Thai court grants Koh Tao evidence review for pair accused of Brit murders

[jdinasia]

re; post #235 and all its verbiage. The H's and RTP defenders will try valiantly to complicate and obfuscate issues relating to this crime. It's already been established that the police lied when they announced Hannah's phone was found near the B2's room. It's a canard. A red-herring. Let's go on.

A phone was found. It is significant to the case. It was misidentified to the press. It will be used in court along with the testimony of the person who broke it and where he got it.

[Si Thea01]

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"If found guilty at their trial -- which is expected to start in early July -- they could face the death penalty, in a case that tarnished Thailand's image as a tourist haven."

Isn't it too much overstated?

They are facing the Death Penalty now. This is why their Lawyers are trying so hard to find a Loop Hole.

One of the main reasons why the Prosecution showed Hannah's Family evidence, or at least explained to them what they have, was to justify why they are going for the Death Penalty. This was clearly stated in that news article.

I don't think this will tarnish their image. Singapore has the Death Penalty for Drugs for many years. I remember quite a few years back when 2 Australian Men were charged for Drug Smuggling and then put to death within that week. The Australian Government was so upset as they didn't even have time for a rebuttal. The bottom line is that this did not hurt their trade our tourism.

Personally I am against Capital Punishment. But then this was not my daughter who was raped and murdered. If it were I am sure I could quite easily change my mind about this. So I guess I am neutral. .

I agree that it is most unlikely for this incident to tarnish the tourism of this country were they to be found guilty and subsequently executed. Does not seem to have affected other countries who have carried out executions. In so far as this matter is concerned, the conclusion is some time off, and we must remember that the trail has not yet begun. Even if they were adjudged guilty and a death sentence imposed, then they have avenues of appeal, which could drag on for years.

The appeal could be dismissed, a death sentence imposed or a term of life imprisonment substituted or the appeal upheld and the conviction quashed. Once all avenues of appeal have been exhausted, they also have the right to seek a royal pardon, so this matter is far from being concluded in the manner many think will occur. Each of us are entitled to our opinions but really emotions should not form the basis of those opinions. None of us can foresee the future, so why are there so many illegitimate claims being made, as the only persons who truly know what occurred on that fateful night are the defendants and, for obvious reasons, they have now withdrawn their initial confessions and are pleading not guilty.

Now, If I may, and hope you don't mind, I would like to correct the reference you made to the Australian executions, which are all drug related.. There has only been one person executed in Singapore, an Australian, Van Tuong Nguyen, who was arrested on the 12th December 2002, and executed on the 2nd December 2005. The two Australians I think you are referring, Barlow and Chambers, were arrested in Malaysia on the 9th November 1983 and after numerous representations by both English and Australian governments, and the normal appeals, were finally executed on the 7th July 1986. There was one other execution in Malaysia, that was of Michael McAuliffe, who after being arrested on the 29th June 1985, was, following his appeals, executed in June 1993.

I won't Cherry Pick with you on this and if it was 1 or 2 in Singapore, as the point I tried to make is having the death sentence in a country does not effect tourism. Which you agreed to.

You are correct about the appeal process yet to come. I am glad you raised that point as nobody else has, and certainly not me. My point, and if I recall my exact words, is that they are "Seeking the Death Penalty". But if I was a Cherry Picker, I could now say to you that you cannot Appeal a Death Sentence until it is first handed down to you. Which hasn't happened yet.

I wasn't trying to be smart, and I know you weren't cherry picking. and agree that nothing can be appealed until sentence is handed down. After some research, it is my understanding that any of the aggrieved parties can appeal, which indicates that the prosecution also has that right.

Apparently it is a long drawn out process, going through various processes and courts, which does not necessarily mean it will be accepted, it could be rejected before even reaching a higher court, however, if there is a successful appeal, the last court to adjudicate on the matter is the Dika or Supreme Court. If successful or not in this jurisdiction, which could take years, the decision, once rendered, is considered final and executory.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Si Thea01

[GOLDBUGGY]

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re; post #235 and all its verbiage. The H's and RTP defenders will try valiantly to complicate and obfuscate issues relating to this crime. It's already been established that the police lied when they announced Hannah's phone was found near the B2's room. It's a canard. A red-herring. Let's go on.

