My Compliments to Local Thai Car Drivers

[beau thai]

The only possible explanation for what we see and have to negotiate on thai roads is that at the moment many/most thai drivers turn on their engine the key they are holding simultaneously turns off their brain.

I also believe that some cultural traits in the Thai make-up do not lend themselves to being able to manage a vehicle in any kind of proper way. The interesting thing is that plenty of thai drivers are okay and can negotiate their vehicles without endangering other road-users and without causing conditions for possible road-rage.

I personally believe in the power of education, and we all know that passing the driving test here is hardly complicated, and that's assuming that individual citizens have decided to even bother with taking this test.

I have often wondered if, just for one month, what would happen if a whole bunch of thai drivers were plonked onto the streets of england, and a whole heap of english drivers were plonked onto the streets of thailand. I believe in both countries there would be a significant decrease in the populations - in england people would be killed by dangerous drivers and in thailand people would be killed from the massive rise in road rage.

I think it is very insulting to state that thai drivers turn off their brain when they start there car. Maybe just a superior farang joke?

They have a different 'system' of driving that incomers need to adjust to. By and large it works. (Yes I know all about all the road safety stats here).

Sometimes their driving style drives me crazy but I accept that it works.

For the many hours I drive both in and out of the city and long distances, I see very very few accidents. Because people use their brain to avoid accidents.

Many countries evolve different driving styles/systems.In the UK its never ok to run a red or overtake on the inside. In the US in many places its ok to turn on a red if the way is clear. Like here. And overtaking on the inside in the US seems normal.

When in Rome, ..... adapt.

[hml367]

I think it is very insulting to state that thai drivers turn off their brain when they start there car. Maybe just a superior farang joke?

They have a different 'system' of driving that incomers need to adjust to. By and large it works. (Yes I know all about all the road safety stats here).

Sometimes their driving style drives me crazy but I accept that it works.

For the many hours I drive both in and out of the city and long distances, I see very very few accidents. Because people use their brain to avoid accidents.

Many countries evolve different driving styles/systems.In the UK its never ok to run a red or overtake on the inside. In the US in many places its ok to turn on a red if the way is clear. Like here. And overtaking on the inside in the US seems normal.

When in Rome, ..... adapt.

Good post... adapt and understand the local customs and traditions ~ CM Expats Club.

Edited May 4, 2015 by hml367

[MESmith]

The only possible explanation for what we see and have to negotiate on thai roads is that at the moment many/most thai drivers turn on their engine the key they are holding simultaneously turns off their brain.

I also believe that some cultural traits in the Thai make-up do not lend themselves to being able to manage a vehicle in any kind of proper way. The interesting thing is that plenty of thai drivers are okay and can negotiate their vehicles without endangering other road-users and without causing conditions for possible road-rage.

I personally believe in the power of education, and we all know that passing the driving test here is hardly complicated, and that's assuming that individual citizens have decided to even bother with taking this test.

I have often wondered if, just for one month, what would happen if a whole bunch of thai drivers were plonked onto the streets of england, and a whole heap of english drivers were plonked onto the streets of thailand. I believe in both countries there would be a significant decrease in the populations - in england people would be killed by dangerous drivers and in thailand people would be killed from the massive rise in road rage.

I see very very few accidents. Because people use their brain to avoid accidents.

You do know what all the white paint on the road means? Outlines of motorbikes & cars with reg numbers next to them? Seen the backlog at car body repair shops? LOL

[MESmith]

Unbelievable, a thread on complimenting local drivers. Meanwhile, in the real world, a thread on 3 cyclists mown down by a drunk driver....

[Happy Grumpy]

Of course, it could simply be that the majority of Thai drivers do not encounter courtesy driving and are totally bemused. Dunno!

Actually, you see this across everything, and not just the roads.

But yes, stop at a zebra crossing and 'allow' the people to start walking across.... watch their expressions of utter bemusement. Though don't do it, it's seriously dangerous to follow that rule of the road.

