How long should Lithium Ion Laptop Batteries Last?

[connda]

I've got a 2 year old Samsung with a Lithium Ion battery that has been having problems holding a charge even though the Battery Indicator in both Windows and Bios indicate it has a charge. Now I can charge the battery to 100% but if I unplug the power source the computer will completely loose power, i.e. hard crash without a shutdown.

Two years doesn't seen like a lot of time, but then again, Windows does give me a - "Consider replacing your battery warning" - which I'll do as soon as I get back to civilization (out in the village right now).

Just for the sake of discussion, what is the 'average' life of a Lithium Ion laptop battery?

[KittenKong]

Various free battery monitor programmes are available that will show what the real remaining life of your battery is. Mine is over 4 years old but still shows 40% life (in practice that means about 45 minutes). http://batterycare.net

Windows does not always report battery charge correctly. You might like to calibrate your battery. https://www.google.com/search?q=battery+calibration+laptop&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

Many people say that 300-400 charge/discharge cycles are the useful life of a battery, but it does depend hugely on how you use the laptop and also things like temperature and how often you run the battery flat etc.

[thedemon]

If you open a command prompt and type powercfg /batteryreport that will generate a report with details including the current and historical battery wear.

As Kittenkong says, the life of an LI battery depends on many factors. 2 years is on the short side but from the symptoms you describe - shows as charging but unable to power the device - almost certainly it is kaput. Windows itself and any battery utility depend on the information provided by the smart battery's circuit.

[Chicog]

https://batterybarpro.com/

There is a free (basic) version.

Do you leave this laptop plugged in with the battery inserted, even when you're not using it?

Edited July 6, 2015 by Chicog

[mmh8]

the best way to understand is google battery university, its the best resource out there

[connda]

https://batterybarpro.com/

There is a free (basic) version.

Do you leave this laptop plugged in with the battery inserted, even when you're not using it?

Yes I do. Can that be a problem?

[Chicog]

That continually uses the battery.

[connda]

If you open a command prompt and type powercfg /batteryreport that will generate a report with details including the current and historical battery wear.

As Kittenkong says, the life of an LI battery depends on many factors. 2 years is on the short side but from the symptoms you describe - shows as charging but unable to power the device - almost certainly it is kaput. Windows itself and any battery utility depend on the information provided by the smart battery's circuit.

Hummm, no such switch with powercfg as /batteryreport. However, there is an /energy switch that give a rather verbose report. It does indicate that my battery isn't fully charging even though it says it is. From my standpoint, it's new battery time.

Oh, and here the command: POWERCFG -ENERGY -OUTPUT <filename> which will drop the report in html in the current directory.

[connda]

That continually uses the battery.

Worked 25 years in the Computer Industry, and still can learn something new all the time. I did not know that. That could explain the short life, 'eh? Thanks!

[Chicog]

Microsoft advice:

Getting the most out of your battery

In addition to using power plans to get the most mileage out of a battery charge, it's also important to take care of your battery to make sure you get the most life out of it.

• Make sure you're following the manufacturer's instructions for charging and maintaining your battery. Only use a charger and power cord supplied by the manufacturer.

• Don't let your battery get too hot (or too cold). A hot battery is a sign of trouble and usually means that your battery isn't working properly. You should stop using it right away. Also, make sure that your battery isn't exposed to extreme temperatures. Batteries are designed to work best at room temperatures. Avoid using (or even storing) batteries in extreme temperature conditions.

• Use your battery to keep it fresh. Don't keep your computer plugged in all the time. It's a good idea to discharge and then recharge your laptop battery about once a month. Also, you should let your battery run down before you recharge it.

I must admit though, I don't discharge my battery regularly, but I use my lappy as a lappy and don't leave it plugged in.

Edited July 6, 2015 by Chicog

[connda]

Microsoft advice:

Getting the most out of your battery

In addition to using power plans to get the most mileage out of a battery charge, it's also important to take care of your battery to make sure you get the most life out of it.

• Make sure you're following the manufacturer's instructions for charging and maintaining your battery. Only use a charger and power cord supplied by the manufacturer.

• Don't let your battery get too hot (or too cold). A hot battery is a sign of trouble and usually means that your battery isn't working properly. You should stop using it right away. Also, make sure that your battery isn't exposed to extreme temperatures. Batteries are designed to work best at room temperatures. Avoid using (or even storing) batteries in extreme temperature conditions.

• Use your battery to keep it fresh. Don't keep your computer plugged in all the time. It's a good idea to discharge and then recharge your laptop battery about once a month. Also, you should let your battery run down before you recharge it.

