Send Video to Screens Downstairs

[OliverKlozerof]

I've started doing a music show in a room above a bar. The owner has some spare video cameras. I'd like to send video of live performers to 1) the projector on the ground floor outside that usually shows sports games on a big screen, and 2) also probably to a smaller TV in the bar downstairs. (So passersby can see what's happening on second floor, and so people in the bar can still see and hear who's playing upstairs.)

How to do? He has pretty good speed internet. I haven't seen his router, but obviously he has one. Maybe there are already ethernet cables running between upstairs and down. Should include both video and audio, in as close to real time as possible. Thx.

[Chicog]

Wire one of the video cameras to the downstairs TV.

You can get really long A/V cables.

[OliverKlozerof]

Wire one of the video cameras to the downstairs TV.

You can get really long A/V cables.

You mean like this?

http://www.amazon.com/Cmple-3-RCA-Composite-Video-Audio/dp/B003XRVW0Y

[lostinisaan]

Wire one of the video cameras to the downstairs TV.

You can get really long A/V cables.

You mean like this?

http://www.amazon.com/Cmple-3-RCA-Composite-Video-Audio/dp/B003XRVW0Y

YEP< that's an A/V cable.

[thedemon]

Agree that long A/V cables would be the easiest provided that the cables can be run.

But bear in mind that A/V will only carry a maximum of about 480p resolution not full HD. To get 1080p you probably need to use HDMI but then the cable length will likely be an issue. There are solutions for that problem though.

[Chicog]

We don't know what the video camera is yet, but then again 480p is enough for a pub tickler I would have thought.

[OliverKlozerof]

Agree that long A/V cables would be the easiest provided that the cables can be run.

But bear in mind that A/V will only carry a maximum of about 480p resolution not full HD. To get 1080p you probably need to use HDMI but then the cable length will likely be an issue. There are solutions for that problem though.

I'll have to ask him what resolution the cameras are...but 480p on a big outdoor projection screen sounds not very watchable. And that seems like pretty old technology. Youtube has 720p in between 480 and 1080. My new iPhone shoots 1080. Seems like we ought to be able to come up with something that shoots 1080 (or at least 720).

So, how to send something with higher res, like 720/1080? Right: I think HDMI cable that long would be real expensive...and maybe not even possible?? Some sort of encode/decode scheme over ethernet?

[thedemon]

Agree that long A/V cables would be the easiest provided that the cables can be run.

But bear in mind that A/V will only carry a maximum of about 480p resolution not full HD. To get 1080p you probably need to use HDMI but then the cable length will likely be an issue. There are solutions for that problem though.

I'll have to ask him what resolution the cameras are...but 480p on a big outdoor projection screen sounds not very watchable. And that seems like pretty old technology. Youtube has 720p in between 480 and 1080. My new iPhone shoots 1080. Seems like we ought to be able to come up with something that shoots 1080 (or at least 720).

So, how to send something with higher res, like 720/1080? Right: I think HDMI cable that long would be real expensive...and maybe not even possible?? Some sort of encode/decode scheme over ethernet?

Yes it's called something like "HDMI over Ethernet" which has a transceiver at either end and a pair of CAT5E/CAT6 ethernet cables in between.

Example: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-HDMI-Over-RJ45-CAT5e-CAT6-UTP-LAN-Ethernet-Extender-Repeater-1080p-3D-DI-/172126357446?hash=item281387c7c6:g:IaEAAOSwu1VW3r6Q

You are right about long HDMI cables. Expensive and over 10 metres they start to get iffy. I have used the ethernet solution in a home cinema for several years and had no issues at all.

EDIT: I just noticed that the example I linked to above is not independently powered. Presumably the transceivers draw power from the HDMI sockets and I'm not sure how well that would work. The ones I use look more like this (with power adapter at both ends): http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-HDMI-DVI-Balun-Extender-over-Cat-5e-6-Ethernet-Converter-1080p-to-196ft-60M/261113601314?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D36331%26meid%3D10af807c63e742a484c9f099e3c33e27%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D201381338220

[OliverKlozerof]

Yes it's called something like "HDMI over Ethernet" which has a transceiver at either end and a pair of CAT5E/CAT6 ethernet cables in between.

Example: http://www.ebay.com/...aEAAOSwu1VW3r6Q

You are right about long HDMI cables. Expensive and over 10 metres they start to get iffy. I have used the ethernet solution in a home cinema for several years and had no issues at all.

EDIT: I just noticed that the example I linked to above is not independently powered. Presumably the transceivers draw power from the HDMI sockets and I'm not sure how well that would work. The ones I use look more like this (with power adapter at both ends): http://www.ebay.com/...sd=201381338220

I also stumbled on these later. The owner said all his cameras are old (record onto tape cassettes), so now I think I'll have to get a camera, as well. I have a top-end Logitech webcam I'm not using that does 1080p, but it's USB. Guess I'll have to find a cheap HD camera that can output HDMI. Or, I wonder if there are converters from USB to HDMI.... Sheesh.

[IMHO]

Agree that long A/V cables would be the easiest provided that the cables can be run.

