Gold Shop Harassment for "deposit" of 10k

[Timebandit]

Its a bit weird they dont even stock 5 baht? I ever bought 20baht they walked to the back and had it in a minute. Why don't you buy from a famous chain, then you are sure your not being scammed, and they always buy back the gold they sell as it has their stamp. I always buy from Aurora, you can find them al over BKK. They NEVER ask for deposit, and they always stock 5 Baht as its nothing for a shop....

I totally agree. I have bought from Auroa for three years now and I have a gold acid test kit with a scale. Why in the the World did she order a single 5 baht bar? You should have told her to buy ( 5 ) 1 baht bars. They are too thin to salt with tungsten. Are you going to the grocery store with a 5 baht bar? "Can you break this 5 please". I walked into Aurora yesterday and bought ( 8 ) 1 baht bars with no problems. I like those people. Always keep the warranty they give as it helps to have them at sales times. I always kept the buyback warranties from the PBoC in HKG.

As for the guy suggesting buying paper gold (ETF's), good luck standing in line at the window when there are one hundred paper ounces for every physical ounce. You are headed for a great disappointment. Even GLD.

[elektrified]

I don't think that's necessary. Gold shops are not known for ripping people off. If it was one of the 2 or 3 shops immediately upon entering Kad Luang from the direction of the bridge (coming from Kaeo Narawat), then there is absolutely no need to worry about them cheating you on the weight of the gold. They are very reputable. I've bought gold from the first shop a few times. They have the largest stock I've seen in Chiang Mai.

As far as getting the deposit back, I would say your chance is only 50% because they will claim it was a deposit on the order. Those first 3 shops all have 5 Baht gold bars so I suspect you bought somewhere else.

But I'm still scratching my head as to why you sent someone to conduct your business???? That makes no sense at all.

If the GF has a history of being a "pushover", then he definitely shouldn't have let her go alone, even if she does speak the language and he doesn't. Plenty of foreigners buy gold and the Thai language skills needed for the transaction aren't complicated.

Most, if not all of the gold shops in Thailand are owned by well-educated Chinese Thais from well-to-do families. Most speak excellent fluent English; and yes the Thai language skills needed to handle a transaction conducted by a shop-worker are minimal. If in doubt - ask to speak to the boss (who is always on the premises counting the money).

[nithisa78]

this is very complicated.

[JDGRUEN]

I am so happy that I would rather live without a G/F as necessary, get rid of unstable G/F's - work on finding a stable one ... I cannot imagine people living in arrangements where a G/F goes out and does such stupid things and then continue a relationship with her as if it were normal ... I am not superman but I am also not addicted to stupid...

[JulieM]

It has been suggested that the OP should have bought five 1 baht bars. You pay a higher premium for the one baht bars, but I admit, they sure are handy to have around when you suddenly need a bit of cash.

He probably saved 500+ baht by going with the 5 baht bar.

Edited February 12, 2015 by JulieM

[lounger]

5 baht of gold is say 95,000 baht so a 10,000 baht deposit seems fair for a trader buying for you.

However most shops should stock 5 baht blocks so why go to a tiny shop that doesn't? Maybe the shops are generally sick of the fall in price of gold and cutting stores to a minimum. next time I would ask around first.

My own experience is that different shops have different margins. the worst i found in Pattaya was a customer buy at 300 over the government price and sell at 200 below, this was two different shops. Up north the margins are much tighter but the gold is not so pretty (not polished).

[Anthony5]

5 baht of gold is say 95,000 baht so a 10,000 baht deposit seems fair for a trader buying for you.

However most shops should stock 5 baht blocks so why go to a tiny shop that doesn't? Maybe the shops are generally sick of the fall in price of gold and cutting stores to a minimum. next time I would ask around first.

My own experience is that different shops have different margins. the worst i found in Pattaya was a customer buy at 300 over the government price and sell at 200 below, this was two different shops. Up north the margins are much tighter but the gold is not so pretty (not polished).

Maybe the shops are generally sick of the fall in price of gold and cutting stores to a minimum.

