Holocaust survivors welcome conviction of Auschwitz guard Reinhold Hanning

[rooster59]

Holocaust survivors welcome conviction of Auschwitz guard Reinhold Hanning



A former Auschwitz guard has been sentenced to five years in jail after being convicted over his role at the Nazi death camp, in what is likely to be one of Germany’s last Holocaust trials.

Reinhold Hanning, now 94, was found guilty of being an accessory to the murder of at least 170,000 people.

The four-month trial in the western city of Detmold included testimony from around a dozen Holocaust survivors who described their horrific experiences.

Hanning apologised to them at the end of April, saying he regretted being part of a “criminal organisation” that had killed so many and caused so much suffering.

More than a million people, mostly Jews, were killed at Auschwitz in Nazi-occupied Poland more than 70 years ago.

The former guard was not charged with direct involvement in the mass murder. But he admitted he knew what was going on and did nothing to oppose it.

Prosecutors said he met prisoners at the camp and may have escorted some to the gas chambers.

The defence said Hanning should be acquitted as the former SS officer had personally never killed, beaten or abused anyone.

Evidence of direct involvement in killings used to be required for convictions in such cases, but in recent years courts have accepted lesser criteria.

Survivors’ organisations and the World Jewish Congress have welcomed the verdict.

Besides Hanning, one other man and one woman in the nineties are accused of being accessories to the mass murder at Auschwitz. A third man who was an SS guard at the camp died in April, days before his trial was due to start.

-- (c) Copyright Euronews 2016-06-18

[ukrules]

When they run out of 'guards' to prosecute who will be next on the list ?

The logical end game / conclusion to this whole idiocy would be to prosecute every German who was alive at the time yet did nothing to stop what they may or may not have known about. This could include Jewish people of course.

This is a complete waste of time and resources and will do nothing to reign in the rising tide of anti semitism which is rapidly growing in Europe.

Then again, it's obviously politically motivated and maybe this is by design.

Edited June 17, 2016 by ukrules

[ezzra]

ukrules, on 18 Jun 2016 - 06:06, said:

When they run out of 'guards' to prosecute who will be next on the list ?

The logical end game / conclusion to this whole idiocy would be to prosecute every German who was alive at the time yet did nothing to stop what they may or may not have known about. This could include Jewish people of course.

This is a complete waste of time and resources and will do nothing to reign in the rising tide of anti semitism which is rapidly growing in Europe.

Then again, it's obviously politically motivated and maybe this is by design.

Unfortunately, they can only find guards to prosecute for their crimes of genocide as many countries, individuals and world institutions has given shelter to many of theNazis leadership top brass,

So, in your opinion it is " idiocy " not prosecute crimeless just because they're old? would you say the same if your family member was murdered and it took many years to find the murderer, would you do? let him go because it happened many years ago?......

[taotoo]

As far as I know he didn't physcially murder anybody, maybe he was an accessory to murder, just as countless other Germans might have been. Not sure if he was conscripted or not, but he probably didn't choose his posting. I find it odd that first he's meant to follow orders handed down from the state, and now the state is imprisoning him for having done so. Not sure how the Nazis dealt with conscientious objectors, but can't blame him for not wanting to find out. Still, good way for the state to shift collective guilt.

[maximillian]

Many cases of low ranking soldiers being accused and convicted while high ranking judges of the regime could become "Ministerpresident" in Federal Republic of Germany. Double standards at its best.

[biplanebluey]

I sometimes wonder who has' found' a person like this,how much effort over many yrs has it taken---and is the end result mean that thousands of people can rest easy now------- no really

[GuestHouse]

As far as I know he didn't physcially murder anybody, maybe he was an accessory to murder, just as countless other Germans might have been. Not sure if he was conscripted or not, but he probably didn't choose his posting. I find it odd that first he's meant to follow orders handed down from the state, and now the state is imprisoning him for having done so. Not sure how the Nazis dealt with conscientious objectors, but can't blame him for not wanting to find out. Still, good way for the state to shift collective guilt.

