Different personal goals are ALL OK on this weight control health forum

[Jingthing]

I started this thread to welcome ALL Thaivisa members who have weight control issues to this health forum.

Health is a broad concept. It includes issues of serious diseases that are associated with obesity and it also includes less critical matters such as the body aesthetics and social issues of not having an "ideal" body size. (To put it bluntly, for most people in modern societies being overweight is not attractive.)

This forum is mostly for people who are obese, overweight, or no longer either but concerned about regaining the weight.

Nurses, doctors, and scientists with expertise in this area are of course MORE THAN WELCOME!

It's also about PREVENTION tactics. For example if you're 10 pounds overweight, that's not usually a health concern but it might be a warning sign that you're headed towards gaining weight to the level where it WOULD be a health problem.

For those who HAVE succeeded in losing weight, to whatever level, the question of MAINTAINING that weight loss is very relevant here. That's because people who have ever had weight problems, especially obesity, usually need to be vigilant for life in order to prevent regain. Somewhat similar but obviously not the same as alcoholics who are currently not drinking. Of course with food, we need to eat daily, so very different that way.

Anyway, the point I'm making here, is that there is not ONLY ONE "correct" goal for people approaching these weight control issues.

You might be very obese and your doctor has told you if you lose 10 percent of your body weight, you will greatly improve your health risk profile, which would be good advise. You may still be clinically obese after that large weight gain, the world would still see you as obese, but YOU and your doctor would know you have greatly improved your health. Definitely a HEALTH SUCCESS story ... psychologically hard for that person though that the world won't see it that way.

That goal is a GOOD goal.

Perhaps you are 10 pounds overweight and want to be a male model and have a "perfect" body with classic muscles.

That is ALSO a GOOD goal.

Welcome to ALL here who have their OWN personal GOOD goals.

Don't let people who have other goals than you tell you that your goal isn't as good as theirs.

These are personal HEALTH matters.

Setting your own specific weight control goals is YOUR business. Other people, no matter how "well intentioned" do NOT have that right.

Edited January 15, 2016 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Oops.

So sorry.

Need to make this correction in the OP:

You may still be clinically obese after that large weight gain, the world would still see you as obese, but YOU and your doctor would know you have greatly improved your health.

should be

You may still be clinically obese after that large weight LOSS, the world would still see you as obese, but YOU and your doctor would know you have greatly improved your health.

Edited January 15, 2016 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

I will add a caveat to the thread heading here.

Of course I meant ALL personal goals related to weight control that are goals towards an improvement in your HEALTH are OK.

I can imagine some exceptions that really wouldn't fit here, such as:

Weight gainers and feeders (as a sexual fetish)

There are places on the internet for that. I don't think here!

Using illegal and dangerous/physically addictive DRUGS for weight control goals

That has been discussed here before in detail. Doesn't seem "OK" to me.

You want to improve your weight level. You don't want to kill yourself doing it!

I'm sure there are others.

But just posting to clarify I meant ALL goals in that are meant to attain better health.

Getting a perfect muscle body is probably not so much about health, but if it makes some people feel psychologically happier, seems to fit well enough.

Edited January 15, 2016 by Jingthing

[singa-traz]

Don't let people who have other goals than you tell you that your goal isn't as good as theirs.

These are personal HEALTH matters.

Setting your own specific weight control goals is YOUR business. Other people, no matter how "well intentioned" do NOT have that right.

Such a defensive position.

People should welcome inputs on their goals, not fear them. Are my goals too conservative, too challenging, misaligned?

They don't necessary need to change them, or feel insecure about them.

But what if the goal remains unhealthy? Like, from now on, I will only smoke 10 cigarettes a day.

Your "well intentioned" friends ought to challenge this type of goal, especially if you have reached it.

Maintaining an obese state? Is that a goal?

It could be, as an intermediate goal, yes, but once reached, a new goal can and should be set.

Your post is "confusing", you seem to imply (in between the lines) that there is such a thing as "healthy obese", and since the person have lost so much weight already, people should get of his/her back.