But bear in mind that A/V will only carry a maximum of about 480p resolution not full HD. To get 1080p you probably need to use HDMI but then the cable length will likely be an issue. There are solutions for that problem though.

I'll have to ask him what resolution the cameras are...but 480p on a big outdoor projection screen sounds not very watchable. And that seems like pretty old technology. Youtube has 720p in between 480 and 1080. My new iPhone shoots 1080. Seems like we ought to be able to come up with something that shoots 1080 (or at least 720).

So, how to send something with higher res, like 720/1080? Right: I think HDMI cable that long would be real expensive...and maybe not even possible?? Some sort of encode/decode scheme over ethernet?

Yes it's called something like "HDMI over Ethernet" which has a transceiver at either end and a pair of CAT5E/CAT6 ethernet cables in between.

Example: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-HDMI-Over-RJ45-CAT5e-CAT6-UTP-LAN-Ethernet-Extender-Repeater-1080p-3D-DI-/172126357446?hash=item281387c7c6:g:IaEAAOSwu1VW3r6Q

You are right about long HDMI cables. Expensive and over 10 metres they start to get iffy. I have used the ethernet solution in a home cinema for several years and had no issues at all.

EDIT: I just noticed that the example I linked to above is not independently powered. Presumably the transceivers draw power from the HDMI sockets and I'm not sure how well that would work. The ones I use look more like this (with power adapter at both ends): http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-HDMI-DVI-Balun-Extender-over-Cat-5e-6-Ethernet-Converter-1080p-to-196ft-60M/261113601314?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D36331%26meid%3D10af807c63e742a484c9f099e3c33e27%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D201381338220

I use HDMI over Ethernet for my projector, and it works fine. Forget about the unpowered ones - they're utter junk - I tried ones rated at 30M to relocate a True Visions box about 10M away from an AVR. It worked for about 10 minutes, before cooking the STB's HDMI output. Buy only powered ones and pay careful attention to the supported distance, and buy something that has plenty of overhead for the run.

The second boxes you linked to use 220V to 5V wall warts at each end, which is where you want to start looking. Some use only one wall wart at the transmitter end, and power the receiver using POE (power over ethernet). Also make sure to check the HDMI version supported - the better ones are HDMI 1.4 (still cheap) and HDMI 2.0 ($$$). If they don't say, they're probably only HDMI 1.0-1.3.

Both TX and RX can get hot, really hot, so make sure they're not stuffed into the back of an AV rack with no airflow.

[IMHO]

Or, I wonder if there are converters from USB to HDMI.... Sheesh.

Sure there are - they're called computers, hehe

There are standalone DVR's that provide HDMI out, but I've never seen one that directly supports USB cameras - the USB cams I've seen do nothing if not connected to a PC with appropriate drivers and software installed.

You might be able to get something like a Raspberry Pi to do the job though - check if the cam has Linux drivers/software.

[Chicog]

I still say an A/V cable is the easiest way, and there's no point in buying a camera with a better resolution than the projector.

[IMHO]

I still say an A/V cable is the easiest way, and there's no point in buying a camera with a better resolution than the projector.

Without knowing what resolution the projector, TV and cameras are, that's a tough call. You wouldn't use composite video cables if they're all 1080P - that would just look terrible.

[Chicog]

I still say an A/V cable is the easiest way, and there's no point in buying a camera with a better resolution than the projector.

Without knowing what resolution the projector, TV and cameras are, that's a tough call. You wouldn't use composite video cables if they're all 1080P - that would just look terrible.

Au contraire, it would give it that authentic '70's look.

Chuck in some platform boots and Hey Presto!

[OliverKlozerof]

I use HDMI over Ethernet for my projector, and it works fine. Forget about the unpowered ones - they're utter junk - I tried ones rated at 30M to relocate a True Visions box about 10M away from an AVR. It worked for about 10 minutes, before cooking the STB's HDMI output. Buy only powered ones and pay careful attention to the supported distance, and buy something that has plenty of overhead for the run.

The second boxes you linked to use 220V to 5V wall warts at each end, which is where you want to start looking. Some use only one wall wart at the transmitter end, and power the receiver using POE (power over ethernet). Also make sure to check the HDMI version supported - the better ones are HDMI 1.4 (still cheap) and HDMI 2.0 ($$$). If they don't say, they're probably only HDMI 1.0-1.3.

Both TX and RX can get hot, really hot, so make sure they're not stuffed into the back of an AV rack with no airflow.

Did you get your powered ones in Thailand? If so, where?

[IMHO]

I use HDMI over Ethernet for my projector, and it works fine. Forget about the unpowered ones - they're utter junk - I tried ones rated at 30M to relocate a True Visions box about 10M away from an AVR. It worked for about 10 minutes, before cooking the STB's HDMI output. Buy only powered ones and pay careful attention to the supported distance, and buy something that has plenty of overhead for the run.

The second boxes you linked to use 220V to 5V wall warts at each end, which is where you want to start looking. Some use only one wall wart at the transmitter end, and power the receiver using POE (power over ethernet). Also make sure to check the HDMI version supported - the better ones are HDMI 1.4 (still cheap) and HDMI 2.0 ($$$). If they don't say, they're probably only HDMI 1.0-1.3.

