Confederate flag sets off debate in 2016 Republican class

[jacky54]

Not all blacks see the flag as racist, not even all the old ones. Flags are not racist, people are.

[beechguy]

Even golfer and proud southerner Bubba Watson realizes that the Confederate flag is offensive:

http://www.golf.com/tour-and-news/bubba-watson-will-paint-over-confederate-flag-general-lee

If it was so racist, why did he buy it? If it was so racist, why is he just now planning to paint over it?

The fact is, the guy is pretty much considered to be an idiot. Just going with the flow I suppose.

[Publicus]

I just ordered a really big confederate flag to fly in front of my house. They are selling like hotcakes. I'm getting ready to invite Publicus over for a beer and I thought he'd like to see a real one.

Same to you and as long as you get the cheque for my first class airfare, to include also bail bond, lawyers fees, and for any rednecks who might come over the fence their medical, doctor and hospital expenses.

Been there, done that Confederate f-rag stuff from the time I was a twentysomething and we were shouting at Gov George Wallace standing there before us, when, in 1968, the little dipstick made a trip up North too close to our university (recently in the news also about the Marathon bomber).

Spent 15 years in Washington (total) to include the Army, and where there's hardly a Reb flag ceptin' in the home of some southern crackers who'd wandered off the reservation slightly north. Five years in GA and I saw stars n' bars everywhere to include on the state f-rag (gone now since 2003).

I just ordered a really big confederate flag to fly in front of my house. They are selling like hotcakes. I'm getting ready to invite Publicus over for a beer and I thought he'd like to see a real one.

Please record the whole thing and upload it to YouTube.....or keep it for the trial!!

Despite the regular demand, regret to say I don't do reality tv or You Tube but I do show up at Fourth of July events thirsty and hungry as well as in good voice.

[Publicus]

Ancient Romans enslaved anybody regardless of race, color, ethnicity, tribe, clan, place of origin and the like, an early on in history equal treatment slaver empire.

In the USA almost all slaves and enslaved people were black.

While the ancient Romans were into power and wealth, the Old Confederacy and its flags were into wealth and white supremacy. After racism began to go out of fashion however all the Old Confederates began to call it "Heritage."

Southern heritage and its twisted pride.

White slaves were far more common than you think in the Americas.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-irish-slave-trade-the-forgotten-white-slaves/31076

Very few people in the North or the South believed in racial equality; including Abe Lincoln himself. There is no reason to demonize the South because they were engaged in something which was practiced throughout history and around the planet. It is scantioned in both the Jewih Bible and the Muslim Koran. Muslims and Jews were also heavily involved in the slave trafficking and Africans themselves sold African slaves to them. Yet it is only Europeans, and especially Southerners , who are demonized as being evil for this. There was an anti-slavery movement in the South before the war too; and even Robert E Lee was opposed to it. Slavery was destined to be abolished and it is truly a tragedy that it ended in this manner. There is absolutely no reason to denigrate the American South or their proud heritage which is far more than the institution of slavery.

White slaves were far more common than you think in the Americas.

Do not presume to consider you know what I think, or that you know what I know or do not know.

It is guaranteed your presumptions and your presumptuous blatherings at me would cause you to be wrong and wrongheaded in this respect.

As to the rest of your dubious and pedestrian post, I'd pointed out previously there are contradictions in anything, anywhere, at any given time; that the South identified themselves as criminal slavers who wanted to establish an official republic of slavery as expressly stated in the constitution of the Confederate States of America.

The Confederate flags and all they represent were always fundamentally wrong and in fact criminal. The logic and attempted reasoning that slavery in the past justified slavery then is a feeble intellectual endeavor that is devoid of morality, principle, human self-respect to include respect toward the human dignity of others.

In March 1861, the Vice President of the Confederate States of America, Alexander Stephens, offered a political manifesto for the slaveholders’ new republic. The original American republic “rested upon the assumption of the equality of the races,” Stephens explained. But “our new government is founded upon exactly the opposite ideas: its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery is his natural condition. This, our new government, is the first in the history of the world based upon this great truth.”

http://www.historynet.com/the-confederacy-americas-worst-idea.htm

Not then, not now and not ever again going forward in history.

[F430murci]

Pub, you are just too old and out of touch.

[Publicus]

This is the most ridiculous stuff ever. They canned the Dukes of Hazard even. Are you kidding me. The Dukes of Hazard had zero to do with race.

