buying house in Thailand paying the owner in the UK

[Mr Wonderful]

If the land and house are in company name then the land department doesn't get involved at all. Your transaction happens at the Department of Business and you are paying to transfer company shares. Make sure you have audited financial statements until the latest financial year end.

[Mr Wonderful]

Get legal advice, from UK ad Thai lawyers on YOUR payroll. End of.

It is foolish to believe that just because you pay a lawyer's he is on your side! It doesn't work that way. I am happy to have the other side pay a lawyer I know watches out for me. And I watch over him.

[BlindMagician]

Get legal advice, from UK ad Thai lawyers on YOUR payroll. End of.

It is foolish to believe that just because you pay a lawyer's he is on your side! It doesn't work that way. I am happy to have the other side pay a lawyer I know watches out for me. And I watch over him.

Really? That's a novel strategy. So you think the other side's lawyer will have your interests higher up on their agenda than their own side who pays them? Could be possible....who can truely tell in this wired and confusing world.

[Mr Wonderful]

Get legal advice, from UK ad Thai lawyers on YOUR payroll. End of.

It is foolish to believe that just because you pay a lawyer's he is on your side! It doesn't work that way. I am happy to have the other side pay a lawyer I know watches out for me. And I watch over him.

Really? That's a novel strategy. So you think the other side's lawyer will have your interests higher up on their agenda than their own side who pays them? Could be possible....who can truely tell in this wired and confusing world.

Not really what I said or meant. I tend to recommend the lawyer doing the transaction. But I also tend not to want to pay for the legal fees so I let him work for the other side.

[bazza40]

I have a bridge in London I can sell you!

Beat me to it - I wanted to sell him the bridge over Sydney Harbor.

[sappersrest]

Buying a property here as a foreigner is a big decision if the price is right you like the property. do the deal over here after all 15 00 pounds for both of you to fly over here in the scheme of things is not a lot of money.

uk law means nothing over here

[blackcab]

If the land and house are in company name then the land department doesn't get involved at all. Your transaction happens at the Department of Business and you are paying to transfer company shares. Make sure you have audited financial statements until the latest financial year end.

The proposed owner is Thai. Most Thai people have no interest in owning property in a company name and having to pay fees each month/year to maintain the company.

[RBOP]

Thank you all for advise. Perhaps I did not give enough background information hense so much doom and gloom in so many replies (but I thank you for them anyway).

I live in Thailand so yes I would be present at the transaction here. Yes I would have a solicitor here to represent me and one in the UK if necessary. All taxes and fees will be checked and paid. My same sex marriage to a Thai person is not recognised in Thailand so that does not matter one way or the other. I am happy for the land and house to be in his name. I don't need to be reminded of the risks with that. It's not what this thread is about. Lets just say at the price I would be paying for this property I can afford to walk away. And if I can't ever take the money back to the UK I can still afford my noodle soup every night.

The house seller is not asking for this by the way. It was purely my idea as a way to avoid transfer fees and seems logical since my money is in the UK where the seller will need it eventually. So it was the practical issues I was most interested in like dealing with the Land Registry office

Thank you all again for your time

You can not avoid transfer fees and taxes in Thailand when buying or selling property. Even you if buy the house for 1 dollar you pay transfer fees and tax based on the assessed value.

[NickJ]

Every seller that I have ever known is quick to fly to Thailand. Your coming here anyways.

There are just so many ways to be conned this way.

[David Barker]

Seriously though, the land department requires that you and your nominees attend at the time of transfer along with a cashiers cheque in Thai baht along with proof of transferring the money into Thailand. You can't pay him in UK pounds.

Just sold one under very similar circumstances no questions at all at land office just pay the fee 90% of payment made in UK as a normal bank transfers as maximum transfer is 50k without ringing bells balance paid into Bangkok bank account. But as someone posted earlier get a lawyer to make sure everything is in order just because it's Brit to Brit doesn't mean there is no scam.