I think you hit the nail on the head. When prices are declining Thais don't take the risk, while when prices are rising, they are more than happy to sell you the gold at a higher price than they bought it some time ago.

[tyznd]

Its a bit weird they dont even stock 5 baht? I ever bought 20baht they walked to the back and had it in a minute. Why don't you buy from a famous chain, then you are sure your not being scammed, and they always buy back the gold they sell as it has their stamp. I always buy from Aurora, you can find them al over BKK. They NEVER ask for deposit, and they always stock 5 Baht as its nothing for a shop....

I totally agree. I have bought from Auroa for three years now and I have a gold acid test kit with a scale. Why in the the World did she order a single 5 baht bar? You should have told her to buy ( 5 ) 1 baht bars. They are too thin to salt with tungsten. Are you going to the grocery store with a 5 baht bar? "Can you break this 5 please". I walked into Aurora yesterday and bought ( 8 ) 1 baht bars with no problems. I like those people. Always keep the warranty they give as it helps to have them at sales times. I always kept the buyback warranties from the PBoC in HKG.

As for the guy suggesting buying paper gold (ETF's), good luck standing in line at the window when there are one hundred paper ounces for every physical ounce. You are headed for a great disappointment. Even GLD.

What did you pay to buy the 8 1 baht bars? I've got a number of 5 baht bars but would like to get some 1 baht bars if the markup is not too high.

[elektrified]

buy the ishares, GLD.....holding physical gold is about like buying a truckload of K rations from military surplus.

GLD? That's American. Why would anyone in Thailand buy that? Everyone holds physical gold in Thailand. Why do you think it's do difficult to get a safety deposit box here? And it's so easy to sell when you need to.

[Anthony5]

Its a bit weird they dont even stock 5 baht? I ever bought 20baht they walked to the back and had it in a minute. Why don't you buy from a famous chain, then you are sure your not being scammed, and they always buy back the gold they sell as it has their stamp. I always buy from Aurora, you can find them al over BKK. They NEVER ask for deposit, and they always stock 5 Baht as its nothing for a shop....

I totally agree. I have bought from Auroa for three years now and I have a gold acid test kit with a scale. Why in the the World did she order a single 5 baht bar? You should have told her to buy ( 5 ) 1 baht bars. They are too thin to salt with tungsten. Are you going to the grocery store with a 5 baht bar? "Can you break this 5 please". I walked into Aurora yesterday and bought ( 8 ) 1 baht bars with no problems. I like those people. Always keep the warranty they give as it helps to have them at sales times. I always kept the buyback warranties from the PBoC in HKG.

As for the guy suggesting buying paper gold (ETF's), good luck standing in line at the window when there are one hundred paper ounces for every physical ounce. You are headed for a great disappointment. Even GLD.

What did you pay to buy the 8 1 baht bars? I've got a number of 5 baht bars but would like to get some 1 baht bars if the markup is not too high.

You will get the sell price for you 5 Baht bars, which is about 2 - 300 baht below the buy price for each Baht of gold. Next you pay the buy price for your 1 Baht bars plus a premium of about 100 Baht. So raw estimate is that it cost you about 300 + 300 + 100 = 700 Baht each Baht of gold.

Why switch them now, at the time you want to cash in some there is time enought to give them 5 Baht and get 4 Baht returned + some cash.

[Regyai]

Sounds very strange

I can think of several shops on Yaowarat Road who always have stock of Thai Gold bars (Weekends not though)

Ive personally bought many 2, 5 & 10 Baht bars (the 10s are better in that I dont pay one satang over the day's window rate on these). Always the same scenario, pick out the bars from the display, pay the clumps of cash over, deal done.

Could be as said the Tirak securing the acquisition, or a weekend when no 'bullion' sold, or a p iss-ant shop with no 'bullion' stock

.

[elektrified]

Sounds very strange

I can think of several shops on Yaowarat Road who always have stock of Thai Gold bars (Weekends not though)

.

So can I, but... he was shopping 700+ Km North of there.

