Govt rejects HRW's criticism for detention of politicians

[Lite Beer]

Govt rejects HRW's criticism for detention of politicians
THE SUNDAY NATION

BANGKOK: -- A GOVERNMENT official yesterday shrugged off a call by a foreign rights group for the release of politicians held in military detention for criticising the government.

Deputy Government Spokesman Maj-General Werachon Sukhondhapatipak said there was no need to explain to Human Rights Watch (HRW) regarding the detention of former energy minister Pichai Naripthaphan and Pheu Thai Party politician Karun Hosakul.

"We have our rules to follow. We enforce the law reasonably," Werachon said. "Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules. This action is not for the interest of any person in particular," he added.

He also said, "The government understands that HRW has its own context to follow. But international organisations also have to understand Thailand's context and situation."

The spokesman said he did not think Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha would feel any pressure from HRW's latest move.

Prayut had explained earlier that Pichai and Karun were summoned for further "attitude adjustment" after they had repeatedly created a political disturbance.

Meanwhile, Pheu Thai Party, which Pichai and Karun are members of, thanked HRW yesterday for their call to release the two politicians.

Pheu Thai's deputy secretary-general Chavalit Wichayasut said the politicians had the right to express their views and make their own decisions to do or not do things.

Chavalit said he did not think comments expressed by the two would severely affect national security, as had been claimed by the authorities.

"Doing this repeatedly will finally bring a negative image to the government," he said, referring to the "attitude adjustment" method used by the government against critics.

On Friday, HRW asked the government to release dissident politicians from military detention. "The Thai junta continues to use arbitrary arrest and secret detention to intimidate and silence people who peacefully criticise military rule," Brad Adams, Asia director of HRW, said in a statement released by the New York-based organisation.

"As the junta tightens its dictatorial powers, Thailand's climate of fear is intensifying," he said.

"The junta's pledges to respect human rights have proven meaningless," Adams said. "General Prayut should immediately order an end to arbitrary arrest and secret detention, and release all those being wrongfully held."

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Govt-rejects-HRWs-criticism-for-detention-of-polit-30268689.html

-- The Nation 2015-09-13

[Reigntax]

Thailand and human rights in the same sentenance. Yeh right. Similar to junta and democracy, military and intellegence, police and enforcement. The list could go on indefinately!

[NongKhaiKid]

" Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules. "

Staging a coup is within the clear rules ?

[cumgranosalum]

" "The government understands that HRW has its own context to follow. But international organisations also have to understand Thailand's context and situation." - this is a I'd suggest that this is a false argument so often by any country that may be breaching human rights....you can't hide behind a facade of a vague concept of "culture" or "being different" - human rights are a basic right for all HUMANS - not nations or countries - ......again there are echoes of past literature.

"All people are equal...but some are more equal than others"

Edited September 12, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[Jon Wetherall]

Mr Prayuth still hasn't understood that Thailand has signed up for international standards in human rights and other areas and is expected to meet those standards, but instead is now ignoring them.

HRW as an organisation isn't perfect but they aren't at all like the ridiculous Thai NGO of a similar name, which was set up only to create appearances, not to actually apply, comply with or embrace international expectations of civilised human rights behaviour in Thailand. That can be demonstrated by a very cursory look at who is on the panel and what their real qualifications are - Abhisit at his most remarkably arrogant,.

HRW has international supporters and if Mr Prayuth wants Thailand to be better accepted in the international community, then he badly needs to show he has at least a basic understanding of the fact that in the 21st Century, no country is completely a law unto itself. Not if they want other countries to buy their wares anyway. To date his actions suggest he doesn't really have a very good grasp of this basic fact, in fact, the things that Mr P doesn't or cannot understand are manifold. Not the brightest star in the night sky is Uncle Too.

He will according reap the disdain of more civilised countries and people when he showboats his way to the UN in a few weeks. Experience with this man shows that he is rightly shunned and isolated among the international community, while lying in his teeth when back home, that other countries support and approve of what he and his illegitimate government are doing, And he thinks those same countries are too stupid to recognise that he lies in his teeth and mis-quotes all over the place - effectively making them look like liars themselves.

He might think he's doing a tip-top job, but self praise is scant recommendation, and Thailand will reap this man's bitter harvest in good time.

