Teacher Licensing, Culture Testing, TCT

[Ganesha77]

I attended the 20 hour cultural training course this week, and everything wangsuda said is what I also heard. One of the members of the TCT showed up at the end for a 20-minute vague Q & A. Some of the issues discussed:

- the four-part test is fantastically difficult and no one is passing it, hence this test will be altered at some unspecified time;

- there will be a study guide issued for the fantastically difficult test at some unspecified time;

- the Cultural Training Certificate can be used in lieu of a Teacher's License for at least the next two years. This is the official line from the TCT, but that doesn't mean various immigration agencies are aware of this. Bottom line seems to be: get the 20 hour Certificate and this should be enough until the knowledge equivalency exam is reworked and we (those without a BoE) actually stand a chance of passing the test and getting our license.

Hope this helped!

[mopenyang]

"Perfect Teacher" or "Regular Joe," it looks like you're going to need one of those baccalaureate degree thingamajibs.

Edited May 1, 2008 by mopenyang

[twschw]

Interesting....no mention at all about having a TEFL, TESOL etc. I guess that is a thing of the past.

[Ganesha77]

Interesting....no mention at all about having a TEFL, TESOL etc. I guess that is a thing of the past.

As is the CELTA. When the speaker was asked about TESOL and CELTA etc, she replied that if the course is only two weeks or a month then it doesn't count. If the course takes three months, six months or a year then it is more likely to count.

[twschw]

Can I get my $1000 back

[Ijustwannateach]

I'd like to remind those who may wish to gloat or gripe too soon that this is only the statement of one person, who is at one Thai government agency. It may be a sign that there will be a global change, or there may not be. Your mileage may vary, and the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. I won't be supporting the view that degrees are absolutely for-ever-and-always required for doing TEFL until there is plenty of evidence to support that, including teachers I know who are currently working with full legal paperwork losing their jobs because of their lack of qualifications.

On the other hand, while the writing may not yet be on the wall, they certainly seem to be sanding it down and preparing it for the first undercoat of paint. I'd have to say that it would be very foolish to START any kind of "serious" TEFL career in Thailand right now, for any reason, with any level of experience (if you have anything other than an education degree, it is too much- too much time, too much paperwork, possibly too much classwork for simply making 30k a month- and if you have an education degree or better, why would you waste it on TEFL?)

They'll probably realise they've shot themselves in the foot, backpedal and set things up in a more reasonable manner- but not before a lot of people are burned. Don't be one of those people. Don't come to Thailand to teach.

"S"

[wangsuda]

"Perfect Teacher" or "Regular Joe," it looks like you're going to need one of those baccalaureate degree thingamajibs.

That's pretty much it. From what I gathered, those without a BA/BS degree will not be able to obtain a teachers licence after this year finishes. However, that could be subject to change (like everything else in Thailand).

[Ijustwannateach]

(there's also that little wrinkle that says that TEFL teachers in *public* schools don't need the license; as far as I know that part's still the law).

[wangsuda]

Don't come to Thailand to teach.

"S"

Judging by what is happening with education in other countries, I'd say, "don't teach." Sorry.

[wangsuda]

(there's also that little wrinkle that says that TEFL teachers in *public* schools don't need the license; as far as I know that part's still the law).

I was told that all "public" (read "government") school teachers, as well as private school teachers, will need the license. Sign of the times.

[Ijustwannateach]

It'll be pretty amazing if it comes true- it will be easier to do TEFL in Japan than in Thailand.

Even the chance of it happening should have people making other plans- wonder what they're planning to do with all of those empty teaching positions?

[Munted]

3. Has at least one year verifiable teaching experience somewhere

Ok, I'm completing a BSocSc right now (in NZ). I have one year (plus) verifiable teaching experience in Thailand (on T&T Tefl Cert). If I do the 20 hr thing, do I qualify? Could I make 50,000+? Or should I continue learning Mandarin?

[Ganesha77]

Hey everyone..

Here are the "definitive" requirements for getting a license through the TCT as of completing the Thai Cultural Training Certificate Course yesterday.

Qualifications for Teacher’s License

1. Recognized teacher credentials from a foreign country

+ at least one year’s teaching experience

+ Orientation Training Certificate

2. A bachelor’s degree in education

+ at least one year’s teaching experience

+ Orientation Training Certificate

3. A bachelor’s degree in a field other than education

+ Completion of a diploma course in education / teaching

+ At least one year’s teaching experience

+ Orientation Training Certificate

Q. What if I don’t have teacher credentials

nor a BA degree in education?

A. You can either:

Do a certificate course in teaching at a local university.