[Cheesekraft]

when we returned the next day to buy the 5 baht bar, the one they had for us was scratched, so we asked for a different one and they brought several out of the back. It was obviously not a question of whether they had stock or not, they had larger bars as well. This was not a tiny shop, I think it might be the biggest one in Chiang Mai? At least in Wallarot

Edited February 12, 2015 by Cheesekraft

[tyznd]

Its a bit weird they dont even stock 5 baht? I ever bought 20baht they walked to the back and had it in a minute. Why don't you buy from a famous chain, then you are sure your not being scammed, and they always buy back the gold they sell as it has their stamp. I always buy from Aurora, you can find them al over BKK. They NEVER ask for deposit, and they always stock 5 Baht as its nothing for a shop....

I totally agree. I have bought from Auroa for three years now and I have a gold acid test kit with a scale. Why in the the World did she order a single 5 baht bar? You should have told her to buy ( 5 ) 1 baht bars. They are too thin to salt with tungsten. Are you going to the grocery store with a 5 baht bar? "Can you break this 5 please". I walked into Aurora yesterday and bought ( 8 ) 1 baht bars with no problems. I like those people. Always keep the warranty they give as it helps to have them at sales times. I always kept the buyback warranties from the PBoC in HKG.

As for the guy suggesting buying paper gold (ETF's), good luck standing in line at the window when there are one hundred paper ounces for every physical ounce. You are headed for a great disappointment. Even GLD.

What did you pay to buy the 8 1 baht bars? I've got a number of 5 baht bars but would like to get some 1 baht bars if the markup is not too high.

You will get the sell price for you 5 Baht bars, which is about 2 - 300 baht below the buy price for each Baht of gold. Next you pay the buy price for your 1 Baht bars plus a premium of about 100 Baht. So raw estimate is that it cost you about 300 + 300 + 100 = 700 Baht each Baht of gold.

Why switch them now, at the time you want to cash in some there is time enought to give them 5 Baht and get 4 Baht returned + some cash.

Not actually sure I am following how you got to the price but are you saying if the display sell price is 19000 per baht you are paying 19700?

I got lost at the sell price of a 5 baht bar being 200 - 300 below the buy price for each baht of gold because the sell price is higher than the buy price.

[louse1953]

Unfortunately, your girlfriend will fall for overcharging and pressure sales tactics every time she has money and has the misfortune to meet pushy salespeople. It is her personality type. One of my relatives is the same. Cannot say no. Feels obliged to thank the salesperson for making decisions for her. You can try and train her to say no but she will always tend to her natural default personality. The best plan is for your hand to be firmly on the pursestrings. It is in your girlfriend's interest.

Your onto it Briggsy,there is one treasurer in my partnership and thats me.Some may say harsh,but i say safe and secure.

[Tokay]

What you really need to worry about is when she gets the gold and tells a few people she has it. Expect a home robbery in your future if she tells anyone about having gold.

[LivinLOS]

Its a bit weird they dont even stock 5 baht? I ever bought 20baht they walked to the back and had it in a minute. Why don't you buy from a famous chain, then you are sure your not being scammed, and they always buy back the gold they sell as it has their stamp. I always buy from Aurora, you can find them al over BKK. They NEVER ask for deposit, and they always stock 5 Baht as its nothing for a shop....

Many gold jewelry shops only have the jewelry grade 96.5 items.. When buying baht bars or gramme bars your buying .999 fine gold.

The larger shops have these, many of the smaller, jewelry focused ones dont.

[Dante99]

Are you 100% sure that Baht bars are .999?

[Regyai]

Because they are not

Edited February 13, 2015 by Regyai

[LivinLOS]

Some are.. Some are not.. Be aware of what your buying and the actual gold content of the bar in relation to the current spot price. Same as a Krugerrand is only 22 kt yet makes up weight over the troy Oz.

Goes without saying no ??

http://www.ausirisgroup.com/ausiris-gold-bullionnew-en.php

Edited February 13, 2015 by LivinLOS

[2020]

OMG, there is some good advice here (and well, he did ask for advice) but there is some garbage being spread by people speculating about someone they haven't met, to people they haven't met about a subject they more than likely know very little about.