[willfreeman]

they tend to be patient in the city, get outside the city and they are incredibly impatient drivers which leads to speeding and overtaking on blind corners and over crests.

as for people saying the local system works? yeah it does in that some people get where they are going but lets not forget an astonishing amount end up n the morgue or the hospital

[FolkGuitar]

I just spent a few days in Petchabun and the area we traveled mostly; (right in town near the jail) had 2 sets of traffic lights out of action evidently awaiting replacement; the traffic through there was sweet-as, moving well with none of the problems and buildup when the lights are working.

Thank you for bringing this thread back in the positive direction in which it was started.

So opinions that state the opposite aren't welcome?

That doesn't sound like 'normal' human interaction to me.

Would it be better if everyone agreed with you?

By all means, please feel free to turn positive energy into negative if that's the space you prefer to inhabit, although I find it curious. Your choice.

When I find a thread (not a post, but a thread) I disagree with, I usually don't involve myself with it. I prefer that rather than to derail the thread for my own agenda. Personally, I prefer to look at the more positive aspects of life in Thailand, but that's just the choice "I" make.

I started a thread about positive behavior. Is there a reason why you didn't start a thread about negative behavior if that's what you prefer to discuss? You're certainly free to do so. It's obvious from the posts in this thread that many people prefer to dwell on the negative aspects of the local drivers. Obviously it deserves its own thread. Or it's own sub-forum.

[Happy Grumpy]

Remember the politician's son shot while driving through Khao Yai last year, he flashed another driver to get out of his way, he obviously didn't move over in a satisfactory way so he took out his gun and started shooting the other driver, the other driver took out his gun and shot back.

The other driver had a better shot.

The next week it was a pilot driving to Swampy that was shot for being flashed and not moving over quickly enough.

[uptheos]

I just spent a few days in Petchabun and the area we traveled mostly; (right in town near the jail) had 2 sets of traffic lights out of action evidently awaiting replacement; the traffic through there was sweet-as, moving well with none of the problems and buildup when the lights are working.

Thank you for bringing this thread back in the positive direction in which it was started.

So opinions that state the opposite aren't welcome?

That doesn't sound like 'normal' human interaction to me.

Would it be better if everyone agreed with you?

By all means, please feel free to turn positive energy into negative if that's the space you prefer to inhabit, although I find it curious. Your choice.

When I find a thread (not a post, but a thread) I disagree with, I usually don't involve myself with it. I prefer that rather than to derail the thread for my own agenda. Personally, I prefer to look at the more positive aspects of life in Thailand, but that's just the choice "I" make.

I started a thread about positive behavior. Is there a reason why you didn't start a thread about negative behavior if that's what you prefer to discuss? You're certainly free to do so. It's obvious from the posts in this thread that many people prefer to dwell on the negative aspects of the local drivers. Obviously it deserves its own thread. Or it's own sub-forum.

A smart reply that doesn't wash very well.

You know exactly what I meant.

I'm not taking the bait.

[Bulldozer Dawn]

Perhaps there are grounds for the current leader to have Yingluck charged with Negligent Manslaughter.

The prosecution's case could be based on the following:

1. Thousands of Thais were induced into ownership of a new car by a financial incentive (viz: 100K THB)

2. Despite the spike in the amount of Thais driving cars nothing was implemented to improve driver training or licensing requirements

3. Despite the spike in the speed, size and performance of vehicles on Thai roads nothing was implemented to address road safety

The cash incentive induced a lot of Thai families, including two of my then neighbours to park the motorbike up and purchase a car for the first time.

Unfortunately, we now observe that many of these new drivers, drive the car EXACTLY the same as they would ride a motorbike. This is why you have four rows of traffic in a two lane street.

A few years back I spent the day with a Thai friend at the Land and Transport office at Phang Nga. She wanted to get her motorbike licence. There is a small cement circle at the back of the main office, perhaps about the size of an olympic swimming pool.

The practical test for the bike riders was to start their bike and ride around the circle once.

Same applied for the cars, of which there were about six, four of which where new toyota sedans, no doubt bought under the 100K scheme.

