Help with breathing through the haze months

[desi]

I'm asthmatic. My grandmother was a smoker and died from emphysema. My grandmother on the other side also smoked and died screaming. Lovely.

I only have five or so years in Chiang mai and I'd like to get advice on surviving through the burning months. Yes. I can leave. But I'm a bit of a homebody and with cats I'd rather not be gone for three plus months.

So, can I get oxygen tanks or whatever from the hospitals here?

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Yes, you can.

(EDIT: Or you can value your health higher than cats. (which can move with you, or someone can take care of them during March.). )

Edited March 8, 2015 by WinnieTheKhwai

[Rancid]

If you can still buy from home pro etc get filters for your a/c. Close the windows and just run on fan if don't like the cold.

That will clean up the air inside, outside is another matter of course. When I was here before ordered a good filter mask online for filtering smoke.

[MaeJoMTB]

The pharmacy and medical supply shop opposite Suan Dok hospital in Suthep road rents out O2 cylinders.

You need to buy your own mask and regulator.

In the order of

3kbht deposit and around 150bht/day rental, mask and regulator 2kbht.

[desi]

The pharmacy and medical supply shop opposite Suan Dok hospital in Suthep road rents out O2 cylinders.

You need to buy your own mask and regulator.

In the order of

3kbht deposit and around 150bht/day rental, mask and regulator 2kbht.

Thank you so much for advice that I can use.

[desi]

If you can still buy from home pro etc get filters for your a/c. Close the windows and just run on fan if don't like the cold.

That will clean up the air inside, outside is another matter of course. When I was here before ordered a good filter mask online for filtering smoke.

Sadly, I have one of those naff homes that look great but have crap insulation. Filters are useless.

[desi]

Yes, you can.

(EDIT: Or you can value your health higher than cats. (which can move with you, or someone can take care of them during March.). )

EDIT: You know piss all about me. My heath. Or finances. Or my cats ...

[northernjohn]

The pharmacy and medical supply shop opposite Suan Dok hospital in Suthep road rents out O2 cylinders.

You need to buy your own mask and regulator.

In the order of

3kbht deposit and around 150bht/day rental, mask and regulator 2kbht.

Thank you so much for advice that I can use.

They also have a machine to suck the oxygen out of the air it comes with 50 feet of hose for moving around. Price start at 30,000 baht maybe more now. when you figure in the cost of your tanks and gauges plus the constant refilling of them and the transportation to do that the machine doesn't look to bad. I use mine all night when I sleep 7 liters a minute. I was told the large tanks would be good for about a night and a half.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Yes, you can.

(EDIT: Or you can value your health higher than cats. (which can move with you, or someone can take care of them during March.). )

EDIT: You know piss all about me. My heath. Or finances. Or my cats ...

I know what you wrote in your original post. No need to get grumpy.

(Also, you may not have noticed I answered your question: Visit any hospital and they'll get you what you need.)

But again, for the price of seeing a doctor and getting all that O2 cylinder stuff you can also go on a holiday, and ask someone (nicely) to take care of your cats for the next 3 weeks or so.

Edited March 9, 2015 by WinnieTheKhwai

[vivid]

Hi,

I'm not from Thailand, but over here we get affected by haze as well. What you can practically do in order to save yourself visits to the doctor or emergency dept at the hospitals, is to get air purifiers and also fine particulate masks.

What you would want to do, is to reduce (1) 24-hour exposure to the haze in terms of particulate exposure (2) any sudden spikes in the haze intensity, eg 8AM you might have a 8km visibility which is pretty alright, but by 12 noon it drops to 1km due to a slight shift in wind direction. Wear a mask then.

Details :

Air purifiers - only get HEPA air purifiers. Ignore all others

Masks - only get fine particulate masks. FFP-1 (think it's a UK standard) are 85% efficient at 0.3 microns. KN90 are used in China and are 90% efficient @ 0.3 microns. N95, N99, N100, P100 etc are 95% - 99.9% efficient, USA OSHA standard. For the intensity of haze in northern Thailand, FFP-1 is more than enough. N95 is really great, but not suitable to be used for long periods (eg > 30 mins) by the elderly/pregnant women. Healthy adults can use them for quite a few hours, pehaps you might get a bit of a headache due to the resulting cut in oxygen due to the mask airflow + if you are outside walking or doing some slightly strenuous activity, that's about it.

