US: Multiple deaths in school shooting in Oregon State

[lostoday]

Lostoday,

In other words, you have no evidence other than your own prejudices. Prejudice which causes you to ignore the known facts.

Would a Muslim say "We will all be meeting soon" to Christians as he killed them?

No; not even if he intended to kill himself as well. A radical Muslim would believe he would be going to heaven, whilst the Christians would be going to hell.

He'd be wrong, as the Koran forbids murder.

I'm not a Christian nor Muslim unlike you I have no dogs in this hunt. I'm only an impartial observer. What groups in the USA kill white/other/but not all black, Christians?

Tell us who?

Then provide evidence to show why this guy did it.

When people talk the first one asking the question is answered by the second person. If I knew I would tell you. I asked the question first now it is your turn to answer.

[Linky]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

[55Jay]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

Sounds like Islam has a problem with interpretation. Don't they all, though.

[Linky]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

Sorry chum, they do follow 'their' interpretation of that book. Similar to Jehovah Witness folk do with the Christian book..Weeell, thats the way I see it..

Well you see it wrong.

But again what has it to do with this thread. There is no muslim connection in this.

[Linky]

Lostoday,

In other words, you have no evidence other than your own prejudices. Prejudice which causes you to ignore the known facts.

Would a Muslim say "We will all be meeting soon" to Christians as he killed them?

No; not even if he intended to kill himself as well. A radical Muslim would believe he would be going to heaven, whilst the Christians would be going to hell.

He'd be wrong, as the Koran forbids murder.

I'm not a Christian nor Muslim unlike you I have no dogs in this hunt. I'm only an impartial observer. What groups in the USA kill white/other/but not all black, Christians?

Tell us who?

Then provide evidence to show why this guy did it.

When people talk the first one asking the question is answered by the second person. If I knew I would tell you. I asked the question first now it is your turn to answer.

You asked the question first. What are you 12?

You made the assertion it was done by a muslim. You cannot back that up so it is clear bigotry in play.

[lostoday]

Well you see it wrong.

But again what has it to do with this thread. There is no muslim connection in this.

The Federal Security Services (FSB) is reporting today that an American black-Islamist terror suspect, who yesterday committed an act of mass murder in the State of Oregon (United States), had been included on a list of 87,000 “known/suspected” Islamic terrorists that the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) and International Criminal Police Organization (INTERPOL) refused last month to accept from the Federation due to its not being “politically viable in the present atmosphere”.

http://www.eutimes.net/2015/10/oregon-mass-shooter-on-terror-list-obama-refused-to-take-from-russia/

Oregon mass murderer Chris Harper Mercer is linked to a Muslim man who praised Islamic terrorism, a survey of one of his social media accounts reveals.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/10/02/oregon-shooter-linked-to-man-praising-islamic-terrorism-kill-the-jews/

Edited October 6, 2015 by lostoday

[lostoday]

I'm not a Christian nor Muslim unlike you I have no dogs in this hunt. I'm only an impartial observer. What groups in the USA kill white/other/but not all black, Christians?

Tell us who?

Then provide evidence to show why this guy did it.

When people talk the first one asking the question is answered by the second person. If I knew I would tell you. I asked the question first now it is your turn to answer.

You asked the question first. What are you 12?

You made the assertion it was done by a muslim. You cannot back that up so it is clear bigotry in play.

It is a hate crime. He killed people because of their religious beliefs. Current non state sponsored religious nonsense is Muslims kill Christians. Muslims kill Jews. I don't think there are groups of radical Christians or Jews going around declaring war on random Muslims. I could be wrong. I don't think reporting on what I read in the newspaper makes me a bigot.

Below is a link for Muslims killing Christians. I have not been able to find one for Christians killing Muslims since 911 to compare the two. Like I said before I have no emotional thing with this as I'm not a Christian or a Muslim only an impartial observer. I don't live in America. I only know what I read in the papers.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/christianattacks.htm

[Linky]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

Sorry chum, they do follow 'their' interpretation of that book. Similar to Jehovah Witness folk do with the Christian book..Weeell, thats the way I see it..

