Even though we voted for it, a Brexit won't happen in the end. Here's why

[NeverSure]

So. If the young people of the UK were attacked by a Hitler today would they fight back or would they wind up being lampshades and bars of soap? In the end I think they'd fight back but they'd have to change their mindset some.

Cheers.

You are saying that the EU is another Hitler?

No it's another Brexiteer fool insinuating that Europeans are cowards and would surrender to another facist regime. Pathetic.

I think you need to learn to read.

Cheers.

[Grouse]

...

Also, note UK pound has fallen 10% so that would make UK cars cheaper to buy.

Depends on where all the car parts are made...

Yes that's right. But the main point is that tariffs are low, and a common sense solution would point to there perobably being none at all, though quite how that will be fudged I don't know.

I'm only taking this from surface knowlwdge but I think UK is Europe's number one trading partner in Europe (possibly the world I don't know), and EU enjoys a healthy trade surplus.

One thing I can definitely say is that in business it's not a good idea to start a war with your best customer, either way. And UK certainly is not in a position to want to lose export custom either.

It all points to an amicable settlement.

The only problem with that is if they agree to a settlement that demands less obligations of the UK but the same privileges, other EU members are going to want the same.

I don't pretend to know the solution. But I imagine there will be aface saver for both parties.

EU really must reform its open border policy, it really must. And UK is not opposed to immigration per se, just wants control.

IMO, we both really need each other.

WE NEED a face saver because our European "friends" would like to give us a face SLAP thanks to that ape Farage. I predict a sticky demise for him.

[Grouse]

So. If the young people of the UK were attacked by a Hitler today would they fight back or would they wind up being lampshades and bars of soap? In the end I think they'd fight back but they'd have to change their mindset some.

Cheers.

You are saying that the EU is another Hitler?

No it's another Brexiteer fool insinuating that Europeans are cowards and would surrender to another facist regime. Pathetic.

I think you need to learn to read.

Cheers.

I stand corrected! Where's my specs...

[jope]

Andrea Leadsom stands for PM job she nails her colours to the mast, she gives Brexit hope

I hope somebody nails her to the mast

What an evil bitch, she makes Thatcher look like mother Teresa!

She stands no chance

I vote conservative (Germany, CDU). Then I read some articles about the Tory candidates. It was ... interesting. It seems that conservative parties in Germany and Britain are two different worlds. I regard myself center right but to them I am probably a disgusting communist.

[Basil B]

[jope]

...

Also, note UK pound has fallen 10% so that would make UK cars cheaper to buy.

Depends on where all the car parts are made...

Yes that's right. But the main point is that tariffs are low, and a common sense solution would point to there perobably being none at all, though quite how that will be fudged I don't know.

I'm only taking this from surface knowlwdge but I think UK is Europe's number one trading partner in Europe (possibly the world I don't know), and EU enjoys a healthy trade surplus.

One thing I can definitely say is that in business it's not a good idea to start a war with your best customer, either way. And UK certainly is not in a position to want to lose export custom either.

It all points to an amicable settlement.

The only problem with that is if they agree to a settlement that demands less obligations of the UK but the same privileges, other EU members are going to want the same.

I don't pretend to know the solution. But I imagine there will be aface saver for both parties.

EU really must reform its open border policy, it really must. And UK is not opposed to immigration per se, just wants control.

IMO, we both really need each other.

WE NEED a face saver because our European "friends" would like to give us a face SLAP thanks to that ape Farage. I predict a sticky demise for him.

It seems that he reached his goal. So, in principle no need for a UKIP anymore. How will he justify the further existence of his party, I wonder?