Is that what you are trying to say?

[Jingthing]

My OP says what it says very clearly already. In other words, decline to take that bait.

Edited January 16, 2016 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Here is some supporting information for losing and maintaining weight at more modest levels.

There is a difference between a perfect ideal and actions that can be taken to achieve significant health benefits.

http://www.msn.com/en-in/health/weightloss/7-reasons-to-lose-5-percent-of-your-body-weight/ar-AAdWF8G?li=AA4WWl&srcref=rss#page=1

“The research shows that even if you don’t reach a weight or BMI that the charts consider to be optimal, you can be successful at improving your health, reducing your risk of chronic diseases, and improving your quality of life with a weight loss of 5 percent,” says Cynthia Sass, MPH, RD, a dietitian in New York and Los Angeles and author of Slim Down Now: Shed Pounds and Inches with Real Food, Real Fast.

Members who come on here with more modest goals, such as loss (and maintenance) of 5 or 10 percent of body weight for the HEALTH BENEFITS deserve our FULL SUPPORT on this health forum. If they explicitly ASK for advice on going further, then I'm sure that advice will be forthcoming here.

I wish that this forum becomes a more SAFE, COMPASSIONATE, less JUDGMENTAL space open to all who are struggling with weight control issues, regardless of where they are on their path and what their personal weight control goals. It clearly is not that now.

Edited January 16, 2016 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

More on the topic of the total validity of different kinds of GOOD GOALS.

Always keep in mind: THIS IS A HEALTH FORUM.

The focus is on improving health. Not necessarily being the hottest person on the beach.

For some people, it may be all about being the hottest bod on the beach. That's valid TOO.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/06/22/health/the-10-percent-solution-losing-a-little-brings-big-gains.html

The 10 Percent Solution: Losing a Little Brings Big Gains

By LESLIE BERGER

MORE than half of American women are overweight or obese, and as they age they are likely to get fatter and unhealthier. But despite this seemingly unstoppable trend, an increasing number of nutrition and weight experts are offering what may seem surprising advice: never mind thin -- just get real and lose a little weight.

It could be called the 10 percent solution: in recent years a steady stream of research has found that losing as little as 10 percent of body weight, or sometimes even less, has a disproportionately positive effect in improving health. Small weight losses significantly reduce the risk of a wide range of illnesses that have been linked to obesity, from heart disease and diabetes to some kinds of cancer.

In one national study, for example, patients who lost a mere 7 percent of their total body weight reduced their risk for diabetes by 58 percent. A study in Finland found the same benefit with only a 5 percent weight loss. Similar improvements have been documented for hypertension and even sleep apnea.

Armed with these results, weight-loss experts have concluded that dieters might have better luck focusing on their hearts instead of on their hips

It's also interesting to note that bariatric surgery success is measured by an obese person losing a significant percentage of body weight and keeping that off, even if the resulting weight level is still clinically obese based on BMI. Sometimes it's progress from morbid obesity to "regular" obesity. In any case, success is success. If the success rates of bariatric surgery were measured by percentage of people going from morbidly obese or obese to "normal" weight and keeping it off, the published success rates would be much much lower than they actually are.

As it stands now, bariatric surgery has the highest rate of long term success of any other option for obese people, though it usually only reserved for more severe life threatening cases of obesity. But how that success is defined may be different than a lot of people think. I think about 80 percent see long term improvement, again, not necessarily EVER reaching normal weight.

Linking this to another topic, RESEARCH is showing that the high success rates of bariatric surgery may actually be more about the change in GUT BACTERIA profiles triggered by the surgery than the physical surgery itself! Surprising, huh? Indeed. Of course more research is needed. Ideally the same gut bacteria profile changes could be PERMANENTLY effected without going with radical step of surgery.

After weight-loss surgery, new gut bacteria keep obesity away

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-obesity-surgery-bacteria-idUSBRE92Q0ZQ20130327

Edited January 16, 2016 by Jingthing

[tominbkk]

Don't let people who have other goals than you tell you that your goal isn't as good as theirs.