Well you see it wrong.

But again what has it to do with this thread. There is no muslim connection in this.

Then answer me this. Some normal peaceful Muslim families in the west's KIDS, who were brought up the way zillions of peaceful Muslims, are buggering off to Join ISIS to kill other Muslims and anyone else they don't like.

Are they still Muslims.?

Yes still muslim. No dont follow islam.

They follow islam as much as a catholic priest is convicted as a pedo is still catholic but does not follow catholicism by committing the crime.

[Linky]

Double post

Edited October 6, 2015 by Linky

[Linky]

Again

Edited October 6, 2015 by Linky

[55Jay]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

Sorry chum, they do follow 'their' interpretation of that book. Similar to Jehovah Witness folk do with the Christian book..Weeell, thats the way I see it..

Well you see it wrong.

But again what has it to do with this thread. There is no muslim connection in this.

Then answer me this. Some normal peaceful Muslim families in the west's KIDS, who were brought up the way zillions of peaceful Muslims, are buggering off to Join ISIS to kill other Muslims and anyone else they don't like.

Are they still Muslims.?

Yes still muslim. No dont follow islam.

They follow islam as much as a catholic priest is convicted as a pedo is still catholic but does not follow catholicism by committing the crime.

Not a very good comparison.

Extremist muslims believe they are following the word of god as interpreted from their particular book.

Catholic priests who diddle little boys aren't.

[Linky]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

Sorry chum, they do follow 'their' interpretation of that book. Similar to Jehovah Witness folk do with the Christian book..Weeell, thats the way I see it..

Well you see it wrong.

But again what has it to do with this thread. There is no muslim connection in this.

Then answer me this. Some normal peaceful Muslim families in the west's KIDS, who were brought up the way zillions of peaceful Muslims, are buggering off to Join ISIS to kill other Muslims and anyone else they don't like.

Are they still Muslims.?

Yes still muslim. No dont follow islam.

They follow islam as much as a catholic priest is convicted as a pedo is still catholic but does not follow catholicism by committing the crime.

Not a very good comparison.

Extremist muslims believe they are following the word of god as interpreted from their particular book.

Catholic priests who diddle little boys aren't.

Nutter believe anything. Doesnt mean they are. ISIS is a very small minority of muslims. The rest of the muslim world condemn them as anti islam.

[55Jay]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

Sorry chum, they do follow 'their' interpretation of that book. Similar to Jehovah Witness folk do with the Christian book..Weeell, thats the way I see it..

Well you see it wrong.

But again what has it to do with this thread. There is no muslim connection in this.

Then answer me this. Some normal peaceful Muslim families in the west's KIDS, who were brought up the way zillions of peaceful Muslims, are buggering off to Join ISIS to kill other Muslims and anyone else they don't like.

Are they still Muslims.?

Yes still muslim. No dont follow islam.

They follow islam as much as a catholic priest is convicted as a pedo is still catholic but does not follow catholicism by committing the crime.

Not a very good comparison.

Extremist muslims believe they are following the word of god as interpreted from their particular book.

Catholic priests who diddle little boys aren't.

Nutter believe anything. Doesnt mean they are. ISIS is a very small minority of muslims. The rest of the muslim world condemn them as anti islam.

I was referring to extremist muslims, not just this new kid on the block called ISIS.

Would also not go along with the "rest of the muslim world" condemning ISIS.

ISIS is aligned with Sunni muslim sect. They have the support of some major Arab states. Even if moderate "true" muslims disagree publicly, they may cheer privately for the broader Sunni effort to check Shi'ite expansion.

You're right earlier though. This is all irrelevant. Unless, of course, his link to radical islamists gells further. Islamist recruiting and mobilization over the internet, is not without precedent.