To be fair, let can BET channel (can you imagine if there was a White Entertainment Channel), all shows such as the Cosby Show, Jeffersons, Fresh Prince of Bel Air and all movies such as Coming to America (makes fun of people).

Holy cow, all of this stuff will actually just back fire in the end. Forcing this stuff down our throats is starting to make people that were once very race neutral such as myself are starting to get very irritated and are starting to racial division.

I mean seriously, Dukes of Hazard? C'mon.

The post misses the point of a culture, the reality and the existence of a culture, in this case entertainment, the culture of entertainment which simultaneously reflects or leads the national culture.

Movies long ago presented black Americans as wide-eyed servants, chauffeurs and the like. That's gone and there have been male and to include more recently female black entertainment heroes for a long time. Ted Turner's movie Gettysburg of 25 years ago was pulled after its first weekend because it was too tough on Americans of either culture to take, North or South. (Turner throughout filming kept trying to, ahem, change the ending.)

Culture.

Follow the culture or lead it. The post follows the culture of the Confederate flag, which is why the thinking expressed in the post has long since been left behind, witness Nascar already. Barack Obama won't be running again for any office but neither he nor HRC need the vote of the segment of the population that strictly and faithfully follow the old culture of the Confederacy and its Battle Flag, to include their backlash anger at themselves for their own pattern of confused voting.

[Publicus]

To clarify, for the comprehension impaired. http://news.yahoo.com/confederate-flag-racist-majority-americans-says-no-164136181.html.

Conveniently ignored previously, is that 57% do not consider it a racist symbol.

Also, please take note, that this was a CNN/ORC Poll. The last time I looked, those letters do not spell FOX.

Reading the link closely for greater detail and comprehension there are factors that need vital consideration and due respect, specifically....

Among African-Americans, 72 percent see the flag as a symbol of racism, compared to 25 percent of white people, the recent poll found.

The difference is even more stark in the South, where 75 percent of African-Americans see the flag as representative of racism, while only 18 percent of whites agree.

“As the white South was undergoing great upheaval, it became a symbol of white resistance to all these cultural changes,” says Robert Brinkmeyer, director of the Institute for Southern Studies at the University of South Carolina in Columbia, told the Monitor.

Another divide can be seen among whites along level of education; among those with a college degree, 51 percent said they see it as a symbol of pride. Among white Americans without a college degree 73 percent see it as representative of Southern pride

These are among the many other excellent reasons why the f-rag of treason is coming down in the South and in other respects throughout the country, such as Nascar tracks. There are however always Rebs in spirit who have worn the red Battle Flag for too long around their necks and in the hot sun besides.

But, you don't have any problem with being a descendant of traitors? After all, weren't our forefathers, traitors to the British?

Wrong use of the word.

The Confederacy was a violent spasm to establish a Republic of Slavery. The War of Revolution and Independence was to reject monarchy in favor of a republic whose Constitution was inspired by and consistent with the European Enlightenment.

http://www.historynet.com/the-confederacy-americas-worst-idea.htm

Keep in mind there are contradictions in anything, anywhere, at any time, so the question then is what fundamentally does one stand on, for, represent.

[Publicus]

the thread is about the confederate flag, not the moron in the white house

It goes hand and hand because it was his agenda and he is the one that said it was God's grace to get rid of the confederate flag. Obama is using stuff like this to trigger emotional and potential violent responses by a few nutters to push more racial crap down our throats.

Interesting that you do not see the abolishment of the Confederate flag and that doing away with benign shows like Dukes of Hazard only came after Obama's God grace eulogy bs at that preacher's funeral.

People need to be smarter so as not to be so manipulated. Amazing grace my butt . . ., what a master manipulator. He manipulated my butt to vote for him and now his true colors are coming out.

Leave the flags alone. Leave the Confederate general names alone. Leave shows like Dukes of Hazard alone. Amazing how much we can get derailed in such a short period of time. Nothing Obama has done has helped the situation. He is actually making worse as all of those loser entitlement people have less reason to work and more reason to blame crap from 100 + years ago for their failures. Amazing bs is what it is.

more reason to blame crap from 100 + years ago for their failures

Reactionaries don't like history when history is exposed for its bad old days. They gotta blank that out cause history then becomes a loser for 'em, all 300 years of slavery in what became the slave owning United States of America, followed by 100 years of Jim Crow laws. The lawyers and the police have defended, protected, preserved this from its outset.