You'd be stretching it to claim that the German state under the Nazis is the German state of today or that the modern German state has somehow shifted collective guilt for the holocaust and other crimes committed by the German state and military during WWII.

[dick dasterdly]

I can understand those who suffered and their descendants wishing to prosecute everyone involved in the horror, but ordinary soldiers are not given any choice - other than do as you're told, or be shot.

Consequently, if there's no evidence that this man was savage towards those in the concentration camp or actually killed anyone - it seems OTT to prosecute an ordinary soldier.

Its made more depressing as so many who were genuinely responsible for the atrocities got away with no punishment at all.

[Morch]

Reinhold Hanning volunteered for service in the SS.

Those feeling sorry for him due to his age, may want to reflect on witnesses attending the trial being as old.

Whether locking him up, at this point and at his age, does anyone any good - I can't say. Not a survivor, and heard differing opinions on that with regard to previous similar cases.

I think what's important here is expressed in this bit:

His hands trembling and his voice shaking, Schwarzbaum looked directly at Hanning and delivered an emotional plea: “Mr Hanning, we are virtually the same age and soon we will face our final judge. I would like to ask you to tell the historical truth here, just as I am. Tell the truth about what you and your colleagues did.”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/feb/11/auschwitz-guard-trial-concentration-camp-germany-reinhold-hanning

[dick dasterdly]

I missed that he was a member of the SS, so agree that he deserved to be imprisoned.

[Rancid]

Can certainly understand survivors wanting to see justice after the he'll they went through.

Interesting that "just following orders" was rejected as an excuse at Nuremburg, however when whistle-blowers in the US like Snowden etc do not "just follow orders" and try to fight against perceived wrongdoing they are vilified, pursued or jailed. Hmm.

So does that mean the excuse is not valid for Nazis but in fact is required procedure for the US?

[Jingthing]

It's not long before all the survivors and all the Nazis have passed.

In the meantime, I'm not going to go against what seems to be the feelings of the vast majority of survivors about such convictions.

More than once I have heard from them, it's not up to me to forgive for those that DIDN'T survive. Makes sense to me.

[soc]

"-he knew what was going on but did nothing to stop it" or words to that effect.

l'm not defending the system at that time, but what exactly was he supposed to do(to stop it)?

lf he had actively assisted the prisoners, he would have soon joined them or been shot.

lf he felt guilty or sympathy for the prisoners at at all, he could have tried to assist them to escape, if that was possible.

He would have soon been found out & then shot. l suppose he could have committed suicide.

Whatever, l would hate to find myself in his situation.

Of course, he may well have enjoyed every bit of his duties.

?

[SheungWan]

Statement from Hanning, a sergeant in the SS, not an 'ordinary' soldier, read out in court:

“People were shot, gassed and burned. I could see how corpses were taken back and forth or moved out. I could smell the burning bodies.”

[wooloomooloo]

Statement from Hanning, a sergeant in the SS, not an 'ordinary' soldier, read out in court:

People were shot, gassed and burned. I could see how corpses were taken back and forth or moved out. I could smell the burning bodies.

Somebody had to shift the bodies, as harsh as it sounds.

[ukrules]

Every German citizen of age at the time should be arrested and imprisoned because they didn't stop it from happening.

Does that sound right ? Because that's what appears to be happening...

Note - there are many more trials coming soon.

Edited June 18, 2016 by ukrules

[Jingthing]

Every German citizen of age at the time should be arrested and imprisoned because they didn't stop it from happening.

Does that sound right ? Because that's what appears to be happening...

Note - there are many more trials coming soon.

-- No they shouldn't.

-- No, that doesn't sound right.

-- That appears that way to not one single sane person in the entire world.

-- "Many" more trials soon? Source please.

[ukrules]

Every German citizen of age at the time should be arrested and imprisoned because they didn't stop it from happening.

Does that sound right ? Because that's what appears to be happening...

Note - there are many more trials coming soon.

-- No they shouldn't.