Two of the cars drove around the circle with out mishap. One lady started her car and in the first 5 metres drove up the half meter curb shattering the left hand side mag wheel. The car had to be reversed off the track. Another lady left the track about half way around and drove straight over a number of 2 meter high steel posts welded in old tyre rims. The front of the car was destroyed. A third man (a lady boy) tried about a dozen times to drive off in the manual car of his boyfriend, but stalled out everytime because he obviously could not drive a car with a clutch.

And now for the funny bit. Every single driver left on the day with a shiny new plastic licence.

[Mr Somtam]

Perhaps there are grounds for the current leader to have Yingluck charged with Negligent Manslaughter.

The prosecution's case could be based on the following:

1. Thousands of Thais were induced into ownership of a new car by a financial incentive (viz: 100K THB)

2. Despite the spike in the amount of Thais driving cars nothing was implemented to improve driver training or licensing requirements

3. Despite the spike in the speed, size and performance of vehicles on Thai roads nothing was implemented to address road safety

The cash incentive induced a lot of Thai families, including two of my then neighbours to park the motorbike up and purchase a car for the first time.

Unfortunately, we now observe that many of these new drivers, drive the car EXACTLY the same as they would ride a motorbike. This is why you have four rows of traffic in a two lane street.

A few years back I spent the day with a Thai friend at the Land and Transport office at Phang Nga. She wanted to get her motorbike licence. There is a small cement circle at the back of the main office, perhaps about the size of an olympic swimming pool.

The practical test for the bike riders was to start their bike and ride around the circle once.

Same applied for the cars, of which there were about six, four of which where new toyota sedans, no doubt bought under the 100K scheme.

Two of the cars drove around the circle with out mishap. One lady started her car and in the first 5 metres drove up the half meter curb shattering the left hand side mag wheel. The car had to be reversed off the track. Another lady left the track about half way around and drove straight over a number of 2 meter high steel posts welded in old tyre rims. The front of the car was destroyed. A third man (a lady boy) tried about a dozen times to drive off in the manual car of his boyfriend, but stalled out everytime because he obviously could not drive a car with a clutch.

And now for the funny bit. Every single driver left on the day with a shiny new plastic licence.

Very funny, but also very scary...

[FolkGuitar]

Thank you for bringing this thread back in the positive direction in which it was started.

So opinions that state the opposite aren't welcome?

That doesn't sound like 'normal' human interaction to me.

Would it be better if everyone agreed with you?

By all means, please feel free to turn positive energy into negative if that's the space you prefer to inhabit, although I find it curious. Your choice.

When I find a thread (not a post, but a thread) I disagree with, I usually don't involve myself with it. I prefer that rather than to derail the thread for my own agenda. Personally, I prefer to look at the more positive aspects of life in Thailand, but that's just the choice "I" make.

I started a thread about positive behavior. Is there a reason why you didn't start a thread about negative behavior if that's what you prefer to discuss? You're certainly free to do so. It's obvious from the posts in this thread that many people prefer to dwell on the negative aspects of the local drivers. Obviously it deserves its own thread. Or it's own sub-forum.

A smart reply that doesn't wash very well.

You know exactly what I meant.

I'm not taking the bait.

Don't let your paranoia get the better of you. There was no 'bait.'

You asked me two question and I answered both of them. I asked you a question and you didn't answer. Instead, you danced. It was a legitimate question, which I'll repeat;

Is there a reason why you didn't start a thread about negative behavior if that's what you prefer to discuss?

Several people contributed their views on the positive behavior of Thai drivers, so it's clear there are some people interested in discussing that position. We aren't saying there are no bad drivers or unsafe conditions. We know that exists. But we're talking about the good side of what is going on out there. For some reason, that seems to upset you.

[Happy Grumpy]

Perhaps there are grounds for the current leader to have Yingluck charged with Negligent Manslaughter.

The prosecution's case could be based on the following:

1. Thousands of Thais were induced into ownership of a new car by a financial incentive (viz: 100K THB)

2. Despite the spike in the amount of Thais driving cars nothing was implemented to improve driver training or licensing requirements

3. Despite the spike in the speed, size and performance of vehicles on Thai roads nothing was implemented to address road safety

The cash incentive induced a lot of Thai families, including two of my then neighbours to park the motorbike up and purchase a car for the first time.