I recallthat after the tsunami in 2005, Oxfam said it would not assist Thailand with it's charity again because much of the money donated was stolen by Thais. Accordingly, Thailand should wish it does not get hit by another natural disaster, and the same must also apply for it's other behaviours.

The international community doesn't owe Thailand anything, and doesn't have to be loyal to any person there, as some Thais seem to expect. As I suspect is happening as we speak with the Erawan bomber, if Thailand ever wants to get international support again, it had better stop flipping the bird at the world and better start growing up.

[cumgranosalum]

" Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules. "

Staging a coup is within the clear rules ?

who makes the rules?

[MZurf]

" Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules. "

Staging a coup is within the clear rules ?

You have to understand that the "rules" he is talking about is anything that will keep the current snouts in the trough.

[JAG]

" Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules. "

Staging a coup is within the clear rules ?

who makes the rules?

The people who made the coup.

[Bluespunk]

Yeah, I don't think this spokesperson has quite understood that HRW publishes its reports so the world can see what is going on and then act accordingly.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Bluespunk

[Eric Loh]

Mr Prayuth still hasn't understood that Thailand has signed up for international standards in human rights and other areas and is expected to meet those standards, but instead is now ignoring them.

HRW as an organisation isn't perfect but they aren't at all like the ridiculous Thai NGO of a similar name, which was set up only to create appearances, not to actually apply, comply with or embrace international expectations of civilised human rights behaviour in Thailand. That can be demonstrated by a very cursory look at who is on the panel and what their real qualifications are - Abhisit at his most remarkably arrogant,.

HRW has international supporters and if Mr Prayuth wants Thailand to be better accepted in the international community, then he badly needs to show he has at least a basic understanding of the fact that in the 21st Century, no country is completely a law unto itself. Not if they want other countries to buy their wares anyway. To date his actions suggest he doesn't really have a very good grasp of this basic fact, in fact, the things that Mr P doesn't or cannot understand are manifold. Not the brightest star in the night sky is Uncle Too.

He will according reap the disdain of more civilised countries and people when he showboats his way to the UN in a few weeks. Experience with this man shows that he is rightly shunned and isolated among the international community, while lying in his teeth when back home, that other countries support and approve of what he and his illegitimate government are doing, And he thinks those same countries are too stupid to recognise that he lies in his teeth and mis-quotes all over the place - effectively making them look like liars themselves.

He might think he's doing a tip-top job, but self praise is scant recommendation, and Thailand will reap this man's bitter harvest in good time.

I recallthat after the tsunami in 2005, Oxfam said it would not assist Thailand with it's charity again because much of the money donated was stolen by Thais. Accordingly, Thailand should wish it does not get hit by another natural disaster, and the same must also apply for it's other behaviours.

The international community doesn't owe Thailand anything, and doesn't have to be loyal to any person there, as some Thais seem to expect. As I suspect is happening as we speak with the Erawan bomber, if Thailand ever wants to get international support again, it had better stop flipping the bird at the world and better start growing up.

We can expect a very unpleasant visit to UN. He will be indifferent no doubt as he properly don't have the intelligence to process what the international community is saying. He lives in his own bubble.

[tomross46]

They are all corrupt politicians and belong in jail.Politicians are elected to support the citizens, but instead they rob, cheet and steal all the money they can get or themselves and their supporters. Another oxymoron is " Honest Politician "

[oneday]

"...Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules..."

That begs the question; are rules set forth by an illegal, non-elected government lawful? Especially if these rules impinge on the very values and foundation of a Democratic society? What we have is "rule of law" as it existed in the day of the caveman. If you have the power then all those without power must bow down to your rule; right or wrong. It is not good for the people, but it is very good for those in power.

Edited September 13, 2015 by oneday

[ALLSEEINGEYE]

I say there a lot more politicians all over the world that should be locked up. There is a long history of politicians getting away with their disgusting abuses of power. If you are a politician and you are guilty of a crime it is time that you are accountable for the crimes you commit.

[jayboy]

"...Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules..."

That begs the question; are rules set forth by an illegal, non-elected government lawful? Especially if these rules impinge on the very values and foundation of a Democratic society? What we have is "rule of law" as it existed in the day of the caveman. If you have the power then all those without power must bow down to your rule; right or wrong. It is not good for the people, but it is very good for those in power.

