ED visa about to require 5 days/week, 2 hours/day.

[someonelovesyou]

My school will be informing students shortly that there is a new policy affecting visa's where students will now be required to attend 5 days/week, 2 hours/day. The policy change announcement comes from the Chiang Mai Educational Service Area and Chiang Mai Immigration Bureau, but I assume this will roll out across other areas too.

Note that this is not the increase from 1 year ago. It already increased 1 year ago from 4 hours/week to 8 hours/week in some schools, with some schools able to do 6 hours/week. (not sure why!)

They haven't officially announced it yet, I just know about it because I'm helping them with the translation of the announcement to English.

[someonelovesyou]

There's a few other changes too.

1. Must provide property rental contract for 3 month extensions. (not sure what's going to happen to foreigners living here without a property rented in their name)

2. Fill out a personal details form for 3 month extension. It asks basic details like address, phone. And also asks your estimated monthly spend in Thailand, contact details in Thailand for someone they can contact to verify your identity, and contact details of a person that financially supports you, if applicable. Also a bunch more personal questions but they said I didn't have to fill that out. I think its only "high risk" countries that do.

These are obviously in direct response to the Bangkok bombing.

[OMGImInPattaya]

I guess all the eager Thai language students will become proficient in half the time, and can return to their homelands that much sooner. Lucky them.

Edited October 28, 2015 by OMGImInPattaya

[SoiBiker]

So they're expecting people to actually spend their time getting educated in order to get an ed visa?

Fair enough.

[someonelovesyou]

I guess all the eager Thai language students will become proficient in half the time, and can return to their homelands that much sooner. Lucky them.

Do I detect a hint of bitterness?

The eager students do most of their study hours outside of class anyway. Also, the advanced learners have to do 1-on-1 because there are no group courses offered at advanced level. For my case, it changes my school fees from 108,000/year to 168,000/year (plus 10,700/year in Visa fees, plus expenses associated with the leaving country once per year).

The result is that this makes a tourist visa a slightly more appealing option as a way to learn Thai here. On a tourist visa, I have the option to get a tutor directly without going through a school. I choose my number of class hours. I can get ones that come to my house, and the rates are cheaper than at schools that obviously need to charge an overhead.

Edited October 29, 2015 by someonelovesyou

[plaid]

Wot a scandal indeed, actually making them go to school on an education visa...who wud have thought of that...

[ScottMallon]

I guess all the eager Thai language students will become proficient in half the time, and can return to their homelands that much sooner. Lucky them.

Do I detect a hint of bitterness?

The eager students do most of their study hours outside of class anyway. Also, the advanced learners have to do 1-on-1 because there are no group courses offered at advanced level. For my case, it changes my school fees from 108,000/year to 168,000/year (plus 10,700/year in Visa fees, plus expenses associated with the leaving country once per year).

The result is that this makes a tourist visa a slightly more appealing option as a way to learn Thai here. On a tourist visa, I have the option to get a tutor directly without going through a school. I choose my number of class hours. I can get ones that come to my house, and the rates are cheaper than at schools that obviously need to charge an overhead.

Right, so basically you're going to pay all this money and risk having immigration tell you to get a proper visa - that is, not a tourist visa. Tourists come to the country for a short period of time, look around, then leave. Thais are lenient, less so these days, but I wouldn't want to shell out almost $5,000 only to have an immigration official tell me I have 30 days to get a "proper visa."

[Vandadavid]

Been in force long time and absolutely stupid as they are stupid

How can a student study and have all that work poured into them

Idiots

[louse1953]

Been in force long time and absolutely stupid as they are stupid

How can a student study and have all that work poured into them

Idiots

Didn't work for you,did it!

[someonelovesyou]

Been in force long time and absolutely stupid as they are stupid

How can a student study and have all that work poured into them

Idiots

This increase is new. Actually, they told schools it was increasing to 5 days/week a year ago, but then allowed them to only increase it to 4 day/week (officially) and 3 day/week (some schools).

Now, it appears that those were just exemptions for a "transition year", and they plan to enforce the original 5 day/week plan.

Edited October 29, 2015 by someonelovesyou

[brewsterbudgen]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

[jacksam]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

Where would you obtain an ed visa for cooking.

[brewsterbudgen]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

Where would you obtain an ed visa for cooking.

From a cooking school.

[SoiBiker]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

Why? If your main reason for staying in the country is to be in education, it seems perfectly reasonable to expect you to attend a school every day.

If you're just going to a couple of classes a week, you're not a student, you're a tourist with a hobby.

[raybal5]

There's a few other changes too.

1. Must provide property rental contract for 3 month extensions. (not sure what's going to happen to foreigners living here without a property rented in their name)

2. Fill out a personal details form for 3 month extension. It asks basic details like address, phone. And also asks your estimated monthly spend in Thailand, contact details in Thailand for someone they can contact to verify your identity, and contact details of a person that financially supports you, if applicable. Also a bunch more personal questions but they said I didn't have to fill that out. I think its only "high risk" countries that do.

These are obviously in direct response to the Bangkok bombing.