[uksomchai]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

Back here in Blighty I am surrounded by Mosques. There is a large Muslim population here. While I was waiting for my kabab the owner was saying he thought the Russians going to Syria was what was needed. I found this confusing. I asked him why other moderate Muslims did not protest about what ISIS was doing and he explained. He said that other Muslims couldn't object as they are doing exactly what the Koran tells them they must do. He said they are the true Muslims really and that it is just the vast majority of what we call Moderate Muslims just ignore what the koran says they must do and just get on with their lives. He said that he prays 5 times a day and gives to the mosque but that is s far as he will ever go. He said that even though they can't officially object to what is going on that doesn't mean that he wants it to continue.

So I would suggest that instead of simply listening to the politicians telling you that ISIS has nothing to do with Islam you either read the Koran or ask some Muslims you know because it is about Islam 100%

I would rather believe someone who has had to learn the koran by heart since he was a child and goes to the Mosque 5 times a day than a mealy mouthed politician with their own political agenda

[uksomchai]

I have just read about an 11 year old boy having an argument with an 8 year old girl neighbour, going into his house and shooting dead the girl with his father's shotgun. There is something wrong with a society that brings up a child to think the answer to a problem is to reach for the shotgun

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/ap/article-3260856/Boy-11-accused-killing-8-year-old-neighbor-shotgun.html

It isn't the gun laws that need changing it is the whole way of life which is a great deal harder

[lostoday]

I have just read about an 11 year old boy having an argument with an 8 year old girl neighbour, going into his house and shooting dead the girl with his father's shotgun. There is something wrong with a society that brings up a child to think the answer to a problem is to reach for the shotgun

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/ap/article-3260856/Boy-11-accused-killing-8-year-old-neighbor-shotgun.html

It isn't the gun laws that need changing it is the whole way of life which is a great deal harder

Yes the whole country is just like an 8 year old from rural Tennessee. Astute observation. Did I tell you how much America misses Piers Morgan?

[Linky]

@ Linky..

What religion, I would suggest which ever one he wanted on that day, for sure he wasn't a Christian on that day..

As for ISIS, are you saying that Muslims from all over the world who are traveling from far and wide to join ISIS are NOT Muslims.....?

Correct. They are muslims in name only but do not follow the teachings of Islam. Islamic leaders have already stated as such.

Back here in Blighty I am surrounded by Mosques. There is a large Muslim population here. While I was waiting for my kabab the owner was saying he thought the Russians going to Syria was what was needed. I found this confusing. I asked him why other moderate Muslims did not protest about what ISIS was doing and he explained. He said that other Muslims couldn't object as they are doing exactly what the Koran tells them they must do. He said they are the true Muslims really and that it is just the vast majority of what we call Moderate Muslims just ignore what the koran says they must do and just get on with their lives. He said that he prays 5 times a day and gives to the mosque but that is s far as he will ever go. He said that even though they can't officially object to what is going on that doesn't mean that he wants it to continue.

So I would suggest that instead of simply listening to the politicians telling you that ISIS has nothing to do with Islam you either read the Koran or ask some Muslims you know because it is about Islam 100%

I would rather believe someone who has had to learn the koran by heart since he was a child and goes to the Mosque 5 times a day than a mealy mouthed politician with their own political agenda

I dont get my information from politicians. Sorry you are surrounded by mosques, must be hell having to look at them.

I live in a muslim country so dont need to hear anything from politicians. I can hardly notice the mosques and churches. Some males pray 5 times for a few minutes each time, no reason for that to bother me.

So I dont need to lsten to politicians. I also dont need to get my world view of muslims because of what one local kebab shop owner says.

Moderate muslims do and contnue to protest against IS. Muslim countries have arrested many that sympathise with them. Plenty of muslim leaders have spoken against them.

But you stick with what the kebab shopmowner tells you as gospel without researching things.

[7by7]

Those who refuse to believe the majority Muslim world condemns ISIS and similar terrorists as unIslamic have previously been shown in other topics the many, many articles, petitions etc. by Muslim governments, Muslim religious leaders, of all sects, Muslim scholars, prominent Muslims and ordinary Muslim individuals doing just that.

But, as ever, they ignore all facts which confound their prejudice.

How this turned into a topic about ISIS, only the haters know.

