Fracair,

Its all been said here and you've been given loads of good advice. Act on it !

A lot has been said on this thread around the issue of where you met her. Taking the wider view i have never understood the importance of that question. Why is it important ? People who met in a bar lie often about it , and no doubt loads of applications get into trouble over this one question . But why? I can't see why the question is even on the application form . When you met ...yes , but where ...i don't see it . Anyone know why this is of any importance at all? All i can think of is that there is some pre-conceived prejudice against those who are bargirls and met that way. But why? there is just as much (or little) chance of them returning to Thailand at the end of a trip as someone who works in Macdonalds in Sukhumvit Road.

Anyway good luck and PLEASE , after so much has been written on this thread, do come back and tell us the outcome. I for one am dying to know

Atlastaname, you'd better sit down and prepare yourself for a shock.

I agree completely with your above post. ECOs are not interested in how couples meet (at no stage during the application process was my wife asked this question). I can appreciate that they may ask some applicants, particularly if the relationship is on the short side. If they do ask, they want the truth. The question is asked not because the ECO particularly cares about the circumstances of the meeting, but to see if the applicant is being consistent about it. The only way to ensure consistency is to tell the truth.

However, certain agencies have a vested interest in putting it about that exbargirls don't stand a chance without the 'help' of an agency to create a 'plausible' fiction. It these rumours that people hear and then start worrying about.

Bargirls do get UK visas; liars don't.

The gent, considering the ridiculously overblown style you adopt every time you post, the remarks in your last should definitely begin "Dear kettle" and end "yours, pot!"

Edited November 6, 200619 yr by GU22

Fracair,

Its all been said here and you've been given loads of good advice. Act on it !

A lot has been said on this thread around the issue of where you met her. Taking the wider view i have never understood the importance of that question. Why is it important ? People who met in a bar lie often about it , and no doubt loads of applications get into trouble over this one question . But why? I can't see why the question is even on the application form . When you met ...yes , but where ...i don't see it . Anyone know why this is of any importance at all? All i can think of is that there is some pre-conceived prejudice against those who are bargirls and met that way. But why? there is just as much (or little) chance of them returning to Thailand at the end of a trip as someone who works in Macdonalds in Sukhumvit Road.

atlastaname,

I too cannot see the importance of where we met, and it’s as you say often people lie mainly because they are fearful of the dim view that some people may take.

Take me for instance, I met my fiancée in a bar, she was not working at that bar and at the time I don’t think she was working at the time. She however has worked in a bar and does so now, she has only ever done service she does not go with farang. This has been confirmed by people I have met and by her two bosses at work.

We have talked about visa and she said to me that she was worried about working bar, not good image for visa, she asked maybe we say she work in restaurant and that we meet in restaurant. I now know through reading through this forum that the best policy on this is to tell the truth and that’s exactly what I intend to do.

I am now beginning to collate paperwork together, not sure how long it will take to have everything ready for submission, but hope to make application by 1st week of December.

I will as things develop keep this post updated, possibility is that I will still require further advice.

Rob

Hi Rob

I read your post when you first put it in the general forum and have kept an eye on your post here and I think you’re a pretty genuine guy. You do seem to wear your heart on your sleeve though and this can make you sound love struck or blinded by your emotions. I would like to say that although you have spent plenty of quality time with her in Thailand, you have still to spend any "not so quality" time with her in England. In other words, from the point of view of anybody reading your posts, by getting married to her on her first visit to England you are jumping in at the deep end with out taking swimming lessons.

There have been lots of horror stories that have exactly the same beginning as yours and I’d imagine that most of the guys from these stories can look back with hindsight and say “I was stupid”. This is probably the reason for most of the cynical posts. I’m not questioning your feelings for her or her feelings for you. If you count phone calls emails visits etc. you will have built more of a relationship with her than if you'd dated a girl from your home town once or twice a week for the same time period.

Have you thought about getting her over here on a visit visa for maybe a month to see if she likes the place. No matter how much she loves you, if she hates where she lives and is constantly homesick and miserable then you will be doomed to fail as a couple.

Sorry if this all sounds negative Rob. Your situation is similar to mine in some respects (and probably a lot of the other members at some stage). You say you want to spend the rest of your life with this girl and hopefully that will be a very long time so a bit of patience now will not do any harm.