I must admit though, I don't discharge my battery regularly, but I use my lappy as a lappy and don't leave it plugged in.

Mine has a 'smart battery' discharge applet in BIOS. When I get a new battery, I will follow your lead Lol, and also fully discharge it via BIOS once a month. Now, where to find a battery for a Samsung where I can also get a receipt and limited return warranty. Probably JIB. I think I bought it there.

Thanks much for the info. Appreciate it!!!

[Barin]

I may not be lucky, in my electric shaver the Lithium Ion battery lasted a little over 1 year.

To buy a new battery I need to pay 60% of the new shaver's cost.

[BuaBS]

2 years is quite short , maybe if you have used it extensively , like nearly every day for 2 years , that 600 cycles. You have to be lucky too. My computer battery is just over 9 years and still holds around 30 %. Just enough to bridge the frequent power outs from the unreliable Thai electricity grid , so that my computer doesn't have a hard stop. My camera battery is 8 years and still hold 75 % !! My little walkman battery went 50 % after 1 year after not that much use.

( the 9 year old laptop battery has 185 cycles , I write these things down....)

Edited July 6, 2015 by BuaBS

[arjunadawn]

Recently I was pleased to learn there are a number of sites that offer classes how to change the battery yourself; very inexpensive. They are called hacks. You can do your own battery hack, assuming those inards are available. I did and works as well as a brand new one would. There are some pretty smart people out there with some tips if you were interested. http://mods-n-hacks.wonderhowto.com/how-to/hack-dead-laptop-battery-250860/

[hawksway]

Two years is about right although the latest laptops with Lithium Polymer are ding rather better. On these budget laptops sub 30K Baht you get a fairly low grade battery and often a mediocre screen. That's why they are cheap. The good news is that you can replace the battery cheaply too.

[connda]

Two years is about right although the latest laptops with Lithium Polymer are ding rather better. On these budget laptops sub 30K Baht you get a fairly low grade battery and often a mediocre screen. That's why they are cheap. The good news is that you can replace the battery cheaply too.

Yeah, this Samsung cost me about 12K THB. Paying another 12 to 24K THB simply doesn't pay for itself in additional performance.

Using Windows, my system is a dog, but it is totally about the 2 GB of RAM I have. If I had 4 GB is would run dandy. But I'm know exactly what processes are sucking the life out of my memory, in my case, the Windows Update Service is the major memory hog, sometimes chewing up in excess of 1 GB. So I disable misbehaving services until I need them.

Using Linux? No problems, works like a champ. Once they discontinue support for critical updates to Win 7, I'm done with Windows and will migrate all my systems to Linux. I might keep Windows in a VM for the odd programs that I can't run in Linux and don't like to behave using Wine, or I might keep on Win 7 computer around that is network disabled and air gapped. Use it for running legacy programs and programs without Linux ports.

[jcisco]

The life of a Lithium battery is determined or rather affected by the stress it suffers during use. If the battery becomes elevated in temperature (above 30) this will slowly reduce performance. Also running the cells from full to flat and then not charging the cell is likely to leave you with a cell that is not rechargeable ever again..

See the following link, it covers the facts.

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries

[Pib]

That continually uses the battery.

Worked 25 years in the Computer Industry, and still can learn something new all the time. I did not know that. That could explain the short life, 'eh? Thanks!

It not that it so much uses the battery, if a lithion ion battery is at the 100% charged level all the time it stresses the battery/shortens it's lifespan....a chemical reaction is accelerated that degrades the battery. And you should never store a lithium ion battery fully charged...once again due to the stress factor of being at 100% for an extend time...you should store it with a 40 to 60% charge. And the next time you get a new lithium ion battery don't be surprised that it only comes approx 60% charged from the factory---the reason for that is they don't want to ship out a new battery fully charged, it sets on the store shelf for a long while at 100% charged before being sold, and that 100% charge for an extended time reduces the battery's lifespan.

My Lenovo laptop comes with a Energy Manager utility with the main purpose of warning you if the battery has been at 100% charge for several days without any discharge activity like going mobile with the laptop (usually me at around the 3 day point although below snapshot from the utility says 7 days) and then it recommends I switch on Conservation Mode which basically allows the battery to discharge to approx 60% and then it holds the charge at 60% while the laptop in plugged in. I do my best to turn on Conservation Mode everytime I turn on the computer to maintain the charge at 60% versus stressing it at 100% for an extend time...the utility intentionally does not remember the setting when I turn the laptop on and off so i have to remember to turn it on otherwise the laptop will charge to 100%.

[jcisco]

Microsoft advice:

Getting the most out of your battery

In addition to using power plans to get the most mileage out of a battery charge, it's also important to take care of your battery to make sure you get the most life out of it.