Reactionaries on the right don't care much for present or developing trends either because after the present comes the future, not the past. Heaven forbid the dark shadows of the past be illuminated -- which is where the right holes up in their dark side heritage and warped pride.

Well let the light come in on the Confederacy and its god-awful flags, its racist constitution and institutions, the war it precipitated, the president it had only contempt of and whom the neoconfederates try so hard to denigrate yet without success.

[F430murci]

Pub, you re stuck in century ago, don't live here, have no clue in what things are like here and have no financial stake in what is going in here. Hello. WTH is your deal then? Am I missing something?

[NeverSure]

I see that the thought police just showed up wrapped in the Statue of Liberty.

I want my liberty and you can have your thoughts.

One thing I despise about liberals is how unliberal they are. They want to control me. They even want to control my thinking. They tell me they want their freedom to do what their pinheads tell them is correct, but they want to stifle me and my thoughts and expressions. How quaint.

After they get just the tiniest concept of what true liberty is for everyone, maybe they'll stifle their rants. (I doubt it.)

[sgtsabai]

And the typical right wing subject changing attacks continue. Cant' win the argument because you are ever so wrong, attack the person. Yea, it works, sometimes. You're a good husband, father etc. yet you brag about your hottie wife? If you think I did not earn my retirement, Social Security and Veterans payments you are sadly mistaken, then again when did people like you ever really work all their lives for an honest living serving the people of the US? I worked for a living and earned every single penny and more, more than I can say for many "rich" people. I support a family, my Thai wife and 2 children for more than 8 yrs. You really, really need to talk face to face, then again, you aren't even in Thailand and I doubt you have ever been here. Human, possibly, well, there are good and bad humans, I certainly would not put you on the good side. The flag represents racism, you can deny, deny, deny, it won't matter. Good people know.

[Publicus]

 

Pub, you re stuck in century ago, don't live here, have no clue in what things are like here and have no financial stake in what is going in here. Hello. WTH is your deal then? Am I missing something?

 

Ad hominem and pointed besides is a loser's pathetic approach.

It's quick and easy to see which side and who on which side are losing in this and in so much else of late. It's a laugh riot watching right wing racial types trying to make it sound as if I were the only one at the thread, in the United States or in the world arguing to take down that Confederate battle rag.

And here's yet another one presuming to define my life and status, position. Wrongheaded to even consider trying to do and just plain and factually wrong...wrong...wrong.

(If my emoticons were functioning at the moment I'd use them.)

[sgtsabai]

Pub, when they can't win with an intelligent, logical argument, they always attack the person. An old right wing trick.

[NeverSure]

Pub, when they can't win with an intelligent, logical argument, they always attack the person. An old right wing trick.

Don't interrupt Pub. He's busy saying "...besides is a loser's pathetic approach."

He's in a fully involved liberal meltdown. Be careful what you accuse others of with your own hateful and dismissive posts.

[Publicus]

 

Pub, when they can't win with an intelligent, logical argument, they always attack the person. An old right wing trick.

 

A number of us go back several decades involving a lotta different but same same right wingnuts in a lot of different places, times, circumstances, so you and I know their predictable approach very well, thx. Remarkably, the nutters here are intensely vile and repugnant. It's just that if I posted as you do so effectively and in the ways you post I'd be a goner.

The boomer generation liberals and our children and grandchildren have won out over the long haul. The direct consequence is that most of the born losers of the cultural and political odd-ball right have nothing to show for their wrongheaded and wrong beliefs of a lifetime during the post WW2 Era, to include Vietnam where you and your guys did good.

I haven't expected anything positive from the wingnuts since Barry Goldwater.

So it's simply a matter of carrying on...

[F430murci]

Pub, when they can't win with an intelligent, logical argument, they always attack the person. An old right wing trick.

Well, let's look at reality. I am still here doing really well, Some of you guys left because you failed here and looked for a really cheap place to live. The really sad part about all of this is that the US is still apparently paying your losers butts to live abroad because you failed here. You should be proud for sure.

[Neurath]

Pub, you re stuck in century ago, don't live here, have no clue in what things are like here and have no financial stake in what is going in here. Hello. WTH is your deal then? Am I missing something?