Do a knowledge equivalency exam through the Teachers’ Council.

[wangsuda]

3. Has at least one year verifiable teaching experience somewhere

Ok, I'm completing a BSocSc right now (in NZ). I have one year (plus) verifiable teaching experience in Thailand (on T&T Tefl Cert). If I do the 20 hr thing, do I qualify?

You can qualify for an exemption to the test for two years UNLESS you have a NZ teaching certificate.

Could I make 50,000+?

Probably not, sorry.

Or should I continue learning Mandarin?

Yes!

[culicine]

Whicever way you look at it, it will result in a large decrease in teachers doing TEFL courses, as they will see the equivalency exams / other teaching course as another hurdle to jump. For government school, teaching 50 kids to a class in difficult conditions, a 4 week TEFL should suffice. I don't see a full blown BEd (for teaching native speakers in a western environment) to be particularly useful (this is coming from a person who just completed the GradDip!). Such a qualification / requirement will command a salary of, let's say 35K a month. However, if the school is running an english program / bilingual program, where teachers are taking a more traditional role to teaching students (of considerably higher ability) and running a homeroom, then higher qualifications can be asked for, but it should also command a higher salary (e.g. 55k a month)

Within the next year or two, it will be interesting to see if teachers with the new TL will be able to squeeze a bit more money out of their schools...either that or they will just employ qualified non-natives on poor salaries, with the usual excuse to parents that there are no qualified farangs in LoS (actually there are, but the salaries and conditions are too poor to attract them)

[withnail]

I honestly can't see all the language schools and English programs switching to qualified non-natives. In my experience a large number of these schools, and more importantly the parents, wouldn't accept this. Even if they did want to switch, would they be able to fill all the positions?

What I see happening is, quite simply, not that much. This sub forum has been getting very politically correct recently, but as I see it these rules don't apply to most people actually out there teaching because they aren't even following the current rules. What's funny is that most of the teachers who have been running to me asking about these rules would already find it hard getting legal.

I don't think it will have much impact on TEFL/TESL/TESOL courses either as not a single BS exam the TCT produces is ever likely to help anyone TEACH ENGLISH AS A FOREIGN LANGUAGE (excuse the caps but I'm hoping one of them is reading this and I don't trust them to notice). People will still take the courses and employers will still ask for them because they do make a difference.

[culicine]

I honestly can't see all the language schools and English programs switching to qualified non-natives. In my experience a large number of these schools, and more importantly the parents, wouldn't accept this. Even if they did want to switch, would they be able to fill all the positions?

I don't think it will have much impact on TEFL/TESL/TESOL courses either as not a single BS exam the TCT produces is ever likely to help anyone TEACH ENGLISH AS A FOREIGN LANGUAGE (excuse the caps but I'm hoping one of them is reading this and I don't trust them to notice). People will still take the courses and employers will still ask for them because they do make a difference.

My last TCT culture course had at least 80% Philipinos, and they are currently working in schools. Other posters suggested at least 70% were non natives at their TCT course. There are many here and their numbers are increasing. As it happens many of them already qualify for the new teachers licence, as they completed teaching credits in their home country. The first two teachers in my school to get the new licence were Filipinas. I can only think of 3 farang teachers in my school that qualify. Thats wuite a shame given, among just a few of them, they have over 40 years teaching experience.

I agree that the TCT exams will in no way ensure that good teachers will emerge from it, and I strongly believe in the value of doing a TEFL certificate, even if it is not a requirement by law. What I'm saying is that if teachers have to pass these exams or do the TCT rajabaht course to get legal, they will do that first, instead of a TEFL (unless they already have it), as this won't make them legal. Ofcourse the TEFL certificate should then be done as a part of a teachers professional development. It shouldn;t affect the market for teachers who want to work in langauage schools, though..

[PeaceBlondie]

Maybe I try to be politically or sponsorally correct because this forum is sponsored by TEFL providers. We can advise that potential, untrained teachers not come to Thailand, but they always will, and so will Filipinos. Maybe it's the Thai food, or Thai women, or the temples, or the beaches. So as long as they are coming, they had better take a four week course that neither B.Ed. courses or the 18 hours of TCT-required courses would teach them.

Bullshit. I still think it's bovine excrement, and they can quote me.

[withnail]

My comment re political correctness was more regarding the legal issues that (if you were to believe everything you read) we all are forced to abide by. I block ads with my browser so am not even aware who sponsors the sub-forum currently. Other than than though PB I completely agree, I meet new teachers all the time and it seems to me that more and more keep arriving, regardless of government legislation, and often the first thing on their mind is to do a course that will help them learn how to do the job properly.