[khunPer]

The normal procedure at Land Office is, that seller pays tax and buyer pays transfer fee – in percentage quite small – based either on the Land Office registered value, which is normally (much) lower than the trading price, or, in some Land Offices, the actual buying price. In case of owner is married to an alien (farang), some Land Offices may claim a certificate that the Thai owner buys for own funds – i.e. the foreigner has no claims later.

Normally a deposit has been paid by buyer upon signing Agreement for the deal, and the balance paid when (Chanote) deed change name at the Land Office.

Real estate agents and projects managers have told me, that it is sometime used that part of the payment – which can be as much as the difference from the Land Office value to the actual trading price – is transferred offshore; I cannot say if it’s legal or not, but presumable seller will not pay personal income tax (or company tax) of more than the payment settled within Thailand.

If you sell property, you cannot transfer amounts over a certain value out of Thailand without a declaration – I believe it used to be equivalent of 20,000 USD, but some posters say it’s now up to 50,000 USD. If you have declared the money-transfer when you buy a house, you can legally transfer same amount out – the initial transfer, which can be a single or multiple, need to meet the 20,000/50,000 USD equivalent value; ask your Thai bank to make the form and have it duly registered, after a weeks time you will receive (pick up) a stamped copy. Seller is income taxable of the capital gain, so any (major) amount over the initial declared shall be proven been income taxed.

I can imagine, that if you buy with offshore payment, you can in “worst case” be income taxed for the part of the initial buying price higher than the Land Office value or whatever proven paid within Thailand. That means, you may need to sell again with partly offshore payment. To my knowledge – what I have been told from real estate agents and property managers – Thais also use the method; however it may be a question of price range, where the offshore method is merely used for expensive luxury houses (knowing it’s relative, as what some people think is small money, may be a fortune for others).

If the land has a house, land and house can be separated – a foreigner can own a house, but not the land, and a house already build can be registered in a foreigner’s name – for eligibility, exactly procedure and documentation, you’ll need to consult a lawyer.

My own experiences only covers property deals with national payments, but I have experienced both Land Office with a (much) lower evaluation than trading price (both Nor Sor 3 and Chanote), and Land Office demanding full documentation of trading price agreed, as base for taxation and transfer fee, before transferring the deed (Chanote).

Wish you good luck...

[johnnytuc]

Seriously though, the land department requires that you and your nominees attend at the time of transfer along with a cashiers cheque in Thai baht along with proof of transferring the money into Thailand. You can't pay him in UK pounds.

[johnnytuc]

Seriously though, the land department requires that you and your nominees attend at the time of transfer along with a cashiers cheque in Thai baht along with proof of transferring the money into Thailand. You can't pay him in UK pounds.

[GOLDBUGGY]

I think you can see that your method is more complicated which could result in some unforeseen problems for you down the road. You can buy a property pretty well anyway you want to so paying the Owner in the UK using UK Funds is not the problem. The problems arises from you not being able to get a FET (Foreign Exchange Transfer) Certificate from the bank, as you did not transfer any money from overseas to the bank.

Again not having a FET is not a problem if you never sell this property, or decide to keep this money in Thailand. But questioning if you can send these funds back to the UK may be a problem for you later. Although I am not a Lawyer dealing in these matters, I did do a lot of my own research before I bought my property here. So contrary to what you read, it may not be as easy as one thinks.

It is possible to transfer up to $20,000 out of Thailand, but not just going online and doing that. For a Thai to do this for example he needs a good reason. For example he is studying abroad and needs these funds to support himself. Which then may require proof. As for you doing a transfer, the obvious question comes up that if you were not working legally in Thailand, and you did not transfer any money into Thailand or buy property this way, then where did you get these funds to transfer back home? A normal question when concerning Money Laundering.

Of course you could always sell your property the way you bought it. Which is to have someone else transfer the money into your UK Account, but you may not find many people who want to do this. I know I wouldn't. For the same reasons you shouldn't. As pointed out it would not be easy for a Thai to do this, so you will lose a lot of potential buyers here in a Buyers Market.

