Balance in the news

[GAZZPA]

IMO opinion Pattaya is the best city in the world in the best country in the world. Nowhere else even comes close.it does have a rather relaxed law enforcement in some areas, but the good outweighs the bad tenfold. Thu why it is so popular and has been for decades. And getting more and more so every year.

Cheap international food at cheap prices, cheap beer served up to you in a cooler in thousands of places from the beach to the bars to the higher end places.

Friendly people from all around the world, every night I see tourists here having the time of their lives, from 20 year olds to 70 year olds.

Great shopping, markets everywhere to the more high end stuff at central etc., great supermarkets that are better and cheaper than in other parts of the world.

A great hospital and some other cheaper one as well.

Dentistry work a fraction of the cost of other countries.

You can party 24/7/365 if you want. I NEVER get bored here.

Cheap professionally trained masseuses. And a few dodgy ones.

Many truly great golf courses such as Siam country club, with amazing terrier like caddies who have an uncanny knack of finding my balls in the roughest of the roughs. International schools.

The worlds best gogos, cold draught beers for a couple of bucks, many other standard nightclubs open every night with a fun atmosphere, or just sit by one of the many beer bars watching the sunset over Pattaya bay. The Thai pubs here also rock, live music, dancing hot, hot girls, table service and the delicious Thai cuisine.

Water parks and heaps of other great tourist attractions.

One of the best privately owned gardens in the world who clean up at the Chelsea garden show every single year smashing the opposition.

Nice and compact, everything pretty much in a 10 or so kilometer radius.

Sit on the beach, the friendly Thais will set you up a chair and bring you food and drinks.

When it comes to the Fun Police, well, yeah it is lawless.

It would have to be the closest place to heaven on earth. I would say God bless Pattaya, but he already has!!!!!

Wow, extreme view indeed,, best city in the world in the best country in the world blessed by God? Ermm, i don't think so.

I too am happy living here but for different reasons. Of curse food is cheaper, as it is an all developing countries compared with the west,, but clothes here are more expensive compared to a mature competitive market such as the UK.

Most of Pattaya is centered around the sex industry and drinking. In fact, if you discount the bars, massage and hookers (none of which i use) all you have really said that could be considered unique for a developing country is there are some good golf courses.

I am pleased you are happy, if a little delusional.

Have fun in the Gogo bars,,

[Rimmer]

An off topic troll rant discussing moderation has been removed

[Roomuck]

IMO opinion Pattaya is the best city in the world in the best country in the world. Nowhere else even comes close.it does have a rather relaxed law enforcement in some areas, but the good outweighs the bad tenfold. Thu why it is so popular and has been for decades. And getting more and more so every year.

Cheap international food at cheap prices, cheap beer served up to you in a cooler in thousands of places from the beach to the bars to the higher end places.

Friendly people from all around the world, every night I see tourists here having the time of their lives, from 20 year olds to 70 year olds.

Great shopping, markets everywhere to the more high end stuff at central etc., great supermarkets that are better and cheaper than in other parts of the world.

A great hospital and some other cheaper one as well.

Dentistry work a fraction of the cost of other countries.

You can party 24/7/365 if you want. I NEVER get bored here.

Cheap professionally trained masseuses. And a few dodgy ones.

Many truly great golf courses such as Siam country club, with amazing terrier like caddies who have an uncanny knack of finding my balls in the roughest of the roughs. International schools.

The worlds best gogos, cold draught beers for a couple of bucks, many other standard nightclubs open every night with a fun atmosphere, or just sit by one of the many beer bars watching the sunset over Pattaya bay. The Thai pubs here also rock, live music, dancing hot, hot girls, table service and the delicious Thai cuisine.

Water parks and heaps of other great tourist attractions.

One of the best privately owned gardens in the world who clean up at the Chelsea garden show every single year smashing the opposition.

Nice and compact, everything pretty much in a 10 or so kilometer radius.

Sit on the beach, the friendly Thais will set you up a chair and bring you food and drinks.

When it comes to the Fun Police, well, yeah it is lawless.

It would have to be the closest place to heaven on earth. I would say God bless Pattaya, but he already has!!!!!

Wow, extreme view indeed,, best city in the world in the best country in the world blessed by God? Ermm, i don't think so.

I too am happy living here but for different reasons. Of curse food is cheaper, as it is an all developing countries compared with the west,, but clothes here are more expensive compared to a mature competitive market such as the UK.

Most of Pattaya is centered around the sex industry and drinking. In fact, if you discount the bars, massage and hookers (none of which i use) all you have really said that could be considered unique for a developing country is there are some good golf courses.

