Mass shooting at Charleston church in South Carolina leaves 9 dead

[sirineou]

Gun enthusiasts can believe or support whatever they want, but the 2nd Amendment has nothing to do with enthusiasm. Gun control will only advantage government. Gun purchases are already widely vetted, it is criminals who bypass this, such as the US Gov and Fast and Furious. There are numerous people advocating gun control that are themselves on the lunatic fringe, such as George Soros, who's bloody fingerprints are on more deaths across the world than most humans. The greatest evil is not these terrible acts of citizens upon citizens, though horrific. The true evil is the incapacity of humans to finally preserve the last means available to defend their lives from others and government. To be so dumbed down as to think government is or always will be beneficent is gross ignorance.

Guns do not have lobbies, people have lobbies. It is an utter shame and symptom of the degradation of intellect where the Bill of Rights must be defended.

Yea right , Saddam with all his military might could not defend against the US government ,but you will with your hunting rifle if you want to defend against the government,exercise your civil duty, get engaged in the political process and elect good people to office.

and you want your guns to defend your family, really you are so very concerned about your family's safety after your gun show, you go to your OSHA training, and then you go to all the home safety shows, conduct fire drills, have fire extinguishers charged and readily available etc etc etc.

"Guns don't have lobbies, people do" so there are no different advocate lobbies only people lobbies

When will we ever get over our macho attitude, get over our big bad selfs, call things for what they are , and move forward.

How many people must die so you people can have your toys?

Gun enthusiasts, should join us, in fully funding the federal background check, creating a viable data base, include mental decease in the federal check. non of these state by state,

divide an conquer lunacy.

so you can enjoy your toys, and we can enjoy our lives.

Stricter control, might not defend against all lunatics, but it might defend against some.

a small price to pay if it saved even one life.[firearm

Background checks are already in place. There is a long list of those that cannot legally own a firearm. Anytime the federal gets involved it becomes a fiasco. If liberals would quit hamstringing law enforcement with more laws, police possibly could have more time to stop illegal firearm ownership.

which State are you referring? You know that there are 50 states all with different laws , different levels of enforcement and different databases.

For instance Dylan Roof was charged with Felony possession and as such he should not had being able to purchase a gun, but the background check was defeated via the private sale exclusion in South Carolina, (one of the 40 states with such a loophole)

Then you have Gun shows, straw purchases. private sales etc etc,

to say that a background check already exists is either ignorant or disingenuous

Why not a universal federal background check? is it because the federal involvement will become a fiasco,as the current laws are not already.

or is it paranoia that the "federales" will know who and where has a gun, and hinder your ability to carry "gorilla warfare" as some have suggested in the case of an oppressive government

Really ? Really? I think it is time we grow up, and join the civilized world.

[cookee68]

Hate???

Another word worthy of consideration... racism.

Theres always one who wants to throw the racism card, why, because it was a black church, were all its members black, cant whites go in there, lots of things can be said about it but racism, only in your head

[sirineou]

If it is asserted that a regional military power cannot defeat the US therefore the people who are Americans cannot, and therefore they should surrender their guns, this ably demonstrates the nature of the confusion. No one ever posited that the possession of weapons could defeat anything, only that it is every human's right to defend themselves and even a cursory review of history suggests it is governments that people should fear most.

Like most Americans I have no problem with background checks, or even tighter restrictions on who can and cannot own guns.There are numerous problems with always taking the same approach, increasingly tightening the noose around law abiding citizens, while doing nothing to combat inner city violence and crime. If anyone thinks a person who wants to kill someone will avoid doing so because they do not have access to a gun they would be demonstrating a lack of information about mental health and the nature of a sociopath. There are so many competent laws on the books already that are rarely enforced or done so selectively.

The assertion that someone who abides in their Bill of Rights is such a political caricature designed only to parody, it offers no real intellect, just vacancy. But since you personalized it, yes, I follow strict safety precautions at all time. One would not require a fire extinguisher in the home as a home is not a gun range.