But for the benefit of lostoday: 10 of the Worst Terror Attacks by Extreme Christians and Far-Right White Men

Most of the terrorist activity in the U.S. in recent years has come not from Muslims, but from radical Christianists, white supremacists and far-right militia groups.

[7by7]

Back here in Blighty I am surrounded by Mosques.......

Really?

In another topic you say that you work in the steelworks in Redcar threatened with closure.

According to this directory, there are only two mosques in Redcar!

Though, as the map on that page shows, they are fairly close together, so maybe you live in between them?

According to the 2011 census, 0.4% of the population of Redcar and Cleveland is Muslim (source)

Of course, you could commute. There are 7 mosques in Middlesbrough; including the above two (source)

[uksomchai]

Back here in Blighty I am surrounded by Mosques.......

Really?

In another topic you say that you work in the steelworks in Redcar threatened with closure.

According to this directory, there are only two mosques in Redcar!

Though, as the map on that page shows, they are fairly close together, so maybe you live in between them?

According to the 2011 census, 0.4% of the population of Redcar and Cleveland is Muslim (source)

Of course, you could commute. There are 7 mosques in Middlesbrough; including the above two (source)

We have things called CARS here in the UK as well as ROADS. You know people use them to get to OTHER places from where they live.

In a five minute walk into town I pass at least 6 Mosques ans several Islamic community centres of which I have no objection to having here, sorry if that doesn't fit with your bigoted ideas

But hey you live in your little warped existence and I will live in mine.

Oh and I will believe the local Muslim rather than a keyboard warrior from Thailand

[7by7]

You seem to have (deliberately?) missed the bit where I said "Of course, you could commute!"

Merely attempting to clear up the inconsistencies in your posts.

So what town is it with so many mosques in such a small area?

BTW, I do live in the UK, in a town with a high proportion of Muslims; none of whom, to the best of my knowledge, though I obviously haven't talked to them all, wish to join ISIS or kill Christians.

[7by7]

Those who refuse to believe the majority Muslim world condemns ISIS and similar terrorists as unIslamic have previously been shown in other topics the many, many articles, petitions etc. by Muslim governments, Muslim religious leaders, of all sects, Muslim scholars, prominent Muslims and ordinary Muslim individuals doing just that.

But, as ever, they ignore all facts which confound their prejudice.

How this turned into a topic about ISIS, only the haters know.

But for the benefit of lostoday: 10 of the Worst Terror Attacks by Extreme Christians and Far-Right White Men

Most of the terrorist activity in the U.S. in recent years has come not from Muslims, but from radical Christianists, white supremacists and far-right militia groups.

YOU will not accept that ISIS and folk shooting and bombing folk in the west ARE Muslims...Muslims doing their stuff via THEIR interpretation of THEIR book..

It's true chap....What on earth is wrong with you...

If these folk ain't Muslims, what are they...?

Many kids born in the West to nice Muslim families are breaking their necks to go and chop heads off with ISIS.....Are they now NOT Muslim...?

I have never denied that ISIS and other Islamic terrorists see themselves as Muslim; that's why I call them Islamic terrorists!

Surely even you can understand that!

One Muslim kid, or adult, born anywhere joining ISIS is one too many; but yes, it does happen. But for every Muslim who joins or even supports ISIS, millions don't.

Why can't you grasp that simple truth?

Why do you dismiss the condemnation of ISIS and other Islamic terrorist coming from Muslims all over the world?

Why do you ignore the fact that the majority of those fighting ISIS, and dying in that fight, right now are Muslims?

<deleted> has all this got to do with a nutjob taking his far too easily obtained gun to college and shooting and killing his college mates?

I can answer the last question; nothing.

[lostoday]

I have never denied that ISIS and other Islamic terrorists see themselves as Muslim; that's why I call them Islamic terrorists!

Surely even you can understand that!

One Muslim kid, or adult, born anywhere joining ISIS is one too many; but yes, it does happen. But for every Muslim who joins or even supports ISIS, millions don't.

Why can't you grasp that simple truth?

Why do you dismiss the condemnation of ISIS and other Islamic terrorist coming from Muslims all over the world?