It's a fair point.Speaking hypothetically and without any reference to Thailand and in an entirely general sense, if a group seizes power illegally by force of arms, it follows any way of removing that clique is permitted ( including non violent force).

[bheard]

"Prayut had explained earlier that Pichai and Karun were summoned for further "attitude adjustment" after they had repeatedly created a political disturbance."

When the man gets to the UN he may need an "attitude adjustment" as well.

[phoenixdoglover]

Dear Mr. Prime Minister,

You are welcome to come to NYC and attend the United Nations.

During your stay, you should head over to NY Pizza Supreme on 8th Avenue. Go for the thick crust. You can thank me later.

Feel free to complain about everything that annoys you. You'll fit right in with a lot of New Yorkers.

And, feel free to openly and loudly criticize the Mayor, the Police Commissioner, the Governor, and our President at every opportunity.

Most people will ignore you. The rest will argue with you.

Then you can go back home as planned. No hard feelings.

This is how we roll in a country that still (yes, still) gives a damn about freedom of speech.

[AGareth2]

power comes from the barrel of the gun

[EnglishJohn]

"The Thai junta continues to use arbitrary arrest and secret detention to intimidate and silence people who peacefully criticise military rule,"

Where was Mr Brad Adams when the last lot were using terrorism to silence people permanently who dared to protest peacefully ?.

These people are a political organisation hiding behind the banner of Human Rights. It is disgusting and they should be ashamed of themselves - though if I've learnt anything from this forum, it's that the kind of people who support Pheu-Thai are not the kind of people who have any shame.

By using the banner for themselves, they are preventing decent people using it for real checks on human rights. Last year they refused to hold their conference in Bangkok because it meant asking the Junta for permission - and they did not want to acknowledge their authority. Oh well, maybe those who needed them will get a look in next year.

[heybruce]

"Werachon said. "Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules. This action is not for the interest of any person in particular," he added."

[candide]

2015 report here

https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2015/country-chapters/thailand

[dageurreotype]

"...Our country has clear rules and we have to follow the rules..."

That begs the question; are rules set forth by an illegal, non-elected government lawful? Especially if these rules impinge on the very values and foundation of a Democratic society? What we have is "rule of law" as it existed in the day of the caveman. If you have the power then all those without power must bow down to your rule; right or wrong. It is not good for the people, but it is very good for those in power.

It's a fair point.Speaking hypothetically and without any reference to Thailand and in an entirely general sense, if a group seizes power illegally by force of arms, it follows any way of removing that clique is permitted ( including non violent force).

You don't mean ...? Nah. No oil

[AlQaholic]

Shouldn't Thailand be expelled from the UN? They have broken all the things they signed up for in the past, including Human rights.

[Jon Wetherall]

They are all corrupt politicians and belong in jail.Politicians are elected to support the citizens, but instead they rob, cheet and steal all the money they can get or themselves and their supporters. Another oxymoron is " Honest Politician "

A good question would be "why do they do this?" There is an answer, it is the example set by one person.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Jon Wetherall

[26vinny]

the UN should wait for the clown to arrive and publicly disgrace him on TV then ban thailand from the organisation,but as usual UN dragging their feet

[phoenixdoglover]

"The Thai junta continues to use arbitrary arrest and secret detention to intimidate and silence people who peacefully criticise military rule,"

Where was Mr Brad Adams when the last lot were using terrorism to silence people permanently who dared to protest peacefully ?.

These people are a political organisation hiding behind the banner of Human Rights. It is disgusting and they should be ashamed of themselves - though if I've learnt anything from this forum, it's that the kind of people who support Pheu-Thai are not the kind of people who have any shame.

By using the banner for themselves, they are preventing decent people using it for real checks on human rights. Last year they refused to hold their conference in Bangkok because it meant asking the Junta for permission - and they did not want to acknowledge their authority. Oh well, maybe those who needed them will get a look in next year.

Didn't bother to check, eh?

HRW was saying, for example in their 2013 report:

The government of Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra, which won a landslide victory in July 2011 elections, has not yet addressed Thailand’s many serious human rights problems, including lack of accountability for the 2010 political violence, abuses in southern border provinces, free speech restrictions, and violations of refugee and migrant rights.