OSHA has nothing to do with homes, guns, safety in personal life, etc. At this point the gig is up, this is diatribe.

I think there are things that can be done as far as gun control, law enforcement and social programs that will improve the situation.

But each on their own will be ineffective.

And it's pointless having strict gun laws in one state when people can cross the state line and buy a car boot full of firearms.

It's the reason the NRA can keep claiming tight gun laws don't work.

I think you are correct, initially. However, gun laws dont work because only law abiding citizens are affected. I dont know exactly what the answer is. I have said elsewhere that a belief in something or a value should not be a suicide pact. Is the gun issue getting to the point where it is a suicide pact to assert the 2nd Amendment is sacrosanct? I dont know. My instinct is no. My instinct is that there is much more to fear than my neighbor with a gun. I have a greater fear of my neighbors without a gun.

Americans fear government more than gun control, a pet of government.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/151490/fear-big-government-near-record-level.aspx

http://www.ijreview.com/2013/04/167721-new-polls-americans-fear-u-s-government-terrorism/

http://www.wnd.com/2013/04/americans-fear-government-more-than-terror/

https://blogs.chapman.edu/wilkinson/2014/10/21/what-americans-fear-the-most/

If that was the case then no laws would be effective, because only law abiding citizens will abide by them .

so why dont we just abolish all laws, why have rape laws? rapists will not abide by them

[Credo]

The assumption about laws is a fallacy. Not all people ignore laws. Many people follow laws. Criminals don't, but that's how we ultimately catch them and get them out of society.

[JDGRUEN]

Gun enthusiasts can believe or support whatever they want, but the 2nd Amendment has nothing to do with enthusiasm. Gun control will only advantage government. Gun purchases are already widely vetted, it is criminals who bypass this, such as the US Gov and Fast and Furious. There are numerous people advocating gun control that are themselves on the lunatic fringe, such as George Soros, who's bloody fingerprints are on more deaths across the world than most humans. The greatest evil is not these terrible acts of citizens upon citizens, though horrific. The true evil is the incapacity of humans to finally preserve the last means available to defend their lives from others and government. To be so dumbed down as to think government is or always will be beneficent is gross ignorance.

Guns do not have lobbies, people have lobbies. It is an utter shame and symptom of the degradation of intellect where the Bill of Rights must be defended.

Yea right , Saddam with all his military might could not defend against the US government ,but you will with your hunting rifle if you want to defend against the government,exercise your civil duty, get engaged in the political process and elect good people to office.

and you want your guns to defend your family, really you are so very concerned about your family's safety after your gun show, you go to your OSHA training, and then you go to all the home safety shows, conduct fire drills, have fire extinguishers charged and readily available etc etc etc.

"Guns don't have lobbies, people do" so there are no different advocate lobbies only people lobbies

When will we ever get over our macho attitude, get over our big bad selfs, call things for what they are , and move forward.

How many people must die so you people can have your toys?

Gun enthusiasts, should join us, in fully funding the federal background check, creating a viable data base, include mental decease in the federal check. non of these state by state,

divide an conquer lunacy.

so you can enjoy your toys, and we can enjoy our lives.

Stricter control, might not defend against all lunatics, but it might defend against some.

a small price to pay if it saved even one life.[firearm

Background checks are already in place. There is a long list of those that cannot legally own a firearm. Anytime the federal gets involved it becomes a fiasco. If liberals would quit hamstringing law enforcement with more laws, police possibly could have more time to stop illegal firearm ownership.

which State are you referring? You know that there are 50 states all with different laws , different levels of enforcement and different databases.

For instance Dylan Roof was charged with Felony possession and as such he should not had being able to purchase a gun, but the background check was defeated via the private sale exclusion in South Carolina, (one of the 40 states with such a loophole)

Then you have Gun shows, straw purchases. private sales etc etc,

to say that a background check already exists is either ignorant or disingenuous

Why not a universal federal background check? is it because the federal involvement will become a fiasco,as the current laws are not already.

or is it paranoia that the "federales" will know who and where has a gun, and hinder your ability to carry "gorilla warfare" as some have suggested in the case of an oppressive government

Really ? Really? I think it is time we grow up, and join the civilized world.