• Make sure you're following the manufacturer's instructions for charging and maintaining your battery. Only use a charger and power cord supplied by the manufacturer.

• Don't let your battery get too hot (or too cold). A hot battery is a sign of trouble and usually means that your battery isn't working properly. You should stop using it right away. Also, make sure that your battery isn't exposed to extreme temperatures. Batteries are designed to work best at room temperatures. Avoid using (or even storing) batteries in extreme temperature conditions.

• Use your battery to keep it fresh. Don't keep your computer plugged in all the time. It's a good idea to discharge and then recharge your laptop battery about once a month. Also, you should let your battery run down before you recharge it.

I must admit though, I don't discharge my battery regularly, but I use my lappy as a lappy and don't leave it plugged in.

Mine has a 'smart battery' discharge applet in BIOS. When I get a new battery, I will follow your lead Lol, and also fully discharge it via BIOS once a month. Now, where to find a battery for a Samsung where I can also get a receipt and limited return warranty. Probably JIB. I think I bought it there.

Thanks much for the info. Appreciate it!!!

The advice here is wrong, it not advisable to deep cycle a lithium cell, cycle sure but not to empty. It will reduce the batteries life more than anything due to the high thermal load.

Just cycle it a bit is all you need, not a full run.

Edited July 6, 2015 by jcisco

[JackRayYawn]

Same problem with my Vaio. Where to get a new battery? Didn't see exact model on Lazada. I'm in Chiang Mai.

[Pib]

An occasional discharge of a lithion-ion battery (i.e., every few months) to around 5-10%% is recommended by many laptop/smartphone/tablet manufacturer's in order to re-calibrate the devices battery gauge....just like how Lenvovo recommends it as shown in my snapshot above. The two Toshiba's laptops I have also recommend the same thing...and so does my sister's Toshiba laptop. But I only do a discharge down to around 5% every 3 to 6 months...usually because I don't have it plugged in although I thought I did and then I get a warning of a battery low condition at around 10%. For smartphone/tablets it's not an issue in remembering to discharge to a low level due to the way they are primary used (i.e., usually not used while plugged into the wall because they are in your pocket, bag, hand, etc.

Based on the OP's description of his problem, the battery sounds bad. Although it may show a charge of 100% that is primarily based on measuring the voltage level of the battery vs its true charge/amperage capability. Heck, an "open" battery can actually show its full voltage level with a voltmeter but since it's an internal/chemical problem exists causing an "open condition" within the battery, it's can allow any/much of any current/amperage flow which means it can't power a device. 12V Lead-acid batteries in vehicles frequently experience this problem in old age...put a voltmeter across the battery posts and get 12V (probably 12.6V) but when trying to crank/start the vehicle or just using the headlights (i.e., putting a significant load on the battery) the voltage drops way off...maybe to nothing...because of no amperage flow capability due to a failure within the battery...maybe a mechanical failure or a chemical failure such as extreme sulfation or corroded internal connections.

Edited July 6, 2015 by Pib

[gandalf12]

Buy a new one. They dont last more than 2 years. I bought one for my Acer cost Baht 2,000

[Phil Water]

To answer the OP. Unless you have learned to religiously discharge your battery regularly, you have already succeeded at achieving double the average life.

With each new battery and laptop, I have improved my attention to full discharge and charge without prolonged periods of not using the battery and can finally say that I am over 3.5 years on one battery. Nearly 2 years longer than my best prior experience.

[fred Kubasa]

" Average life" is limited to 1 day after warranty expires !

[SantiSuk]

Manufacturer's Lenovo batteries seem to last about 2-3 years and cost say 150-200 US$ to replace. 'Copy' batteries from the likes of Pratunam Bangkok cost $50 and last not much more than 9 months. No idea about the e-purchase batteries from Hong Kong - somewhere in the middle on pricing and probably in the middle on life-span? You pays your money and makes your choices.

Just one man's experience of using lightweight Lenovos like X60 and X220 over many years. 2-3 hours use per day. Mind you I do tend to take the lazy man route of leaving the bugger plugged in.

[Commogwinto]

• Would this also apply to Li-Io batteries in roaming dogs? (mobile phones)??\

Microsoft advice:

Getting the most out of your battery

In addition to using power plans to get the most mileage out of a battery charge, it's also important to take care of your battery to make sure you get the most life out of it.

• Make sure you're following the manufacturer's instructions for charging and maintaining your battery. Only use a charger and power cord supplied by the manufacturer.