I am pleased you are happy, if a little delusional.

Have fun in the Gogo bars,,

Thanks

[Roomuck]

An off topic troll rant discussing moderation has been removed

Sorry

[oxforddon]

Not sure this thread is staying on topic and it seems like its going downhill so permission given to close it now.

[GAZZPA]

Not sure this thread is staying on topic and it seems like its going downhill so permission given to close it now.

Don't think its off topic,, it's discussing Thailands reputation as reported in the news... A couple of remarks have been removed i see but from the other posts it is mostly quite positive, don't see it going downhill.

[TKDfella]

I don't think it's right to compare crime in other countries. Laws, social structure, religion are different. Take a look at America; you can't compare it to England because of the gun laws. Although England has prostitution rackets it is outlawed whereas in Thailand it isn't. If you use statistics you can use the figures to show many things but that doesn't they are necessarily valid.

[JSixpack]

What is considered everyday life . Is not news. People living in harmony and doing humanitarian things is simply doing the right thing. Good actions are their own reward no need for news about it.

That's a point but doesn't apply so well here, consistent with what oxfordon is saying I think.

If one of our nervous members is in his home country, then he can put the "man bites dog" news into perspective. He realizes this isn't usual but not terribly significant in the overall scheme of things and the news source is trying to grab page views.

When he's here, though, he's out of his comfort zone, disoriented and beset by paranoia and misunderstanding (despite the Mr. Cool pretense). Faraway land, different culture, different language. Suddenly "man bites dog" while drunk on Beach Rd. at 3 AM becomes a crime wave and he daren't set foot out of his room. This has always been true here in Pattaya.

There are two types of articles appearing in the Pattaya Mail with regularity: those where business and political leaders decry the decline in tourism and propose ways to improve the situation; and a steadily increasing number of reports of tourists being insulted, assaulted, drugged, robbed and extorted. . . . Pattaya is being inundated with rude obnoxious thugs who do not care about the city or its visitors. . . . They are driving away the tourists and the income and jobs that they bring. Inevitably, this rabble will win as they reduce everyone to their level of poverty. Meanwhile, tourism to Cambodia is increasing by 50% every six months...[emphasis mine]

--Lawrence Neal, "Down on Pattaya," Pattaya Mail, Vol. V No. 5 Friday 31 January 1997 - 6 February 1997

See, everybody's always been moving to Cambodia.

What's lost here is that Pattaya is #8 on the list of top tourist destinations in SE Asia, with 8.1 million overnight visitors last year according to the Mastercard Asia Pacific Destinations Index. (We daren't mention TAT here.) 8.1 million in this small city. And the number is projected to keep growing. Considering that vast number, then how much danger we talkin', really?

So the reason more positive news is needed is that our members can't seem to put things into perspective as they would in their home countries. The most inconsequential item becomes a sign of total anarchy and savagery, of course heralding the end of all tourism.

Still, anything positive will be sneered at by our cynics, haters, bashers, and trolls, many of whom don't live here but nonetheless have an unhealthy obsession with our beloved cesspool. Recently we had 30 pages of Pattaya Is Dead started and kept alive by a troll posting from the UK. Now that was funny.

[tomyumchai]

I'm really pleased to see so many positive responses on this thread. I'm with the OP too. But, what about the "silent majority"? Over 1300 views of the thread, but only 20 odd replies. Can Thai Visa do anything to get more people posting rather than just viewing?

one way to do that would be to ban those posters who only come here to rip the shit out of other peoples comments and never add anything positive to the discussion.

i would post a lot of topics if it wasnt for the ash holes who only turn up to bash the question id asked.

[Roomuck]

What is considered everyday life . Is not news. People living in harmony and doing humanitarian things is simply doing the right thing. Good actions are their own reward no need for news about it.

That's a point but doesn't apply so well here, consistent with what oxfordon is saying I think.

If one of our nervous members is in his home country, then he can put the "man bites dog" news into perspective. He realizes this isn't usual but not terribly significant in the overall scheme of things and the news source is trying to grab page views.

When he's here, though, he's out of his comfort zone, disoriented and beset by paranoia and misunderstanding (despite the Mr. Cool pretense). Faraway land, different culture, different language. Suddenly "man bites dog" while drunk on Beach Rd. at 3 AM becomes a crime wave and he daren't set foot out of his room. This has always been true here in Pattaya.