[Grouse]

One of Britain's most famous fund managers is bullish on Brexit

One of the UK's most famous fund managers, Neil Woodford, says that Brits need to look beyond the short-term fears hitting the markets following the country's vote to leave the European Union, and focus on the long-term gains that can be made as a result of Brexit.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/neil-woodford-on-the-market-impact-of-brexit-and-the-eu-referendum-2016-6

Brexit gives the UK the freedom to maneuver, take advantage of, and participate in financial and cultural trends that it will take the EU a decade to recognize and another decade to act upon. This gives the economy alacrity. Meanwhile, across the channel, Eurosclerosis sets in with a vengeance. Brexit means opportunity. The EU means a moribund, lifeless disaster. The UK has just cut itself free of a cement block that has just gone into the ocean.

If the pound continuous to fall, our unemployed will be able to get manual work in Romania! Oh, wait, we won't be in the EU....

[uptheos]

Good old Boris leads us out into chaos and then decides not to stand after being stabbed in the back by Gove, they really are showing their Laurel and Hardy colours. The smart money now is on low key remainer Theresa May, longest serving Home Secretary in the last century, who said in her speech today "Brexit means Brexit". Be interesting who Boris supporters throw their support behind, surely not Gove?

[Grouse]

"So, what's wrong with the Chinese buying up London? ".

Personally I have nothing against the Chinese, my wife is a Chinese/Thai hiso and I think they're great people.

But a gentlemen poster was complaining earlier about what's happening on the street in the UK, in London those streets used to house Brits, then Europeans, then various nationalities in different areas, then Russians and now Chinese. Friends tell me, and this confirmed by the media, that the price of property in London is now such that many wealthy foreigners can't afford to live there, many are now scouting and buying into the larger more desirable cities of the UK. As for the native Brits, well, they've been forced to rent in an increasing number of cases, especially the young as they are priced out of the market.

It seems to me that whilst we're making the UK attractive to foreign purchasers of everything in the country, especially the housing stock (not sold to wealth creators) , we don't care about the availability and affordability of housing for our own citizens. So it seems distinctly odd, if not totally bizarre, to complain about how the high cost of Eu membership and the negative effects of UK immigration whilst at the same time we're selling the country in parts to any foreigner who wants to buy it, a process that was just accelerated by the Brexit vote.

Thypical Chang Mai post. My wife is Thai/Chinese "hi so" . Is it relevant to this discussion that YOU think she is, I repeat "HI -SO" what snobbishness, but what can we expect from a mill owners son.

So you don't do satire NB, I was going to put a silly little smiley after that phrase and and add that I was special forces then I thought no, even the most imbecilic of posters who've been on TVF for any period of time will recognise that as oft repeated Thai Visa humour subject matter, seemingly not. Ah well, never mind.

And it's odd for an Englishman not to get that type of humour, are you absolutely certain you're a Brit. NB and not something else?

Anyway, 'ave to get back t' mill t'see t'lads, a'fore you know it they'll all be on their uppers and wanting a raise, bloody peasants, who do they think they are eh!

Hilarious!

I'm in York now, following Winchester and 'arrogate before that. Still not come across a genuine Brexiteer prepared to admit as much. Even on my lunch trip to Belgravia, not one. Odd eh?

[jope]

For historical reasons I am reluctant to "Like This". But I had to laugh nevertheless.

[Thaiwine]

"So, what's wrong with the Chinese buying up London? ".

Personally I have nothing against the Chinese, my wife is a Chinese/Thai hiso and I think they're great people.

But a gentlemen poster was complaining earlier about what's happening on the street in the UK, in London those streets used to house Brits, then Europeans, then various nationalities in different areas, then Russians and now Chinese. Friends tell me, and this confirmed by the media, that the price of property in London is now such that many wealthy foreigners can't afford to live there, many are now scouting and buying into the larger more desirable cities of the UK. As for the native Brits, well, they've been forced to rent in an increasing number of cases, especially the young as they are priced out of the market.

It seems to me that whilst we're making the UK attractive to foreign purchasers of everything in the country, especially the housing stock (not sold to wealth creators) , we don't care about the availability and affordability of housing for our own citizens. So it seems distinctly odd, if not totally bizarre, to complain about how the high cost of Eu membership and the negative effects of UK immigration whilst at the same time we're selling the country in parts to any foreigner who wants to buy it, a process that was just accelerated by the Brexit vote.

