITY of foreigners working as teachers here who are illegal and NEVER VETTED AT ALL AND NEVER WILL BE. That's the problem I was trying to address in my first or second response back above. You've either got to run these people out of Thailand and heavily punish the schools who employ them, or you've got to regulate them and give them legal protection. Neither is in the interests of the Thai grey labour industry, which makes so much money exploiting them, and so neither will happen. The standards which they say they will check would not have raised a flag re. this guy Karr anyway. So it's all a song and dance to save face.

"Steven"

Edited August 19, 2006 by Ijustwannateach

[johnwills]

.

I do not have a degree but I am more than qualified to teach English as a second language. I have met many stupid degree educated people in my time, it is just a piece of paper saying that you spent 3 years partying and managed to fit in some study around that time :c).

Why not tone down your rhetoric. Since without the degree you're not qualified to posit on the merit of your innate abilities, or lack thereof.

Ah, you must have a degree, but as I say this means nothing. Rhetoric and innate, must have taken you some time to find those in your Theasurus Dude, ah get a life.

A degree shows that you have reached a certain level of education. How can you pretend to be an educator when you have not been educated? What standards are you teaching to?

The 8 years that I spent university were not spent at parties as one of your previous posts suggests.

Rhetoric and innate are words in common usage, as a self-proclaimed english teacher it surprises me that you were not aware of this.

Sorry, I don't remember saying was was an English teacher? I just said I was more than qualified to do it, being English is my first language and that I had also taught I.T. so I have teaching experience. No I l'll leave the these jobs to you guys. I agree that a a degree relates to an educational level, however, it doesn't mean you can teach. Would you not agree with that? Also, how does a degree in lets say for arguments sake P.E help you as an English teacher in Thailand?

Answer, it doesn't

[Ijustwannateach]

We've done the whole degree-or-no-degree-requred-for-TEFL thing to death in the teaching subforum a number of times. I don't think it's really on topic here and would recommend those interested go looking for those topics in the teaching subforum.

[johnwills]

We've done the whole degree-or-no-degree-requred-for-TEFL thing to death in the teaching subforum a number of times. I don't think it's really on topic here and would recommend those interested go looking for those topics in the teaching subforum.

Agreed.

[PeaceBlondie]

Most of the foreigners who teach in Thailand are illegal aliens, or undocumented foreign laborers, like the so-called "wetbacks" of Mexico who come to the USA. Oh, at least we passed through the immigration checkpoint (as often as monthly), but many teachers only have tourist visas.

Please believe me: it is no easy matter for a farang to come to Thailand (with, say, an actual bachelor's degree and a TEFL certificate, but no teaching degree) and get legal. You can't get a teaching license or a work permit until you've worked here for MONTHS. I never got either one in YEARS. And, unlike bona fide foreign workers in most countries, the farang teacher has an almost constant battle trying to remain legal. In order to learn 350,000 baht, after related expenses, per stinkin' year.

Thailand: great place to live. Thais: great people, if a smiling face can be xenophobic. But teaching? Teaching, you ask? No easy task anywhere, and far more difficult here. Last Thursday, I went out job hunting, 'pounding the pavement,' for the first time in a long while. Today, I'm not so encouraged. I enjoyed my hours in the classroom, in spite of all the related difficulties. Was it worth it, though, in the long run? Quite possibly not. Will I bother to teach again? I don't know. I can not imagine one scenario in which I would be immediately, 100% legal if I started teaching again. No way.

[VanZam]

.

I do not have a degree but I am more than qualified to teach English as a second language. I have met many stupid degree educated people in my time, it is just a piece of paper saying that you spent 3 years partying and managed to fit in some study around that time :c).

Why not tone down your rhetoric. Since without the degree you're not qualified to posit on the merit of your innate abilities, or lack thereof.

Ah, you must have a degree, but as I say this means nothing. Rhetoric and innate, must have taken you some time to find those in your Theasurus Dude, ah get a life.

A degree shows that you have reached a certain level of education. How can you pretend to be an educator when you have not been educated? What standards are you teaching to?

The 8 years that I spent university were not spent at parties as one of your previous posts suggests.

Rhetoric and innate are words in common usage, as a self-proclaimed english teacher it surprises me that you were not aware of this.

Sorry, I don't remember saying was was an English teacher? I just said I was more than qualified to do it, being English is my first language and that I had also taught I.T. so I have teaching experience. No I l'll leave the these jobs to you guys. I agree that a a degree relates to an educational level, however, it doesn't mean you can teach. Would you not agree with that? Also, how does a degree in lets say for arguments sake P.E help you as an English teacher in Thailand?

Answer, it doesn't

I agree that a degree does not allow one to become a good teacher, although it is a building block of what should become a well rounded teachers education.

Of course a degree in P.E will not help in teaching english, and immigration officals handing out work permits should take note.

The fact remains nonetheless, without a degree nobody can gauge your abilities, and whether you have the required skills to teach others. To teach with simply a basis of "life experience" will be cheating your students out of the decent education they deserve from trained professional teachers.

There is however a problem with this new move by the government. If there are in fact crackdowns on english teachers then they may find that they have a severe shortage, and many here will advocate the notion that "under-educated teachers are better than none at all". The only solution to this is to find a way to attract professional teachers to Thailand. I don't see pay rates increasing anytime soon and with the treatment of farang in Thailand going nowhere but downhill, I can't see much of a light at the end of the tunnel for teaching in the LOS.

[opalhort]

Steven, I have no sympathy for the Thailand schools. Background checks should be conducted on all teachers -- not just Farangs. Running criminal history checks are not that difficult and can be run through Interpol. Too bad that some teachers will be inconvenienced and even possibly discharged. This is a small price to pay for the safety of the children in Thailand, don't you think?

I second this statement!

Our son (Grade 7) is attending a very large bi-lingual school which has many branches throughout BKK and employs a large number of foreign teachers (not only "farang"), some of whom I would regard as "shady characters".

opalhort