No my friend. You are 100% wrong! It was Social Media that got it wrong, with the help of the police. But the Police didn't lie about anything!

The Police Chief first said that Hannah's Cell Phone was found in the accused residence, after a search was conducted. What happened next is the Media soon had a picture of Hannah's Friend turning her cell phone over to the Police, then photos of her in the Bar with her Cell phone, to prove it was the same one handed over. So from that people accuse the Police of being Liars, and for trying to frame these guys.

Hannah's Cell Phone was turned over to the Police who later gave it to Hannah's Family. This was witnessed by a member of the UK Embassy. They didn't keep it because the Cell Phone that was stolen, which is now evidence, and found in the accused house, belonged to David Miller. The other Murdered Victim.

The Police Chief made a mistake and got confused with names when he made that announcement, and said it was Hannah's Cell Phone when in fact it was David's. A Big Mistake! But a mistake is not a Lie! It also doesn't mean these guys were framed or are innocent. It just means that this Police Chief, who has since been replaced, should have been more careful with his words.

Read this LINK

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412601958&typecate=06&section=

[boomerangutang]

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Whether the alibi video is altered is secondary. The concept of a desperate man, with money getting from the island to Bangkok. in 5 hours is a stretch, but not impossible. But the question of that person's guilt doesn't hinge on that video. The primary issue is whether all the evidence which might pertain to the crime - is taken in to account. Just before the first head cop was replaced, all evidence pointing to the original two prime suspects was tossed in the trash, never to be considered again by officialdom. That's not a proper crime investigation.

Again, you haven't seen the exculpatory evidence.

Once a person is cleared you don't waste time and resources on them.

Your obsession is bizarre.

Maybe it's 'waste of time' to someone with a pre-cemented idea of how he wants the chips to fall.

If I was investigating this case, I would look at all the evidence. Would you?

There are more than a few 'cold cases' in the US, where an investigator took his own time to investigate, sometimes YEARS later. And in some of those formerly 'cold cases' a suspect was revealed - which led to a conviction. An occasional result: criminals who thought they got away with murder, were hauled in and proven guilty by trial - sometimes years after they thought they were cleared. It couldn't happen in Thailand, because officials here are too eager to drop cases and dismiss evidence (and cops here aren't known for thinking outside the box), ....but there's hope it might happen in the future. Another positive outcome of scrutinizing all evidence: dangerous people sometimes get taken off the streets, so they can't murder and rape again (except maybe while incarcerated).

[jdinasia]

Same obsession.

This isn't a cold case.

This is a case in front of a judge.

Edited May 4, 2015 by jdinasia

[stephenterry]

re 226 - AleG

But he revealed that Thais may have been involved in the murders and had tried to destroy evidence linking them to the attacks.

Your memory is not as good as you think, you forgot the very important "may" that preceded the "had tried to destroy evidence". It makes not a small difference in meaning.

Actually, not grammatically correct. The 'may' in this sentence refers to the subject, which is Thais, not the outcome. Had the quote been

...Thais may have been involved in the murders and may have (rather than 'had') tried to destroy evidence... then your interpretation would be correct.

Of course, the English grammar could have been a faulty translation...

[berybert]

I have read a number of comments about posters worrying about tourism on the last page. Now we seem to be getting to some real motives.

[boomerangutang]

The Police Chief made a mistake and got confused with names when he made that announcement, and said it was Hannah's Cell Phone when in fact it was David's. A Big Mistake! But a mistake is not a Lie! It also doesn't mean these guys were framed or are innocent. It just means that this Police Chief, who has since been replaced, should have been more careful with his words.

Read this LINK

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412601958&typecate=06&section=

The police announced it was Hannah's phone because they thought that would add cement to their case against the B2. They were blindsided by social media, which showed how police were in possession of Hannah's phone right after the murder. So their ruse didn't float, and they very quickly switched to say it was David's phone. However, even that was suspect, because it was reported in mid-Sept that David's phone was found at the crime scene. Did he have 2 phones? Maybe.