Thypical Chang Mai post. My wife is Thai/Chinese "hi so" . Is it relevant to this discussion that YOU think she is, I repeat "HI -SO" what snobbishness, but what can we expect from a mill owners son.

So you don't do satire NB, I was going to put a silly little smiley after that phrase and and add that I was special forces then I thought no, even the most imbecilic of posters who've been on TVF for any period of time will recognise that as oft repeated Thai Visa humour subject matter, seemingly not. Ah well, never mind.

And it's odd for an Englishman not to get that type of humour, are you absolutely certain you're a Brit. NB and not something else?

Anyway, 'ave to get back t' mill t'see t'lads, a'fore you know it they'll all be on their uppers and wanting a raise, bloody peasants, who do they think they are eh!

Hilarious!

I'm in York now, following Winchester and 'arrogate before that. Still not come across a genuine Brexiteer prepared to admit as much. Even on my lunch trip to Belgravia, not one. Odd eh?

No your not going to meet any in the gentlemens clubs sipping g and t's.

[MJP]

Heseltine on Boris . . .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/video_and_audio/headlines/36677623

[bkkcanuck8]

Heseltine on Boris . . .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/video_and_audio/headlines/36677623

very fair appraisal

[Thaiwine]

Andrea Leadsom stands for PM job she nails her colours to the mast, she gives Brexit hope

I hope somebody nails her to the mast

What an evil bitch, she makes Thatcher look like mother Teresa!

She stands no chance

It sounds like she might be just the person for the job, so I'll give her a 10

Number 10

[SheungWan]

Heseltine on Boris . . .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/video_and_audio/headlines/36677623

very fair appraisal

Scathing coup de grace.

[WhamBam]

2 to 1 ratio say they are happy with BREXIT and do not want another referendu.... YouGov poll. Tells a lot.

We will leave. If we do not leave, there will be more bloodletting than there was in the Tory Party on Thursday.

[happy Joe]

Also, note UK pound has fallen 10% so that would make UK cars cheaper to buy.

The pound has lost 10% of its value in the last episode.

But she had already lost 5% before in anticipation of the Brexit risk.

July 2015 -1 pound = $ 1.57

July 2016 -1 pound = $ 1.33

In one year the British currency lost 15%.

GDP in 2015 = 1800 billion pounds = 2.826 trillion dollars

GDP in 2016 = 1800 billion pounds = 2.394 trillion dollars

Net loss in dollars 432 billion.

All this to specify that speaks well of a major financial disaster that will not be recovered quickly as some advertise.

The price of the protectionist demagogy by especially poor leaders and perhaps also for some a little xenophobia.

[JAG]

Frankly the present turmoil in both parties is irrelevant to the act of leaving the EU. Whoever comes out top in the Tory party will influence how it is managed over the next two years, but this won't change the fact that we have decided to leave.

For as long as I can remember the EU has been a constant argument in Parliament. Treaties have been signed, institutions created, powers transferred to Brussels and court decisions, made by judges from outside our jurisdiction have been followed, all with lots of debate and arguments amongst politicians but without ever having been put to the electorate. The Lisbon Treaty was a classic example, bitterly opposed by many inside and outside parliament, signed "on the hoof" in a hotel room without any proper debate. The topic of Europe and our membership of the EU was avoided by the major contestants (with the possible exception of the Liberal Democrats )at every General Election.

Then, probably as a result of a political miscalculation on the part of David Cameron, the electorate were given the chance to have their say, in a referendum.The decision was taken out of the hands of the politicians, and given to the people. They decided to leave the EU. Messy, yes, adverse effects for the economy, possibly, (we have to wait and see), against the wishes of a significant proportion of the population, yes, but the decision of a more significant proportion of the population. Leave it is.

[SheungWan]

2 to 1 ratio say they are happy with BREXIT and do not want another referendu.... YouGov poll. Tells a lot.

