Please Help Me Solve This Riddle

[qualtrough]

I had to go to do some shopping today so I visited the local Carrefour. Bad timing on my part as it was a Sunday afternoon. I quickly found the things I wanted and headed for the checkout counters. Twentyseven counters, and only 8 were manned while I waited in line about 15 minutes. Here is the riddle: In Thai department and big box stores there are dozens if not hundreds of sales people who have little to do but stand around and pick their nose. Most can barely tell you what is in their department much less another department in the store. Why not train some of those people to be cashiers, so that the full bank of 27 (or whatever number) checkout counters are fully manned? Much better to have a cashier standing around idle than a useless salesperson. If I had to choose between store A with no wait in the checkout line, or store B where I could anticipate a long wait, it would be store A no question. I suspect many others would feel the same way.

[Thaiboxer]

I have recently discussed this same issue with many of my colleagues and we all agree on one big factor...cheap labor. When I worked at a hotel in the States, if we didn't have much going on, the manager would simply start sending people home in order to cut down on overhead. I also find it annoying when there are so many workers standing around while one or two are trying to help all the customers. I guess since labor is cheap, it doesn't result in too big of a loss for those business to hire so many people and not give them any work.

[taxexile]

i think that the cashiers will have better qualifications than the shelf stackers and will be on a higher salary scale , hence fewer cashiers and more stackers.

i try and avoid the big supermarkets at weekends for the same reasons.

long checkout waits and the chaos of a store filled with thais and their shopping trolleys , its just like the roads here ..... madness.

[libya 115]

At Carrefour: use the 'Ten items or less' cash desk. You can get away with 13 or 14 items if you smile! What makes me more mad though is non beer sales between 2.00pm and 5.00pm. Crazy!

[geoffphuket]

i think that the cashiers will have better qualifications than the shelf stackers and will be on a higher salary scale , hence fewer cashiers and more stackers.

i try and avoid the big supermarkets at weekends for the same reasons.

long checkout waits and the chaos of a store filled with thais and their shopping trolleys , its just like the roads here ..... madness.

Quite correct. My wife worked at Makro as a senior cashier. These girls are not only responsible for taking money at the tills; some are also responsible for dealing with cash in the strong room and for collections by securicor.

[Gumballl]

What would really be nice is for these Walmart wannabe's is to offer online shopping. That way one could do their shopping from home, pay with a credit card, and wait for the delivery to show up at their front door. Oh wait... this is Thailand.... must adjust watch to reflect that it is the hub of the 19th century.

Edited August 27, 2006 by Gumballl

[jbowman1993]

Because of course, online shopping has been available in the west for the past 106 years... Give me a break

[stumonster]

Because of course, online shopping has been available in the west for the past 106 years... Give me a break

ok stuntman

[Boon Mee]

What would really be nice is for these Walmart wannabe's is to offer online shopping. That way one could do their shopping from home, pay with a credit card, and wait for the delivery to show up at their front door. Oh wait... this is Thailand.... must adjust watch to reflect that it is the hub of the 19th century.

I'm just glad we've got the Tesco-Lotus's with the Food Courts.

Wern't that long ago it was food off the street if you felt a bit peckish when shopping.

[kurgen]

At Carrefour: use the 'Ten items or less' cash desk. You can get away with 13 or 14 items if you smile! What makes me more mad though is non beer sales between 2.00pm and 5.00pm. Crazy!

you can get round that law by buying 20 (I think) small bottles, as Tescos always tell me

Cheers

[Heng]

I'd assume hypermarts like Tesco-Lotus/Carrefour have various cashier check systems, but for our family "super"market in Austin, maybe not super as it only has 7 aisles and 4 checkouts/cashier stations, we limit the # of active cashiers because it's more difficult to keep an eye on them (from the various double/miss scan scams and skimming that is typically one of the leading areas of employee theft). Like a casino, it seems like there is always someone trying to cheat you. It's usually the manager's call as to how many cashiers we have going at once.

I doubt the "problem" is the number of available cashiers... more likely whatever policy the manager has in place in regards to how many active checkouts he/she wants going at once in ratio to customer volume.

[qualtrough]

Following up on my original post, why do they build 27 checkout stations if at the busiest times they might have 10 working? I am sure you want to have a few extra for downtime/maintainance, but 17 extra? Agreed that sales staff are cheaper to employ than cashiers, but why not get rid of two or three sales positions and create more cashiers? I don't know if sales staff and stackers are one and the same, but in a lot of stores I usually see sales staff just idling around chatting with friends, picking at something, or even playing with pets (little dogs, etc.). Despite that, if you ask them where something is they will just point you in the general direction most times rather than walk you there! Even if they are paid minimum wage they are a waste of space. I once counted something like 22 employees in a fairly small electronics area at Big C.

