Teacher Licensing, Culture Testing, TCT

[aidenai]

I have just been told that we have to do the teachers licence course this year, there is a review handbook available from the Siam Knowledge Transfer Centre tel 02-3797239 or 02-3797344. The cost of the book is 250 Baht + 100 Baht P&P. When you phone you have to order by fax and transfer money to an account number given over the phone.

The information from the book gives you a nice overview but isn't really helpful in sitting the Professional Knowledge Tests successfully.

[aitch52]

The information from the book gives you a nice overview but isn't really helpful in sitting the Professional Knowledge Tests successfully.

Thanks Aidenai, any suggestions as to what may help as a study guide, we had two teachers take the test last year, one passed 7 units and the other 5.

[Firelily]

My school submitted the documents for a second waiver a couple of weeks ago - I am still told I cannot get a teaching licence even though I have the right qualifications, in theory, no more hoops to jump - but they just go "ajarn, don't worry, it difficult, Thai teacher don't have too same same you".

I'm really wondering what is going to happen.

Someone pls confirm that a waiver cannot be transferred from one school to another, but a TL can....

Thanks

:jap:

[Scott]

I can't confirm much of anything regarding this issue, but I can give you my take on it based on information (mostly in this forum).

The waiver is for the school to employ an otherwise unqualified or under qualified teacher. Basically, the waiver is for the school.

A Teacher's License is your license to teach in Thailand. The license belongs to you and covers you. It has little or nothing to do with the school where you chose to work.

If anyone has any other information, please feel free to correct me.

[jackbox]

I can't confirm much of anything regarding this issue, but I can give you my take on it based on information (mostly in this forum).

The waiver is for the school to employ an otherwise unqualified or under qualified teacher. Basically, the waiver is for the school.

A Teacher's License is your license to teach in Thailand. The license belongs to you and covers you. It has little or nothing to do with the school where you chose to work.

If anyone has any other information, please feel free to correct me.

You are correct. The two year waivers are issued for a specific school. The Professional Teacher License (certificate) is a five year, renewable license that belongs to the teacher and is valid at any school in Thailand where the license is required. When you get a job you give them a signed photocopy of your license certificate and card. You are technically supposed to have the card with you when you are performing any duties covered by the license and have it available for inspection at any time. The temporary licenses are kept by the school and usually you are not given a copy of it; but they are supposed to give it to you if you quit or resign even though it is only valid at that school.

[Firelily]

I received another 1-year visa and work permit extension without a teaching licence OR a waiver, seemed very straight-forward. Clerk still maintains that teaching licences are impossible to get even for qualified teachers like me and most of my Thai colleagues and she has never heard about waivers. For the 4th time, she submitted proof that the school asked for a teacher's licence on my behalf and that's all. I really don't know what to think about this whole issue now, but I'm glad it worked out.

[macknife]

Please help!!!

Teaching Licence or 'teaching waver' expires in the next month or two.

TCT says I may have to enroll in a uni course to study for the TCT test.

I already have the Culture course certificate etc. I have also sat these TCT tests for the last 4 years. Like many people I have passed the first one but not the other 3. My school tells me I've already had two waivers so they think I can't get more. To enroll in the uni course I would have to submit everything by Monday. After reading what paperwork they want me to give them I know it will be impossible to get them before Monday.

So what can I do? Has anyone got this far down the track before? Basically I don't really want to study at the weekends from 9-5 for the next 1 1/2 years and seeing as I can't get the paperwork ready in time I can't anyway.

I know I can apply for the TCT test again next week for the tests in January but will that be enough, seeing as I've already done that for the last 3-4 years.

Will I get a third waiver?????? I'm going to the TCT tomorrow, so anything I should ask them? Help!!!

[Scott]

I have no idea, but I hope a poster comes along that can help you out.

I was under the impression--and it's only an impression--that as long as you are signed up for a test, you would get the waiver.

Best of luck and keep us posted.

[macknife]

I have no idea, but I hope a poster comes along that can help you out.

I was under the impression--and it's only an impression--that as long as you are signed up for a test, you would get the waiver.

Best of luck and keep us posted.