Both TX and RX can get hot, really hot, so make sure they're not stuffed into the back of an AV rack with no airflow.

Did you get your powered ones in Thailand? If so, where?

My original powered ones were bought on Lazada, and worked well for my old 1080P projector (~25M) / currently work well for the Truevisions STB (~10M):

http://www.lazada.co.th/oem-hdmi-extender-lan-cat-5e-6-60m-full-hd-14-black-3531245.html

After I upgraded to a 4K projector, I bought some Wolfpack branded HDMI 2.0 ones from the states, but they were 7x the price, so you don't buy them unless you have to

[OliverKlozerof]

I use HDMI over Ethernet for my projector, and it works fine. Forget about the unpowered ones - they're utter junk - I tried ones rated at 30M to relocate a True Visions box about 10M away from an AVR. It worked for about 10 minutes, before cooking the STB's HDMI output. Buy only powered ones and pay careful attention to the supported distance, and buy something that has plenty of overhead for the run.

The second boxes you linked to use 220V to 5V wall warts at each end, which is where you want to start looking. Some use only one wall wart at the transmitter end, and power the receiver using POE (power over ethernet). Also make sure to check the HDMI version supported - the better ones are HDMI 1.4 (still cheap) and HDMI 2.0 ($$$). If they don't say, they're probably only HDMI 1.0-1.3.

Both TX and RX can get hot, really hot, so make sure they're not stuffed into the back of an AV rack with no airflow.

Did you get your powered ones in Thailand? If so, where?

My original powered ones were bought on Lazada, and worked well for my old 1080P projector (~25M) / currently work well for the Truevisions STB (~10M):

http://www.lazada.co.th/oem-hdmi-extender-lan-cat-5e-6-60m-full-hd-14-black-3531245.html

After I upgraded to a 4K projector, I bought some Wolfpack branded HDMI 2.0 ones from the states, but they were 7x the price, so you don't buy them unless you have to

Went to Fortune Town yesterday, but of course one of the main video-oriented shops was still closed for Songkran.

All this is very new to me...I asked a few questions at the CCTV shops...one shop had a pretty amazing CCTV camera that was digital--4k resolution!--and looked great on the monitor (all the others, as you probably know, are analog). The digital camera was B12,000. It plugged into a box that cost B10,000 via (pretty sure he said) an ethernet cable! Then you plug the box into your TV (or whatever) using HDMI cable. So, that seems like another option.

I should find out the resolution of the owner's projector. The outside screen is big (10' x 10'?), and the image on it is pretty crisp...so it seems like it must be more than 1080p...?

[IMHO]

I use HDMI over Ethernet for my projector, and it works fine. Forget about the unpowered ones - they're utter junk - I tried ones rated at 30M to relocate a True Visions box about 10M away from an AVR. It worked for about 10 minutes, before cooking the STB's HDMI output. Buy only powered ones and pay careful attention to the supported distance, and buy something that has plenty of overhead for the run.

The second boxes you linked to use 220V to 5V wall warts at each end, which is where you want to start looking. Some use only one wall wart at the transmitter end, and power the receiver using POE (power over ethernet). Also make sure to check the HDMI version supported - the better ones are HDMI 1.4 (still cheap) and HDMI 2.0 ($$$). If they don't say, they're probably only HDMI 1.0-1.3.

Both TX and RX can get hot, really hot, so make sure they're not stuffed into the back of an AV rack with no airflow.

Did you get your powered ones in Thailand? If so, where?

My original powered ones were bought on Lazada, and worked well for my old 1080P projector (~25M) / currently work well for the Truevisions STB (~10M):

http://www.lazada.co.th/oem-hdmi-extender-lan-cat-5e-6-60m-full-hd-14-black-3531245.html

After I upgraded to a 4K projector, I bought some Wolfpack branded HDMI 2.0 ones from the states, but they were 7x the price, so you don't buy them unless you have to

Went to Fortune Town yesterday, but of course one of the main video-oriented shops was still closed for Songkran.

All this is very new to me...I asked a few questions at the CCTV shops...one shop had a pretty amazing CCTV camera that was digital--4k resolution!--and looked great on the monitor (all the others, as you probably know, are analog). The digital camera was B12,000. It plugged into a box that cost B10,000 via (pretty sure he said) an ethernet cable! Then you plug the box into your TV (or whatever) using HDMI cable. So, that seems like another option.

I should find out the resolution of the owner's projector. The outside screen is big (10' x 10'?), and the image on it is pretty crisp...so it seems like it must be more than 1080p...?

If the screen is actually square (1:1 aspect ratio) it's unlikely it's a very high resolution projector - the 1080P are 4K ones are typically 16:9 or 2.35:1. In my HT room I have a 120" (diagonal) 16:9 screen and 1080P looked pretty good - much better than you would expect. The 4K looks awesome of course, but light output is noticeably lower so requires a very dark room to be effective.

My guess is they probably have a 1080P high lumens model.

4K cameras aren't hard to find these days.. 5000 Baht will buy you a 4K action cam for example.