While I'm at it, be aware gold may not be the be all and end all that will bring happiness, prosperity and protect themselves from economic collapse, misfortune, ghosts and / or general bad luck....

http://www.tungsten-alloy.com/tungsten-alloy-gold-bullion.html

or some nice one's here

http://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale-fake-gold-bars.html

A simple internet search for fake gold bars and you'll quickly find out nobody knows how much is out there in the market already, who has been fooled or how many have been fooled!

Have fun!

[easybullet3]

i bought Gold quite a few times in Bangkok in "Hua Seng Heng" (which is one of the most famous and oldest gold sellers)... they had LOTS of 5 and 10 baht golds.. i couldnt see any reason to leave any deposit for something which is ready available .

Also: it seemed that EVERY shop I went into had 5 and 10 bahts of gold.

this is not a special model of shoes that has a limited run and only a few pairs left in your size... this is standard Gold,, (available throughout Thailand). it doesnt change,, there is no special design. its just a lump of Gold... (make sure you get them to WEIGH IT) and check it is absolutely correct.

i think you should NEVER leave any deposit for a Gold Bar... because its nothing special.. (can get it anywhere).

BUT: if it was a handcrafted Gold ring or necklace that is lovely and she wants it.. and only a few in stock, then YES OF COURSE put a deposit, (as it is a limited item and can run out of stock!)

but gold bars will never run out of stock!

[JeezeLooeze]

Only buy physical gold at a reputable gold shop who is a member of the Gold Traders Association - GTA [of Thailand] such as Hua Seng Heng located at Yaowarat and on Silom Rd. to ensure you get the real stuff. If you have Baht you will get gold your there and then, no questions asked, no 'deposit' shenanigans. Yesterday there was a big dip in the gold price and the shop I went to was crowded with eager buyers.

Note that in Thailand gold bullion bars (1, 2, 5,10 & 20 baht weight) are 95.6% pure (about 23 karot). Fine gold 99.99% is available but usually only in larger size bars and you may need to book ahead to obtain it.

Edited February 13, 2015 by JeezeLooeze

[2020]

There is loads of stories out there of fake gold which if one could be bothered, you can google at your will. Here is one that sums it all up quite well...

http://taxfreegold.co.uk/certificatesforgoldbars.html

so be aware, and if you don't have the time to click on the link, here is a summary....'If in any doubt, buy from a reputable source, and obtain a receipt.'

[LivinLOS]

Yesterday there was a big dip in the gold price and the shop I went to was crowded with eager buyers.

Yesterday gold rose from +- 1220 to 1227..

http://www.kitco.com/charts/popup/au24hr3day.html

[georgemandm]

Hi op look I don't like to say this but your thai gf is BS to you mate never believe a thai woman they are born to lie I know a lot of man out there will have a go at me here saying this but I don't care I am just telling what I think is going on up to you to believe what I am saying but I am giving you my throughs on what happened.

[Berkshire]

I really don't understand what the OP means by his GF being "pressured into leaving a deposit." I mean, was she held hostage? Prevented from leaving? I don't get it.

Now I understand that these shops are in business to make a sale. Getting a deposit is the closest thing to making a sale, so of course they'd prefer that you leave something as opposed to nothing and possibly never coming back. Either the GF is incredibly naive (and I'm being nice) or she's in on it, i.e., wanting the OP to commit to buying the gold. But no way there was any "pressure to leave a deposit," just the typical sales pitch.

Edited February 13, 2015 by Berkshire

[ALFREDO]

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FYI - I would not assume that leaving a deposit locks in today's price. In fact, I would doubt that they could do that. If they price goes up in the next 24 hours (it just shot up about $8 but that means nothing) expect to pay more.

If the price goes down I would buy at the lower price or demand my deposit back and go buy it next door.

Thats clearly not what a deposit does.. A deposit indicates the firm agreement to buy, at a set price.. At teh time of the deal..

If the price rises, they have to honor it.. If the price falls you do.. Given the price was falling they were almost certainly concerned she would try to squirm out of the agreed price..