Thanks Scott, I hope so too.

My fear is, no waiver or teacher licence = no work permit (eventhough I've had one for 6 years) = no renewal of visa = I don't want to even think about it.

Feels like I'm being punished for being a decent teacher and wanted by my school. Whereas others can just get off the plane and immediately get a waiver.

[aidenai]

Has anyone got this far down the track before?

I'm afraid that until now no foreign teacher applied for their third provisional teaching permit. The first permits were issued at the end of 2007 and beginning 2008. These permits expired at the end of 2009 or beginning 2010. Second waivers became issued. Some teachers reported that the second waivers were issued without any extra requirement while others reported that proof of attempts to meet the TCT requirements had to be submitted. The second provisional teaching permits will expire at the end of this year or the beginning of 2012. Mine expires at the end of next month. Fortunately, I won't have any problems as I recently passed all sections of the TCT Professional Knowledge Tests. So, we have to conclude that there isn't any teachers' experience yet.

The only thing I can advise is to talk in person, accompanied by a Thai colleague with responsible employees of the TCT. Prove that you are ongoing in meeting the TCT requirements.

[dindong]

A senior Thai teacher from our school went to the Teacher's council last week to inquire about the latest developments regarding teacher's licenses for foreign teachers.

He was told that there will be no more waivers after the second one but that they will accept anyone who has a B.A degree.

The degree can be in any subject.

[aidenai]

Thanks for this, dindong.

He was told that there will be no more waivers after the second one but that they will accept anyone who has a B.A degree.

The degree can be in any subject.

I don't understand what you're writing there. No 3rd waiver?

Accept BAs for what? The teacher license or the provisional teaching permit?

Please elaborate.

Cheers and thanks again. :jap:

Edited September 30, 2011 by Scott
correction

[Scott]

If there is no waiver, then they must be issuing some type of Teacher's License. Is that correct?

[macknife]

Well I went and the guy behind the counter said there would be no more waivers so I had to enroll on a uni course every Saturday and Sunday. i told him that it was now too late for me to apply for that. So what could I do??? He sent me upstairs to the supervisor/manager (I don't know what her position is to be honest). That lady then went to another lady who came to speak to me. She said to apply for all the next round of tests (apps starting next week for exams in January). It turned out my waiver still applied until next year(Silly school said it was next month). So i asked IF i fail the tests would i get a waiver again? She said yes. I said it would be my third waiver and would that be allowed? She said yes, as long as your trying. I said i was very worried as the test were very difficult to pass. She said not to worry and that next year I should go directly to her and proceeded to give me her email and phone number. I left feeling much happier. Though it must be pointed out that the guy downstairs behind the counter said there would be no third waiver, unless I started a uni course and that doing the test only wouldn't be enough.

Edited September 30, 2011 by Scott
formatting

[aidenai]

Well I went and the guy behind the counter said there would be no more waivers so I had to enroll on a uni course every Saturday and Sunday. i told him that it was now too late for me to apply for that. So what could I do??? He sent me upstairs to the supervisor/manager (I don't know what her position is to be honest). That lady then went to another lady who came to speak to me. She said to apply for all the next round of tests (apps starting next week for exams in January). It turned out my waiver still applied until next year(Silly school said it was next month). So i asked IF i fail the tests would i get a waiver again? She said yes. I said it would be my third waiver and would that be allowed? She said yes, as long as your trying. I said i was very worried as the test were very difficult to pass. She said not to worry and that next year I should go directly to her and proceeded to give me her email and phone number. I left feeling much happier. Though it must be pointed out that the guy downstairs behind the counter said there would be no third waiver, unless I started a uni course and that doing the test only wouldn't be enough.

Thank you very much for this update. :jap:

I guess that dindong's senior colleague has met the guy downstairs.

[Scott]

Yes, a big thanks for the information. It will be helpful to future posters, since this problem is likely to crop up again.

[jt936]

the supervisor/manager (I don't know what her position is to be honest). That lady then went to another lady who came to speak to me. She

Thanks Mac,

Do you know the lady's name?

[macknife]

I don't remember, it's written on the papers a gave back to my school.