Unfortunately, we now observe that many of these new drivers, drive the car EXACTLY the same as they would ride a motorbike. This is why you have four rows of traffic in a two lane street.

A few years back I spent the day with a Thai friend at the Land and Transport office at Phang Nga. She wanted to get her motorbike licence. There is a small cement circle at the back of the main office, perhaps about the size of an olympic swimming pool.

The practical test for the bike riders was to start their bike and ride around the circle once.

Same applied for the cars, of which there were about six, four of which where new toyota sedans, no doubt bought under the 100K scheme.

Two of the cars drove around the circle with out mishap. One lady started her car and in the first 5 metres drove up the half meter curb shattering the left hand side mag wheel. The car had to be reversed off the track. Another lady left the track about half way around and drove straight over a number of 2 meter high steel posts welded in old tyre rims. The front of the car was destroyed. A third man (a lady boy) tried about a dozen times to drive off in the manual car of his boyfriend, but stalled out everytime because he obviously could not drive a car with a clutch.

And now for the funny bit. Every single driver left on the day with a shiny new plastic licence.

Very funny, but also very scary...

Adapt.

Don't try to educate.

Be a good wannabe-Thai.

[GlutinousMaximus]

The only possible explanation for what we see and have to negotiate on thai roads is that at the moment many/most thai drivers turn on their engine the key they are holding simultaneously turns off their brain.

I also believe that some cultural traits in the Thai make-up do not lend themselves to being able to manage a vehicle in any kind of proper way. The interesting thing is that plenty of thai drivers are okay and can negotiate their vehicles without endangering other road-users and without causing conditions for possible road-rage.

I personally believe in the power of education, and we all know that passing the driving test here is hardly complicated, and that's assuming that individual citizens have decided to even bother with taking this test.

I have often wondered if, just for one month, what would happen if a whole bunch of thai drivers were plonked onto the streets of england, and a whole heap of english drivers were plonked onto the streets of thailand. I believe in both countries there would be a significant decrease in the populations - in england people would be killed by dangerous drivers and in thailand people would be killed from the massive rise in road rage.

I think it is very insulting to state that thai drivers turn off their brain when they start there car. Maybe just a superior farang joke?

They have a different 'system' of driving that incomers need to adjust to. By and large it works. (Yes I know all about all the road safety stats here).

Sometimes their driving style drives me crazy but I accept that it works.

For the many hours I drive both in and out of the city and long distances, I see very very few accidents. Because people use their brain to avoid accidents.

Many countries evolve different driving styles/systems.In the UK its never ok to run a red or overtake on the inside. In the US in many places its ok to turn on a red if the way is clear. Like here. And overtaking on the inside in the US seems normal.

When in Rome, ..... adapt.

What a joke - these roads are lethal. I consider driving on Thai roads at about the same risk level as an extreme sport such as paragliding or potholing or somesuch. Reasonably safe if you know what you're doing and have some experience, but plenty of scope for things to go wrong at the drop of a hat.

Accidents happen in farangland too, but driving there is way more predictable IMO.

When I drive now, I'm on a constant state of high alert. Anyone or anything in front of me (I have to assume) could randomly pull into my path at any time whatsoever without warning.

I concur with willfreeman, pootling around town is OK on the whole (from a safety viewpoint). The real danger is on the open road.

[Happy Grumpy]

So opinions that state the opposite aren't welcome?

That doesn't sound like 'normal' human interaction to me.

Would it be better if everyone agreed with you?

By all means, please feel free to turn positive energy into negative if that's the space you prefer to inhabit, although I find it curious. Your choice.

When I find a thread (not a post, but a thread) I disagree with, I usually don't involve myself with it. I prefer that rather than to derail the thread for my own agenda. Personally, I prefer to look at the more positive aspects of life in Thailand, but that's just the choice "I" make.

I started a thread about positive behavior. Is there a reason why you didn't start a thread about negative behavior if that's what you prefer to discuss? You're certainly free to do so. It's obvious from the posts in this thread that many people prefer to dwell on the negative aspects of the local drivers. Obviously it deserves its own thread. Or it's own sub-forum.