I read that the idiot father of the idiot child gave him the gun for his 21st birthday. Has that account been changed by an verified update? I have no idea if the father purchased the gun legally or not but if he did - then any state or federal law about gun purchases apply to the father -- not to the son ...

[MaxYakov]

TO STOP MASS KILLERS, WE HAVE TO STOP DRUGGING OUR YOUNG BOYS

We may never know quite what drives some people to kill. But it seems that in young Dylann Storm Roof, we have further evidence of a trend that should worry us all. I’m talking about his dependence on prescription drugs: suboxone, to be precise.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/06/19/how-our-touchy-feely-feminised-society-creates-young-male-killers/

Oh dear God. The idiot brigade talking about think of which they have no clue. SSRIs are actually a very bad idea for most of the population. I have been through the litigation, seen the studies and understand completely how SSRIs can actually exacerbate the problem for which unknowledgeable GPs prescribe the drug.

But common, does this moron have any clue about suboxone? First of all, thy said the guy did not have a prescription. Bupe is a synthetic partial agonist that is actually very hard on on the body as is the blocker, naloxone when taking in higher amounts over extended period of time.

Neither Bupe nor naloxone alter the xy axis like SSRIs. Lupe is not can to drive someone mad and cause them to be a maniac like SSRIs have the potential to do. People like Bret Bart are idiots that like to drum up fear in certain aspects of the public who are also idiots. Playing the drug card is just another way to stir emotions in those without a clue.

Suboxone Side Effects In Detail - www.drugs.com

Psychiatric

Common (1% to 10%): Anxiety, depression, nervousness, abnormal thinking

Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Abnormal dreams, agitation, apathy, depersonalization, drug dependence, euphoric mood, hostility

Frequency not reported: Restlessness, irritability

Postmarketing reports: Hallucination, attempted suicide, insomnia

(Emphasis mine)

[JDGRUEN]

Drugs? Spare us.

Sounds like pure right wing SPIN to avoid the issue of white racism against blacks.

I'm not buying it.

The justice department is now considering terrorism charges. Good!

I can't believe you will deny outright facts. All these shooters have been under the influence of mind altering prescription drugs - all have mental health issues- it is documented ... GO READ SOME FACTS.

If you read what I wrote on this thread before ... I said as much - yes Racism is involved -- but the side effects of the mind altering drugs bolsters up this cowardly in his non functional brain to take action of killing people ... These shooters are delusional -- GO READ ABOUT THEM .. .they are all much the same ... young, known mental health issues - documented. All were on different mixes of extremely strong drugs with serious side effects ....

You can use facts and reason... you do not have to echo the While House ... Salon.com narrative ... Putting this shooter in perspective does not make him innocent of his dastardly crimes... He - at his young age has obviously developed a racist attitude... he said it - it is a recorded statement. But what makes people dive deep into delusions to act on his racism and kill nine people ... It is called DRUGS.

The medical literature is full of the account of serious side effects of producing violent actions - homicides and suicides...

This shooter pushed himself over the top of mere racism to believing in some crazy grandeur of trying to start a race war. This nutcase deluded himself into believing he could do it ...

On a very similar to less complicated basis - people who drink alcohol to excess lower their inhibitions - and become angry bellicose drunks, or melancholy crybabies, or happy life of the party until they fall down.

This shooter did this sort of thing to the ultimate ... the side effects of the drugs drove his already psychotic brain to even more malfunction ... A crazy man on prescription drugs that are on record for making some people even more crazy and violent...

These are FACTS - you cannot stuff this guy in to some Liberal - Leftist talking point - that racism and racism alone drove him to be a killer. It did not happen .....