Apparently quite a lot.

[Scott]

A large number of inflammatory, threatening and troll posts along with replies have been removed.

Please dispense with the personal comments directed at other posters.

I believe this thread is about the removal of a flag from a state building. I don't believe that anyone is prevented from owning or displaying the flag on their personal property.

Flags are symbols and apparently this flag represents racism to some and culture and history to others.

Please stay on topic, or if you are going to veer off-topic, then please be civil toward one another.

[CMNightRider]

The politically correct liberals really opened a can of worms over removing the Confederate flag. I just saw on CNN, South Carolina is considering banning the sale of Tylenol in bottles because they fear picking cotton from the bottles may represent slavery and racism.

[CMNightRider]

Pub, when they can't win with an intelligent, logical argument, they always attack the person. An old right wing trick.

Hold on there cowboy. It seems anytime another poster questions your radical and at times hysterical rants, you invite them to a party where you can adjust their way of thinking. Somehow, I don't believe that line of logic falls into the intelligent category.

I'm beginning to think the Confederate flag is going to continue flying in South Carolina. There are a lot of people coming forward in support of the Confederate flag that have nothing to do with hatred or racism.

[KarenBravo]

Will they have to stop singing The Yellow Rose of Texas?

[chuckd]

Will they have to stop singing The Yellow Rose of Texas?

If they ever find out who the Yellow Rose of Texas really was, the song will be verboten from that day forward and relegated to the dustbin of history along with the Confederate flag.

[KarenBravo]

Will they have to stop singing The Yellow Rose of Texas?

If they ever find out who the Yellow Rose of Texas really was, the song will be verboten from that day forward and relegated to the dustbin of history along with the Confederate flag.

That was my point.

[sdanielmcev]

Will they have to stop singing The Yellow Rose of Texas?

If they ever find out who the Yellow Rose of Texas really was, the song will be verboten from that day forward and relegated to the dustbin of history along with the Confederate flag.

Emily West. A black freewoman. She left New York to escape the oppression of blacks. Found her freedom in Texas.

[jacky54]

Why did 4 slave states fight for the Union? obviously they had no idea that slavery would be banned. Lincoln said he had no intention and no authority to do so, what a liar and a fraud he was. He only emancipated slaves to try and win the war, it was not idealism, just desperation.

Edited July 4, 2015 by jacky54

[sgtsabai]

That flag represents all that is wrong with the south, especially today. It was resurrected during the civil rights movement. The only people supporting it are racist=right wing=racist and personally I'm glad to know who they are. Repression by the north, give me a break, please go back to History 101, please. That war was about states rights, the state right to enslave human beings. 4f, those of us that were fortunate to earn enough to move here, unlike you who has never been here, EARNED every single penny, most, obviously not all on here but perhaps even some of our misguided right wing folks, of us the hard way not screwing over people but helping the people and the country. Well Ok, backtrack that a bit some of us thought at one time we were "helping the country", except for that little disaster in SE Asia which set the US on the path to nowhere land. Ah, the yellow rose of Texas, a lady of some ill repute and color. She would have been called "high yellow". Not much is known about her but she allegedly went to NY sometime after the Texas independence. History is vague on her, perhaps on purpose.

[sdanielmcev]

But, you don't have any problem with being a descendant of traitors? After all, weren't our forefathers, traitors to the British?

Wrong use of the word.

The Confederacy was a violent spasm to establish a Republic of Slavery. The War of Revolution and Independence was to reject monarchy in favor of a republic whose Constitution was inspired by and consistent with the European Enlightenment.

http://www.historynet.com/the-confederacy-americas-worst-idea.htm

Keep in mind there are contradictions in anything, anywhere, at any time, so the question then is what fundamentally does one stand on, for, represent.

Nice distortion of history. The Civil War was about throwing off the choke of tyranny the South felt the North was inflicting on them. No more or less righteous than the American revolution. But you being a bigot, hardly surprising.

It is impossible to deny slavery had a major role in causing 13 states in the South to secede from the Union of the States and then to fire the first shot, which was against United States Army and Navy forces at Fort Sumter in Charleston Harbor in South Carolina, which had been the first state to secede.

Anyone who denies slavery as an initiating factor of secession, the formation of the Confederate States of America and their starting the Civil War has no credibility whatsoever....none, zilch, oogats, zero.