Even if there was a stolen phone found on the premises, here's another scenario: The B2 are playing guitar with a small crowd around a fire at the beach, after midnight(no one disputes that). They hear a commotion southward about 50 meters. They go and see what all the noise was about. Perps have fled. They take a m.phone and sunglasses. If so, that's theft, and not much more (except leaving the scene of a crime without offering aid to victims. But is that a crime in Thailand?) Why wouldn't they sound an alarm? Asians in general try to skirt away from trouble as much as possible. Plus, every migrant Burmese knows how easy it is to become a scapegoat for a crime in Thailand.

[Si Thea01]

I have read a number of comments about posters worrying about tourism on the last page. Now we seem to be getting to some real motives.

And they are? Please do not keep us in suspense.

[fritzzz25]

This topic seems to be beaten to death like the others that have been closed. I am not sure why this one hasn't been sealed up yet. It is the spewing of the same things over and over.

[stephenterry]

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Pol Maj Gen Kittipong Kaosam-ang, a Surat Thani police commander, asked the media not to report in-depth investigation results, saying it may give some clues to the culprits. But he revealed that Thais may have been involved in the murders and had tried to destroy evidence linking them to the attacks. Some people on Koh Tao had given false information to police in a bid to divert attention. Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Koh-Tao-police-fail-another-day-30243890.html

So, no, my memory is correct. Clearly yours, isn't. From your posts, it seems to me that the initial collecting of evidence doesn't need managing properly for it to pass the competency criteria. Had the police sealed off the crime scene and not allowed all and sundry access, especially Mon, there wouldn't have been attempts to destroy evidence - that is proper evidence management.

I think the Police Officer is correct in his statement.

They knew early on that from DNA Samples collected from Hannah that the killer(s) were Asian. Since a Thai is Asian, then at that time it may have been a Thai. Who knows for sure when they discovered the missing Cell Phone? It would be considered evidence, and it is obvious that someone tried to destroy it. Or at the very least throw it away. They just just didn't know who, or 100% yet, as they didn't have the DNA Match yet.

If the Police Officer is correct in his statement, why would Thai people try and destroy evidence and why would some people on Koh Tao give false information to police in order to divert attention if no Thais were involved? I hope his allegations will be raised in court and be subject to further examination by the defence.

The alternative scenario, i.e. the PO made a mistake, is that the B2 (if complicit in the crimes) would have been marched into police HQ by the locals the following morning. Whichever way one looks at it, the actions of the Thai locals don't match the B2 scenario that has now been painted by the RTP.

[Si Thea01]

The Police Chief made a mistake and got confused with names when he made that announcement, and said it was Hannah's Cell Phone when in fact it was David's. A Big Mistake! But a mistake is not a Lie! It also doesn't mean these guys were framed or are innocent. It just means that this Police Chief, who has since been replaced, should have been more careful with his words.

Read this LINK

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412601958&typecate=06&section=

The police announced it was Hannah's phone because they thought that would add cement to their case against the B2. They were blindsided by social media, which showed how police were in possession of Hannah's phone right after the murder. So their ruse didn't float, and they very quickly switched to say it was David's phone. However, even that was suspect, because it was reported in mid-Sept that David's phone was found at the crime scene. Did he have 2 phones? Maybe.

Even if there was a stolen phone found on the premises, here's another scenario: The B2 are playing guitar with a small crowd around a fire at the beach, after midnight(no one disputes that). They hear a commotion southward about 50 meters. They go and see what all the noise was about. Perps have fled. They take a m.phone and sunglasses. If so, that's theft, and not much more (except leaving the scene of a crime without offering aid to victims. But is that a crime in Thailand?) Why wouldn't they sound an alarm? Asians in general try to skirt away from trouble as much as possible. Plus, every migrant Burmese knows how easy it is to become a scapegoat for a crime in Thailand.

What an amazing deduction from the thought police. Are you fair dinkum? Police did this because they thought it would do that, come on, stop treating members with contempt. A new scenario, straight out of a scene from Hawaii Five O or some other fictitious crime series. Asians skirting away from trouble, gee, now Asia is crime free. This is going from the sublime to the ridiculous.

[boomerangutang]

You figure a Finger Ring matched Davids wounds and was the cause of his demise? You have got to be kidding! Have you seen the wounds on David? Well I have seen the crime photos and although I am not an expert in Forensic, any fool can see that the open long cut to the top left side of his head is no damned Finger Ring! It matches much more closely a wound you would get from being hit hard on the head with a sharp object, like a Garden Hoe.