As long as I am on this topic, why do the Automotive Products sections always have aggressive sales people? If you so much as walk through the aisle and pause for a moment they are on you in a second. I have never noticed that with any other product areas. It is so bad at Central, Robinson, etc. that I skip those areas even though I would like to browse around some time.

[Heng]

Following up on my original post, why do they build 27 checkout stations if at the busiest times they might have 10 working?

Surely they have many more open at times. It all depends. I don't go to the market often, but I'm fairly sure I recall both Big C (Tha Kham, sometimes Fashion Island) and Tesco Lotus (Seacon, usually) have the majority of their registers open. Oh yeah, and some places might not think it an insane idea to plan for growth.

As long as I am on this topic, why do the Automotive Products sections always have aggressive sales people? If you so much as walk through the aisle and pause for a moment they are on you in a second.

Commission.

Edited August 27, 2006 by Heng

[Neeranam]

Thai people love going to Tesco etc - they can cool down and the floors are great for shuffling the "gerb keep" sandals.

Why would they want things to speed up?

[barryofthailand]

Maybe on Sunday they have to pay OT. I don't know. The only other answer is to save labor costs. All the supermarkets in the states do this. In southern california their use to be lots of major brand supermarkets and the service was excellent because the competition was so fierce. Then one company started buying up the other supermarkets, now their are only about three or four major brand markets owned by two companie

[think_too_mut]

What would really be nice is for these Walmart wannabe's is to offer online shopping. That way one could do their shopping from home, pay with a credit card, and wait for the delivery to show up at their front door. Oh wait... this is Thailand.... must adjust watch to reflect that it is the hub of the 19th century.

Thanks God for Tesco, Carefour, 7-11...they lifted the quality and standards of retailing in Thailand and did overall good to the nation.

As for shopping online and waiting on delivery - Walmart is actually finding that shopping online and coming to pick up in person is what people want. Indeed, click what you want, get them to pack it up and make it available when you drive/walk past. No queues, no sitting at home "between 6 and 8" waiting on delivery.

Further, the hypermarkets are managed the way McDonalds franchises are - by staff trained by corporate and by western standards. Why 17 cashier points were unmanned could be an one-off hickup. Tesco/Carefour would not get too far if they did it all the time.

[Scott]

I have seen the same situation over and over again. I tend to go to places that are efficient and do my shopping ( a few of the Tops are good--and some not so good). The difficulty is that a lack of cashiers is like a traffic problem, when it starts backing up, it has a real knock-on effect and slows everything down.

I am fairly busy and sometimes, I take a look at those long lines and either pick out a handful of items and head for the express lane and leave a 1/2 full cart for those floor-walkers to put back. Sometimes, I just leave.

It's well worth the investment to have a few extra cashiers around--they can do other things during the down time and when you need them put them on.

The other problem is that some check out personnel are ungodly slow. They don't hurry, they can't pack stuff efficiently or quickly and they can't (or won't) speed up. Even counting change becomes a chore for them.

The other problem is the people with the credit card in the "cash only" line. Drives me nuts!

[steveromagnino]

What would really be nice is for these Walmart wannabe's is to offer online shopping. That way one could do their shopping from home, pay with a credit card, and wait for the delivery to show up at their front door. Oh wait... this is Thailand.... must adjust watch to reflect that it is the hub of the 19th century.

Thanks God for Tesco, Carefour, 7-11...they lifted the quality and standards of retailing in Thailand and did overall good to the nation.

As for shopping online and waiting on delivery - Walmart is actually finding that shopping online and coming to pick up in person is what people want. Indeed, click what you want, get them to pack it up and make it available when you drive/walk past. No queues, no sitting at home "between 6 and 8" waiting on delivery.

Tesco Lotus is considered the best operator, and much of their knowledge came from the 'Lotus' side, not just the Tesco side. Now 96% owned by Tesco, but wasn't always this way. 7-11 is sharp for the most part, good procedures from the parent, and good implementation by CP. Look at the merchandising and stocking policy of Carrefour and you'll see some big gaps in performance at some stores. However, in general totally agree; the policies of the foreign chains have upped the game here a lot.

Walmart is retreating many places excluding China and USA; I wouldn't hold them up as the best role model for retail at the moment. In China I think even CP is bigger than them at the moment.... I'd guess only an American would consider them to be a 'great operator' since their performance in Japan and in Germany were amusing, if not totally inept.

Online shopping has little relevance to a market with low internet penetration and the ability to send a maid to buy things; at the highest end of the market (the ones most likely to have broadband and thus be able to order online not using the snail pace of typical Thai internet connection speed) I think you'll find many of that group haven't even stepped foot in a hyper market; they buy at places like Villa who already offer delivery and other services. Or they send the maid. If I was rich screw wasting 5 minutes online; I can just send my maid to buy the stuff and select the best fruit, meat etc etc.