There are two types of articles appearing in the Pattaya Mail with regularity: those where business and political leaders decry the decline in tourism and propose ways to improve the situation; and a steadily increasing number of reports of tourists being insulted, assaulted, drugged, robbed and extorted. . . . Pattaya is being inundated with rude obnoxious thugs who do not care about the city or its visitors. . . . They are driving away the tourists and the income and jobs that they bring. Inevitably, this rabble will win as they reduce everyone to their level of poverty. Meanwhile, tourism to Cambodia is increasing by 50% every six months...[emphasis mine]

--Lawrence Neal, "Down on Pattaya," Pattaya Mail, Vol. V No. 5 Friday 31 January 1997 - 6 February 1997

See, everybody's always been moving to Cambodia.

What's lost here is that Pattaya is #8 on the list of top tourist destinations in SE Asia, with 8.1 million overnight visitors last year according to the Mastercard Asia Pacific Destinations Index. (We daren't mention TAT here.) 8.1 million in this small city. And the number is projected to keep growing. Considering that vast number, then how much danger we talkin', really?

So the reason more positive news is needed is that our members can't seem to put things into perspective as they would in their home countries. The most inconsequential item becomes a sign of total anarchy and savagery, of course heralding the end of all tourism.

Still, anything positive will be sneered at by our cynics, haters, bashers, and trolls, many of whom don't live here but nonetheless have an unhealthy obsession with our beloved cesspool. Recently we had 30 pages of Pattaya Is Dead started and kept alive by a troll posting from the UK. Now that was funny.

Thanks for that very informative post. Interesting to see that

Inbound arrivals to Bangkok grew 28.6% in 2015, with three Thai destinations securing top 10 positions

And

Thailand dominated the top ten destinations, taking three of the top ten rankings, with Phuket securing fifth place (9.3 million) and the coastal city of Pattaya coming in at eighth

I will be interested to see how Never Say twists these figures.

[hdkane]

Lawlessness and its opposite is in the eyes of the beer holder ......

OP, you're not using much critical judgment here...the news that is reported on this forum usually relates to incidents that involve farang...there are dozens of incidents EVERY day that occur in Pattaya...most involve Thais, and are not reported...Pattaya, and most of urban Thailand, has a serious problem with crime and corruption...most of it is simply accepted, so it receives no attention...to dispute that is to ignore the obvious...

[Rimmer]

A baiting troll post has been removed.

[JSixpack]

Tourists are turning their backs to Pattaya,Thailand.

Why because nothing has gotten better in the last ten years for them instead things went down hill for foreigners.

So if people feel unwelcome and are treated unfairly on a regular basis yes then they will go elsewhere.

Perhaps The thais also are not broken heart about the farangs packing up their bags.So its a win win situation.

Totally off topic besides nonsense. Find a "Dead" thread and post there.

[seedy]

Troll / Flaming / Off Topic posts removed

Keep the Personal Attacks off this Forum

[chiang mai]

It is lawless.

Get in your car, go drive down the Sukhumvet road for an hour or so

then come back and report, about law and order,

and that's just on the roads.

Sukhumvit, especially lower Sukhumvit, is not representative of any part of Thailand and may indeed not even be Thailand!

[chiang mai]

Tourists are turning their backs to Pattaya,Thailand.

Why because nothing has gotten better in the last ten years for them instead things went down hill for foreigners.

So if people feel unwelcome and are treated unfairly on a regular basis yes then they will go elsewhere.

Perhaps The thais also are not broken heart about the farangs packing up their bags.So its a win win situation.

I'm not a big fan of Pattaya but I'm even less of a fan of generalizations and emotional mistruth!

Pattaya has changed enormously in the past ten years, most of it has been for the better, sadly however some aspects have stagnated and the increase in tourist numbers has magnified them.

On the plus points: there's a lot more higher quality hotels, decent upmarket shopping centres, tourist attraction that are geared towards families (rather than single adult males), airport access has been eased as Swampy came online and theme parks have been built to provide alternate entertainment, and so on.

So yes, many many things have changed, you just haven't seen them or noticed them!

[Roomuck]

Well DELETED I am just presuming the death rate is going up steeply because all us old farts are getting older and more decrepit.

Now getting to something sensible, I'm one of the silent majority (spent considerable time in Pattaya and elsewhere in Thailand over the last 15 years) who somehow never have problems here. I understand there are plenty of farang crims and other lowlife but like most of us they never bother me, I guess because I mind my own business, don't get blind drunk, don't dabble in dope and mix socially with decent people, both Thais and farangs. I have no problems wandering around central Pattaya in the early hours, say 4am (I'm an early riser). The sois are lively with party goers, drunks, ladyboys on the hussle etc but no one bothers me. I live in a decent town in Oz with a large party precinct and it is decidedly dangerous at 4am there. Not so in Pattaya! But as usual the Pattaya doomsdayers love an opportunity, like this thread, to come out from their hiding holes to deride Pattaya. Just saying.