I just did it the Old Fashioned Way in Thailand. I made a deposit on the land with a signed contract. I went to the bank and wrote a check, from which I got a FET Certificate. When the money arrived I went to the bank and withdrew what I needed then headed to the Land Office with the Seller with cash in hand. Buyer and Seller sat together at the Land Office and made there declaration to sell and buy this land and at what price. Inspected the Land Certificate for Liens. Seller (in my case) agreed to pay all property taxes. Signed all the necessary documents. Handed the Seller the money, and walked out with the Land Title Certificate. No lawyer and no problems.

So if you don't want any possible future problems, and you have a choice here, I suggest you do it the Old Fashioned Way to. Taxes are higher on land owned by a business I believe. If a Thai owns personal land for a certain period of time he avoids Capital Gains Taxes, which a business does not. With the Buyers Market it just makes good sense to do it the easy and legal way. If the owner is selling this property in Thailand he will do that in Thai Baht. If he uses the Official Thai Baht Bank Exchange Rate to Convert back to UK Pounds, you may not be saving on the Exchange Rate and as you may think. Cost me about 200 Baht to cash a check here. What you may also save on a discount you will lose in Capital Gains Taxes anyway.

Since you are not married, nor expect to be in the future, I would also suggest you make out a 30 Year Lease with your Partner, or Usufruct. You need a lawyer before hand to do this for you, but it is cheap to do and gives you some insurance if things go South for you later. Bring that along when you do the property transfer at the Land Office, as they will register this for you. Which will be attached to the Land Certificate later and you can pick up in about 3 weeks.

Again I am not an expert, but you did ask for an opinion. I did buy property in Thailand. Or my Thai Wife did at least.

[GOLDBUGGY]

I bought a house in Mae Rim two years ago at The Spa resort. The owner was a Brit and I sent her UK funds from my bank in Canada. The property manager (Thai)had power of attorney and the transfer of the house at the land office went without a hitch. I leased the land the house was on for 30 years (renewable twice).

I sold it this past August. The buyer paid me in my Canadian bank with Canadian dollars from a UK bank. Not a problem. I gave the same property manager power of attorney to transfer the house title to the buyer. No problem.

I don't know what all the talk it can't be done is all about. Just go ahead. Do it.

I am sorry but I am having a difficult time following your thread.

How do you buy a house (if you are a Foreigner) and also lease this land and house to yourself for 30 years as you said. I can't see how you did both. So did you buy this property or lease it? If you leased it, how then did you sell this property again you do not own? Or did you sell the Lease?

Sorry but it just doesn't make sense to me

[xylophone]

When you buy a house in Thailand, you go to the land office with the seller and pay cash (or bank draft).

Chances of the sale being recorded without you there, almost nil!

You can't own a house (that is already built)in Thailand, and you can never own the land it sits on.

You gf can, but the chances of you ever taking the money out of the country again are almost NIL.

So no need to worry.

Why can't I own a house that is already built?

Once land and house are registered as one unit at the lad office, they won't split ownership.

But if bought with the help of a Thai partner they can draw up a contract whereby you lease the house from them. In effect they own the land and you "own" (through a lease) the house.

[scubachild]

I just did it the Old Fashioned Way in Thailand. I made a deposit on the land with a signed contract. I went to the bank and wrote a check, from which I got a FET Certificate. When the money arrived I went to the bank and withdrew what I needed then headed to the Land Office with the Seller with cash in hand. Buyer and Seller sat together at the Land Office and made there declaration to sell and buy this land and at what price. Inspected the Land Certificate for Liens. Seller (in my case) agreed to pay all property taxes. Signed all the necessary documents. Handed the Seller the money, and walked out with the Land Title Certificate. No lawyer and no problems.

I don't follow you on this part. For the deposit on the land you wrote a check at your Thai bank and for this you got the FET? And this is BEFORE you have transferred the money from overseas...?

[meatboy]

co.owned eh.maybe gen.prayut's team are looking into these illegal practices. OH YES THEY ARE.

if your not worried about the money WHY GO DOWN THIS ROUTE.

or is it toooooooooooo good to be true. BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP THE ALARM'S GONE OFFFFFFFFFFFFFF.