The previous shooters have similar stories delusional unstable, isolated do nothings, never achieved anything in their short lives, non socially functional... why - their brain is not wired right -- they are insane in one form or another ... then steps in prescription drugs that work for many but for some produce horrible side effects... it is well documented ... But the truth does not sit well with the Leftist narrative ... WHO WANTS so badly for the truth to be different.

The shooter didn't had to take hard drugs to hallucinate racist motives.

South Carolina has 20 active hate groups. And yes they operate mostly with drugs in groups with social and economic difficulties of the society.

http://www.wspa.com/story/25443280/map-active-hate-groups-in-sc-nc

Drug use of the shooter can not hide or compensate his main motivation of hateful white supremacist racial aspirations.

I would in part agree with your statement -- but drugs - mind altering psychotropic drugs in a way similar to the effects of alcohol - Lowers inhibitions to do certain things... The Perp had hate in his mind -- but the drugs likely lowered his inhibitions and perhaps clouded his mind as to the consequences - of committing mass murder. There are many racists in America including former Attorney General Holder - who despise people of another race -- but do not go out and kill them.

No one knows the number of racist in America and by far they certainly are not all white - no matter how much the current President of the United States wants to twist that fact. The biggest organized hateful racist group in America is La Raza -- whose members constantly spew racist statements against White and Black Americans but to the best of my knowledge have not killed anyone ... The same for the dumb butt members of local Nazi like groups in America - only a few over a half century have resorted to killing. Drugs and alcohol are often associated with reaching the tipping point of where racism turns to killing. In the case of idiot Roof he has strong underlying mental health issues - coupled with psychotropic drugs that often have side effects that produce suicide and homicide ... Roof reached a tipping point where he found cowardly courage to kill innocent people for racist reasons.

The vast majority - pushing 99% of racists in America of any color do not resort to killing without other influences that give them a false sense of ability an 'bravery' to perform heinous acts (they become 10 ft tall and bullet proof for a while).

Too bad the sometimes side effect of psychotropic - suicide - did not take place with idiot Roof.

Edited June 22, 2015 by JDGRUEN

[nazree360]

Pure racist killing!

[Chicog]

I read that the idiot father of the idiot child gave him the gun for his 21st birthday. Has that account been changed by an verified update? I have no idea if the father purchased the gun legally or not but if he did - then any state or federal law about gun purchases apply to the father -- not to the son ...

The killer was facing a felony charge so....

It’s illegal to give guns to felons or people with felony indictments — but that’s only if you know about their criminal records. In South Carolina, you don’t have to ask, so private citizens can more or less freely exchange guns.

If prosecutors can show that the father knew about Roof’s indictment but gave him the gun anyway, Roof’s father could face up to 10 years in prison.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/govbeat/wp/2015/06/18/the-legal-loophole-that-allowed-dylann-roof-to-get-a-gun/

Edited June 22, 2015 by Chicog

[chuckd]

I read that the idiot father of the idiot child gave him the gun for his 21st birthday. Has that account been changed by an verified update? I have no idea if the father purchased the gun legally or not but if he did - then any state or federal law about gun purchases apply to the father -- not to the son ...

The killer was facing a felony charge so....

It’s illegal to give guns to felons or people with felony indictments — but that’s only if you know about their criminal records. In South Carolina, you don’t have to ask, so private citizens can more or less freely exchange guns.

If prosecutors can show that the father knew about Roof’s indictment but gave him the gun anyway, Roof’s father could face up to 10 years in prison.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/govbeat/wp/2015/06/18/the-legal-loophole-that-allowed-dylann-roof-to-get-a-gun/

The kid's grandfather and uncle have told authorities, and the media, they gave him cash for his birthday.

They assume he used that for the weapon purchase.

If that is the case, they would not be complicit that I can see.

[Jingthing]

So he bought the gun legally or not?

[chuckd]

So he bought the gun legally or not?

JT, I haven't seen anything further about the actual purchase of the gun. I expect it will come out someday but I have heard nothing on that yet.

[Jingthing]

So he bought the gun legally or not?