-- No, that doesn't sound right.

-- That appears that way to not one single sane person in the entire world.

-- "Many" more trials soon? Source please.

You will read about them over the coming months as these 90+ year olds are dragged through the court system.

All you need to do is wait, there's a long line of these old geezers being lined up for prosecution.

If you want to know right now all you need to do is some extensive research, or just wait for the headlines...

[Jingthing]

Sorry, dude. You kind of lost credibility with your grand predictions with your weak attempt at wit, I suppose, suggesting every German alive then is being prosecuted.

You make an announcement and then we're supposed to do research? You do realize how WEAK that sounds.

"Long" line? Got a number, dude? What percentage of those alive then would that be then?

[ukrules]

Sorry, dude. You kind of lost credibility with your grand predictions with your weak attempt at wit, I suppose, suggesting every German alive then is being prosecuted.

You make an announcement and then we're supposed to do research? You do realize how WEAK that sounds.

"Long" line? Got a number, dude? What percentage of those alive then would that be then?

I don't require credibility, there are more pending prosecutions, that's all I'm saying.

[Jingthing]

Hilarious! You've gone down from everyone alive there then to pending prosecutions with that being plural would indicate at least TWO.

Back to reality. Thank you.

[ukrules]

Hilarious! You've gone down from everyone alive there then to pending prosecutions with that being plural would indicate at least TWO.

Back to reality. Thank you.

I'm pretty sure there are way more than two but I read the article a few days ago and it was not full of details.

There are for sure many prosecutions which are going to happen in the near future.

I would like to cite a source but I simply don't have one to hand right now. Maybe I'll revisit this subject and add some additional information. What I read described a process whereby Nazis during the WWII era were previously assumed to have been forced to do their jobs, this is no longer the case. This makes a big difference in law and now allows prosecution.

It is an important subject and I think we both know there will be media coverage of the prosecutions and subsequent trials when they happen.

As to coming back to reality, where do you draw the line ?

Edited June 18, 2016 by ukrules

[Jingthing]

It's kind of now or soon or never, innit?

[ukrules]

It's kind of now or soon or never, innit?

Yes, it is.

[Andaman Al]

Reinhold Hanning volunteered for service in the SS.

Those feeling sorry for him due to his age, may want to reflect on witnesses attending the trial being as old.

Whether locking him up, at this point and at his age, does anyone any good - I can't say. Not a survivor, and heard differing opinions on that with regard to previous similar cases.

I think what's important here is expressed in this bit:

His hands trembling and his voice shaking, Schwarzbaum looked directly at Hanning and delivered an emotional plea: “Mr Hanning, we are virtually the same age and soon we will face our final judge. I would like to ask you to tell the historical truth here, just as I am. Tell the truth about what you and your colleagues did.”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/feb/11/auschwitz-guard-trial-concentration-camp-germany-reinhold-hanning

Well my Great Uncle volunteered for service in the RAF and was a bomber Pilot who took part in the firebombing of Dresden amongst other missions. The Brits and Americans killed over 600 000 innocent German civilians in conventional bombings and if we had lost the war, then by your standards my Great Uncle would have been jailed or hanged for war crimes. Those who write history determine who are the bad guys. Jailing this man does not 'protect society' and at the end of the day, war is a crappy business. I am glad that with two or more 90 year olds to go, the Simon Wiesenthal Investigative teams will soon be out of a job and maybe the world can consign this nasty event to history (it is but one of a thousand such events since man learned you can crack another mans skull with a stone). It is time we allowed the German people to move on.

[hdkane]

As far as I know he didn't physcially murder anybody, maybe he was an accessory to murder, just as countless other Germans might have been. Not sure if he was conscripted or not, but he probably didn't choose his posting. I find it odd that first he's meant to follow orders handed down from the state, and now the state is imprisoning him for having done so. Not sure how the Nazis dealt with conscientious objectors, but can't blame him for not wanting to find out. Still, good way for the state to shift collective guilt.