[namarupa]

I bought a house in Mae Rim two years ago at The Spa resort. The owner was a Brit and I sent her UK funds from my bank in Canada. The property manager (Thai)had power of attorney and the transfer of the house at the land office went without a hitch. I leased the land the house was on for 30 years (renewable twice).

I sold it this past August. The buyer paid me in my Canadian bank with Canadian dollars from a UK bank. Not a problem. I gave the same property manager power of attorney to transfer the house title to the buyer. No problem.

I don't know what all the talk it can't be done is all about. Just go ahead. Do it.

I am sorry but I am having a difficult time following your thread.

How do you buy a house (if you are a Foreigner) and also lease this land and house to yourself for 30 years as you said. I can't see how you did both. So did you buy this property or lease it? If you leased it, how then did you sell this property again you do not own? Or did you sell the Lease?

Sorry but it just doesn't make sense to me

I'll answer the questions as best as I can:

1. I bought the house from a Brit national who owned the house. I paid from my Canadian bank to her UK bank directly.

2. I leased the land that the house was on from the Thai national who owned the land. The lease was for 30 years, renewable twice. The lease fee was part of the house sale.

3. I sold the house to a Chinese national with a UK bank account. He paid me in Canadian dollars from the UK to my bank in Canada.

4. He leased the land from the Thai national who owns the land.

Note: I owned the house, but not the land. The land was leased from a Thai national.

Since I did not want to go to the land office to transfer the house title, I gave power of attorney to the Thai property manager who did it for me. No money went through the property manager's hands, other than appropriate land office fees and taxes. The Chinese owner paid for the house sales tax and land transfer fees.

Clear?

Edited October 31, 2015 by namarupa

[KittenKong]

They are not Thai - they are British.

If the vendors are British then they certainly dont own the land and probably dont own the house either.

They may own a minority share in a company that owns the land and house.

You need to do a lot more investigation into what they own and what is being sold as this entire thing sounds like a massive potential scam to me.

When it comes to money/property in Thailand you should remember House M.D.'s favourite saying: "everybody lies".

[Mr Wonderful]

They are not Thai - they are British.

If the vendors are British then they certainly dont own the land and probably dont own the house either.

They may own a minority share in a company that owns the land and house.

You need to do a lot more investigation into what they own and what is being sold as this entire thing sounds like a massive potential scam to me.

When it comes to money/property in Thailand you should remember House M.D.'s favourite saying: "everybody lies".

When I sold a house to a European family I told them it's a bad idea to take over the company with it. My wife would have kept the land in the company name and leased it and they would have purchased the house on the land. Alas, they thought I was scamming them and "want to own not lease". Now they own 49 percent of the company and a real estate scam artist owns he rest. No papers were pre signed for the share transfer later, so the rude awakening will be when they want to sell a house they think they "own".

[GOLDBUGGY]

I just did it the Old Fashioned Way in Thailand. I made a deposit on the land with a signed contract. I went to the bank and wrote a check, from which I got a FET Certificate. When the money arrived I went to the bank and withdrew what I needed then headed to the Land Office with the Seller with cash in hand. Buyer and Seller sat together at the Land Office and made there declaration to sell and buy this land and at what price. Inspected the Land Certificate for Liens. Seller (in my case) agreed to pay all property taxes. Signed all the necessary documents. Handed the Seller the money, and walked out with the Land Title Certificate. No lawyer and no problems.

I don't follow you on this part. For the deposit on the land you wrote a check at your Thai bank and for this you got the FET? And this is BEFORE you have transferred the money from overseas...?

No. I made a small deposit with cash on the land to the owner so he would keep this property for me until my funds arrived at the bank.

I then wrote a check at the bank for the full amount, including my initial deposit to the owner, and which I had it directed to my bank account. I can't recall how long it took but I am sure it was less than 6 weeks. I think 3 weeks sounds about right.

When the money arrived I got this bank to type up a FET Certificate, which is just a letter from the bank which states the funds came from outside of the country.

I then proceeded to complete the sale with the owner at land office.