[Jim's_a_Thai_Fox]

Hi there,

As Aidenai mentioned before, you can now register again for the TCT tests that are in mid/late January 2012. You have to register and pay before 25th Ocotber.

TIP: use Internet Explorer as your browser or else you may have difficulty filling in all the fields, notably DOB.

http://upload.ksp.or.th/ksptest/index_en.php

click on the left hand side icon called "online application".

cheers

[Jim's_a_Thai_Fox]

There seems to be an update on the website. Early indications point to the possibility that even if you paid your fee for testing, you might not be on the testing list!!!

Please check the list to see if you are eligible. If you aren't, you had to send your receipt back to the TCT before the 21st December for a refund!!!

The madness continues unabated in 2012 :-)

[joeymcjoberstein]

Hello, you onced helped me before....Maybe you can again.

I am going at the end of february beg.of march to extend my visa and work permit for another year.

I have the 1st waiver giving my the two years and well I didn't go to school so I found out that I can get a 2nd waiver for another two years? How exactly do I do this/ Also I have a Thai cultural,ethics,professional certificate of 30 hours (20 required) but it's from 2010 and I got it a couple months before I got the 1st waiver... Can I use this thai cultural certificate (same one year 2010) to apply for a second waiver? please explain, I had a big meeting (so stupid) with my school and they told me they wanted to know why I haven't been going to a school to get the licence..and I told them because I don't have 60,000 baht on top of I have no time to dedicate my weekends and money to some program..

So now I gave the school the original certificate(thai cultural) and so should I get a new* thai cultural certificate that will have a new date in it? for example there is a Thai cultural Seminar that is going on February 4th-5th and 6th and it is on the tct's website...

Should I take this class and get the new certificate?

also if I have to take this class that means that it will only give me about 3 weeks before my visa and work permit expire is that enough time to go into the tct office? I know to mail it I've read it takes up to 8weeks? gosh... please

[Scott]

We may have other posters who can give you the benefit of their experience. If you did not use the Thai Cultural Course to obtain the first waiver, then by all means use it this time. I wouldn't take the course again, but that's just an opinion.

To get your degree or necessary credits for educational certification, you should pay for each class your take, not necessarily 60,000 baht up front.

Other ideas?

[thaicbr]

Does any one have a date for the next round of tests and a booking date etc.

[aidenai]

Does any one have a date for the next round of tests and a booking date etc.

Nobody knows at this very moment.

The dates for test 10 will be announced shortly after the results of test 9 are published. Only then you can book.

The 2011 tests were in January and July. The latter was initially planned for May.

[LecheHombre]

I'll try to keep this relatively short -- I managed to read through the whole thread here to try to beef up on what is going on, but I'm still in need of some advice:

I have a pretty negative opinion of the TCT in general and the 4 tests, although that is just based on reading about them.

I've been teaching here in Thailand for about 5 years. I have a B.S. in Computer Science. When this all first came up I got my first 2-year waiver with no issues. The following year I moved to another school and was told I needed to get a new 2-year waiver (my second) -- I believe that was correct and it was non-transferable, but perhaps I wasted the 2nd year of that first waiver? In any case, I got the second waiver possibly due to having taken the Thai Culture Course. I am now happily working in the same school and my second waiver will expire with my visa in late April.

The school told me that they do want me to continue working there, but that they cannot get me an additional waiver. I wasn't aware that might be a problem, so I have been scrambling to figure things out. Anyway, my school said that I should convert to a Non-O Marriage visa (currently on work Non-B.) which would exempt me from needing a TL. Basically, I think that my school is misinformed, but they may actually be de-facto correct -- that would limit the paperwork that I would have to present to immigration to the marriage and financial documentation, which I can handle. The local labor office in my area grants Work Permits for teachers without a Teacher's License, basically because at the local level they can see that they wouldn't have any teachers left if they followed that requirement (I am not in a major / popular area for foreign teachers). So I don't know exactly what if any laws I, my school, the local Labor Office, or the area Immigration Office (Nan for my area) might be breaking "selectively interpreting" by doing this, but it seems reasonably possible that it could functionally keep me employed.