• Don't let your battery get too hot (or too cold). A hot battery is a sign of trouble and usually means that your battery isn't working properly. You should stop using it right away. Also, make sure that your battery isn't exposed to extreme temperatures. Batteries are designed to work best at room temperatures. Avoid using (or even storing) batteries in extreme temperature conditions.

• Use your battery to keep it fresh. Don't keep your computer plugged in all the time. It's a good idea to discharge and then recharge your laptop battery about once a month. Also, you should let your battery run down before you recharge it.

I must admit though, I don't discharge my battery regularly, but I use my lappy as a lappy and don't leave it plugged in.

[narisarasgroove]

Have you considered the possibility that the problem is not actually the battery at all but lies with the computer circuitry. When A/C power is removed from your laptop what should happen is that a circuit should immediately switch the power source over to battery. From the fault description you give it sounds like this is not happening.

I am a retired electronics / telecomms engineer with more than 40 years experience and very rarely have I found problems with any type of battery that just fails without giving at least some sort of indication that it is dying. Add to that the fact that your laptop and BIOS indicate the battery has a full charge then it may be possible that you are barking up the wrong tree.

An easy way to check is to take the laptop (and battery) to a dealer and explain the problem. Ask if they can try a new battery in your machine and when it is installed if the problem persists then the computer must be at fault. If all is OK then it will be up to you to decide if you want to shell out for a new battery or not.

There is also the remote possibility that it might be something as silly as corroded or dirty contacts between the battery and the machine. Worth giving it a look first just in case.

Good luck!

[Pib]

Have you considered the possibility that the problem is not actually the battery at all but lies with the computer circuitry. When A/C power is removed from your laptop what should happen is that a circuit should immediately switch the power source over to battery. From the fault description you give it sounds like this is not happening.

I am a retired electronics / telecomms engineer with more than 40 years experience and very rarely have I found problems with any type of battery that just fails without giving at least some sort of indication that it is dying. Add to that the fact that your laptop and BIOS indicate the battery has a full charge then it may be possible that you are barking up the wrong tree.

An easy way to check is to take the laptop (and battery) to a dealer and explain the problem. Ask if they can try a new battery in your machine and when it is installed if the problem persists then the computer must be at fault. If all is OK then it will be up to you to decide if you want to shell out for a new battery or not.

There is also the remote possibility that it might be something as silly as corroded or dirty contacts between the battery and the machine. Worth giving it a look first just in case.

Good luck!

I think you misread the OP's problem description. He said the laptop runs fine when plugged in and the battery indicator even shows 100% charge, but when unplugging the laptop the laptop immediately dies as in no battery power...as if the battery is really dead or not connected. I've had laptop batteries do that two me twice over my computer lifetime...the connection between the battery and laptop was fine...it's just the battery was defective.

But I agree it could be the computer circuity, but I think the chances are low...probably just a defective battery...he won't know for sure until he can plug in a known good/new battery.

[narisarasgroove]

Have you considered the possibility that the problem is not actually the battery at all but lies with the computer circuitry. When A/C power is removed from your laptop what should happen is that a circuit should immediately switch the power source over to battery. From the fault description you give it sounds like this is not happening.

I am a retired electronics / telecomms engineer with more than 40 years experience and very rarely have I found problems with any type of battery that just fails without giving at least some sort of indication that it is dying. Add to that the fact that your laptop and BIOS indicate the battery has a full charge then it may be possible that you are barking up the wrong tree.

An easy way to check is to take the laptop (and battery) to a dealer and explain the problem. Ask if they can try a new battery in your machine and when it is installed if the problem persists then the computer must be at fault. If all is OK then it will be up to you to decide if you want to shell out for a new battery or not.

There is also the remote possibility that it might be something as silly as corroded or dirty contacts between the battery and the machine. Worth giving it a look first just in case.

Good luck!

I think you misread the OP's problem description. He said the laptop runs fine when plugged in and the battery indicator even shows 100% charge, but when unplugging the laptop the laptop immediately dies as in no battery power...as if the battery is really dead or not connected. I've had laptop batteries do that two me twice over my computer lifetime...the connection between the battery and laptop was fine...it's just the battery was defective.

But I agree it could be the computer circuity, but I think the chances are low...probably just a defective battery...he won't know for sure until he can plug in a known good/new battery.

Don't want to get into a ping pong situation over this but what I am saying is that the computer works fine when plugged into the mains. When the mains is removed the machine dies. When the mains is removed a circuit should sense the loss of AC power and switch over to battery straight away. If this circuit is not operating then the battery will not be connected when the mains is removed and the computer will switch off irrespective of whether the battery is in good condition or not.

I am not saying it IS the answer but a possibility that should be explored.

[ToYoungToRetire]

Battery life depends more on battery usage than battery age.