I also saw photos and diagrams of wounds to David. I was referring to stab wounds to the right side of his neck (and a few other parts of his torso) - as being from a sharp small stabbing implement. Very unlikely caused by a blunt how. The stab wounds appeared to be uniformly about 4 cm inches long by 1 cm wide. They didn't appear to show blunt trauma alongside as one would expect from wounds delivered by (the corner of) a hoe. To get several same-size clean stab wounds from a blunt beach hoe seems very doubtful. I look forward to Brit findings on that, if they ever come forth. I don't trust Thai forensic findings published thus far (were they from expert analysis?).

As for David's head, I don't know. I'm not commenting on that except to say it's possible a different weapon was used. Probably the blunt end of the hoe, the same weapon used on Hanna's head - though police say none of David's DNA was found on hoe (that's also questionable, and the hoe deserves more in-depth scrutiny).

[Si Thea01]

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Whether the alibi video is altered is secondary. The concept of a desperate man, with money getting from the island to Bangkok. in 5 hours is a stretch, but not impossible. But the question of that person's guilt doesn't hinge on that video. The primary issue is whether all the evidence which might pertain to the crime - is taken in to account. Just before the first head cop was replaced, all evidence pointing to the original two prime suspects was tossed in the trash, never to be considered again by officialdom. That's not a proper crime investigation.

Again, you haven't seen the exculpatory evidence.

Once a person is cleared you don't waste time and resources on them.

Your obsession is bizarre.

Maybe it's 'waste of time' to someone with a pre-cemented idea of how he wants the chips to fall.

If I was investigating this case, I would look at all the evidence. Would you?

There are more than a few 'cold cases' in the US, where an investigator took his own time to investigate, sometimes YEARS later. And in some of those formerly 'cold cases' a suspect was revealed - which led to a conviction. An occasional result: criminals who thought they got away with murder, were hauled in and proven guilty by trial - sometimes years after they thought they were cleared. It couldn't happen in Thailand, because officials here are too eager to drop cases and dismiss evidence (and cops here aren't known for thinking outside the box), ....but there's hope it might happen in the future. Another positive outcome of scrutinizing all evidence: dangerous people sometimes get taken off the streets, so they can't murder and rape again (except maybe while incarcerated).

If I was your senior officer then I would have you removed to an inactive post as you are biased, have pre-conceived ideas and clearly are unable to analyse the incident in order to determine fact from fiction.

[boomerangutang]

The Police Chief made a mistake and got confused with names when he made that announcement, and said it was Hannah's Cell Phone when in fact it was David's. A Big Mistake! But a mistake is not a Lie! It also doesn't mean these guys were framed or are innocent. It just means that this Police Chief, who has since been replaced, should have been more careful with his words.

Read this LINK

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412601958&typecate=06&section=

The police announced it was Hannah's phone because they thought that would add cement to their case against the B2. They were blindsided by social media, which showed how police were in possession of Hannah's phone right after the murder. So their ruse didn't float, and they very quickly switched to say it was David's phone. However, even that was suspect, because it was reported in mid-Sept that David's phone was found at the crime scene. Did he have 2 phones? Maybe.

Even if there was a stolen phone found on the premises, here's another scenario: The B2 are playing guitar with a small crowd around a fire at the beach, after midnight(no one disputes that). They hear a commotion southward about 50 meters. They go and see what all the noise was about. Perps have fled. They take a m.phone and sunglasses. If so, that's theft, and not much more (except leaving the scene of a crime without offering aid to victims. But is that a crime in Thailand?) Why wouldn't they sound an alarm? Asians in general try to skirt away from trouble as much as possible. Plus, every migrant Burmese knows how easy it is to become a scapegoat for a crime in Thailand.

What an amazing deduction from the thought police. Are you fair dinkum? Police did this because they thought it would do that, come on, stop treating members with contempt. A new scenario, straight out of a scene from Hawaii Five O or some other fictitious crime series. Asians skirting away from trouble, gee, now Asia is crime free. This is going from the sublime to the ridiculous.