If you can, get the FFP-1, they should be available from ebay. There are some models with exhalation valves which do aid with "breathing" but they are a bit more expensive.

You can also try to get these masks from your local pharmacy.

Surgical masks do not really work below 5 microns and have horrible amounts of bypass at the sides. They are next to useless. Haze particles from biomass burning is predominantly 0.15 microns - 0.4 microns (Indonesian peatland haze)

Of course in heavy haze you wouldn't survive with just a mask, it's too uncomfortable.

Get yourself a HEPA air purifier.

Any model with any grade of HEPA is fine, ultimately it depends on your budget. What is important is the airflow capability of the unit. Do take note of the noise level also, since they are somewhat noisy and light sleepers would have problems. Though you can solve this problem with blasting the unit in the highest fan speed for 30 mins first and throttling it down to medium or low after that. But during very hazy days, you'd need to maintain it in medium speed.

You can "size" the air purifier by measuring your room and get the volume, ie 5m x 4m x 3m = 60 cubic m. Subtract maybe 10m3 due to furnitures. You need to get an air purifier with an airflow that's at least 5X of this, eg 50 x 5 = 250 m3/hr airflow. Alternatvely you can look at the purifiying area spec, but that's not nearly as useful. Simply, get something that's powerful, you can easily throttle down the power after that. It's like choosing a car + its bhp/torque and your terrain.

Recently, its been found that air pollution and the effects of PM2.5 particulates are more damaging than previously thought. Those with chronic lung/heart problems, those with higher risk of stroke, pregnant women, newborns/infants/toddlers are very susceptible to the effects of haze. Just a slight increase in haze levels significantly increase the risk of heart attacks and stroke.

Asthmatics/those with sinusitis or rhinitis don't get it as bad but still they do suffer.

Feel free to ask any questions and i'll try to ans.

Good luck!

[vivid]

By the way, you can check ebay,<deleted>Amazon for your needs. For the original poster, I think online ordering might present a bit of an issue, ultimately it depends on your local conditions.

On <deleted> you can check do a search on Samsung AX40. Some sellers use EMS, some sellers use FedEx. I think FedEx might be a better option since you guys need it NOW. Also will be more reliable for Chiang Mai. If you are in Bangkok, then EMS should be very reliable as it probably uses the local postal system for the last leg.

I am not sure how much it'd cost. But after factoring it in, it should still be cheaper than your local stores. Do note the 220V 60Hz requreiments from Korea, but over here in Singapore (240V 50Hz), this SAmsung AX40 unit operated perfectly for over a year now. It uses an electronic switch mode power supply, so no worries it can withstand the range.

Edited March 9, 2015 by CharlieH

[vivid]

I have been checking out Thailand's situation on aqicn.org

It seems like in Thailand, you only have PM10 figures published. Check out Hanoi, they have PM2.5 published in addition to PM10.

PM2.5 is more dangerous than PM10 in most cases (google it). In a country as large as Thailand, you can expect the PM2.5 levels to be higher than PM10 (PM10 does not get to travel as far).

This is Hanoi. Note the colour bars and note the spikes and dips. Also note the PM10 and PM2.5 rows. PM2.5 is always worse than PM10

http://aqicn.org/city/vietnam/hanoi/

This is Chiang Mai, note how the bars are smoothed out, it probably is a 24-hr rolling average.

http://aqicn.org/city/thailand/chiangmai/yupparaj-wittayalai-school/

I'd say that a mask is probably needed if you spend more than an hour outside. For susceptible groups, it IS needed.

[masuk]

By the way, you can check ebay, www.qoo10.sg, Amazon for your needs. For the original poster, I think online ordering might present a bit of an issue, ultimately it depends on your local conditions.

On www.qoo10.sg you can check do a search on Samsung AX40. Some sellers use EMS, some sellers use FedEx. I think FedEx might be a better option since you guys need it NOW. Also will be more reliable for Chiang Mai. If you are in Bangkok, then EMS should be very reliable as it probably uses the local postal system for the last leg.

I am not sure how much it'd cost. But after factoring it in, it should still be cheaper than your local stores. Do note the 220V 60Hz requreiments from Korea, but over here in Singapore (240V 50Hz), this SAmsung AX40 unit operated perfectly for over a year now. It uses an electronic switch mode power supply, so no worries it can withstand the range.

I understand that a 10% range in voltage is not a problem.

I brought some 220V equipment from Europe (220V) to Australia (240V) many years ago, and they all ran perfectly well.