Why do you ignore the fact that the majority of those fighting ISIS, and dying in that fight, right now are Muslims?

<deleted> has all this got to do with a nutjob taking his far too easily obtained gun to college and shooting and killing his college mates?

I can answer the last question; nothing.

What group kills people today because of their religion? America kills countries. The UK kills countries. The KKK and those groups kill people because of race. Fidel kills freedom loving people. What groups kills people today because of their religion?

If 10 black people were shot in the USA who would you suspect? If a country was attacked and overrun with thousands of military troops in the Middle East who would you suspect? If Iran's nuclear reactors were attacked who would you suspect?

If a Buddhist temple and school was burned and the monks and teachers beheaded in the South of Thailand would you suspect Buddhist red shirts or yellow shirts or the Thai military?

[Linky]

I have never denied that ISIS and other Islamic terrorists see themselves as Muslim; that's why I call them Islamic terrorists!

Surely even you can understand that!

One Muslim kid, or adult, born anywhere joining ISIS is one too many; but yes, it does happen. But for every Muslim who joins or even supports ISIS, millions don't.

Why can't you grasp that simple truth?

Why do you dismiss the condemnation of ISIS and other Islamic terrorist coming from Muslims all over the world?

Why do you ignore the fact that the majority of those fighting ISIS, and dying in that fight, right now are Muslims?

<deleted> has all this got to do with a nutjob taking his far too easily obtained gun to college and shooting and killing his college mates?

I can answer the last question; nothing.

What group kills people today because of their religion? America kills countries. The UK kills countries. The KKK and those groups kill people because of race. Fidel kills freedom loving people. What groups kills people today because of their religion?

If 10 black people were shot in the USA who would you suspect? If a country was attacked and overrun with thousands of military troops in the Middle East who would you suspect? If Iran's nuclear reactors were attacked who would you suspect?

If a Buddhist temple and school was burned and the monks and teachers beheaded in the South of Thailand would you suspect Buddhist red shirts or yellow shirts or the Thai military?

Why are you even asking as it is irrelevant. They know who did it. A nutter that hated all organised religions. Why do you keep harping on about something that doesnt exist?

You dnt need to suspect because it is known who did it.

Edited October 6, 2015 by Linky

[DisparateDan]

Some Data

http://www.gunviolencearchive.org/

[notmyself]

More guns will result in less gun crime. What kind of twisted BS is that? If someone wants to sit with a gun in one hand while jacking off to a picture of Charlton Heston then fine but don't try and present it as a rational argument.

Me: Is there any chance people can stop selling guns to people with mental issues?

DON'T TAKE MY GUNS!

Me: No, can we be a little more careful?

DON'T TAKE MY GUNS!

Me: Can we al least...

DON'T TAKE MY GUNS!

The U.S. is considered a basket case in this regard and for a very good reason.

[notmyself]

Yes still muslim. No dont follow islam.

I'm calling BS on this assertion. Have you ever read to Qur'an or hadiths?

[Linky]

Yes still muslim. No dont follow islam.

I'm calling BS on this assertion. Have you ever read to Qur'an or hadiths?

Yes, and I am taught the meanings and interpretations. You?

[DisparateDan]

It is often put down to isolated mental health problems, I believe that a significant majority must have a mental health problem.

[notmyself]

Yes still muslim. No dont follow islam.

I'm calling BS on this assertion. Have you ever read to Qur'an or hadiths?

Yes, and I am taught the meanings and interpretations. You?

The same myself though not sure I would use the word taught. I have learned of innumerable meanings and interpretations from sources whose motivations are unclear so said bugger it, I'll go find out myself. What I found by reading the texts was a genocide and hate filled piece of fictional prose. The whole idea of 'religion of peace' was and is, unsubstantiated. It is often said that groups such as AQ, Taliban and IS do not represent Islam but it has never ever been shown to be true. I think they are all ****¹ but that is beside the point and subjective.

I could, would and should but the world news section is not the place to do it. It is also way off topic. OTB would be a far batter place to discuss this.

[1] Insert word that supposedly has magical properties.