Any return of the deposit will I am sure come after a deduction in falling price levels, as is fair.. Of course in a rising market I bet they wouldnt hesitate to give the deposit back in full and no one would hesitate to buy the gold.

when we returned the next day to buy the 5 baht bar, the one they had for us was scratched, so we asked for a different one and they brought several out of the back. It was obviously not a question of whether they had stock or not, they had larger bars as well. This was not a tiny shop, I think it might be the biggest one in Chiang Mai? At least in Wallarot

I think OP you have your possible answer (deposit for a fixed price of that day and possibly a good idea from shop personal and - or your GF so she - you had to come back ), see above.

[Anthony5]

i bought Gold quite a few times in Bangkok in "Hua Seng Heng" (which is one of the most famous and oldest gold sellers)... they had LOTS of 5 and 10 baht golds.. i couldnt see any reason to leave any deposit for something which is ready available .

Also: it seemed that EVERY shop I went into had 5 and 10 bahts of gold.

I'm sure by now you must have noticed that the OP is about 900km away from Bangkok, and that at his location NOT every shop has 5 and 10 bahts of gold in stock

this is not a special model of shoes that has a limited run and only a few pairs left in your size...

Well, 5 baht of gold also cost a bit more than a pair of shoes, don't you agree?

this is standard Gold,, (available throughout Thailand). it doesnt change,, there is no special design. its just a lump of Gold... (make sure you get them to WEIGH IT) and check it is absolutely correct.

i think you should NEVER leave any deposit for a Gold Bar... because its nothing special.. (can get it anywhere).

My experience is that if you order something they don't have usually stock of, be it gold or a pair of shoes or a birthday cake, you pay a deposit. This is so in Thailand and in most countries in the world I have been.

[LarryLEB]

5 baht of gold is say 95,000 baht so a 10,000 baht deposit seems fair for a trader buying for you.

However most shops should stock 5 baht blocks so why go to a tiny shop that doesn't? Maybe the shops are generally sick of the fall in price of gold and cutting stores to a minimum. next time I would ask around first.

My own experience is that different shops have different margins. the worst i found in Pattaya was a customer buy at 300 over the government price and sell at 200 below, this was two different shops. Up north the margins are much tighter but the gold is not so pretty (not polished).

I agree with the above poster: I would buy only from a shop that has the Thai gold bars in stock and available for immediate sale.

I can speak only to my experience buying and selling Thai gold bars in Pattaya.

You should NEVER deal with a gold shop that posts a base differential of more than 100Baht between the BUY and SELL prices for Thai gold bars. Additionally, find a reliable shop that will add only 100Baht to 200Baht to that base differential (the amount added depends on HOW MANY BAHT WEIGHT you purchase). Some examples from my experience:

• First, assume that the BUY price is 19,600 and the SELL price is 19,700. (Remember, the SELL price is what you pay for your gold bar purchase, since the shop is SELLing to you.)
• Example1: You buy only one, one-baht Thai gold bar. You would pay 19,700 + 200 = B19,900.
• Example2: You buy 10, one-baht Thai gold bars. You would likely pay 19,700 + 150 = B19,850 for each bar. Total purchase = B198,500. I say “likely” because the fee you pay depends on whether you are a good customer with that shop. (Also depends on how good you are at negotiating!)
• Note for the next 2 examples, that the shop charges you per baht weight, not per bar...
• Example3: You buy one 10-baht Thai gold bar. You will pay the same as in Example2 = B 198,500.
• Example4: You buy four 5-baht Thai gold bars. You likely pay 19,700 + 100 = 19,800 X 20 = B396,000. (WHY only 100Baht per bar, instead of 150 or 250? Because of the large quantity purchased. I made this exact purchase some months ago.)

Another poster mentioned the benefit of buying only those bars of one-baht weight (not the larger 5- or 10-baht bars). His concern was that the larger bars would be easier to be faked by having tungsten interiors. That is a valid concern in that some Kruggerands and some larger bars (10 ounce and one kilogram) have had this fraudulent alteration. These fakes were not discovered in Thailand. However, the probability that 5-baht Thai gold bars are faked is low (but not zero). I always have the Pattaya gold shop "chop" the bars I buy if they are larger than one baht in weight (the "chop" is unique to the shop and is applied using a hammer).