[Cheesekraft]

when outside, buy some masks that filter out the smoke and it will help immensely, as that is when you are most exposed. 3M P95 particulate respirators to be exact. Try getting some 3m Filtrete filters for your A/C. Limit outdoor exposure, and NAC (n-acetyl-cysteine) and vitamin C can show some lesser benefits, enough to be worthwhile during smoking season imo.

[true blue]

some great help and advice from posters,must be pretty rough if you have some sort of bronchial proplem and staying here.any one got any advise on streaming eyes,mine are pretty watery at the moment,in or outside probably drops????,

[cmsally]

Today seems much worse and the pollution readings are lower than last week when it got a bit bad (but not half as bad as today). I wouldn't put much faith in the numbers.

I am thinking of exiting for a week or so if I can schedule it. About the only solution.

[beau thai]

Yep, I can hardly see off my 12th floor terrace and the smell of smoke is the worst I have known.

But I check the figures and PM10 93 and moderate at City Hall so everything is ok!! Or is AQ site run byt TAT??

Maybe I shoul;d relocate to City Hall.....

[MaeJoMTB]

I have been checking out Thailand's situation on aqicn.org

It seems like in Thailand, you only have PM10 figures published. Check out Hanoi, they have PM2.5 published in addition to PM10.

PM2.5 is more dangerous than PM10 in most cases (google it). In a country as large as Thailand, you can expect the PM2.5 levels to be higher than PM10 (PM10 does not get to travel as far).

This is Hanoi. Note the colour bars and note the spikes and dips. Also note the PM10 and PM2.5 rows. PM2.5 is always worse than PM10

http://aqicn.org/city/vietnam/hanoi/

This is Chiang Mai, note how the bars are smoothed out, it probably is a 24-hr rolling average.

http://aqicn.org/city/thailand/chiangmai/yupparaj-wittayalai-school/

I'd say that a mask is probably needed if you spend more than an hour outside. For susceptible groups, it IS needed.

Passive masks aren't useful for people with Asthma as far as I know.

The added breathing resistance caused by the mask adds to the problem.

(feel free to correct me OP)

[Lizard2010]

Wow it is bad today

Just returned from my bicycle Ride

Eyes sore

I had better look around for face mask

Plus buy some eye cleaner

[Cheesekraft]

the numbers indicate that a couple of days ago are worse; leading me to believe the numbers are inaccurate. Anyone else feel this way?...

[Lobo4819]

I'll be specific. Get some 3M Filtrete fabric (HomePro, 3M shop, etc.) and cover the existing AC filters with it. Or get someone to help you do this. This will filter out the particles that your &lt;deleted&gt; filters miss., and turn your AC unit into an air purifier. Again at HomePro, 3M shop, or Baan & Beyond, get some 3M N-95 face masks. The stupid things that all the Thais wear only filter out large bugs. The N-95 masks filter out very small particles (they are rated for Ebola, if ever that invades). If it doesn't have N-95 stamped on in, don't buy it. You can spray paint all day in one. I bicycle about 20 km per day, and wear one while exercising. A quality face mask like this puts a slightly higher load on your pulmonary system, so if exercising, you may want to cut back your workout intensity a bit, but for normal household stuff. they are fine.

[Sparkles]

Wow it is bad today

Just returned from my bicycle Ride

Eyes sore

I had better look around for face mask

Plus buy some eye cleaner

For cleaning eyes OPTAL is pretty good ,cheap as chips and seems to help, comes with eye bath

[vivid]

I have been checking out Thailand's situation on aqicn.org

It seems like in Thailand, you only have PM10 figures published. Check out Hanoi, they have PM2.5 published in addition to PM10.

PM2.5 is more dangerous than PM10 in most cases (google it). In a country as large as Thailand, you can expect the PM2.5 levels to be higher than PM10 (PM10 does not get to travel as far).

This is Hanoi. Note the colour bars and note the spikes and dips. Also note the PM10 and PM2.5 rows. PM2.5 is always worse than PM10

http://aqicn.org/city/vietnam/hanoi/

This is Chiang Mai, note how the bars are smoothed out, it probably is a 24-hr rolling average.

http://aqicn.org/city/thailand/chiangmai/yupparaj-wittayalai-school/

I'd say that a mask is probably needed if you spend more than an hour outside. For susceptible groups, it IS needed.