A smart reply that doesn't wash very well.

You know exactly what I meant.

I'm not taking the bait.

Don't let your paranoia get the better of you. There was no 'bait.'

You asked me two question and I answered both of them. I asked you a question and you didn't answer. Instead, you danced. It was a legitimate question, which I'll repeat;

Is there a reason why you didn't start a thread about negative behavior if that's what you prefer to discuss?

Several people contributed their views on the positive behavior of Thai drivers, so it's clear there are some people interested in discussing that position. We aren't saying there are no bad drivers or unsafe conditions. We know that exists. But we're talking about the good side of what is going on out there. For some reason, that seems to upset you.

Perhaps people are discussing what you see as 'positives', but in a way that you see as negatives.

For example, a less intelligent and less experienced person might see 100% wholesome politeness and patience, more intelligent and more experienced posters might see submission and repression of emotions due to fear of violence (being shot).

Just take a look at the news, almost everyday there is a driver killed (or perhaps just threatened with a gun) for flashing his lights, beeping the horn, cutting in front of somebody.

There are reasons that Thais try not to use their horns or flash their lights, fear of fatal violence from other Thais.

Na Khrap.

[FolkGuitar]

Don't let your paranoia get the better of you. There was no 'bait.'

You asked me two question and I answered both of them. I asked you a question and you didn't answer. Instead, you danced. It was a legitimate question, which I'll repeat;

Is there a reason why you didn't start a thread about negative behavior if that's what you prefer to discuss?

Several people contributed their views on the positive behavior of Thai drivers, so it's clear there are some people interested in discussing that position. We aren't saying there are no bad drivers or unsafe conditions. We know that exists. But we're talking about the good side of what is going on out there. For some reason, that seems to upset you.

Perhaps people are discussing what you see as 'positives', but in a way that you see as negatives.

For example, a less intelligent and less experienced person might see 100% wholesome politeness and patience, more intelligent and more experienced posters might see submission and repression of emotions due to fear of violence (being shot).

Just take a look at the news, almost everyday there is a driver killed (or perhaps just threatened with a gun) for flashing his lights, beeping the horn, cutting in front of somebody.

There are reasons that Thais try not to use their horns or flash their lights, fear of fatal violence from other Thais.

Na Khrap.

It's certainly possible that you are correct. I highly doubt it, but it is possible.

Not everyone lives in fear of violence. Not everyone lives in fear, period. In fact, most people don't.

But again I'll agree with you that 'some' people do, especially in the farang community.

I AM certain the 'mai pen rai' attitude didn't spring up in Thai culture out of fear of retribution...

One of the reasons I moved to Thailand was that it was so relatively peaceful and comfortable. I refuse to give up that tranquility to live a life ruled by forethought of grief. This does NOT mean that I turn a blind eye to what's going on. It means I spend my time paying attention to the other stuff. It's a choice we make. This is why I notice the passivity of the local drivers, admire it, and started a thread to discuss it. 14 other people 'liked' the idea of this thread, several posted but got drowned out by those preferring to discuss how horrible life on the Thai roads can be. Oh well... Mai pen rai.

Mods, this thread has gotten well off the point I was trying to make. I request that it be closed.

[worgeordie]

I believe they don't sound the horn,along with many who

don't bother using turn signals,because it uses the battery up.

regards worgeordie

[redandyellow]

Tolerant drivers are one thing - inherent safety is another

If you factor in that the Thailand refuses to abide by WHO standards - then Thailand has the most dangerous roadways on the planet, not number 2 as they always say.

I can prove it from many different articles.

But tolerant is nice, especially when I drive from Phuket to Pai, like 1,800 kilometers..

There is no road rage - but plenty of every other transgression under the sun - constantly

Shiite, where are my rose colored glasses?

[Andre0720]

This so-called tolerance is part of the PROBLEM...

This absence of social pressure makes these people do the craziest and dangerous maneuvers,.

They will keep on doing it as long as there are no back bone social pressure indicating that what they do is dangerous to others, and is devoid of curtesy.