Ok, calm down, take a deep breath. I know this case and its botched investigation stirs up emotions, but that doesn't have to make the H's/RTP's defenders in to a bunch of Jr. H.S. girls having nitfits.

Thai police have been known to toss out crime scenarios and (particularly if dealing with a Thai audience) are accustomed to people accepting those scenarios, however reluctantly/quietly. Social media is a relatively new phenomena, and Thai officials were unpleasantly surprised when social media took such close looks at all the shenanigans RTP/H's people mixed in to the investigation.

When I mentioned 'Asians skirt away from trouble as much as possible' - I wasn't referring to perps, I was referring to bystanders and/or witnesses.

[boomerangutang]

If I was your senior officer then I would have you removed to an inactive post as you are biased, have pre-conceived ideas and clearly are unable to analyse the incident in order to determine fact from fiction.

You're right. I would make an awful Thai cop. I would buck the trends and search diligently for the real truth, rather than the story my superiors wanted. You'd be right in shutting me down.

[stephenterry]

If I was your senior officer then I would have you removed to an inactive post as you are biased, have pre-conceived ideas and clearly are unable to analyse the incident in order to determine fact from fiction.

You're right. I would make an awful Thai cop. I would buck the trends and search diligently for the real truth, rather than the story my superiors wanted. You'd be right in shutting me down.

Boom - it seems you're on the attitude adjustment list. How dare you criticise your senior officer.

[JLCrab]

If I was your senior officer then I would have you removed to an inactive post as you are biased, have pre-conceived ideas and clearly are unable to analyse the incident in order to determine fact from fiction.

You're right. I would make an awful Thai cop. I would buck the trends and search diligently for the real truth, rather than the story my superiors wanted. You'd be right in shutting me down.

Boom - it seems you're on the attitude adjustment list. How dare you criticise your senior officer.

It ain't so hard to criticize your senior officer when you're doing from a keyboard in Chiang Nowhere.

[AleG]

The Police Chief made a mistake and got confused with names when he made that announcement, and said it was Hannah's Cell Phone when in fact it was David's. A Big Mistake! But a mistake is not a Lie! It also doesn't mean these guys were framed or are innocent. It just means that this Police Chief, who has since been replaced, should have been more careful with his words.

Read this LINK

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412601958&typecate=06&section=

The police announced it was Hannah's phone because they thought that would add cement to their case against the B2. They were blindsided by social media, which showed how police were in possession of Hannah's phone right after the murder. So their ruse didn't float, and they very quickly switched to say it was David's phone. However, even that was suspect, because it was reported in mid-Sept that David's phone was found at the crime scene. Did he have 2 phones? Maybe.

Even if there was a stolen phone found on the premises, here's another scenario: The B2 are playing guitar with a small crowd around a fire at the beach, after midnight(no one disputes that). They hear a commotion southward about 50 meters. They go and see what all the noise was about. Perps have fled. They take a m.phone and sunglasses. If so, that's theft, and not much more (except leaving the scene of a crime without offering aid to victims. But is that a crime in Thailand?) Why wouldn't they sound an alarm? Asians in general try to skirt away from trouble as much as possible. Plus, every migrant Burmese knows how easy it is to become a scapegoat for a crime in Thailand.

What an amazing deduction from the thought police. Are you fair dinkum? Police did this because they thought it would do that, come on, stop treating members with contempt. A new scenario, straight out of a scene from Hawaii Five O or some other fictitious crime series. Asians skirting away from trouble, gee, now Asia is crime free. This is going from the sublime to the ridiculous.

Then, of course, the fact that the bodies were found by Burmese cleaners that then raised the alert completely demolishes Boomerangutang's latest display of self serving prejudice.

[GOLDBUGGY]

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The Police Chief made a mistake and got confused with names when he made that announcement, and said it was Hannah's Cell Phone when in fact it was David's. A Big Mistake! But a mistake is not a Lie! It also doesn't mean these guys were framed or are innocent. It just means that this Police Chief, who has since been replaced, should have been more careful with his words.