The evidence and proof that slavery motivated and drove secession and thus caused the Civil War is overwhelming. Read the constitution of the Confederate States of America and the constitution of each and every of its states and count the number of times "slavery" is used and in obvious context. The CSA constitution btw did not grant or recognize states rights of its member states nor did it permit secession.

You need a new record player. That one keeps skipping. You keep denying the first hundred years of the US' existence to promote your viewpoint, which is false. I have not said slavery was not an issue, just not the main issue. If slavery was the main issue, there would be no reason for the South to secede, as slavery was not abolished, nor was going to be, as the North did not have the votes in the Senate to make it so. Even President Lincolns' fiat needed to be ratified. And, as stated above, slavery was also present in the North. It was about strong central federal governing vs. weak federal governing. Goes all the way back to the first Continental Congress. And, if the Civil War was about slavery, why did he wait until the end of the war to make the Emancipation Proclamation? Because it was not the driving issue.

You can revise history, but there are these things called books. And libraries. The truth will out. Not you and your ilks' attempts at god-only-knows-why demonizing all that disagree with your agenda.

[sdanielmcev]

That flag represents all that is wrong with the south, especially today. It was resurrected during the civil rights movement. The only people supporting it are racist=right wing=racist and personally I'm glad to know who they are. Repression by the north, give me a break, please go back to History 101, please. That war was about states rights, the state right to enslave human beings. 4f, those of us that were fortunate to earn enough to move here, unlike you who has never been here, EARNED every single penny, most, obviously not all on here but perhaps even some of our misguided right wing folks, of us the hard way not screwing over people but helping the people and the country. Well Ok, backtrack that a bit some of us thought at one time we were "helping the country", except for that little disaster in SE Asia which set the US on the path to nowhere land. Ah, the yellow rose of Texas, a lady of some ill repute and color. She would have been called "high yellow". Not much is known about her but she allegedly went to NY sometime after the Texas independence. History is vague on her, perhaps on purpose.

What?

[Publicus]

Why did 4 slave states fight for the Union? obviously they had no idea that slavery would be banned. Lincoln said he had no intention and no authority to do so, what a liar and a fraud he was. He only emancipated slaves to try and win the war, it was not idealism, just desperation.

what a liar and a fraud he was.

President Lincoln said, "I hope to have God on my side, but I must have Kentucky."

There were four border states: Maryland, Delaware, Missouri, Kentucky that separated the North from the South and in which sentiment was divided to varying extents. These were not slave states.,

In addition, there were Tennessee, Kansas, Oklahoma. In these three states, sentiment was also divided concerning slavery and secession. President Lincoln needed most or all of the seven states to help achieve critical mass against the Confederacy.

During the war: Kentucky transformed from neutrality to official support of the Union. Maryland voted to abolish slavery, in 1864. Union loyalty eventually took a decisive hold in Missouri. The Union loyalty of Maryland and Delaware was never in a serious question and the two gave continuous geographic buffer protection to Washington against Confederate armies. West Virginia seceded from Virginia to side with the Union..

These states were the primary reason that President Lincoln waited so long to issue the Emancipation Proclamation. Abolitionists in the North were demanding that he free the slaves. So President Lincoln had been stuck between wanting to free the slaves and needing the border states to win the war. Lincoln knew he had to win the war to emancipate the slaves of the Confederacy, aka the Republic of Slavery.

Nice distortion of history. The Civil War was about throwing off the choke of tyranny the South felt the North was inflicting on them. No more or less righteous than the American revolution. But you being a bigot, hardly surprising.

It is impossible to deny slavery had a major role in causing 13 states in the South to secede from the Union of the States and then to fire the first shot, which was against United States Army and Navy forces at Fort Sumter in Charleston Harbor in South Carolina, which had been the first state to secede.

Anyone who denies slavery as an initiating factor of secession, the formation of the Confederate States of America and their starting the Civil War has no credibility whatsoever....none, zilch, oogats, zero.

The evidence and proof that slavery motivated and drove secession and thus caused the Civil War is overwhelming. Read the constitution of the Confederate States of America and the constitution of each and every of its states and count the number of times "slavery" is used and in obvious context. The CSA constitution btw did not grant or recognize states rights of its member states nor did it permit secession.