I should note that I did not need this FET to complete the sale as the property is in my Thai Wife's name. So I did not need it on this day. I got this FET for the future if I should want to send this money back out. Which may never happen.

.

[GOLDBUGGY]

I bought a house in Mae Rim two years ago at The Spa resort. The owner was a Brit and I sent her UK funds from my bank in Canada. The property manager (Thai)had power of attorney and the transfer of the house at the land office went without a hitch. I leased the land the house was on for 30 years (renewable twice).

I sold it this past August. The buyer paid me in my Canadian bank with Canadian dollars from a UK bank. Not a problem. I gave the same property manager power of attorney to transfer the house title to the buyer. No problem.

I don't know what all the talk it can't be done is all about. Just go ahead. Do it.

I am sorry but I am having a difficult time following your thread.

How do you buy a house (if you are a Foreigner) and also lease this land and house to yourself for 30 years as you said. I can't see how you did both. So did you buy this property or lease it? If you leased it, how then did you sell this property again you do not own? Or did you sell the Lease?

Sorry but it just doesn't make sense to me

I'll answer the questions as best as I can:

1. I bought the house from a Brit national who owned the house. I paid from my Canadian bank to her UK bank directly.

2. I leased the land that the house was on from the Thai national who owned the land. The lease was for 30 years, renewable twice. The lease fee was part of the house sale.

3. I sold the house to a Chinese national with a UK bank account. He paid me in Canadian dollars from the UK to my bank in Canada.

4. He leased the land from the Thai national who owns the land.

Note: I owned the house, but not the land. The land was leased from a Thai national.

Since I did not want to go to the land office to transfer the house title, I gave power of attorney to the Thai property manager who did it for me. No money went through the property manager's hands, other than appropriate land office fees and taxes. The Chinese owner paid for the house sales tax and land transfer fees.

Clear?

Yes! I guess I am surprised you were able to sell the house on leased land so easily. I would have thought this would be a difficult sell. I appears I was wrong about this.

I suppose it is one way in which a person can own the house and have rights to the property. I guess I would just feel uncomfortable dealing with a stranger in leasing this land. Maybe because it is a different way of doing things that throws me off to this.

[GOLDBUGGY]

I bought a house in Mae Rim two years ago at The Spa resort. The owner was a Brit and I sent her UK funds from my bank in Canada. The property manager (Thai)had power of attorney and the transfer of the house at the land office went without a hitch. I leased the land the house was on for 30 years (renewable twice).

I sold it this past August. The buyer paid me in my Canadian bank with Canadian dollars from a UK bank. Not a problem. I gave the same property manager power of attorney to transfer the house title to the buyer. No problem.

I don't know what all the talk it can't be done is all about. Just go ahead. Do it.

I am sorry but I am having a difficult time following your thread.

How do you buy a house (if you are a Foreigner) and also lease this land and house to yourself for 30 years as you said. I can't see how you did both. So did you buy this property or lease it? If you leased it, how then did you sell this property again you do not own? Or did you sell the Lease?

Sorry but it just doesn't make sense to me

I'll answer the questions as best as I can:

1. I bought the house from a Brit national who owned the house. I paid from my Canadian bank to her UK bank directly.

2. I leased the land that the house was on from the Thai national who owned the land. The lease was for 30 years, renewable twice. The lease fee was part of the house sale.

3. I sold the house to a Chinese national with a UK bank account. He paid me in Canadian dollars from the UK to my bank in Canada.

4. He leased the land from the Thai national who owns the land.

Note: I owned the house, but not the land. The land was leased from a Thai national.

Since I did not want to go to the land office to transfer the house title, I gave power of attorney to the Thai property manager who did it for me. No money went through the property manager's hands, other than appropriate land office fees and taxes. The Chinese owner paid for the house sales tax and land transfer fees.

Clear?

I understand as I said but I am still not sure why someone would do this. I understand if you are single and you want to live in your own house, as this is a way in which you can do this, but why not just rent then? What happens if things change for you in the future?