Read this LINK

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1412601958&typecate=06&section=

The police announced it was Hannah's phone because they thought that would add cement to their case against the B2. They were blindsided by social media, which showed how police were in possession of Hannah's phone right after the murder. So their ruse didn't float, and they very quickly switched to say it was David's phone. However, even that was suspect, because it was reported in mid-Sept that David's phone was found at the crime scene. Did he have 2 phones? Maybe.

Even if there was a stolen phone found on the premises, here's another scenario: The B2 are playing guitar with a small crowd around a fire at the beach, after midnight(no one disputes that). They hear a commotion southward about 50 meters. They go and see what all the noise was about. Perps have fled. They take a m.phone and sunglasses. If so, that's theft, and not much more (except leaving the scene of a crime without offering aid to victims. But is that a crime in Thailand?) Why wouldn't they sound an alarm? Asians in general try to skirt away from trouble as much as possible. Plus, every migrant Burmese knows how easy it is to become a scapegoat for a crime in Thailand.

And your fast knowledge about these guys comes from where? When are you ever going to LINK some of the BS you are saying.

Okay! I will play along!

First you say that if you murdered them you would keep the cell phone to hopefully sell later.

Now you say these guys stepped over dead bodies to retrieve a cell phone, yet not report this to the Police?

Now I say you have about as much logical thinking as a Pig's Patuney.

Do you really believe what you say. I am interested in you not for what you say, but cant believe someone like you exists. I must be a joke.

Do you think it makes a damned bit of difference if the cell phone that was found in there house was Hannah's or David's? Because it doesn't make a difference as both were murdered and they did not give the cell phone to them.

Now you claim that while sitting on the log, which before said I was full of it and where did I get such information, hear some noise. They did not see anyone walk past them, which by the photos was impossible not to. Nor did they see anyone leave. They just walked over dead bodies to pick up a Cell Phone, the saw on the ground, and then walked home for a good night sleep.

I hope this is the defense's main argument and you work for them. You wouldn't know evidence if it hit you with the same club, and not Hoe as tyou said earlier, square on the Nose.

These Bastards Murdered and Raped an Innocent UK Girl on vacation and only having some fun.

And Yes! When convicted I would gladly sign up for the Firing Squad (which Thailand does not use anymore) and put an end to these Monsters.

Anything else you want to know?

[berybert]

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Personally I am against Capital Punishment. But then this was not my daughter who was raped and murdered. If it were I am sure I could quite easily change my mind about this. So I guess I am neutral. .

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And Yes! When convicted I would gladly sign up for the Firing Squad (which Thailand does not use anymore) and put an end to these Monsters.

Anything else you want to know?

In 3 pages of an internet forum discussion you have turned from a person who is against the death penalty to someone who would actually pull the trigger.

Unhinged springs to mind.

[boomerangutang]

Then, of course, the fact that the bodies were found by Burmese cleaners that then raised the alert completely demolishes Boomerangutang's latest display of self serving prejudice.

Whether cleaners found the bodies or not is not mentioned by either side of the prior missives. That's a side topic. You wanna talk about who found the bodies, and what action they took? We can talk about that, if you want. It may include Mon saying he was notified, and went running out, dressed only in his briefs (wrong direction, then right direction), and so on. Mon sure looked youthful that morning. How a 40-something yr. old man can look like a 19 yr old skinny kid is amazing. If he's got some 'fountain-of-youth' pills, tell him I'd like some. And all those players are hard-drinkers who party-hardy 'til the wee hours.

Stealing a cell phone and pair of sunglasses from a corpse (if that's what either of the B boys did) is disgusting, but not grounds for putting someone in jail for a year without bail, while facing the death penalty. There's still the prickly issue of who would get so enraged as to bludgeon a young woman to death. Two guys who, minutes earlier, were playing guitar by a campfire?

Answer that question, and you're probably well on the way to solving the case.

[GOLDBUGGY]

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Personally I am against Capital Punishment. But then this was not my daughter who was raped and murdered. If it were I am sure I could quite easily change my mind about this. So I guess I am neutral. .

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And Yes! When convicted I would gladly sign up for the Firing Squad (which Thailand does not use anymore) and put an end to these Monsters.

Anything else you want to know?

In 3 pages of an internet forum discussion you have turned from a person who is against the death penalty to someone who would actually pull the trigger.

Unhinged springs to mind.

You keep changing the subject because you are caught in a web of Lies and BS.

