Help with answer to daughter's question

[sir charles IV]

My non-thai daughter loves her thai step-mum. She is puzzled with how my wife pronounces R words with L and the L words with R. (Prease vs please and lice vs rice). If a sound does not exist in a certain language it is understandable. Both do in thai.

On a similar note as I'm trying to learn thai I copy her. To my horror when the gps in our car said in that "song Roy" turn left. I asked is it not meant to be "song loi"? She replied the correct term is "Roy". Is she a bad teacher or is it a "Thai thing" and just get on with it? All this time thinking I'm learning proper thai.

[simon43]

The 'r' sound exists in Thai, (as you mention), but doesn't exist in Lao language. Lao people and those from north-east Thailand who speak Issan-Lao will often use an 'l' in place of the 'r', (not 100% all the time - some 'r' words will be changed to start with an 'h').

So 'roi' will be 'loi', and 'farang' will be 'falang' etc.

Additionally, the 'r' sound is a little difficult for many Thais to pronounce, so they will use the 'l' sound, even though they are not from Issan.

Clear now?

[sir charles IV]

The 'r' sound exists in Thai, (as you mention), but doesn't exist in Lao language. Lao people and those from north-east Thailand who speak Issan-Lao will often use an 'l' in place of the 'r', (not 100% all the time - some 'r' words will be changed to start with an 'h').

So 'roi' will be 'loi', and 'farang' will be 'falang' etc.

Additionally, the 'r' sound is a little difficult for many Thais to pronounce, so they will use the 'l' sound, even though they are not from Issan.

Clear now?

you make perfect sense. She is from north east near lao border. And she does say the language there is closer to lao than it is to thai. So am I learning lao now? Geez.

[CharlieH]

Moved to the PUB, where similar questions on basic language/pronounciation have been asked, if you want more in depth, suggest you post in the Thai language forum.

[simon43]

Thanks Charlie, I'll keep this thread as a general discussion, without in-depth or Thai script etc.

If you are learning to speak Thai, it makes sense to learn 'Bangkok Thai', or central Thai, since that pronounciation will be (should be?) understood by all Thais, regardless of whether their 'family' language is Issan from the north-east or Southern Thai from the south or... or...

Additionally, if you learn to speak Thai as is spoken in a regional location, it may be that Thai people's perception of you is somewhat 'degraded', ==> meaning that if you can only speak bar-girl Issan or taxi-driver Southern Thai, then you may be looked on as the same!

The best option, if you have an interest in languages, is to learn both Bangkok Thai as your main instrument of conversation in Thailand, and then also learn some key words/phrases in the regional dialect.

A knowledge of both Issan and Thai can be a little confusing at times.

For example, the Thai word for umbrella is 'rom' (I'm ignoring tones in this example)

The Thai word for wind is 'lom'

So if an Issan person drops the 'r' in umbrella and speaks it with an 'l', then everyone would get rather confused as to why that person needs a 'wind' when it is raining. Because it is not practical to pronounce 'rom' as 'lom', Issan language changes the ;'r; to an 'h'. So 'rom' becomes 'hom', not 'lom'.

Another interesting point about Issan language is that it is a verbal language, not written down. Issan people can only write Issan words using the equivalent Thai characters.

But move just across the Mekong river to Laos, where Lao language is very similar to Issan language (I'm ignoring localised accents/dialects here), and then the language is written down using Lao characters/letters.

In my own family example, the spoken family language is Issan. The written family language is Thai. I can speak both, but I can also read/write Lao, unlike my family members

So a written sentence in Lao language cannot be read by my Issan family, (maybe read with difficulty, since Lao letters are similar to Thai but more 'curvy'). But my family can of course, speak that Lao sentence.

[roamer]

I've often noticed that many Thai's who can, and do, pronounce the "r" sound when they are speaking more formally switch to the "L" sound in more informal situations. As Simon says, the former is more difficult for them, especially when speaking fast hence the switch.

[sir charles IV]

Thank u guys for making it clear. Interesting how we can be pigeon holed based on the way we speak (or in my case trying). Never thought of it that way but it does make sense. Next time the wife and I are strolling down a posh part of bkk I shall say "rao rao" instead of "lao lao". [emoji51][emoji51]

[Derek M]

Mai pen lai!

[Aussieroaming]

I made my wife repeat Colin Farrel's name repeatedly until she distinguished her R and L. His name was Corin Fallel for a while until she got it but she is good now.

[sir charles IV]

I made my wife repeat Colin Farrel's name repeatedly until she distinguished her R and L. His name was Corin Fallel for a while until she got it but she is good now.

thats hilarious and clever. The other one for the kids is "fridge". She says "fish". Cracks them up!!