Passive masks aren't useful for people with Asthma as far as I know.

The added breathing resistance caused by the mask adds to the problem.

(feel free to correct me OP)

Those in the susceptible/sensitive groups, as some have already mentioned above, number 1 thing to do is to limit outdoor exposure. Every walking step = increased respiration = additional exposure. Everyone's response to haze is quite different.

But we know that this is not always possible, and in cosmopolitan Singapore and many cities whereby you are trying to earn as much $$$ as possible with businesses implementing Business Continuity Plans, this is probably impossible. The same thing goes for bird flu, perhaps some of you remember SARS in 2003. It's either you go to a doc and get a medical certificate to exempt you from returning to office or you just continue the rat race. "Business as usual". This is especially so in a prolonged bout of haze that could stretch on for several weeks/months (continuously or intermittently).

Hence the number 2 option, fine particulate masks like FFP-1/N95s....for those who need it due to prolonged exposure outside esp those requiring exertion which leads to increased respiration.

I am looking at City Hall Chiang Mai right now, and yes it's steadily increasing. PM10 of AQI 120 now. Mae hongson and Phayao are also increasing.

The only "issue" I see is that this is probably a 24-hr rolling average number, my experience here in Singapore is that it smooths out all the peaks and valleys. However, this is not to say that the 24-hr number is not useful. It just doesn't tell you the whole picture. That said, I am not saying that there is anything wrong, just that there are additional missing pieces of info and hence things can be improved.

This is what happened to Singapore and Peninsula Malaysia in 2013. We hit a peak of 3-hr rolling average PSI of 401 (it was achieved at a concentration of 500 ug/m3 for PM10). Luckily it did not persist for long.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Southeast_Asian_haze

The readings are a wee different, we use the PSI system in Singapore and Malaysia uses API, China and USA uses AQI. There are different health advisories for each system. But having said that, hazy air = hazy air. You body lets you know that it's not good.

For 2014, we experienced intermittent haze from Sep to Dec 2014 for 3 months. It was much lower in level but very much prolonged. So what happened is that for folks in the Sensitive Groups, their symptoms did not exactly go away. Some of my more sensitive colleagues coughed nearly non-stop for the whole 3 months, with intermittent sore throat etc.

Just some additional info there, for those who are interested. =)

[vivid]

I'll be specific. Get some 3M Filtrete fabric (HomePro, 3M shop, etc.) and cover the existing AC filters with it. Or get someone to help you do this. This will filter out the particles that your <deleted> filters miss., and turn your AC unit into an air purifier. Again at HomePro, 3M shop, or Baan & Beyond, get some 3M N-95 face masks. The stupid things that all the Thais wear only filter out large bugs. The N-95 masks filter out very small particles (they are rated for Ebola, if ever that invades). If it doesn't have N-95 stamped on in, don't buy it. You can spray paint all day in one. I bicycle about 20 km per day, and wear one while exercising. A quality face mask like this puts a slightly higher load on your pulmonary system, so if exercising, you may want to cut back your workout intensity a bit, but for normal household stuff. they are fine.

The 3M Filtrete electrostatic filter does work decently and may be the fastest and cheapest practical option for those who can still get it.

During the 2013 haze in Singapore, someone experimented with it and got the below measurements. It is not going to beat an air purifier, but still it works and anything is better than nothing.

One thing to note is that you can use it at the intake side of a fan as well. If one is to use it at the aircon fan coil unit, make sure that it's not impeding the airflow too much (some aircon FCUs are choked full of dust due to months of neglect). Else your metal coil would freeze and that is gonna cost $$$.

[vivid]

the numbers indicate that a couple of days ago are worse; leading me to believe the numbers are inaccurate. Anyone else feel this way?...

It's probably not inaccurate. I do not know where does aqicn.org source its number from for Thailand (it's probably some Thai environment ministry webby or something), perhaps you please could point it out to me?

The same thing happened in Singapore before year 2014 (we had haze in 2006, 2008 etc), until last year they released hourly PM2.5 concentration raw data in addition to the PM10 figures. Even the 3-hr rolling average figure does not tell you much as there is not much "resolution".

I highly suspect the number that is published there for Thailand is a 24-hour figure, according to the shape of the graph. Most scientific epidemiological studies are done with 24-hr "short term" exposure.

However, ENT specialists here in SG say that even a short term exposure in hours or even minutes can trigger an episode of asthma esp those involving huge spikes.