A man comes home and finds his wife in bed with His Best Friend. He is in shock. He goes to his car to think things over and discovers how angry he is. He takes a Legal Gun from his glove compartment, goes back to the bedroom, and in anger shoots both of them. But law, this is premeditated murder and he would get the death sentence.

This is the kind of murder I am against for the death sentence.

But to Monsters who brutally rape and murder a young woman like this, I am not.

I have made it perfectly clear I am against the death penalty, but could quickly change if it was my daughter. For these monsters I have change my view. There is nothing wrong with my hinges. But there is certainly something wrong with you. Which you have now proved many times to everyone here.

I never called anyone a Troll before, so you don't get this honor from me either.

A Drunken Idiot would be closer to my thoughts! Which by-the-way surpasses the name Fool! You have presented nothing in your defense, or their defense, except nonsense. Which now coming from you this is all you have to present, so I fully understand.

You are fooling nobody here, except yourself.

Now go and play and let the Grown-ups talk!

[jdinasia]

Then, of course, the fact that the bodies were found by Burmese cleaners that then raised the alert completely demolishes Boomerangutang's latest display of self serving prejudice.

Whether cleaners found the bodies or not is not mentioned by either side of the prior missives. That's a side topic. You wanna talk about who found the bodies, and what action they took? We can talk about that, if you want. It may include Mon saying he was notified, and went running out, dressed only in his briefs (wrong direction, then right direction), and so on. Mon sure looked youthful that morning. How a 40-something yr. old man can look like a 19 yr old skinny kid is amazing. If he's got some 'fountain-of-youth' pills, tell him I'd like some. And all those players are hard-drinkers who party-hardy 'til the wee hours.

Stealing a cell phone and pair of sunglasses from a corpse (if that's what either of the B boys did) is disgusting, but not grounds for putting someone in jail for a year without bail, while facing the death penalty. There's still the prickly issue of who would get so enraged as to bludgeon a young woman to death. Two guys who, minutes earlier, were playing guitar by a campfire?

Answer that question, and you're probably well on the way to solving the case.

Strawman -

The defendants aren't in jail for theft, they aren't possibly facing the death penalty for theft. They are in jail for rape and murder.

Yet your fixation with people who aren't suspects is quite telling.

[Si Thea01]

Then, of course, the fact that the bodies were found by Burmese cleaners that then raised the alert completely demolishes Boomerangutang's latest display of self serving prejudice.

Whether cleaners found the bodies or not is not mentioned by either side of the prior missives. That's a side topic. You wanna talk about who found the bodies, and what action they took? We can talk about that, if you want. It may include Mon saying he was notified, and went running out, dressed only in his briefs (wrong direction, then right direction), and so on. Mon sure looked youthful that morning. How a 40-something yr. old man can look like a 19 yr old skinny kid is amazing. If he's got some 'fountain-of-youth' pills, tell him I'd like some. And all those players are hard-drinkers who party-hardy 'til the wee hours.

Stealing a cell phone and pair of sunglasses from a corpse (if that's what either of the B boys did) is disgusting, but not grounds for putting someone in jail for a year without bail, while facing the death penalty. There's still the prickly issue of who would get so enraged as to bludgeon a young woman to death. Two guys who, minutes earlier, were playing guitar by a campfire?

Answer that question, and you're probably well on the way to solving the case.

Are you really saying that the two defendants were gaoled and bail refused because of allegedly stealing a phone and sunglasses from one of the deceased. They confessed, didn't they, whether foolishly or otherwise, to the murders and rape, so I'd suggest it is for these reasons that they were gaoled and also because they were in the country illegally and were considered a flight risk. Now, whether it occurred as they alleged or not, they have taken themselves out of the frying pan and into the fire, either by being truthful and admitting to something without understanding their rights or, as they allege, were forced to confess.

Yes, they retracted their confessions, alleging they were made under duress but did this not occur until sometime later and only following a meeting with their legal representatives? Unfortunately, in any country, not only Thailand, if someone makes admissions and were found to be a flight risk, they too, would be interned until they had to present before a judge. I don't understand why you are forever harping on about them being gaoled and facing the death penalty, don't you understand that they are not facing anything yet, except a trail. They are not at risk of being executed for the alleged crimes, how can they be when they have not been convicted of any offence.