Culicine, I'm not arguing that there are, and will be, many non-native teachers here; I've met many of them. But there will always be people who don't want to employ them.

[mopenyang]

"Perfect Teacher" or "Regular Joe," it looks like you're going to need one of those baccalaureate degree thingamajibs.

That's pretty much it. From what I gathered, those without a BA/BS degree will not be able to obtain a teachers licence after this year finishes. However, that could be subject to change (like everything else in Thailand).

The handwriting has been on the wall for sometime.

Reality can be difficult to deal with at times.

[BigA]

Is the culture test mandatory for all teachers now?

Who would be excluded from having to take it?

[wangsuda]

Is the culture test mandatory for all teachers now?

No, it isn't.

Who would be excluded from having to take it?

Those with a BEd/BSEd, and those with a credential that enables them to teach in their home country.

[aidenai]

Is the culture test mandatory for all teachers now?

No, it isn't.

Who would be excluded from having to take it?

Those with a BEd/BSEd, and those with a credential that enables them to teach in their home country.

...........but in your initial post your wrote that all teachers have to do the 20 hour Thai language, culture, and teaching ethics course.

[Scott]

If you were a licensed teacher in Thailand before 2003, you do not need to take the course. You are 'grandfathered' in.

[spice1]

Hi all..

I have heard that there is a course available for those without a degree, to study and work at the same time.

Can this be true? Apparently it is undertaken at weekends, and work the other 5 days.

Or another rumour?

[Ijustwannateach]

You might try reading other threads, including the one that was right next to this one called "TCT and getting legal- what does it take?" In any case, no one really knows, and I am merging your question with that thread.

[Ijustwannateach]

This thread is being updated in order to merge all related threads into this topic. Please bear with us while threads are merged.

There it is. Here are all the significant threads we have had so far regarding the new academic teacher licensing procedures, the "culture" testing, TCT; all the facts, links, opinions, rumours, and shilling that we have seen so far. Please be aware that much of this information is highly unreliable and self-contradictory, and that multiple persons posting here are doing so in bad faith, as shills or salesmen for certain courses and points of view- frequently they are outed as such, but sometimes they produce information which is valuable (and so I have included them here).

Good luck. No one really seems to know what the full story is, even the shill who claimed to be part of the TCT. Apologies to Wangsuda for hijacking his thread (which was the most recent), but I felt it was important to collect this information in one place, as this unclear, unhelpful, and teacher-demotivating fuzzy cloud of regulations doesn't seem to be going away or becoming clearer, and is obviously becoming yet another reason not to teach in Thailand.

Future threads on this subject will also be merged here when it becomes appropriate.

"S"

[wangsuda]

Apologies to Wangsuda for hijacking his thread (which was the most recent)

No sweat. It's good to have all the info together. Ganesha77 and I attended the same TCT culture course (it was good. The speakers kept us laughing and made it very lighthearted), so can substantiate Ganesha77's info. But like I said earlier (and that you and PB have said for years), all is subject to change, ESPECIALLY in 2009, when the MoE phases out sor chor 11 and allows schools to independently approve teachers to teaching appointments, thus making sor chors 18 and 19 independent (not the right word), or not reliant on MoE approval. These are interesting times we are entering.

[PeaceBlondie]

Kudos to my fellow teaching moderator, Ijustwannateach, for merging all these threads - a task that my computer skills, dial-up modem, and attention span could not have managed.

It makes the subject cumbersome to review, but we couldn't have all those separate topics, either. Merging the threads illustrates many things, especially the "unclear, unhelpful, and teacher-demotivating fuzzy cloud of regulations" as described by IJWT.

I still think that most of this is going to fade away or be twisted into something even more bizarro.

[withnail]

Apologies to Wangsuda for hijacking his thread (which was the most recent)

No sweat. It's good to have all the info together. Ganesha77 and I attended the same TCT culture course (it was good. The speakers kept us laughing and made it very lighthearted), so can substantiate Ganesha77's info. But like I said earlier (and that you and PB have said for years), all is subject to change, ESPECIALLY in 2009, when the MoE phases out sor chor 11 and allows schools to independently approve teachers to teaching appointments, thus making sor chors 18 and 19 independent (not the right word), or not reliant on MoE approval. These are interesting times we are entering.

So what you're saying is that, currently, everyone must do a course and pass the tests, however there are extensions being given at the moment, which will cover people until a time arrives when the school can independently approve them anyway?

I'm already hearing from my boss at the moment that as I don't work in a prathom or mathayom school she will just have to write a letter vouching for me or something.