No compliments there from me...

[femi fan]

Amazing how such patient drivers in the city turn into aggressive, speeding, unsafe drivers on the ring roads and highways. I experienced this yesterday with a very quiet, gentle female. On the highway she was changing up and down gears, getting to 120 in an older 4WD and passing whenever possible. Glad to get home intact

Yes, and this is an outcome of exactly what i mean when i say many thai drivers turn their brains off when they turn the key in the ignition to start the vehicle. It's a swap, one engine fires up, the other engine - their brain - closes down.

To put it another way, most people drive with their subconscious brain, after all, driving is a habit. Therefore drivers drive according to the habits they learn when young, which is your culture and society's influence on you. The typical thai mentality is to want life to be as totally easy as possible. So, driving along a ring road or open road and a car is suddenly in your way, all your subconscious brain wants to do is get past it because it's blocking your progress.

In addition, and more especially with thai men, but women are not exempt, driving fast is of course the mark of a man, of great skill, and therefore fast driving is what they do. It 'proves' they are good drivers!! See the ads for cars in this country.

And, just for the OP, in terms of positive behaviour when driving, all societies have good and bad, so subconscious habits like being 'mai pen rai' also come into play, and that's most likely seen in chiang mai when driving in the middle of town and on the moats where you can't really go fast anyway.

Driving is more or less learned habits, and these habits reflect deeper culture. Thais do not like to be bothered by rules and laws which hinder their sabai sabai requirements for life. This is why i said that to a great degree thais and motor vehicles are a dangerous cocktail.

[femi fan]

Mods, this thread has gotten well off the point I was trying to make. I request that it be closed.

Oh really! You start a conversation and when it doesn't go the way you want it to, you want to shut everyone up. What kind of democratic and orderly debating style is this?!!

Aside from that, and as per the concepts and way of understanding life of yin and yang, in the positive there is negative, and in the negative is positive. We need to explore both for fuller understanding. You might embrace that idea in order to let people speak in their own way without trying to shut them up if they say the wrong thing. You never know, you might learn something.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

It's effective though. Original posters have completely control over this on this forum.

I will say though that in this case I find the closing request understandable.

I find it less understandable when someone posts something crazy, then everyone tells him it's crazy, and then he goes 'boohoo close my topic'.

in this case though it's a very reasonable request, because it (perhaps predictably in hindsight) brought out the Thailand haters. (Remains puzzling why they're even here, on this site or physically in Thailand but that's another topic that will likely remain a mystery.)

[FolkGuitar]

Mods, this thread has gotten well off the point I was trying to make. I request that it be closed.

Oh really! You start a conversation and when it doesn't go the way you want it to, you want to shut everyone up. What kind of democratic and orderly debating style is this?!!

Aside from that, and as per the concepts and way of understanding life of yin and yang, in the positive there is negative, and in the negative is positive. We need to explore both for fuller understanding. You might embrace that idea in order to let people speak in their own way without trying to shut them up if they say the wrong thing. You never know, you might learn something.

I started a thread to compliment the local drivers. You want the thread to be about the negative aspects of local drivers. Different subject.

I have no interest in trying to 'shut everyone up,' There is a button at the top of your page you can use to create your own thread about anything you wish to discuss. No one will stop you, and I promise I won't try to change the subject of your thread.

If you prefer to discuss the yin and yang of something, or discuss the negative aspects of local drivers, why not start a thread about that?

Just as other people do who have no interest in a subject, I promise I won't try to change the thread by discussing something other than its purpose, as you are doing here? Just what is your need instead to run roughshod over someone else's intent? Are you some sort of bully that has to force his ideas on others? If you want to discuss your ideas about bad driving, please do so. Just do it in your own thread about that. No one will stop you.

This thread is about the positive aspects of local drivers as the title says.

Mods... as the subject of this thread obviously can't go in its stated direction, I again request that you close this thread.

Edited May 5, 2015 by FolkGuitar

[Gutterboy]

I think it's unnatural not to get upset or impatient when somebody has triple parked when they could have parked at the curb and holds up the flow of traffic while they've run in for an iced coffee. They must put Prozac in the drinking water here.