We will leave. If we do not leave, there will be more bloodletting than there was in the Tory Party on Thursday.

That's right. They just can't wait to lose their regional EU subsidies. The bill for many has yet to come.

Edited July 1, 2016 by SheungWan

[Naam]

Frankly the present turmoil in both parties is irrelevant to the act of leaving the EU. Whoever comes out top in the Tory party will influence how it is managed over the next two years, but this won't change the fact that we have decided to leave.

For as long as I can remember the EU has been a constant argument in Parliament. Treaties have been signed, institutions created, powers transferred to Brussels and court decisions, made by judges from outside our jurisdiction have been followed, all with lots of debate and arguments amongst politicians but without ever having been put to the electorate. The Lisbon Treaty was a classic example, bitterly opposed by many inside and outside parliament, signed "on the hoof" in a hotel room without any proper debate. The topic of Europe and our membership of the EU was avoided by the major contestants (with the possible exception of the Liberal Democrats )at every General Election.

Then, probably as a result of a political miscalculation on the part of David Cameron, the electorate were given the chance to have their say, in a referendum.The decision was taken out of the hands of the politicians, and given to the people. They decided to leave the EU. Messy, yes, adverse effects for the economy, possibly, (we have to wait and see), against the wishes of a significant proportion of the population, yes, but the decision of a more significant proportion of the population. Leave it is.

the electorate had its say, but the decision to leave the EU was and is still with the UK parliament.

[Franky Bear]

Of the four freedoms, the freedom of movement of persons is the most sacred, so to say. It is the freedom that actually every European citizen can experience directly and personally. There is NO way to reach a compromise. If the UK wants access to the single market the UK will leave the freedom of movement of persons untouched. There must not be any limitation at all. In short: abandon all hope (in that regard).

They still will have freedom of movement. The difference will be they get a stamp in their passport and a VOA.

[dick dasterdly]

2 to 1 ratio say they are happy with BREXIT and do not want another referendu.... YouGov poll. Tells a lot.

We will leave. If we do not leave, there will be more bloodletting than there was in the Tory Party on Thursday.

Do you have a link?

[teatree]

WE NEED a face saver because our European "friends" would like to give us a face SLAP thanks to that ape Farage. I predict a sticky demise for him.

It seems that he reached his goal. So, in principle no need for a UKIP anymore. How will he justify the further existence of his party, I wonder?

To ensure that the UK actually does become independent, and to maintain that independence.

And if parties change tack according to environmental changes, so what?

The Labour party was formed to look out for the working class, but under Blair the links with trade unions were cut, and it became pretty much indistinguishable from the Tory party.

Edited July 1, 2016 by teatree

[JAG]

Frankly the present turmoil in both parties is irrelevant to the act of leaving the EU. Whoever comes out top in the Tory party will influence how it is managed over the next two years, but this won't change the fact that we have decided to leave.

For as long as I can remember the EU has been a constant argument in Parliament. Treaties have been signed, institutions created, powers transferred to Brussels and court decisions, made by judges from outside our jurisdiction have been followed, all with lots of debate and arguments amongst politicians but without ever having been put to the electorate. The Lisbon Treaty was a classic example, bitterly opposed by many inside and outside parliament, signed "on the hoof" in a hotel room without any proper debate. The topic of Europe and our membership of the EU was avoided by the major contestants (with the possible exception of the Liberal Democrats )at every General Election.

Then, probably as a result of a political miscalculation on the part of David Cameron, the electorate were given the chance to have their say, in a referendum.The decision was taken out of the hands of the politicians, and given to the people. They decided to leave the EU. Messy, yes, adverse effects for the economy, possibly, (we have to wait and see), against the wishes of a significant proportion of the population, yes, but the decision of a more significant proportion of the population. Leave it is.

the electorate had its say, but the decision to leave the EU was and is still with the UK parliament.