JT, I haven't seen anything further about the actual purchase of the gun. I expect it will come out someday but I have heard nothing on that yet.

But if he did buy it would he normally have been screened out based on his criminal record or not?

[Ulysses G.]

I am guessing, but if he had not been convicted of a felony yet, he might have been able to get around the indictment.

[CMNightRider]

TO STOP MASS KILLERS, WE HAVE TO STOP DRUGGING OUR YOUNG BOYS

We may never know quite what drives some people to kill. But it seems that in young Dylann Storm Roof, we have further evidence of a trend that should worry us all. I’m talking about his dependence on prescription drugs: suboxone, to be precise.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/06/19/how-our-touchy-feely-feminised-society-creates-young-male-killers/

Oh dear God. The idiot brigade talking about think of which they have no clue. SSRIs are actually a very bad idea for most of the population. I have been through the litigation, seen the studies and understand completely how SSRIs can actually exacerbate the problem for which unknowledgeable GPs prescribe the drug.

But common, does this moron have any clue about suboxone? First of all, thy said the guy did not have a prescription. Bupe is a synthetic partial agonist that is actually very hard on on the body as is the blocker, naloxone when taking in higher amounts over extended period of time.

Neither Bupe nor naloxone alter the xy axis like SSRIs. Lupe is not can to drive someone mad and cause them to be a maniac like SSRIs have the potential to do. People like Bret Bart are idiots that like to drum up fear in certain aspects of the public who are also idiots. Playing the drug card is just another way to stir emotions in those without a clue.

Suboxone Side Effects In Detail - www.drugs.com

Psychiatric

Common (1% to 10%): Anxiety, depression, nervousness, abnormal thinking

Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Abnormal dreams, agitation, apathy, depersonalization, drug dependence, euphoric mood, hostility

Frequency not reported: Restlessness, irritability

Postmarketing reports: Hallucination, attempted suicide, insomnia

(Emphasis mine)

It looks like symptoms some of our Thai Visa posters are experiencing.

[sdanielmcev]

So he bought the gun legally or not?

JT, I haven't seen anything further about the actual purchase of the gun. I expect it will come out someday but I have heard nothing on that yet.

But if he did buy it would he normally have been screened out based on his criminal record or not?

Possession of suboxone is a misdemeanor, thereby not disqualifying him from buying a firearm. Which he bought himself.

[sdanielmcev]

From here:

https://reason.com/blog/2015/06/22/obama-wonders-if-dylann-roof-who-passed

[stevenl]

From here:

https://reason.com/blog/2015/06/22/obama-wonders-if-dylann-roof-who-passed

"Roof bought the .45-caliber Glock Model 41 handgun he used in the church attack from a Charleston gun store in April, shortly after his 21st birthday (which was on April 3), with money his father had given him as a present. That means he passed a background check."

Bold printed from me, because the author reaches that conclusions too easy. Not everything is done the way it should be.

[cumgranosalum]

has this video appeared on the thread yet?

https://youtu.be/lL8JEEt2RxI

Edited June 23, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[cumgranosalum]

Drugs? Spare us.

Sounds like pure right wing SPIN to avoid the issue of white racism against blacks.

I'm not buying it.

The justice department is now considering terrorism charges. Good!

I can't believe you will deny outright facts. All these shooters have been under the influence of mind altering prescription drugs - all have mental health issues- it is documented ... GO READ SOME FACTS.

If you read what I wrote on this thread before ... I said as much - yes Racism is involved -- but the side effects of the mind altering drugs bolsters up this cowardly in his non functional brain to take action of killing people ... These shooters are delusional -- GO READ ABOUT THEM .. .they are all much the same ... young, known mental health issues - documented. All were on different mixes of extremely strong drugs with serious side effects ....

You can use facts and reason... you do not have to echo the While House ... Salon.com narrative ... Putting this shooter in perspective does not make him innocent of his dastardly crimes... He - at his young age has obviously developed a racist attitude... he said it - it is a recorded statement. But what makes people dive deep into delusions to act on his racism and kill nine people ... It is called DRUGS.