Point 1 is stupid. When I was in Thailand for 11 months, I lived with my partner and the rental agreement was only in his name even though I usually paid the rent.

[brewsterbudgen]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

Why? If your main reason for staying in the country is to be in education, it seems perfectly reasonable to expect you to attend a school every day.

If you're just going to a couple of classes a week, you're not a student, you're a tourist with a hobby.

Most university degree courses have fewer classes per week!

[SoiBiker]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

Why? If your main reason for staying in the country is to be in education, it seems perfectly reasonable to expect you to attend a school every day.

If you're just going to a couple of classes a week, you're not a student, you're a tourist with a hobby.

Most university degree courses have fewer classes per week!

Less than 10 hours a week?

Degrees must have got easier since my day.

[brewsterbudgen]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

Why? If your main reason for staying in the country is to be in education, it seems perfectly reasonable to expect you to attend a school every day.

If you're just going to a couple of classes a week, you're not a student, you're a tourist with a hobby.

Most university degree courses have fewer classes per week!

Less than 10 hours a week?

Degrees must have got easier since my day.

I did a Sociology degree at Bath University back in the 80s and we had less than 10 hours of lectures a week! Maybe that's why I'm now a lowly teacher in Thailand!

[HikeFromLA]

OP,

thanks for the info... terrible news, there goes the ED as a viable option.

BUT...

Uni-Thai in ChiangMai clearly touts 4 hours a week to get an ED visa.

http://www.uni-thai.com/

Your thoughts on this?

[SoiBiker]

OP,

thanks for the info... terrible news, there goes the ED as a viable option.

Unless you actually want to use it for the purpose it is intended for, of course.

[someonelovesyou]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

Why? If your main reason for staying in the country is to be in education, it seems perfectly reasonable to expect you to attend a school every day.

If you're just going to a couple of classes a week, you're not a student, you're a tourist with a hobby.

While I agree in principal, this is about the increase from 4 days/week to 5 days/week. University students that have lectures 4 days/week aren't necessarily doing it as a hobby compared to students who have lectures 5 days/week.

The point is, serious students that come here have to decide whether the ED Visa (which restricts their learning options, and generally forces higher learning fees) is better than a tourist Visa (where they can choose whatever learning schedule they want - i.e. attend a group course 2 hours week + private tutor coming to your house + write your own essays etc).

If they want students to actually use the ED Visa, they have to make it a better option than the tourist Visa.

[jacksam]

OP,

thanks for the info... terrible news, there goes the ED as a viable option.

BUT...

Uni-Thai in ChiangMai clearly touts 4 hours a week to get an ED visa.

http://www.uni-thai.com/

Your thoughts on this?

Clearly many people are using an ed visa as a means to stay longer in Thailand. There is no limit to current tourist visas. Soon in November, there will be the new 6 month METV. Most likely available from nearby consulates. Why do the charade of ed visa.

Better to hop on board and enjoy travel

[someonelovesyou]

OP,

thanks for the info... terrible news, there goes the ED as a viable option.

BUT...

Uni-Thai in ChiangMai clearly touts 4 hours a week to get an ED visa.

http://www.uni-thai.com/

Your thoughts on this?

I would guess they haven't updated their website in a year. The increase from 2 days/week only come into force in Chiang Mai late last year. Try calling the number.

Also, just some gossip, apparently they are denying a lot more student visa applications now from "higher risk" countries. This shouldn't affect farangs (Caucasians).

[someonelovesyou]

OP,

thanks for the info... terrible news, there goes the ED as a viable option.

BUT...

Uni-Thai in ChiangMai clearly touts 4 hours a week to get an ED visa.

http://www.uni-thai.com/

Your thoughts on this?

Clearly many people are using an ed visa as a means to stay longer in Thailand. There is no limit to current tourist visas. Soon in November, there will be the new 6 month METV. Most likely available from nearby consulates. Why do the charade of ed visa.

Better to hop on board and enjoy travel

I'm a serious Thai learner (I studied for 4 years before coming to study in Thailand) and a 6-month METV with the flexibility to create my own learning schedule is actually looking a lot better than the restrictive ED Visa option. It doesn't even have to be a charade to be a better option.

[JackThompson]

OP,

thanks for the info... terrible news, there goes the ED as a viable option. ...

Clearly many people are using an ed visa as a means to stay longer in Thailand. There is no limit to current tourist visas. Soon in November, there will be the new 6 month METV. Most likely available from nearby consulates. Why do the charade of ed visa.

Better to hop on board and enjoy travel

No confirmation on the METV "available at nearby consulates" for non-legal-residents of those nations - nor what the restrictions might be if they do. But we can cross our fingers and hope

As to those replying with statments along the line of, "If you really wanted to learn Thai..." - I have a solution. Just lock all students in a big warehouse with bunk-beds and desks. Classes are daily, with the first beginning at 5AM sharp. No need to go anywhere else in Thailand, see temples and other sites, because if you "really wanted to learn Thai," you would be gracious and happy to be locked into a rigourous schedule that prevents such activities.