Let's say you find a partner you want to be with for life (you hope). They move in with you and all is fine. Maybe even have a couple of kids together. Then you suddenly die? What happens to your partner? You can Will your house to your partner as you own that, but you can't do that with Lease.

This Lease dies when you do. Or at least this is what I thought. You can sub-lease to someone else, but the sub-lease would end when your life does to. The owner of the land is not required to give your Partner another 30 year lease and if he doesn't what do you do with this house then? I am trying to see the benefit to doing this but I just can't.

I also can't understand why someone would sub-lease from you. Or the owner would write another 30 year least to someone else for free. Is he charging you a monthly or yearly rental fee to lease from him? Did you get this house at a steal and less then renting, including any maintenance fees and lease rental fees?

If he is charging you rent on your lease I think I would just rent the whole place. Then, when you find a partner, buy a house with her/him and then perhaps put on another lease. At least then this house and property would go to her.or him, or your kids, after you die. I just can't see any benefit of doing it this other way.

[namarupa]

I bought a house in Mae Rim two years ago at The Spa resort. The owner was a Brit and I sent her UK funds from my bank in Canada. The property manager (Thai)had power of attorney and the transfer of the house at the land office went without a hitch. I leased the land the house was on for 30 years (renewable twice).

I sold it this past August. The buyer paid me in my Canadian bank with Canadian dollars from a UK bank. Not a problem. I gave the same property manager power of attorney to transfer the house title to the buyer. No problem.

I don't know what all the talk it can't be done is all about. Just go ahead. Do it.

I am sorry but I am having a difficult time following your thread.

How do you buy a house (if you are a Foreigner) and also lease this land and house to yourself for 30 years as you said. I can't see how you did both. So did you buy this property or lease it? If you leased it, how then did you sell this property again you do not own? Or did you sell the Lease?

Sorry but it just doesn't make sense to me

I'll answer the questions as best as I can:

1. I bought the house from a Brit national who owned the house. I paid from my Canadian bank to her UK bank directly.

2. I leased the land that the house was on from the Thai national who owned the land. The lease was for 30 years, renewable twice. The lease fee was part of the house sale.

3. I sold the house to a Chinese national with a UK bank account. He paid me in Canadian dollars from the UK to my bank in Canada.

4. He leased the land from the Thai national who owns the land.

Note: I owned the house, but not the land. The land was leased from a Thai national.

Since I did not want to go to the land office to transfer the house title, I gave power of attorney to the Thai property manager who did it for me. No money went through the property manager's hands, other than appropriate land office fees and taxes. The Chinese owner paid for the house sales tax and land transfer fees.

Clear?

I understand as I said but I am still not sure why someone would do this. I understand if you are single and you want to live in your own house, as this is a way in which you can do this, but why not just rent then? What happens if things change for you in the future?

Let's say you find a partner you want to be with for life (you hope). They move in with you and all is fine. Maybe even have a couple of kids together. Then you suddenly die? What happens to your partner? You can Will your house to your partner as you own that, but you can't do that with Lease.

This Lease dies when you do. Or at least this is what I thought. You can sub-lease to someone else, but the sub-lease would end when your life does to. The owner of the land is not required to give your Partner another 30 year lease and if he doesn't what do you do with this house then? I am trying to see the benefit to doing this but I just can't.

I also can't understand why someone would sub-lease from you. Or the owner would write another 30 year least to someone else for free. Is he charging you a monthly or yearly rental fee to lease from him? Did you get this house at a steal and less then renting, including any maintenance fees and lease rental fees?

If he is charging you rent on your lease I think I would just rent the whole place. Then, when you find a partner, buy a house with her/him and then perhaps put on another lease. At least then this house and property would go to her.or him, or your kids, after you die. I just can't see any benefit of doing it this other way.

------

You , as well as most that post here, are overthinking the issue. Not only that, you assume values (eg., marriage and kids) that are not explicitly mentioned. Please refrain from assuming and then it is quite clear what has transpired.

To my delight, I made 50% profit on the house sale in two years.

For me, that is a plus. Do you really wish to say anything to the contrary?