The medical literature is full of the account of serious side effects of producing violent actions - homicides and suicides...

This shooter pushed himself over the top of mere racism to believing in some crazy grandeur of trying to start a race war. This nutcase deluded himself into believing he could do it ...

On a very similar to less complicated basis - people who drink alcohol to excess lower their inhibitions - and become angry bellicose drunks, or melancholy crybabies, or happy life of the party until they fall down.

This shooter did this sort of thing to the ultimate ... the side effects of the drugs drove his already psychotic brain to even more malfunction ... A crazy man on prescription drugs that are on record for making some people even more crazy and violent...

These are FACTS - you cannot stuff this guy in to some Liberal - Leftist talking point - that racism and racism alone drove him to be a killer. It did not happen .....

The previous shooters have similar stories delusional unstable, isolated do nothings, never achieved anything in their short lives, non socially functional... why - their brain is not wired right -- they are insane in one form or another ... then steps in prescription drugs that work for many but for some produce horrible side effects... it is well documented ... But the truth does not sit well with the Leftist narrative ... WHO WANTS so badly for the truth to be different.

...and yet he was STILL able to get hold of firearms!

[chuckd]

has this video appeared on the thread yet?

https://youtu.be/lL8JEEt2RxI

This nonsense has been posted at least once on each and every thread that has gun control or Confederate flags as its topic.

There may be a Jon Stewart or Bill Maher stand up routine we haven't been told about, but I frankly doubt it.

[chuckd]

Drugs? Spare us.

Sounds like pure right wing SPIN to avoid the issue of white racism against blacks.

I'm not buying it.

The justice department is now considering terrorism charges. Good!

I can't believe you will deny outright facts. All these shooters have been under the influence of mind altering prescription drugs - all have mental health issues- it is documented ... GO READ SOME FACTS.

If you read what I wrote on this thread before ... I said as much - yes Racism is involved -- but the side effects of the mind altering drugs bolsters up this cowardly in his non functional brain to take action of killing people ... These shooters are delusional -- GO READ ABOUT THEM .. .they are all much the same ... young, known mental health issues - documented. All were on different mixes of extremely strong drugs with serious side effects ....

You can use facts and reason... you do not have to echo the While House ... Salon.com narrative ... Putting this shooter in perspective does not make him innocent of his dastardly crimes... He - at his young age has obviously developed a racist attitude... he said it - it is a recorded statement. But what makes people dive deep into delusions to act on his racism and kill nine people ... It is called DRUGS.

The medical literature is full of the account of serious side effects of producing violent actions - homicides and suicides...

This shooter pushed himself over the top of mere racism to believing in some crazy grandeur of trying to start a race war. This nutcase deluded himself into believing he could do it ...

On a very similar to less complicated basis - people who drink alcohol to excess lower their inhibitions - and become angry bellicose drunks, or melancholy crybabies, or happy life of the party until they fall down.

This shooter did this sort of thing to the ultimate ... the side effects of the drugs drove his already psychotic brain to even more malfunction ... A crazy man on prescription drugs that are on record for making some people even more crazy and violent...

These are FACTS - you cannot stuff this guy in to some Liberal - Leftist talking point - that racism and racism alone drove him to be a killer. It did not happen .....

The previous shooters have similar stories delusional unstable, isolated do nothings, never achieved anything in their short lives, non socially functional... why - their brain is not wired right -- they are insane in one form or another ... then steps in prescription drugs that work for many but for some produce horrible side effects... it is well documented ... But the truth does not sit well with the Leftist narrative ... WHO WANTS so badly for the truth to be different.

...and yet he was STILL able to get hold of firearms!

Yes, he was able to obtain a firearm, but he didn't fall through a gun control crack.

He fell through a medical privacy crack that widens with each incident such as this, Sandy Hook, Aurora and Columbine.

All the way back to Charles Whitman at UT Austin.