[JAG]

"The Thai junta continues to use arbitrary arrest and secret detention to intimidate and silence people who peacefully criticise military rule,"

Where was Mr Brad Adams when the last lot were using terrorism to silence people permanently who dared to protest peacefully ?.

These people are a political organisation hiding behind the banner of Human Rights. It is disgusting and they should be ashamed of themselves - though if I've learnt anything from this forum, it's that the kind of people who support Pheu-Thai are not the kind of people who have any shame.

By using the banner for themselves, they are preventing decent people using it for real checks on human rights. Last year they refused to hold their conference in Bangkok because it meant asking the Junta for permission - and they did not want to acknowledge their authority. Oh well, maybe those who needed them will get a look in next year.

Didn't bother to check, eh?

HRW was saying, for example in their 2013 report:

The government of Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra, which won a landslide victory in July 2011 elections, has not yet addressed Thailand’s many serious human rights problems, including lack of accountability for the 2010 political violence, abuses in southern border provinces, free speech restrictions, and violations of refugee and migrant rights.

Of course he didn't bother to check. he is far too busy running after every passing junta bandwagon, bellowing his undying love for the men in tight green uniforms!

Still, I suppose it keeps him fit. Which will be useful when the red-shirts get back into power. One never knows, he might feel the need to move quickly then!

Edited September 13, 2015 by JAG

[rubl]

The interesting part of the comments is the 'head in the sky' aspect.

I think the opinion is that the junta, it's government and so should behave more democratically, behave as if they were democratically elected. Next I'm waiting for demands for an open election of NCPO members.

[lildragon]

"The Thai junta continues to use arbitrary arrest and secret detention to intimidate and silence people who peacefully criticise military rule,"

Where was Mr Brad Adams when the last lot were using terrorism to silence people permanently who dared to protest peacefully ?.

These people are a political organisation hiding behind the banner of Human Rights. It is disgusting and they should be ashamed of themselves - though if I've learnt anything from this forum, it's that the kind of people who support Pheu-Thai are not the kind of people who have any shame.

By using the banner for themselves, they are preventing decent people using it for real checks on human rights. Last year they refused to hold their conference in Bangkok because it meant asking the Junta for permission - and they did not want to acknowledge their authority. Oh well, maybe those who needed them will get a look in next year.

Didn't bother to check, eh?

HRW was saying, for example in their 2013 report:

The government of Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra, which won a landslide victory in July 2011 elections, has not yet addressed Thailand’s many serious human rights problems, including lack of accountability for the 2010 political violence, abuses in southern border provinces, free speech restrictions, and violations of refugee and migrant rights.

It's EnglishJohn. Now that you have posted facts he will dissappear from this topic never to seen again. He doesn't take it well when facts disrupt his twisted world view

[tomacht8]

Detention of politicians sounds hard.
Politicans summoned for "attitude adjustment” sounds unfair.

That is the wrong way.

Better:
Full review of the financial situation of politicians by the tax authorities.
How much money, real estate, cars, gold, securities, foreign accounts are there?
The whole should include the family environment.
What was actually reported in recent years in the tax declaration?
Projection of the historic income for plausibility.

If some politicians can not prove the origin of their wealth without any doubt,
then tax criminal fines, collection of wrongly received assets and prison.

Then there is no trouble with the Human Rights Groups.
Some politicians are real crooks.

I bet many politicians would beg then for an “attitude adjustment”, only that they can keep the embezzled money.

Edited September 13, 2015 by tomacht8

[JAG]

Detention of politicians sounds hard.

Politicans summoned for "attitude adjustment” sounds unfair.

That is the wrong way.

Better:

Full review of the financial situation of politicians by the tax authorities.

How much money, real estate, cars, money, securities, foreign accounts are there?

The whole should include the family environment.

What was actually reported in recent years in the tax declaration?

Projection of the historic income for plausibility.

If some politicians can not prove the origin of their wealth without any doubt,

then tax criminal fines, collection of wrongly received assets and prison.

Then there is no trouble with the Human Rights Groups.

Some politicians are real crooks.

I bet many politicians would beg then for an “attitude adjustment”, only that they can keep the embezzled money.

What a corker of an idea. Perhaps we can begin the process by reviewing those currently in power?

Oh, ah, umm, perhaps not...

Edited September 13, 2015 by JAG