Again, best of luck

Oh for goodness sake, enough is enough.

Fracair is a troll posting this tosh both here and elsewhere. The only difference being is that the membership of ' that other place ' seem to be infinitely more astute in spotting the charade and consequently giving him short shrift.

Most posters here are essentially nice chaps who mean well but in all frankness they are not necessarily the sharpest tools in the box.

Please, get a grip now. This thread is beginning to read like the problem page for simpering adolescents writing to a menopausal agony aunt in the Lady magazine circa 1953.

I’m sure "The “gent” means well, even w/ his “ridiculously overblown style” there are underlining genuine concerns for you, and don’t want to see you get hurt & become the latest statistic.

However you can not teach a blind man to see, and right now he is blindly in love – nothing he does is making any sense to many of us. We can't always judge the book by its cover. There are “his side”, “her side”, and “the truth”. Time will tell....If infact she is what many of us assumed her to be (using him to achieve her end, whichever that is),.... then let the lesson be learned…..if the experience doesn’t kill him, at least it will make him stronger.

Hi Gent

I had wondered if this OP was for real and, to be honest, I had decided he was. How thick am I?

If you could lend me your whet stone and tell me the name of "that other place" I would know for sure. I would really appreciate the enlightening.

Also, please accept my apologies for causing so much irritation with my post. I’ll try to be a bit sharper in future.

P.S. Have you ever watched the TV program “grumpy old gent”? Sorry, I mean “grumpy old men”?

Hi Gent

I had wondered if this OP was for real and, to be honest, I had decided he was. How thick am I?

Also, please accept my apologies for causing so much irritation with my post. I’ll try to be a bit sharper in future.

ling men, I am a little confused are you apologising to the gent for trying to help someone who in your opinion required help?

Just because we all do not have the time to frequent other boards is neither a criticism nor a failing, but possibly a realisation of having a life outside forums.

What is a very real irritation to me is people who frequent this sub-forum in particular and post pointless and potless cries for help when other people do find it a very traumatic time in their life.

What is possibly even more irritating is finding the gent probably right in his sleuthing, which does also have to put me into the position of also apologising to Thaipwriter in the first instance.

I have come to this position independently and not through the blunt words of the amanuensis, himself.

Good Luck

Moss

Guys

I have the gent saying that I have posted same post on another forum, well partly true. When I first became member I posted 1st post in the general section, I was informed that it would be better if I was to post here, so that’s what I did and this is the result, there is no other posts.

The post is totally legit, despite some people being quite brash and out spoken with their clever, less than welcome cynicisms.

You read this post; it’s easy for you to be cynical toward someone you don’t know, maybe if I were on the other side of this post I too would think this a bit fetched! But it’s fact.

When I first became engaged I looked at the possibility for me to marry and remain in Thailand, it was soon realised I could not, as the funds I have would only last 2 years tops without work, and I don’t have a skill that is in any demand, I would be broke and would have too return England with nothing.

Never once has my fiancée mention about going to England, when we realised that this was possibly our only option, we went for a meal and discussed the idea over dinner. Yes she has agreed to live in England with me because she loves me and for no other reason.

Visit visa not an option,, I feel with the love that we have for each other the embassy may see through this and think that she will not return to Thailand thus not grant visa, then I may be stuffed for fiancée visa.

If she is home sick and finds it difficult here then I will have no option but to re-evaluate my position and find a way into Thailand.

Rob

Oh for goodness sake, enough is enough.

Fracair is a troll posting this tosh both here and elsewhere. The only difference being is that the membership of ' that other place ' seem to be infinitely more astute in spotting the charade and consequently giving him short shrift.

The best way to deal with a troll in this situation is to deal with them as if they were genuine. That way a troll would get bored and go elsewhere to play their silly games.

If Fracair is a troll, and I have no reason to think that he is, then the only one feeding him is the Gent!

Please, get a grip now. This thread is beginning to read like the problem page for simpering adolescents writing to a menopausal agony aunt in the Lady magazine circa 1953.

If you don't care for a thread, don't read it! No one is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to read it!

I was trying to be sarcastic towards the gent. You might be right in what you say but you don’t have to be so nasty in the way you say it. You grumpy old man!!