Thanks for your insightful comments...I'm from the USA, and so many people suffer from unearned collective guilt about slavery...so your comment made it easy for me to make a connection and better understand what this sad case may actually be about...

[Morch]

Incarcerating a 94 year old man isn't justice - it is revenge.

As in, an eye for an eye until the whole world is blind.

...​Promise was that I,

​Should Israel from Phillistian yoke deliver;

​Ask for this great deliverer now, and find him,

​Eyeless in Gaza at the mill with slaves.

The survivors are about the same age. Those that did not survive will not reach this age.

Eye for an eye how? Hanning is not about to be executed, tortured or experience any of the horrors he described in his own testimony.

Eye for an eye would mean a whole lot more of people even standing trial, which did not happen. On second thought, strike that....neither survivors nor victims of the Nazi camps had a fair trial (or any trial, at that).

[Morch]

Every German citizen of age at the time should be arrested and imprisoned because they didn't stop it from happening.

Does that sound right ? Because that's what appears to be happening...

Note - there are many more trials coming soon.

No, it does not sound right, sounds like hyperbole.

Not every German of similar age volunteered to the SS, not all served in the concentration camps.

Do tell about those "many more trials coming soon".

[Morch]

Reinhold Hanning volunteered for service in the SS.

Those feeling sorry for him due to his age, may want to reflect on witnesses attending the trial being as old.

Whether locking him up, at this point and at his age, does anyone any good - I can't say. Not a survivor, and heard differing opinions on that with regard to previous similar cases.

I think what's important here is expressed in this bit:

His hands trembling and his voice shaking, Schwarzbaum looked directly at Hanning and delivered an emotional plea: “Mr Hanning, we are virtually the same age and soon we will face our final judge. I would like to ask you to tell the historical truth here, just as I am. Tell the truth about what you and your colleagues did.”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/feb/11/auschwitz-guard-trial-concentration-camp-germany-reinhold-hanning

Well my Great Uncle volunteered for service in the RAF and was a bomber Pilot who took part in the firebombing of Dresden amongst other missions. The Brits and Americans killed over 600 000 innocent German civilians in conventional bombings and if we had lost the war, then by your standards my Great Uncle would have been jailed or hanged for war crimes. Those who write history determine who are the bad guys. Jailing this man does not 'protect society' and at the end of the day, war is a crappy business. I am glad that with two or more 90 year olds to go, the Simon Wiesenthal Investigative teams will soon be out of a job and maybe the world can consign this nasty event to history (it is but one of a thousand such events since man learned you can crack another mans skull with a stone). It is time we allowed the German people to move on.

Your Great Uncle was taking part in a war. Civilian casualties are an accepted, if lamented, fact of modern warfare. In contrast, what took place in the Nazi concentration camps had nothing to do with war, but was outright organized murder and slaughter of civilians.

Sending Hanning to prison is not about "protecting society", and nobody made this claim. It is simply deemed, at least in some countries, that the statute of limitations does not apply for certain offenses. While I agree that sending a 94 years old man to prison is questionable, it bears remembering that those survivors still around are about the same age.

The quote previously linked relates directly to your last lines. Some would like to forget and erase history, some see a value in remembrance.

Interesting to note that Hanning himself seems to be making less excuses for himself, and is willing to accept more responsibility compared with some posters.

[ukrules]

Many more trials are coming, here's why.

For a little background on why this is the case first read this - : http://time.com/4186602/prosecute-last-surviving-nazis/


The precedent was changed and set during the trial of trial of John Demjanjuk not so long ago and the bar to prosecution for a lot of people who worked at these concentration camps was lifted, this activated a number of cases which would not have been possible before. They are ongoing, being planned and in the pre-planning stage.

Demjanjuk’s case was supposed to be the last big Nazi trial in Germany. Instead, it set a precedent that continues to be used to this day, leading to further prosecutions of those who were indirectly involved in the Holocaust, most often as guards assigned to one of the six death camps.

So the law has changed in recent years and there's now people working towards further prosecutions.