These are personal HEALTH matters.

Setting your own specific weight control goals is YOUR business. Other people, no matter how "well intentioned" do NOT have that right.

Such a defensive position.

People should welcome inputs on their goals, not fear them. Are my goals too conservative, too challenging, misaligned?

They don't necessary need to change them, or feel insecure about them.

But what if the goal remains unhealthy? Like, from now on, I will only smoke 10 cigarettes a day.

Your "well intentioned" friends ought to challenge this type of goal, especially if you have reached it.

Maintaining an obese state? Is that a goal?

It could be, as an intermediate goal, yes, but once reached, a new goal can and should be set.

Your post is "confusing", you seem to imply (in between the lines) that there is such a thing as "healthy obese", and since the person have lost so much weight already, people should get of his/her back.

Is that what you are trying to say?

It's always good to be open to others' ideas, but many posters can be quite judgemental towards what 'works' or 'doesn't work' in a diet or with exercise.

I do best on a ketogenic diet, not too much cardio (though I love riding my bike and going for long walks) but doing intensive and farily short strength sessions. That being said, I have friends that eat low fat and do 2 hours of cardio a day. I have my feelings towards that regime, but if someone likes it and it's working for them then who am I to judge?

[robblok]

Don't let people who have other goals than you tell you that your goal isn't as good as theirs.

These are personal HEALTH matters.

Setting your own specific weight control goals is YOUR business. Other people, no matter how "well intentioned" do NOT have that right.

Such a defensive position.

People should welcome inputs on their goals, not fear them. Are my goals too conservative, too challenging, misaligned?

They don't necessary need to change them, or feel insecure about them.

But what if the goal remains unhealthy? Like, from now on, I will only smoke 10 cigarettes a day.

Your "well intentioned" friends ought to challenge this type of goal, especially if you have reached it.

Maintaining an obese state? Is that a goal?

It could be, as an intermediate goal, yes, but once reached, a new goal can and should be set.

Your post is "confusing", you seem to imply (in between the lines) that there is such a thing as "healthy obese", and since the person have lost so much weight already, people should get of his/her back.

Is that what you are trying to say?

It's always good to be open to others' ideas, but many posters can be quite judgemental towards what 'works' or 'doesn't work' in a diet or with exercise.

I do best on a ketogenic diet, not too much cardio (though I love riding my bike and going for long walks) but doing intensive and farily short strength sessions. That being said, I have friends that eat low fat and do 2 hours of cardio a day. I have my feelings towards that regime, but if someone likes it and it's working for them then who am I to judge?

Correct.. it does not really matter what kind of regime.. I don't like yours as I need carbs for my exercise. But when its working for someone then so be it. We are not all the same and we do respond different. But obese people need to change.. that is the bottom line. they got obese because of their diet.. and they need to change or stay obese.

I love lifting weights (or at least dont hate it always) and i do like badminton and other sports at times. I also got a rowing machine and that is the most effective too.. but I use it the least (in comparison). Its not always about the best way to loose fat.. but a way you can stick too.. as consistency is key.

[tominbkk]

Don't let people who have other goals than you tell you that your goal isn't as good as theirs.

These are personal HEALTH matters.

Setting your own specific weight control goals is YOUR business. Other people, no matter how "well intentioned" do NOT have that right.

Such a defensive position.

People should welcome inputs on their goals, not fear them. Are my goals too conservative, too challenging, misaligned?

They don't necessary need to change them, or feel insecure about them.

But what if the goal remains unhealthy? Like, from now on, I will only smoke 10 cigarettes a day.

Your "well intentioned" friends ought to challenge this type of goal, especially if you have reached it.

Maintaining an obese state? Is that a goal?

It could be, as an intermediate goal, yes, but once reached, a new goal can and should be set.