You need a new record player. That one keeps skipping. You keep denying the first hundred years of the US' existence to promote your viewpoint, which is false. I have not said slavery was not an issue, just not the main issue. If slavery was the main issue, there would be no reason for the South to secede, as slavery was not abolished, nor was going to be, as the North did not have the votes in the Senate to make it so. Even President Lincolns' fiat needed to be ratified. And, as stated above, slavery was also present in the North. It was about strong central federal governing vs. weak federal governing. Goes all the way back to the first Continental Congress. And, if the Civil War was about slavery, why did he wait until the end of the war to make the Emancipation Proclamation? Because it was not the driving issue.

You can revise history, but there are these things called books. And libraries. The truth will out. Not you and your ilks' attempts at god-only-knows-why demonizing all that disagree with your agenda.

You can revise history, but there are these things called books. And libraries. The truth will out.

The Civil War for fifth graders....

There are many causes that led to the American Civil War. While slavery is generally cited as the main cause for the war, other political and cultural differences between the North and the South certainly contributed

At the heart of much of the South's issues was slavery. The South relied on slavery for labor to work the fields. Many people in the North believed that slavery was wrong and evil. These people were called abolitionists. They wanted slavery made illegal throughout the United States. Abolitionists such as John Brown, Frederick Douglass, Harriet Tubman, and Harriet Beecher Stowe began to convince more and more people of the evil of slavery. This made the South fearful that their way of life would come to an end.

Causes of the Civil War http://www.ducksters.com/history/civil_war/causes_of_the_civil_war.php

Edited July 4, 2015 by Publicus

[Publicus]

It is impossible to deny slavery had a major role in causing 13 states in the South to secede from the Union of the States and then to fire the first shot, which was against United States Army and Navy forces at Fort Sumter in Charleston Harbor in South Carolina, which had been the first state to secede.

Anyone who denies slavery as an initiating factor of secession, the formation of the Confederate States of America and their starting the Civil War has no credibility whatsoever....none, zilch, oogats, zero.

The evidence and proof that slavery motivated and drove secession and thus caused the Civil War is overwhelming. Read the constitution of the Confederate States of America and the constitution of each and every of its states and count the number of times "slavery" is used and in obvious context. The CSA constitution btw did not grant or recognize states rights of its member states nor did it permit secession.

You need a new record player. That one keeps skipping. You keep denying the first hundred years of the US' existence to promote your viewpoint, which is false. I have not said slavery was not an issue, just not the main issue. If slavery was the main issue, there would be no reason for the South to secede, as slavery was not abolished, nor was going to be, as the North did not have the votes in the Senate to make it so. Even President Lincolns' fiat needed to be ratified. And, as stated above, slavery was also present in the North. It was about strong central federal governing vs. weak federal governing. Goes all the way back to the first Continental Congress. And, if the Civil War was about slavery, why did he wait until the end of the war to make the Emancipation Proclamation? Because it was not the driving issue.

You can revise history, but there are these things called books. And libraries. The truth will out. Not you and your ilks' attempts at god-only-knows-why demonizing all that disagree with your agenda.

You can revise history, but there are these things called books. And libraries. The truth will out.

The Civil War for fifth graders....

There are many causes that led to the American Civil War. While slavery is generally cited as the main cause for the war, other political and cultural differences between the North and the South certainly contributed

At the heart of much of the South's issues was slavery. The South relied on slavery for labor to work the fields. Many people in the North believed that slavery was wrong and evil. These people were called abolitionists. They wanted slavery made illegal throughout the United States. Abolitionists such as John Brown, Frederick Douglass, Harriet Tubman, and Harriet Beecher Stowe began to convince more and more people of the evil of slavery. This made the South fearful that their way of life would come to an end.

Causes of the Civil War http://www.ducksters.com/history/civil_war/causes_of_the_civil_war.php

Civil War history for grown-ups. States' rights.

Put your big boy pants on pubicus if you want to sit at the grown-ups table. We left your crayons in your play pen.

And you still haven't answered any of my questions. I don't have to wonder why. Would ruin your agenda, wouldn't it?

All you can ever do is state the same liberal clap trap over and over again. And looking over the stories you cite, I pity you and your lack of education. If you paid for that education, you should get your money back.

And remember, I'm a centrist.

your.....you.....your.....your.....you.....your.....you.....you.....you.....your.....you.....you....

And remember, I'm a centrist.

An off the deep end centrist.

Edited July 4, 2015 by Publicus