Prozac and Valium. I am sure of this.

[mike324]

It always surprises me how slow folks are to pull away when the light turns green. Even the fast guys who squeeze into a non existent space inside/in front, like they were going to a fire.

And it cant just be that they are afraid someone will run a red coming across because many junctions are very clear but still painfully slow to pull away leaving the queue behind stranded when their green changes colour.

But the lack of hooting may have more to do with fear than tolerance surely...

I see the opposite. Many locals like to pull away whilst the light is still on red. They look at the other lights when they turn red there is a few seconds delay before the traffic lights they are stopped at turn green. Many times everybody sets off on red and gains 2 seconds! If you hold your ground and wait for green its almost like you are stupid one to the other road users. I see this a lot in the city.

I often see motorcycles pull away while light is red, not so much with cars. Cars are usually 1 or 2 seconds slower based on my experience.

[mike324]

"The wife actually remarked to me earlier this week that the "faranger" is creeping into Thai motorists; starting with more use of the horn and selfish attitude with letting people in."

You might point out to the wife that the "faranger", unlike Thai's always let people in when those people are in an ambulance.

In parts of "farangerland" when someone flashes their lights it means "I see you, go ahead". There is no signal for that here. Flashing lights mean "I am bigger or more important than you so screw the law, I'm coming through!" Selfish much? Don't get me started!

On the topic of flashing lights, in USA people rarely flash their lights, if they do sometimes its to warn you of police ahead.

As for the other country where I drove frequently such as Germany, cars flash lights at you to tell you to get out of the way on the autobahn same as Thailand. Its is very common, more so than in Thailand I would say. In Thailand, the number of people flashing lights at cars have decrease significantly over the past 5 years, most cars will wait patiently until they have a space to squeeze in and pass you.

The most common flashing I see are to warn other drivers of your presence either when coming out of intersections or if someone is driving too close or veering into your lane.

[GlutinousMaximus]

I started a thread to compliment the local drivers. You want the thread to be about the negative aspects of local drivers. Different subject.

I have no interest in trying to 'shut everyone up,' There is a button at the top of your page you can use to create your own thread about anything you wish to discuss. No one will stop you, and I promise I won't try to change the subject of your thread.

If you prefer to discuss the yin and yang of something, or discuss the negative aspects of local drivers, why not start a thread about that?

Just as other people do who have no interest in a subject, I promise I won't try to change the thread by discussing something other than its purpose, as you are doing here? Just what is your need instead to run roughshod over someone else's intent? Are you some sort of bully that has to force his ideas on others? If you want to discuss your ideas about bad driving, please do so. Just do it in your own thread about that. No one will stop you.

This thread is about the positive aspects of local drivers as the title says.

Mods... as the subject of this thread obviously can't go in its stated direction, I again request that you close this thread.

OP - your intention to start a positive thread about driving in Thailand is indeed commendable. Unfortunately, it just seems an unlikely combination...like recommending Kabul as a relaxing tourist destination.

I've been scratching my head trying to think of instances of genuine courtesy I've experienced on the roads here (after quite a few years). So far I'm drawing a blank (plenty however in the debit column).

My own belief is that the locals have a different concept of personal space - e.g. they don't object to being pushed in on at the 7-11 checkout (or even when transacting at the bank counter) which I as a Brit with a 3 metre exclusion zone around me find infuriating. This carries over to the roads and leads to the gentle melee you've witnessed in local Chiang Mai traffic - it's no big deal for them to jostle around at slow speeds.

Spend a lot of time on the open roads however at higher speeds and it's much more dog eat dog.

[CNXBKKMAN]

"The wife actually remarked to me earlier this week that the "faranger" is creeping into Thai motorists; starting with more use of the horn and selfish attitude with letting people in."

You might point out to the wife that the "faranger", unlike Thai's always let people in when those people are in an ambulance.

In parts of "farangerland" when someone flashes their lights it means "I see you, go ahead". There is no signal for that here. Flashing lights mean "I am bigger or more important than you so screw the law, I'm coming through!" Selfish much? Don't get me started!