Am I on the right track with those who seem to absolutely hate seeing young people enjoying their lives here? Maybe a good crack on the knuckles with a rod, if you mispronounce a Thai word in class - would that be enough? It is like some bizarre, recurring fraternity-hazing ritual, where some reflect on what they had to endure, given 20th century school and life-options, and think all future generations should suffer the same, "... because I had to do it."

Forcing people to sit at desks for more days/wk has not been shown to increase education-results (hence the increase in "distance-learning"). In the case of Thailand, this also limits ones ability to see the country, which is a key reason people would want to study Thai here, rather than online, in the first place.

I considered the ED visa awhile back, but I prefer to study mostly on my own, with class-attendence for lectures - like at normal universities - which occur 2 or 3 days per week. In most universities, a student does not even need to show up for those, and can watch the lectures on-line. Tests determine pass/fail, and would, in this case, determine eligibility for continuing the program and visa. Fail two monthly exams in a row (with immigration-officers present to ensure no cheating) and you have 7 days to leave the country - fair enough?

[someonelovesyou]

I guess all the eager Thai language students will become proficient in half the time, and can return to their homelands that much sooner. Lucky them.

Do I detect a hint of bitterness?

The eager students do most of their study hours outside of class anyway. Also, the advanced learners have to do 1-on-1 because there are no group courses offered at advanced level. For my case, it changes my school fees from 108,000/year to 168,000/year (plus 10,700/year in Visa fees, plus expenses associated with the leaving country once per year).

The result is that this makes a tourist visa a slightly more appealing option as a way to learn Thai here. On a tourist visa, I have the option to get a tutor directly without going through a school. I choose my number of class hours. I can get ones that come to my house, and the rates are cheaper than at schools that obviously need to charge an overhead.

Right, so basically you're going to pay all this money and risk having immigration tell you to get a proper visa - that is, not a tourist visa. Tourists come to the country for a short period of time, look around, then leave. Thais are lenient, less so these days, but I wouldn't want to shell out almost $5,000 only to have an immigration official tell me I have 30 days to get a "proper visa."

A tourist visa is a "proper visa". I'm planning to study here for 1 more year before heading back. So the option is another 1-year ED, or two 6 month METV.

If they didn't want people living in Thailand for more than 10 months of the year on a tourist Visa, do you think that would be hard to implement? The tourist visa caters for more than just tourists, that's the primary group it caters for.

[oncearugge]

"One Year" Ed visas are not issued anywhere in the region.

All that can be obtained, with correct paperwork supplied by a school, is a 90 day single entry visa.

The 90 day visa can be extended at immigration, again with school supplied paperwork for 90 days. After 12 months a new visa will be needed.

Only schools approved by the Min. Ed. can supply the necessary documentation.

[OMGImInPattaya]

There's a few other changes too.

1. Must provide property rental contract for 3 month extensions. (not sure what's going to happen to foreigners living here without a property rented in their name)

2. Fill out a personal details form for 3 month extension. It asks basic details like address, phone. And also asks your estimated monthly spend in Thailand, contact details in Thailand for someone they can contact to verify your identity, and contact details of a person that financially supports you, if applicable. Also a bunch more personal questions but they said I didn't have to fill that out. I think its only "high risk" countries that do.

These are obviously in direct response to the Bangkok bombing.

Point 1 is stupid. When I was in Thailand for 11 months, I lived with my partner and the rental agreement was only in his name even though I usually paid the rent.

Foreigners here on Ed visas are here to learn something and this should be their main priority...not to shack up with the locals. Seems perfectly reasonable that legit foreign students would have some sort of housing accommodation in their own name.

[someonelovesyou]

"One Year" Ed visas are not issued anywhere in the region.

All that can be obtained, with correct paperwork supplied by a school, is a 90 day single entry visa.

The 90 day visa can be extended at immigration, again with school supplied paperwork for 90 days. After 12 months a new visa will be needed.

Only schools approved by the Min. Ed. can supply the necessary documentation.

Right, that's what I meant. 90-day ED Visa's that can be extended for up to 1-year.

Thanks for clarifying.

[OMGImInPattaya]

Seems excessive if your Ed visa is to study Muay Thai or cooking.

Why? If your main reason for staying in the country is to be in education, it seems perfectly reasonable to expect you to attend a school every day.

If you're just going to a couple of classes a week, you're not a student, you're a tourist with a hobby.

While I agree in principal, this is about the increase from 4 days/week to 5 days/week. University students that have lectures 4 days/week aren't necessarily doing it as a hobby compared to students who have lectures 5 days/week.

The point is, serious students that come here have to decide whether the ED Visa (which restricts their learning options, and generally forces higher learning fees) is better than a tourist Visa (where they can choose whatever learning schedule they want - i.e. attend a group course 2 hours week + private tutor coming to your house + write your own essays etc).

If they want students to actually use the ED Visa, they have to make it a better option than the tourist Visa.

Students studying at recognized Thai universities have no problem getting or renewing their Ed. visas. These new rules apply to students at Thai language visa mill schools.