The Bejing (China) and US Embassy in Beijing air quality "fiasco" for PM2.5 and PM10 was pretty international and interesting to say the least (USA and China in a boxing ring, always interesting!). You can read about it all here.

https://www.chinadialogue.net/article/4661-Beijing-s-hazardous-blue-sky?order=old&page=2

http://www.ebeijing.gov.cn/BeijingInformation/BeijingNewsUpdate/t1212024.htm

There is a lot of public pressure to clean up China's air pollution, despite censorship.

This is how bad it is in China. Some reporter in China got some good connections (and $$$) and did the video. In China, this is already blocked and taken down in the local videoshare sites and forums.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6X2uwlQGQM

Edited March 9, 2015 by vivid

[vivid]

some great help and advice from posters,must be pretty rough if you have some sort of bronchial proplem and staying here.any one got any advise on streaming eyes,mine are pretty watery at the moment,in or outside probably drops????,

Eye drops help. But that is passive + reactive.

Nothing short of a full eyes goggles would work, unfortunately. And it looks dorky.

Some folks experience rashes. I have one colleague who has skin rash whenever there is haze, her rhinitis is just as bad.

For me, I have terrible headaches so much so that I need to pop paracetamol regularly (I keep it to within 8 x 500mg per 24hrs), but not so much of rhinitis despite being a sufferer.

[vivid]

Ok, I can confirm that Thailand uses a 24-hr figure for PM10.

http://www.pcd.go.th/AirQuality/Regional/Graph/CreateAQI2.cfm

AQI from PM10 is based on the 24 hours running average, calculated at 09.00hrs today."

Ok, found the latest/present source.

http://aqmthai.com/

Moving AVG 24 Hour หมายถึง ค่าเฉลี่ย 24 ชั่วโมงแบบ

ศาลากลางเชียงใหม่

198 ug/m3 PM10

198 ug/m3 PM10 (24-hr avg) indicates a AQI of 122

http://airnow.gov/index.cfm?action=resources.conc_aqi_calc

So yes, aqicn.org figures are legit for Thailand. Just that there is no report on PM2.5 (24-hr or hourly, whatever)

I can tell you from experience with the 24-hr moving average figure, that if you guys experienced dense haze today, it would take the figure quite some time to rise, and it only somewhat gets reflected tomorrow, if and only if the dense haze persists for a good number of hours.

Edited March 9, 2015 by vivid

[vivid]

The links below would give you a very good idea how long the haze is gonna last. Currently Thailand and surrounding countries are just absolutely dry.

Below picture denoting the hotspots is for 5th March 2015. I screen captured it.

Source is from ASMC. (cloud cover today blocked many parts of Thailand etc)

http://www.weather.gov.sg/wip/web/ASMC

Another source of information is from the ASEAN FDRS or Fire Danger Rating Ssystem. It gives you the moisture content of grasslands, peatlands etc based on meteorological data.

http://haze.asean.org/

Edited March 9, 2015 by vivid

[beau thai]

some great help and advice from posters,must be pretty rough if you have some sort of bronchial proplem and staying here.any one got any advise on streaming eyes,mine are pretty watery at the moment,in or outside probably drops????,

Eye drops help. But that is passive + reactive.

Nothing short of a full eyes goggles would work, unfortunately. And it looks dorky.

Some folks experience rashes. I have one colleague who has skin rash whenever there is haze, her rhinitis is just as bad.

For me, I have terrible headaches so much so that I need to pop paracetamol regularly (I keep it to within 8 x 500mg per 24hrs), but not so much of rhinitis despite being a sufferer.

You mention skin rashes- I suffered with them for months here for first time in my life.

Pharmacy sells a calamanine/menthol liquid but it just blocks the pores.

My dermo said apply rubbing alcohol with cotton wool pads, and within a week the rash had gone. It opens up the pores and actually the pads look dirty even if you use them just after a shower which puzzled me. The dermo said the 'dirt' is just keratin and removal allows perspiration easier passage.

Havent needed to try it on my face but it works well on the body, but DYOR!

[jonwilly]

I know Dr Morgan often wears the "white' surgical masks that so many Thais wear.

I have not seen anyone riding around town in a more sophisticated "3Ms" type this year and only a few, very few in previous years.

I usually go away but I also use a White Mask when riding around town and the manner in which is dirties up tells me why not perfect it is removing much of the airborne muck.

john