I don't want you to think I'm trying to be clever, but your thing about 'flashing' is a major irritant here.

First, and this is what I mean, the Thai's actually have it right. I believe the UK Highway Code states that flashing you light merely means 'I am here'. (stand corrected if I'm wrong).

However, we have developed a culture in the UK as described in your post - and it works, by showing courtesy.

But here in Pattaya, if you hang back in slow moving traffic creating a gap, with a vehicle trying to cross in front of you, and you flash your lights, more often than not the other vehicle won't move.! Suddenly you have to stop as you are then not sure what he/she is going to do. Many times I've rolled down the window and and waved the car across.

The reason and my big irritant?............Those blacked out windows that do not allow for any visual contact between drivers. I wonder how many misunderstandings are caused by that?. They ought to be banned, at least on the windscreen, as they are in the UK.

Of course, it could simply be that the majority of Thai drivers do not encounter courtesy driving and are totally bemused. Dunno!

Blacked out windows were banned years ago. A big thing was made of it at the time. You can see the results of this ban today.....not much.

[hutchings1963]

It always surprises me how slow folks are to pull away when the light turns green. Even the fast guys who squeeze into a non existent space inside/in front, like they were going to a fire.

And it cant just be that they are afraid someone will run a red coming across because many junctions are very clear but still painfully slow to pull away leaving the queue behind stranded when their green changes colour.

But the lack of hooting may have more to do with fear than tolerance surely...

IT IS BECAUSE SO MANY RUN THE RED LIGHT HERE THAT IS WHY THEY ARE SLOW AWAY.

[CNXBKKMAN]

The only possible explanation for what we see and have to negotiate on thai roads is that at the moment many/most thai drivers turn on their engine the key they are holding simultaneously turns off their brain.

I also believe that some cultural traits in the Thai make-up do not lend themselves to being able to manage a vehicle in any kind of proper way. The interesting thing is that plenty of thai drivers are okay and can negotiate their vehicles without endangering other road-users and without causing conditions for possible road-rage.

I personally believe in the power of education, and we all know that passing the driving test here is hardly complicated, and that's assuming that individual citizens have decided to even bother with taking this test.

I have often wondered if, just for one month, what would happen if a whole bunch of thai drivers were plonked onto the streets of england, and a whole heap of english drivers were plonked onto the streets of thailand. I believe in both countries there would be a significant decrease in the populations - in england people would be killed by dangerous drivers and in thailand people would be killed from the massive rise in road rage.

I think it is very insulting to state that thai drivers turn off their brain when they start there car. Maybe just a superior farang joke?

They have a different 'system' of driving that incomers need to adjust to. By and large it works. (Yes I know all about all the road safety stats here).

Sometimes their driving style drives me crazy but I accept that it works.

For the many hours I drive both in and out of the city and long distances, I see very very few accidents. Because people use their brain to avoid accidents.

Many countries evolve different driving styles/systems.In the UK its never ok to run a red or overtake on the inside. In the US in many places its ok to turn on a red if the way is clear. Like here. And overtaking on the inside in the US seems normal.

When in Rome, ..... adapt.

To keep on the positive side most locals dont do road rage. Somebody may come within millimetres of smashing your car, you leg, crippling you, leaving you with colossal hospital bills but rarely will anyone scream and shout or be outraged by it. Is this positive or negative?

To say that the way Thailand drives works and there are few accidents because they use their brains is imo deluded. I see accidents all the time they are normal here. In the uk i rarely see any accidents for months and months. If the way Thailand drives works why are the second or third in the world for road safety with only Libya and the Dominican Republic ranked worse. Those nations are not of the same statue as Thailand so you could say Thailand is the most dangerous in the world.

The facts, statistics and what you see with your own eyes confirms the way Thailand drives doesnt work at all! If safety and courtesy to other road users and pedestrians is valued they fail massively. If being able to start a vehicle, make it go forward and get from A to B is the criteria the Thai way does work but this is a very low standard which results in Thai roads being the most dangerous in the world. The Thai way of driving causes unnecessary grief, pain, hardship and misery. Nobody can argue it doesnt.