You are spot on. For the amount of grog that gets consumed here you would expect a lot more violence. I think a lot of the negative posters either don't live here or don't get out much and watch Pattaya One all day. The local press here a generally a bit lazy, it is easy for them just to chase after the police. An old farang will die at home in his pool of natural causes and somehow this gets spun into "Naked Foreigner Found Floating Naked in Pool" Then out come the conspiracy theorists. I am a bit more wary down in Phuket and Samui but in Pattaya it does have a very happy, relaxed feel even at 4am as you say.

I have put it down to GENERALLY because the farangs here are a bit older =wiser, and less aggressive whereas down south the Thais have to put up with more younger idiots, are more jaded and thus treat everyone accordingly. Other factors at play also, most of the Thais here are from the north and north east, who, IMO are more laid back than the slightly more hot hearted southern Thai.

[onemorechang]

It is lawless.

Get in your car, go drive down the Sukhumvet road for an hour or so

then come back and report, about law and order,

and that's just on the roads.

Sukhumvit, especially lower Sukhumvit, is not representative of any part of Thailand and may indeed not even be Thailand!

Now your just being silly.

[chiang mai]

It is lawless.

Get in your car, go drive down the Sukhumvet road for an hour or so

then come back and report, about law and order,

and that's just on the roads.

Sukhumvit, especially lower Sukhumvit, is not representative of any part of Thailand and may indeed not even be Thailand!

Now your just being silly.

Yes, extremes to make the point that it is not typical of anywhere in the country, other than perhaps one or two sleazy soi's in one or two adult tourist quarters. Sadly that's the only part of Thailand some foreigners know and they base all their so called opinions of the entire country on what they see there.

[kennyro]

If Pattaya is so bad why do people leave jackets, helmets and even groceries on their unlocked bike, and return to find them untouched.

[onemorechang]

It is lawless.

Get in your car, go drive down the Sukhumvet road for an hour or so

then come back and report, about law and order,

and that's just on the roads.

Sukhumvit, especially lower Sukhumvit, is not representative of any part of Thailand and may indeed not even be Thailand!

Now your just being silly.

Yes, extremes to make the point that it is not typical of anywhere in the country, other than perhaps one or two sleazy soi's in one or two adult tourist quarters. Sadly that's the only part of Thailand some foreigners know and they base all their so called opinions of the entire country on what they see there.

This is the Pattaya forum.

so we should be talking about , wait for it , Pattaya.

Not the rest of of Thailand, Uk or USA.

but Pattaya.

If it is now about the above , the thread should be moved, to

general , what ever.

I enjoy living in the wide west ( Lawless pattaya )

i acknowledge, that is what it is. and love it..

some call it Sex Town, fine by me. but it is lawless

when you look under the veneer.

Many people live there lives with rose tinted spectacles on most of the time. Looking down from there ivory Towers, never interacting with the locals. just living in a bubble from the country they came from.

[Roomuck]

If Pattaya is so bad why do people leave jackets, helmets and even groceries on their unlocked bike, and return to find them untouched.

So true, most of the time I don't even lock my car.

Though I did have a helmet stolen once on Pattaya nua about six years ago. Probably a farang!

[onemorechang]

If Pattaya is so bad why do people leave jackets, helmets and even groceries on their unlocked bike, and return to find them untouched.

So true, most of the time I don't even lock my car.

Though I did have a helmet stolen once on Pattaya nua about six years ago. Probably a farang!

Most likely a Lady-boy.

[chiang mai]

Tourists are turning their backs to Pattaya,Thailand.

Why because nothing has gotten better in the last ten years for them instead things went down hill for foreigners.

So if people feel unwelcome and are treated unfairly on a regular basis yes then they will go elsewhere.

Perhaps The thais also are not broken heart about the farangs packing up their bags.So its a win win situation.

I'm not a big fan of Pattaya but I'm even less of a fan of generalizations and emotional mistruth!

Pattaya has changed enormously in the past ten years, most of it has been for the better, sadly however some aspects have stagnated and the increase in tourist numbers has magnified them.

On the plus points: there's a lot more higher quality hotels, decent upmarket shopping centres, tourist attraction that are geared towards families (rather than single adult males), airport access has been eased as Swampy came online and theme parks have been built to provide alternate entertainment, and so on.

So yes, many many things have changed, you just haven't seen them or noticed them!