At least, that's what my rich boss does.

Queues...well they suck. Generally I never have a problem when going to the supermarket, maybe you lot should come out to Carrefour Lard Prao; it is only carrefour, but queues aren't too bad at all.

Edited August 28, 2006 by steveromagnino

[bkkresident]

Following up on my original post, why do they build 27 checkout stations if at the busiest times they might have 10 working? I am sure you want to have a few extra for downtime/maintainance, but 17 extra? Agreed that sales staff are cheaper to employ than cashiers, but why not get rid of two or three sales positions and create more cashiers? I don't know if sales staff and stackers are one and the same, but in a lot of stores I usually see sales staff just idling around chatting with friends, picking at something, or even playing with pets (little dogs, etc.). Despite that, if you ask them where something is they will just point you in the general direction most times rather than walk you there! Even if they are paid minimum wage they are a waste of space. I once counted something like 22 employees in a fairly small electronics area at Big C.

As long as I am on this topic, why do the Automotive Products sections always have aggressive sales people? If you so much as walk through the aisle and pause for a moment they are on you in a second. I have never noticed that with any other product areas. It is so bad at Central, Robinson, etc. that I skip those areas even though I would like to browse around some time.

A lot of the sales staf that you see are not employed by the stores themselves but by the companies whose products, or brands they represent. Many of these sales staff earn more commission than salary, and that's why they appear aggressive.

It's another reason that such staff cannot be used as cashiers.

[marshbags]

Following up on my original post, why do they build 27 checkout stations if at the busiest times they might have 10 working? I am sure you want to have a few extra for downtime/maintainance, but 17 extra? Agreed that sales staff are cheaper to employ than cashiers, but why not get rid of two or three sales positions and create more cashiers? I don't know if sales staff and stackers are one and the same, but in a lot of stores I usually see sales staff just idling around chatting with friends, picking at something, or even playing with pets (little dogs, etc.). Despite that, if you ask them where something is they will just point you in the general direction most times rather than walk you there! Even if they are paid minimum wage they are a waste of space. I once counted something like 22 employees in a fairly small electronics area at Big C.

As long as I am on this topic, why do the Automotive Products sections always have aggressive sales people? If you so much as walk through the aisle and pause for a moment they are on you in a second. I have never noticed that with any other product areas. It is so bad at Central, Robinson, etc. that I skip those areas even though I would like to browse around some time.

A lot of the sales staf that you see are not employed by the stores themselves but by the companies whose products, or brands they represent. Many of these sales staff earn more commission than salary, and that's why they appear aggressive.

It's another reason that such staff cannot be used as cashiers.

At my local U.K. ASDA store they have admin. staff and others who they can call on when a certain amount of customer build up is waiting to go through the check outs.

All they do is make an announcement for all stand by staff to go to allocated emergency tills over the loud speaker system.

So simple and before anyone says " but this is Thailand "

The big stores are all majority owned by international companies who with the right will, can develop the same proceedures out there, no problem.

Regarding the 10 items counter.

At my local store in Udon when i,m over there you should see them bulk buying and using these facilities.

Trolleys full of stuff and multiples times ten of each product which are then cashed individually by timid cashiers who are bullied by them

They should be marked 10 items / baskets only please, with no room to allow the trolleys to utilise them, should they try to ignore this.

marshbags

P.S.

I go early Mon. to Fri. at opening time, do my shopping and get out before the build ups and no problems normally as most Thai,s there don,t go into the stores until after 10.00

No complaints from me with this method

Edited August 28, 2006 by marshbags

[think_too_mut]

A lot of the sales staf that you see are not employed by the stores themselves but by the companies whose products, or brands they represent. Many of these sales staff earn more commission than salary, and that's why they appear aggressive.

It's another reason that such staff cannot be used as cashiers.

"A lot of the sales staff" is a bit of exageration. That could be true with cosmetics, medicines, some electronics but I doubt they are more than 1-3 % of the people on the floor.

And they have their own cashiers, right at the point of sale, they get their money, seal the bag and let you go with other purchases.

30 items per minute throughput for the cashiers is the norm in the retail sector, my observations were the Thais are there or almost always there. No slackiness on the Thai side of the same hypermarket chains, same as anywhere in the world.

Bulky items such as crates of beverages, brooms and other "unryly" goods get averaged with others.

What is a not-too-bad job in Thai (working as a cashier in an airconditioned hypermarket) could be the last resort for many in the West, migrants included.

So, the quality of the workforce can not be questioned, IMO.