You are not now, nor will you ever be, privy to any of the evidence for or against the defendants until it is given in court. Now some may be released to the media but this is after the event so how is it that you profess to be an expert and have all this knowledge which enables you to decry others who have opposing opinions. No one knows what the outcome will be, I am sure the hell I don't and after reading the rubbish you post, I can assuredly state that you do not either, even though you think you do.

Biases, hearsay, innuendo, rumours and in some cases fabrications, do not come into play in a murder trail and the evidence given must be proven, beyond a reasonable doubt, that the defendants are guilty however, if this does not occur, then maybe, just maybe, they will be exonerated. I must add that your last statement is so ludicrous that one has to comment. No one, and I mean no one, on TVF, the lead investigators, detectives and lawyer, have any idea or will solve the case but it does make for some interesting reading. I really hope you were not serious with this aspect and said it, "tongue in cheek."

Edited May 4, 2015 by Si Thea01

[mcm991]

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In 3 pages of an internet forum discussion you have turned from a person who is against the death penalty to someone who would actually pull the trigger.

Unhinged springs to mind.

You keep changing the subject because you are caught in a web of Lies and BS.

A man comes home and finds his wife in bed with His Best Friend. He is in shock. He goes to his car to think things over and discovers how angry he is. He takes a Legal Gun from his glove compartment, goes back to the bedroom, and in anger shoots both of them. But law, this is premeditated murder and he would get the death sentence.

This is the kind of murder I am against for the death sentence.

But to Monsters who brutally rape and murder a young woman like this, I am not.

I have made it perfectly clear I am against the death penalty, but could quickly change if it was my daughter. For these monsters I have change my view. There is nothing wrong with my hinges. But there is certainly something wrong with you. Which you have now proved many times to everyone here.

I never called anyone a Troll before, so you don't get this honor from me either.

A Drunken Idiot would be closer to my thoughts! Which by-the-way surpasses the name Fool! You have presented nothing in your defense, or their defense, except nonsense. Which now coming from you this is all you have to present, so I fully understand.

You are fooling nobody here, except yourself.

Now go and play and let the Grown-ups talk!

I always thought the BiB cheerleading squad could use a hired goon to stir things up and muddy the water on occasion - just to keep things interesting. You may even be over qualified for the position.

I don't agree with their opnions and I'm often suspicious of their motivations but they are not idiots.

You arrived at the party late with too many empty bottles in your car - armed only with a few headlines that you read slowly while on the can.

Nobody is defending monsters and rapists. They are well meaning people who think for very good reasons that these guys are not the perps. I also do not believe that these 2 are the guilty ones. There are literally thousands of posts going back to last year that you can read through if you want the details as to why I and many others feel a good case can be made for their innocense.

I'm waiting to see what transpires at their trial - hopefully enough publicity will keep it from being a farce. I'm not holding my breath though......

Incidently, the case you describe in your post would likely be considered a 'crime of passion' and not premeditated murder - and not result in the death penalty.

[jdinasia]

MCM - rape leading to murder is a capital case in Thailand.

[mcm991]

MCM - rape leading to murder is a capital case in Thailand.

Sorry if unclear JD.

I was referring to the example given of the man finding his wife in bed with his mate.

I am aware that this case here and now is a capital case.

[jdinasia]

What is interesting is that in Thailand, when you confess, as the 2 Burmese defendants did; you receive a reduced sentence (normally)

However, a man who confessed was sentenced to death at almost the same time as the defendants.

[DM07]

Just one question to the hang'em high-brigade: soooooo...let's assume for a second, that you are right (which you are not IMO) and the B2 killed and raped poor Hannah (which they did not IMO).

They didn't care to flee the island, they didn't care for the hoe, they didn't care throwing the victims phone (one of many, if we follow all the police reporting) behind their place and they are overall totally careless with important evidence.

How come, the second murder weapon was never found and there never was any mentioning of bloodstained clothes...and as I understand, there should have been lots of blood!

They didn't give two hot sh1ts for all the "evidence" presented, but they were careful enough to get rid of the clothes and the second murder weapon, right?!

Just asking your opinions, of course!