I am a positive person but when talking about Thailand or Pattaya i think its more fair to be honest instead of positive.

U say a lot is better because there is swampi...And so what an airport and then?

I am saying the place became much more restricted with complicated visa procedures,etc,however foreigners death rate went up with 54%,,then playing bridge is already crime.

People who spike your drinks and rob your belonging get a slap on their hands.Jet skies mob still there..While countries such as vietnam have a positive vibe with relaxing their real estate ownership laws and their foreigner employee laws again i sadly see the contrary over here.I not see that bright future for us as you try painting it.

Since Swampy came about, access to and from Pattaya has been made far easier than when folks had to use just Don Muang, that was my point, it;'s made access more convenient.

And you say that "the place became much more restricted because of visa procedures", yet early you wrote that people are "turning their backs on Pattaya". Visa procedures are common to Thailand as a whole and not just Pattaya so I'm not sure now whether you are complaining about, visa's within Thailand or things not having got any better in Pattaya in the past ten years!

[chiang mai]

Sukhumvit, especially lower Sukhumvit, is not representative of any part of Thailand and may indeed not even be Thailand!

Now your just being silly.

Yes, extremes to make the point that it is not typical of anywhere in the country, other than perhaps one or two sleazy soi's in one or two adult tourist quarters. Sadly that's the only part of Thailand some foreigners know and they base all their so called opinions of the entire country on what they see there.

This is the Pattaya forum.

so we should be talking about , wait for it , Pattaya.

Not the rest of of Thailand, Uk or USA.

but Pattaya.

If it is now about the above , the thread should be moved, to

general , what ever.

I enjoy living in the wide west ( Lawless pattaya )

i acknowledge, that is what it is. and love it..

some call it Sex Town, fine by me. but it is lawless

when you look under the veneer.

Many people live there lives with rose tinted spectacles on most of the time. Looking down from there ivory Towers, never interacting with the locals. just living in a bubble from the country they came from.

It seems to me that you're complaining about traffic conditions and peoples attitudes to traffic laws rather than anything else, do you really think that Pattaya is any different form any other part of the country in that respect, it isn't but that in itself doesn't make it lawless/wild west, it's just a feature of the country overall, I mean, it's aint Kansas!

[Rimmer]

Topic is about balance in the news not Pattaya is dying please stick to it, further off topic rants will just disappear. thank you.

[onemorechang]

It seems to me that you're complaining about traffic conditions and peoples attitudes to traffic laws rather than anything else, do you really think that Pattaya is any different form any other part of the country in that respect, it isn't but that in itself doesn't make it lawless/wild west, it's just a feature of the country overall, I mean, it's aint Kansas!

That's Just one example, But I do believe with the influx of Nutters from Bangkok at the weekends, it is a bit different, than say Chiang-Mai.

One more example of Lawlessness in Pattaya.

Never thought i would read in the news about a Thai guy murdering his wife on walking street by slashing her throat open outside a 7/11

Lawless , yes.

[onemorechang]

Sorry you feel that way.

The truth, is so hard to swallow.

Lawless , was the op' words.

[Roomuck]

If Pattaya is so bad why do people leave jackets, helmets and even groceries on their unlocked bike, and return to find them untouched.

So true, most of the time I don't even lock my car.

Though I did have a helmet stolen once on Pattaya nua about six years ago. Probably a farang!

Most likely a Lady-boy.

Yeah, some of those farang ladyboys can be scary.

[JSixpack]

While countries such as vietnam have a positive vibe with relaxing their real estate ownership laws and their foreigner employee laws again i sadly see the contrary over here.I not see that bright future for us as you try painting it.

Here's the positive vibe for ya. When you leavin', anyway?

Having lived in VN from 2002-2010 and having tired of the Noise, pollution, constant theft, racism, rudeness, traffic congestion, corruption and distinct lack of education/intelligence/manners of the people (just about in that order). I would STRONGLY advise you not to make the mistake that it seems you are about to make.

Vietnam is fairly easy to travel but very difficult to live there. They do not speak as much English as they do here in Thailand. They will rob you at EVERY GIVEN OPPORTUNITY. In case of any problems, you will always lose.

I would strongly suggest that you take an extended holiday of a few months, travel around. Enjoy an extended visit there and answer all the questions that you have and also see if you feel you could live there.

I am personally much happier here in Thailand, even taking into consideration 'recent changes'. Here I am able to be fully in control of my company and my business, afford a decent house and have a licence for and drive my car legally.

I would wait until at least 1 week after Tet/Chinese new year before you go as everything is closed.

Chuc vui ve va Chuc mung nam moi!!