I had read the previous post by Rob in the general section, it was the same as this one word for word and he was told to move it here.

We can’t be sure if Rob is for real or not, now I’m not sure. If he is for real he is a love struck falang and all the stories about a falang getting taken to cleaners involve that kind of falang.

Rob, your statement about the embassy seeing how much you love each other and not giving you a visit visa is either a sign that you are a troll or an idiot.

Visit visa not an option,, I feel with the love that we have for each other the embassy may see through this and think that she will not return to Thailand thus not grant visa, then I may be stuffed for fiancée visa.

Not right.

It is not unusual for couples in your position to apply for a visit visa so the Thai half can see what life would be like in the UK before making the commitment to live here permanently. In most cases, even if there is no 'reason to return', they are successful. If the embassy are satisfied that the relationship is genuine, and therefore the reason for the visit is genuine, then they will issue a visit visa if one is applied for; provided the maintenance and accommodation requirements are met, of course. This is because they feel that the applicant would not want to jeopardise a future settlement application by overstaying or otherwise breaking the conditions of a visit visa.

Even if they refused her a visit visa this would have no adverse effect on a subsequent settlement application. Having refused a visit visa because they felt that once in the UK she would seek to stay there with you, they could not then refuse a settlement visa because they had doubts about the relationship!

If you are both certain that marriage and settlement in the UK is what you want, then go for the fiance visa, or even marry in Thailand and then go for a spouse visa (cheaper in the long run). If still unsure, then go for a visit visa so she can spend some time in the UK with you before making the final commitment.

Ling men,

I think Fracair is neither troll nor an idiot. I may be wrong, but at the moment I will do him the courtesy of treating him as genuine.

However, he doesn't seem to know much about the UK immigration rules and procedures and so is seeking advice. He also seems worried by all the horror stories he has doubtless read on this and other forums about the "monsters" at the visa section, and so needs reassurance.

The OP has so many options his head must be spinning. Ignoring all the nasty/flame posts Fracair has several options , but the one i think he should go with having read all this is the visit visa. As GU22 says , you most definately CAN go for this visa as your situation is not different from thousands of others who have gone before you , largely successful. I can see no disadvantage for the OP in getting this visa .

After that you can always move on to the fiancee visa. Keep all your emotions, of which you have many, OUT of your application. The Embassy staff care nothing for your feelings so don't bother bringing that into it . Stick to factually presenting your case as best as you can after reading up on the requirements and remember to put the well -used but VERY useful bit in that GU22 so eloquently lays before you in his above post about not wanting to jepodise any future applications etc. Its a MUST.

Make your case as perfect as you can , make sure she knows and UNDERSTANDS everything she has written in the application and what all the documents mean. Make sure she knows all the dates , where she will stay , length of stay etc . Basic stuff. With a bit of luck you won't even have to go to interview . And if you do , lets hope she does avoid the "monsters" that lurk there.(although the biggest one is now in Taiwan)

Ling men,

I think Fracair is neither troll nor an idiot. I may be wrong, but at the moment I will do him the courtesy of treating him as genuine.

However, he doesn't seem to know much about the UK immigration rules and procedures and so is seeking advice. He also seems worried by all the horror stories he has doubtless read on this and other forums about the "monsters" at the visa section, and so needs reassurance.

GU22

Correct on all counts, thank you for giving me the benefit of doubt, by treating this post as genuine. I however never expected to draw such attention to my plight; all I wanted was advice to make an informed choice, and that I have the relevant criteria to meet the embassy’s approval.

Yes I am a bit green on immigration matters, I accept that others have had nightmares which could befall me, and I will take on board these pitfalls and to the best of my ability have a contingency plan to address them. My main concern at his time is to have in place all the correct documentation to support the fiancée visa.

I have already begun this process, I have bank statements and salary pay slips, I have contacted two people of standing for character references’ I have also asked my company for letter detailing my employment and future within the company.

Today I book day for wedding, it’s a provisional booking I have paperwork confirming booking. When she arrives in England at least 17 days before the ceremony we both have to go to Bury St Edmonds to finalise the wedding arrangements.