Your post is "confusing", you seem to imply (in between the lines) that there is such a thing as "healthy obese", and since the person have lost so much weight already, people should get of his/her back.

Is that what you are trying to say?

It's always good to be open to others' ideas, but many posters can be quite judgemental towards what 'works' or 'doesn't work' in a diet or with exercise.

I do best on a ketogenic diet, not too much cardio (though I love riding my bike and going for long walks) but doing intensive and farily short strength sessions. That being said, I have friends that eat low fat and do 2 hours of cardio a day. I have my feelings towards that regime, but if someone likes it and it's working for them then who am I to judge?

Correct.. it does not really matter what kind of regime.. I don't like yours as I need carbs for my exercise. But when its working for someone then so be it. We are not all the same and we do respond different. But obese people need to change.. that is the bottom line. they got obese because of their diet.. and they need to change or stay obese.

I love lifting weights (or at least dont hate it always) and i do like badminton and other sports at times. I also got a rowing machine and that is the most effective too.. but I use it the least (in comparison). Its not always about the best way to loose fat.. but a way you can stick too.. as consistency is key.

I do weights but am doing mainly core strength weights, just a 30 minute routine 3 times a week. The other days I go for long walks or ride my bike. I am enjoying the rowing machine too. They have a coupe Concept 2s at my club and 20 minutes on that is more than enough for me!

[robblok]

I do weights but am doing mainly core strength weights, just a 30 minute routine 3 times a week. The other days I go for long walks or ride my bike. I am enjoying the rowing machine too. They have a coupe Concept 2s at my club and 20 minutes on that is more than enough for me!

Oh my workouts are build around compound exercises.. so squat.. deadlifts.. benchpress and then a few extra ones. So 3 times a full body workout of 45-60 min inclusive warmup and abs.

The rowing machine.. if i hook it up to the computer I can go for 30 min.. heart-rate monitored.. visual stimulant of watching myself row. Some good music on my Bluetooth headset. Still i do get bored after a while but when I am committed i usually finish.

But I have learned from when I was going to extremes that too much can really make you crazy and forget about it all. I am not easy on myself but try not to overdo it.. its a fine line between not being easy and doing too much.

But stuff like badminton is fun and a good workout too. Though I am now nursing a sore forearm from playing. (funny for someone who lifts so much weights to get a sore forearm from a bit of badminton)

In the end its all about finding something you like and sticking with it. I feel that working out helps in a way also with my diet.. if i workout a lot i watch my foods more too.

Its all in tune and all inter connected.

[tominbkk]

I do weights but am doing mainly core strength weights, just a 30 minute routine 3 times a week. The other days I go for long walks or ride my bike. I am enjoying the rowing machine too. They have a coupe Concept 2s at my club and 20 minutes on that is more than enough for me!

Oh my workouts are build around compound exercises.. so squat.. deadlifts.. benchpress and then a few extra ones. So 3 times a full body workout of 45-60 min inclusive warmup and abs.

The rowing machine.. if i hook it up to the computer I can go for 30 min.. heart-rate monitored.. visual stimulant of watching myself row. Some good music on my Bluetooth headset. Still i do get bored after a while but when I am committed i usually finish.

But I have learned from when I was going to extremes that too much can really make you crazy and forget about it all. I am not easy on myself but try not to overdo it.. its a fine line between not being easy and doing too much.

But stuff like badminton is fun and a good workout too. Though I am now nursing a sore forearm from playing. (funny for someone who lifts so much weights to get a sore forearm from a bit of badminton)

In the end its all about finding something you like and sticking with it. I feel that working out helps in a way also with my diet.. if i workout a lot i watch my foods more too.

Its all in tune and all inter connected.

Exactly...finally a Fitness First opened on my route home from work so I am regularly going 3 days a week. Weight training is such a good exercise and stress burner, especially when followed by a 20 minute steam. Off days I do a 5-7 k. walk at a fast pace with intermittent 30 second sprints to get the sweat going. Swimming is great and I love my bike too. Used to love badminton but haven't played in awhile.