However, I'd like to try to do things by the book. My basic plan at this point is to make the switch to a Non-O marriage visa, make no mention of my employment at immigration if I can avoid it (but not to lie about it if I am directly asked) and to get the Work Permit as usual, with assurances from school and local contacts that the local Labor Office is still "don't ask don't tell" vis-a-vis TL's or waivers. If that all goes well, I would feel pretty comfortable with a legitimate visa, and legitimate WP for my legitimate job.

However I think that considering TIT, it is probably prudent for me to maintain some cover-my-ass options. So, I'm considering signing up for 1 (or more if necessary) of the TCT tests and having my school submit a request for a 3rd waiver based on that. Anybody in a similar situation have info about whether or not the TCT may grant a 3rd waiver if you sign up for 1 test? Presumably I wouldn't have actually sat the test by the time my visa is due, late April 2012. I'm definitely too late to sign up for the one happening in a few days, and the next will probably be in July or so?

That would give me 2 years to either decide to buckle down and attempt to take and pass the remaining 3 tests, or better yet for the farcical nature of this whole fiasco to come to a head and let everyone save face by keeping it on the books while being utterly unenforced...

Cover-my-ass fallback number 2 is trying to get a job at the local University, but I'd really rather stay where I am -- quite comfortable with my current situation.

Any takers? Sorry for the length of the post, and thanks to all posters so far, this thread has been very helpful -- just count me in the group that is waiting to see what bizarre turn happens next.

/edit: cleared out an incorrect auto-smiley, and fixed a detail

Edited January 23, 2012 by LecheHombre

[Scott]

Hopefully we will have some posters with some experience come along and give you some advice.

My concern is that you might run into a problem if you are asking for a waiver, but not using this to get the Work Permit. I think you can sign up for the next round of tests without having a waiver.

It is my understanding that once that 3rd waiver is used up, you are out of luck, so I would tend to think it would be best to go the Non-O route and bypass the TC altogether. In the meantime, just sign up for the exams and start working toward compliance. Your only problem with that might be if they ask for your place of employment.

[a99az]

I am coming up to my third year with my school. The school have said they want me to stay as long as I can, and have said on many occasions that they intend to renew my third contract. Over a year ago I told to school that I had no intension of taking any form of exam for a teaching / culture license as I felt it would be a wast of my money and time. It also has absolutely no worth outside the kingdom. I guess I will find out soon enough if they hold good the promise or not.

[LecheHombre]

Hopefully we will have some posters with some experience come along and give you some advice.

My concern is that you might run into a problem if you are asking for a waiver, but not using this to get the Work Permit. I think you can sign up for the next round of tests without having a waiver.

It is my understanding that once that 3rd waiver is used up, you are out of luck, so I would tend to think it would be best to go the Non-O route and bypass the TC altogether. In the meantime, just sign up for the exams and start working toward compliance. Your only problem with that might be if they ask for your place of employment.

Helpful and calming advice for me, so I believe that barring any other developments I will follow the portion of your response that I have bolded above and sign up for at least one of the tests (probably the first about tech usage in the classroom) while looking into possible self-study guides that would give me a fighting chance at passing the others in the future. Thanks!

Any folks that have already taken some of the TCT tests have any comment on whether or not they inquire about your current place of employment and/or need to see your work permit if you have a Non-O? I wouldn't want to land myself or my school in any trouble by having that traced back by some particularly motivated and curious TCT person (although I imagine that is highly unlikely even if the info is right there in front of them).

[aidenai]

As of 2008, teachers have to submit the TCT provisional teaching permit or TCT teacher license when applying for an extension of the permission of stay. The same rule became into effect at our provincial Labour Office in 2010 when renewing the work permit. Both are nationally written rules by both bodies. See police order 777/2551 and WP.1/ WP.5. Our Labour Office does accept the non-immigrant O visa (spouse) for a work permit.

Edited January 25, 2012 by aidenai

[aidenai]

I sat the TCT Professional Knowledge Tests and did the Thai Language, Culture and Ethics Course.

Edited January 25, 2012 by aidenai