I agree with your concerns regarding visitors visa, it’s a possibility and I shall discuss this with her; however we both want marriage at the end of the day. I appreciate there is real concerns regarding her being home sick, or not liking England. If this is the case I will have to adopt a contingency plan for this which would involve me living in Thailand with her, there will always be a solution, a way forward.

I have met a girl that has changed my life completely; I am not about to let any hurdle we have to overcome stop us from being together.

Rob

Oh for goodness sake, enough is enough.

Fracair is a troll posting this tosh both here and elsewhere. The only difference being is that the membership of ' that other place ' seem to be infinitely more astute in spotting the charade and consequently giving him short shrift.

The best way to deal with a troll in this situation is to deal with them as if they were genuine. That way a troll would get bored and go elsewhere to play their silly games.

If Fracair is a troll, and I have no reason to think that he is, then the only one feeding him is the Gent!

Please, get a grip now. This thread is beginning to read like the problem page for simpering adolescents writing to a menopausal agony aunt in the Lady magazine circa 1953.

If you don't care for a thread, don't read it! No one is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to read it!

Oh dear!

If you and the other wittering buffoons wish to make <deleted> of yourselves then so be it but I can't help but think that in posting his spurious crap Fracair is feeding your own little egos in which case more power to him.

It is one thing to have knowledge and judgment but sadly there are those who cannot resist the temptation to trumpet their cause at every opportunity in order to reinforce the self belief they have something to offer over and above what they may bring to their own, rather mundane little lives.

As Solomon observed, ' vanity,vanity all is vanity '.

Toodle pip or should that be " tits and poodles ?"

Rob, homesickness can definitely be a problem in the early stages. She cannot work until after the marriage and she has obtained FLR. Even then, it may take her a while to find a job. This means she will be sat at home alone all day while you are working. It is going to be hard for her.

Obviously, you will try to find other Thais for her to meet. But don't make the mistake of thinking that just because they are both Thai they will want to be friends! Introduce her to other Thais, of course, but it is up to her if she wants to be friends with them.

See if you can find a source of Thai videos etc. close to you, you can also rent or buy them from Thailand Centre .

A good source of advice and information on life in the UK for Thais is the Thailand-UK Community.

It is one thing to have knowledge and judgment but sadly there are those who cannot resist the temptation to trumpet their cause at every opportunity in order to reinforce the self belief they have something to offer over and above what they may bring to their own, rather mundane little lives.

Well done, you have described yourself exactly.

As you were so quick to point out another's spelling error, you should know that it is spelt 'judgement'

I suggest that, as you find this thread so irritating, you don't bother reading it anymore.

When I first read Rob’s OP it was in the general topic forum and it read like it was written by a man about to get taken for a ride from one of Pattaya’s “hardened criminals”. They’re a cynical bunch on that forum and duly ripped him to shreads. When he put the same post on this forum I was glad to see the good guys here help him out with advice even stand up for him when the nasty posts started.

It is obvious that he has little knowledge of the visa system and his perception of reality has been altered by his new found love (nothing wrong with that, in fact, lucky him).For that reason he should be listening to the good advice given to him here. When he asked about agents 80% warned him against it but he decided to go ahead with the agent for nonsensical reasons. When he started talking about a fiancé visa he got advised to think about a visit visa, again he decided to ignore the advice for nonsensical reasons.

I gratefully received the advice from the guys here and without it I would NOT have got the visit visa for my girl.

Scouser, Atlastaname and GU22, I have a loads of respect for you because you give a lot here without return and that is real generosity. GU22, I appreciate what you say about giving Rob the benefit of the doubt but some of the things he has written are completely illogical, and that is frustrating.

Rob, if you are for real then try to get real. You’ve only known her when you’ve been on holiday and in that environment it hard not to have a good time. See how things go with the reality of having to get up for work and mundane every dayness before you sign your (and her) life away.

The gent, you really are a grumpy old man . If you are going to use big words at least use them in the proper context.

Edited November 8, 200619 yr by ling men

I think you both owe The Gent an apology.

I have found the posts that The Gent was talking about and it does indeed look like we have a troll here.

Well please PM me the site where the post has been made, I would really appreciate it

I think you both owe The Gent an apology.

I have found the posts that The Gent was talking about and it does indeed look like we have a troll here.

As said, please provide a link, then we can judge for ourselves.