[Chicog]

From here:

https://reason.com/blog/2015/06/22/obama-wonders-if-dylann-roof-who-passed

"Roof bought the .45-caliber Glock Model 41 handgun he used in the church attack from a Charleston gun store in April, shortly after his 21st birthday (which was on April 3), with money his father had given him as a present. That means he passed a background check."

Bold printed from me, because the author reaches that conclusions too easy. Not everything is done the way it should be.

So which is true?

Dylann Roof, the man suspected of fatally shooting nine people at a historic African American church in South Carolina on Wednesday, was given a gun by his father as a 21st birthday present in April, his uncle told Reuters on Thursday.

Edited June 23, 2015 by Chicog

[bamnutsak]

One of nine victims:

Susie Jackson, 87, was also a victim of the attack, the coroner confirmed. Her nephew, Tywanza Sanders, died when he dived in between her and the shooter to save her. Jackson’s cousin, Ethel Lance, was also a victim of the attack.

I was surprised to learn that approximately two-thirds of the annual firearm related deaths in the U.S. are suicides (~ 21,000), while the remaining are homicides (~ 11,000) and accidental discharge (~ 1,500).

[Publicus]

Well, turns out this Roof guy has a lot of black friends. Kills the racism claim. And, one more time, that quote from the NAACP person was not a direct quote from an eyewitness, as she herself said.

Could ask for some thoughts on the battle flag thingy at this point of ongoing developments but then again why invite more of the same from the same same minds as they labor under their oxygen deficits.

[cumgranosalum]

One of nine victims:

Susie Jackson, 87, was also a victim of the attack, the coroner confirmed. Her nephew, Tywanza Sanders, died when he dived in between her and the shooter to save her. Jackson’s cousin, Ethel Lance, was also a victim of the attack.

I was surprised to learn that approximately two-thirds of the annual firearm related deaths in the U.S. are suicides (~ 21,000), while the remaining are homicides (~ 11,000) and accidental discharge (~ 1,500).

Yes - there's a lot of accidental discharge on this thread.....

[sdanielmcev]

Well, turns out this Roof guy has a lot of black friends. Kills the racism claim. And, one more time, that quote from the NAACP person was not a direct quote from an eyewitness, as she herself said.

Could ask for some thoughts on the battle flag thingy at this point of ongoing developments but then again why invite more of the same from the same same minds as they labor under their oxygen deficits.

Since that was unknown at the time, what is your point? Only little minds like yours jump to conclusions based on their innate loathing of anyone dissimilar to them.

[MaxYakov]

From here:

https://reason.com/blog/2015/06/22/obama-wonders-if-dylann-roof-who-passed

From your linked reason.com article:

"In short, "universal background checks" make no sense as a response to the Charleston shootings, contrary to what Obama and Martin O'Malley seem to think. Then again, universal background checks made no sense as a response to the Sandy Hook massacre, the perpetrator of which, Adam Lanza, used a rifle legally purchased by his mother and in any case did not have the sort of criminal or psychiatric record that would have legally barred him from buying a gun on his own. Such emotional appeals do not have much staying power, not because people forget about the horrors perpetrated by the likes of Roof and Lanza, but because the proposed solutions are non sequiturs that cannot withstand a moment's reflection."

Manchin (D-WV) , Toomey (R-PA) Both Interested in Reviving Gun Control Push - PowerPost - June 23, 2015

[Jay Sata]

Japan is the developed world's least firearm-filled nation and perhaps its strictest controller?

In 2008, the U.S. had over 12 thousand firearm-related homicides.

All of Japan experienced only 11!

And that was a big year: 2006 saw an astounding two, and when that number jumped to 22 in 2007, it became a national scandal.

[chuckd]

Japan is the developed world's least firearm-filled nation and perhaps its strictest controller?

In 2008, the U.S. had over 12 thousand firearm-related homicides.

All of Japan experienced only 11!

And that was a big year: 2006 saw an astounding two, and when that number jumped to 22 in 2007, it became a national scandal.

So are you moving to Japan so you won't have to worry about those big, bad guns?