[JAG]

Frankly the present turmoil in both parties is irrelevant to the act of leaving the EU. Whoever comes out top in the Tory party will influence how it is managed over the next two years, but this won't change the fact that we have decided to leave.

For as long as I can remember the EU has been a constant argument in Parliament. Treaties have been signed, institutions created, powers transferred to Brussels and court decisions, made by judges from outside our jurisdiction have been followed, all with lots of debate and arguments amongst politicians but without ever having been put to the electorate. The Lisbon Treaty was a classic example, bitterly opposed by many inside and outside parliament, signed "on the hoof" in a hotel room without any proper debate. The topic of Europe and our membership of the EU was avoided by the major contestants (with the possible exception of the Liberal Democrats )at every General Election.

Then, probably as a result of a political miscalculation on the part of David Cameron, the electorate were given the chance to have their say, in a referendum.The decision was taken out of the hands of the politicians, and given to the people. They decided to leave the EU. Messy, yes, adverse effects for the economy, possibly, (we have to wait and see), against the wishes of a significant proportion of the population, yes, but the decision of a more significant proportion of the population. Leave it is.

the electorate had its say, but the decision to leave the EU was and is still with the UK parliament.

In theory yes.

In theory Parliament can pass a bill demanding the slaughter of the firstborn!

In practice Parliament has no real choice but to obey the request conveyed by the people in this referendum.

[mommysboy]

Certainly the EU Trade Commisioner Cecilia Malmstrom is stating that there are no trade talks until after the Brexit. First, invoke Article 50, then finalise Brexit, then and only then trade talks. She was interviewed on BBC Newsnight. It can also be read on BBC website. Trade talks would also take some time, probably at least 3 years.

[nontabury]

"So, what's wrong with the Chinese buying up London? ".

Personally I have nothing against the Chinese, my wife is a Chinese/Thai hiso and I think they're great people.

But a gentlemen poster was complaining earlier about what's happening on the street in the UK, in London those streets used to house Brits, then Europeans, then various nationalities in different areas, then Russians and now Chinese. Friends tell me, and this confirmed by the media, that the price of property in London is now such that many wealthy foreigners can't afford to live there, many are now scouting and buying into the larger more desirable cities of the UK. As for the native Brits, well, they've been forced to rent in an increasing number of cases, especially the young as they are priced out of the market.

It seems to me that whilst we're making the UK attractive to foreign purchasers of everything in the country, especially the housing stock (not sold to wealth creators) , we don't care about the availability and affordability of housing for our own citizens. So it seems distinctly odd, if not totally bizarre, to complain about how the high cost of Eu membership and the negative effects of UK immigration whilst at the same time we're selling the country in parts to any foreigner who wants to buy it, a process that was just accelerated by the Brexit vote.

Thypical Chang Mai post. My wife is Thai/Chinese "hi so" . Is it relevant to this discussion that YOU think she is, I repeat "HI -SO" what snobbishness, but what can we expect from a mill owners son.

So you don't do satire NB, I was going to put a silly little smiley after that phrase and and add that I was special forces then I thought no, even the most imbecilic of posters who've been on TVF for any period of time will recognise that as oft repeated Thai Visa humour subject matter, seemingly not. Ah well, never mind.

And it's odd for an Englishman not to get that type of humour, are you absolutely certain you're a Brit. NB and not something else?

Anyway, 'ave to get back t' mill t'see t'lads, a'fore you know it they'll all be on their uppers and wanting a raise, bloody peasants, who do they think they are eh!

Hilarious!

I'm in York now, following Winchester and 'arrogate before that. Still not come across a genuine Brexiteer prepared to admit as much. Even on my lunch trip to Belgravia, not one. Odd eh?

Try Scarboroigh,plenty there voted Brexit. As for Yorkshire as a whole,only three areas voted to remain. In one district the vote was 50/50 remain won by one thousand. Another district,remain won by 51/49. The odd one out York, not sure,I think 58/42. The rest of Yorkshire overwhelming voted out.

[nontabury]

"So, what's wrong with the Chinese buying up London? ".