(Odd first post ever in the immigration forum, isn't it?)

I am not sure what you meant by that comment GU22.

I apologise if you found my post offensive, I did not intend to offend anyone. I don't usually post on forums I only read them but I find it most annoying when some people ruin a perfectly good forum with their trolling.

I will go back to lurking now. Sorry.

Having read the same post by Rob in another forum I am certain he is a troll. I don't understand the mindset of trolls but there has been some good advice given out on this thread and it might benefit some genuine people.

Thanks for the PM 1man.

Of course, a gentleman would never seek or welcome anything so crass as an apology in these circumstances.

However, thank you to No 1 man for due diligence and your support.

I have never craved popularity in this forum or anywhere else for that matter, heaven forbid (!), but it's nice to know one has an angel from time to time.

GU22, if you look up your thesaurus or whatever lexicon you reference, you may find that ' judgment ' is listed as a variant.

Unlike you, I never cut and paste quotes to embarrass not least because I lack the technical skills and the inclination !!

Toodle pip!

P.S. To the grand scribe ....... Something from your repertoire redolent of the lovely Uma perhaps?

I feel there is little need for any apologies, except perhaps for my previous outburst, which I might add was a little ill conceived, poorly thought out and said in anger, apart from that it was fine.

I feel the gent is niether a grump nor an old man but has own way of putting things, which in most peoples view could be more eloquently put, but then he wouldn't be having fun and would find the post pointless.

Similarly, I find the posts of Trolls pointless and cannot figure why they do it and why on earth they cannot find something better to do, my irritation of said Trolls on this sub-forum is pretty well established, just because of the import of this forums nature.

The reason the posts solicit help, even when the post in there initial stages are outlandish to say the least, is because we all know the 'one eyed' ejits are out there and seem to proliferate with each following year.

The reason they can't function both Dick and Brain at the same time is because they do not have enough blood to function both simultaneously, use one and the other goes into submissive somnolence.

Because these need some kind of direction or heaven help the actual genuinely nice but dim types, people and I include myself here, will continue to give them the benefit of the doubt.

Gent, you know they are out there, or you need to come in from cloud cuckoo land and get that Angel of yours to give you a lift down.

BTW, you can post some pretty good advise as has been shown on some recent threads including mine, although that doesn't include your last vitriolic diatribe, I would suggest that it is better to build than destroy.

But then it wouldn't be so much fun would it.

Thanks for listening folks.

Good Luck

Moss

Odd that no one wants to post a link to this so-called proof that Rob is a troll.

Even if he did post this question on another forum, what does that prove? Nothing, except that he wants as much information as he can get. Lot's of people post the same question on different forums.

Of course, a gentleman would never seek or welcome anything so crass as an apology in these circumstances.

Even if an apology was due, a gentleman would not make such a comment.

GU22, if you look up your thesaurus or whatever lexicon you reference, you may find that ' judgment ' is listed as a variant.

I didn't realise you were a septic and so use their spellings. That explains a lot.

Unlike you, I never cut and paste quotes to embarrass

I have no need to do something which you manage so well on your own.

GU22,

Are you a woman?

Been away for a while,

I see there is still some debate as to whether or not my case is genuine.

For you disbelievers let me reiterate to you, this is genuine, I do intend to marry with or without help from this forum.

I am unfamiliar with he phrase troll; I can only think that you believe me to be a liar, yes my story reads a bit mills and bloom but I guarantee it to be 100% fact.

None of you know me or my fiancée; you have to take things on face value. I am sorry if I have not convinced some of you!

I will be going ahead with visa, some of you may wish to know how things progress others well what do they care.

I am not sure if I will continue this post due to the sadistic and destructive comments of a few.

Maybe all my lights may not be switched on but I am sure about her and at the end of the day that’s what it’s all about.

Rob

GU22,

Are you a woman?

What possible relevance does my gender have?

It appears that you are not just a prig; you are a sexist prig.

GU22,

Are you a woman?

What possible relevance does my gender have?

It appears that you are not just a prig; you are a sexist prig.

the gent is a talking toilet

GU22,

Are you a woman?

What possible relevance does my gender have?

It appears that you are not just a prig; you are a sexist prig.

the gent is a talking toilet

Just passing through, are we?