Edited August 28, 2006 by think_too_mut

[terry57]

yes, i'll help you out my good friend,

its all good so dont worry your self too much about the small things in life.

i take the sky train to on nutt and then do a bolt into texico.

head staight to the water fountain for a drink and them run amuck in the brilliant food hall.

try buying a duck in texaco and then getting wanton noodle soup and throw it all in together.

bliss people and i suggest you give it a whirl.

cheers friends

[fxm88]

Try HomePro -- suffers terribly from overstaffed floors but at least they've also overstaffed the checkout registers.

Back home I worked in a big box store: you had to get special training to work the cash register, mostly so you'd know how to deal with customers who wanted to haggle on the price -- in America *LOL* (foreigners mostly). Once in a while they'd accounce "Code Blue" or some thing over the overhead loudspeakers meaning the floorstaff with training were all supposed to go start working the cash registers.

[steveromagnino]

Try HomePro -- suffers terribly from overstaffed floors but at least they've also overstaffed the checkout registers.

Back home I worked in a big box store: you had to get special training to work the cash register, mostly so you'd know how to deal with customers who wanted to haggle on the price -- in America *LOL* (foreigners mostly). Once in a while they'd accounce "Code Blue" or some thing over the overhead loudspeakers meaning the floorstaff with training were all supposed to go start working the cash registers.

Hey FXM88...did you order the code blue?

What do you want?

I want the truth!

Did you have this conversation about 50 times per day then or what?!!

[Papa_Lazarou]

"hundreds of sales people who have little to do but stand around and pick their nose"

It does require a certain dexterity and expertise to do a good nasal excavation.

Sometimes I marvel at what I pull out of mine.

[VanZam]

It's a psychological technique used to get customers to stay in the shop longer. It is well thought out, and has nothing to do with Thai management.

You see the lines are full, you naturally take a look around, "Oh I missed that bottle of wine!"

Store just made more money from you by having less staff, and taking advantage of impulse buyers.

[qualtrough]

It's a psychological technique used to get customers to stay in the shop longer. It is well thought out, and has nothing to do with Thai management.

You see the lines are full, you naturally take a look around, "Oh I missed that bottle of wine!"

Store just made more money from you by having less staff, and taking advantage of impulse buyers.

I really, really doubt that. What kind of logic tells someone that they should get one more item and lose their place in line? I would believe that point of purchase sales rise since people are standing in line with nothing to do but look at the goods on offer by the register. If the lines look ridiculous I ditch the cart. If I am really thinking I will check the lines before beginning shopping. If they are really long I will go somewhere else or buy a few items and use the express lane. I avoid stores that consistently present shopping nightmares. Lots of choices here nowadays.

[baboon]

You need more salespeople in a shop so they can follow you around perpetually, making YOU FEEL LIKE A CRIMINAL!!!!! AAAAARRRRRRGGGGHHHH!!

Thats it. Come on, dear, we will go and look somewhere else.

[BattyBatty]

Of course the old chestnut of 7/11 has to be one of the most agreed bummers in Thailand - when you wait for sodding ages with 10 other customers, whilst one slow as hel_l person serves, and three others are all counting stock behind the counter...And then BAM! Just when its your turn, random Thai guy walks in and barges right in front of you.

My biggest gripe of LOS shopping though - being followed around a shop by some gormless service person who contributes nothing, bar staring at you. I was in the Paul Smith shop in Paragon last weekend with three people just following me around, staring at me. The only conversation we had was -

Woman - you can try

Me - Yep, thanks

2 mins later

Woman - you can try

me - yep, you said. I will if i see something, ok?

Woman - you can try

Me - I'll shout you if i need help, ok?

Woman - You can try

Repeat another 5 times untill i leave the shop. Winds the hel_l outa me.

[Johpa]

Thanks God for Tesco, Carefour, 7-11...they lifted the quality and standards of retailing in Thailand and did overall good to the nation.

Pardon me, but I never had any issues with the quality of retailing in Thailand before the advent of these dull warehouse emporiums. I would visit local small shops where the owners would know my name and the names of my kids so we would talk and gossip a bit. Of course I could not buy everything under one roof so I might have to walk down the street or even ride over to my next destination. Prices were not fixed so some friendly bargaining was expected on both sides. But I always found that the quality and standards were most excellent and when I found lower standards I would choose not to shop at that establishments. The choice was mine.

At the local afternoon market I could purchase fresh produce and meats. In general, the foods were far fresher than any of the shrink wrapped "fresh" foods at the newer big emporiums. And if I got hungry there were countless food stalls for purchasing snack food, a meal, or meals to take-away and eat at home.

I can't belive that some here actually think that the food courts at the malls and the warehouse emporiums serve edible versions of Thai food.

So other than funneling profits offshore to the likes of the offspring of Tessie Cohen and keeping the money in the banking system instead of circulating locally, I fail to see the overall good to the nation.