Personally I have nothing against the Chinese, my wife is a Chinese/Thai hiso and I think they're great people.

But a gentlemen poster was complaining earlier about what's happening on the street in the UK, in London those streets used to house Brits, then Europeans, then various nationalities in different areas, then Russians and now Chinese. Friends tell me, and this confirmed by the media, that the price of property in London is now such that many wealthy foreigners can't afford to live there, many are now scouting and buying into the larger more desirable cities of the UK. As for the native Brits, well, they've been forced to rent in an increasing number of cases, especially the young as they are priced out of the market.

It seems to me that whilst we're making the UK attractive to foreign purchasers of everything in the country, especially the housing stock (not sold to wealth creators) , we don't care about the availability and affordability of housing for our own citizens. So it seems distinctly odd, if not totally bizarre, to complain about how the high cost of Eu membership and the negative effects of UK immigration whilst at the same time we're selling the country in parts to any foreigner who wants to buy it, a process that was just accelerated by the Brexit vote.

Thypical Chang Mai post. My wife is Thai/Chinese "hi so" . Is it relevant to this discussion that YOU think she is, I repeat "HI -SO" what snobbishness, but what can we expect from a mill owners son.

So you don't do satire NB, I was going to put a silly little smiley after that phrase and and add that I was special forces then I thought no, even the most imbecilic of posters who've been on TVF for any period of time will recognise that as oft repeated Thai Visa humour subject matter, seemingly not. Ah well, never mind.

And it's odd for an Englishman not to get that type of humour, are you absolutely certain you're a Brit. NB and not something else?

Anyway, 'ave to get back t' mill t'see t'lads, a'fore you know it they'll all be on their uppers and wanting a raise, bloody peasants, who do they think they are eh!

Hilarious!

I'm in York now, following Winchester and 'arrogate before that. Still not come across a genuine Brexiteer prepared to admit as much. Even on my lunch trip to Belgravia, not one. Odd eh?

Try Scarboroigh,plenty there voted Brexit. As for Yorkshire as a whole,only three areas voted to remain. In one district the vote was 50/50 remain won by one thousand. Another district,remain won by 51/49. The odd one out York, not sure,I think 58/42. The rest of Yorkshire overwhelming voted out.

[Naam]

Frankly the present turmoil in both parties is irrelevant to the act of leaving the EU. Whoever comes out top in the Tory party will influence how it is managed over the next two years, but this won't change the fact that we have decided to leave.

For as long as I can remember the EU has been a constant argument in Parliament. Treaties have been signed, institutions created, powers transferred to Brussels and court decisions, made by judges from outside our jurisdiction have been followed, all with lots of debate and arguments amongst politicians but without ever having been put to the electorate. The Lisbon Treaty was a classic example, bitterly opposed by many inside and outside parliament, signed "on the hoof" in a hotel room without any proper debate. The topic of Europe and our membership of the EU was avoided by the major contestants (with the possible exception of the Liberal Democrats )at every General Election.

Then, probably as a result of a political miscalculation on the part of David Cameron, the electorate were given the chance to have their say, in a referendum.The decision was taken out of the hands of the politicians, and given to the people. They decided to leave the EU. Messy, yes, adverse effects for the economy, possibly, (we have to wait and see), against the wishes of a significant proportion of the population, yes, but the decision of a more significant proportion of the population. Leave it is.

the electorate had its say, but the decision to leave the EU was and is still with the UK parliament.

In theory yes.

In theory Parliament can pass a bill demanding the slaughter of the firstborn!

In practice Parliament has no real choice but to obey the request conveyed by the people in this referendum.

facts apply, not your theories.

[SgtRock]

It would appear that there is a lot of influential people throughout the EU are starting to get just a little twitchy.

The next EU President from July 01st.

Slovakian foreign minister: I will support any measure to stop Brexit

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/30/slovakia-foreign-minister-eu-support-measure-stop-brexit

Sarkozy and Kohl also getting in on the act