Bar Owners

[davethailand]

this topics gone mad, i'm off

[Wolfie]

Hey, MsNina,

Your kinda new here, shame you simply would have loved Erco, no seriously...

Youd have torn him to peices.

[kurgen]

Hey, MsNina,

Your kinda new here, shame you simply would have loved Erco, no seriously...

Youd have torn him to peices.

Erco's now a ladyboy

[MsNina]

yohan, you've got some serious issues... what on earth happened to you that you hate women so?

[mbkudu]

Could it be that Goosetie, Erco and Msnina is a Thai person who dispises farangs who go out with bar girls? Highly unlikely but you never know. Like a web stalker.

[Wolfie]

Could it be that Goosetie, Erco and Msnina is a Thai person who dispises farangs who go out with bar girls? Highly unlikely but you never know. Like a web stalker.

I think you might have let fantasy over-take reality there bud, i could be wrong.

[MsNina]

lol

[monty]

There is one big reality in prostitution:

There is lots and lots of money to be made!!!!!!!

An average looking Bargirl working the Farang scene can earn a lot more then an university educated employee...

A good looking/smart/fun personality/good English speaking kind of women ranks up there with CEO's CFO's and the like earnings wise...

They are always saying that these girls should be helped and educated so they can make a decent earning and let go of prostitution. What help/education are you going to give a girl (who might be illiterate, hardly went to school...) so she can even earn half of what she rakes in now???

Lots of girls earn more then their employers, who is exploiting who?

It simply boils down to how much cash somebody is going to end up with at the end of the month....

Whose fault is that??? Blame it on the acceptance of the Western capitalistic system. If you hardly see any of your parents, because they're both working their <deleted> of for their next Pick-up waht are you going to do when you're grown up???

[Mai Krap]

If I wanted some overwieght, hairy, overopinionated, self-rightous, delousional that desired to strap up and hump me up the pooper telling me what to do all day I could just hang out on khoa son rd and tell all the fat girls how great they are,,, no thanx,,,, heard it all before,,, in a perfect world,,, yada yada yada,,,,,,, TELL IT TO YOUR MAMA...........

[Yohan]

yohan, you've got some serious issues...  what on earth happened to you that you hate women so?

I do not hate women.....and I NEVER used that word HATE in all my postings...

My wife is 27 years with me and my older daughter is living with us since 25 years, my younger daughter is living in the USA - my mother-in-law is living next door.

How can you say, I hate women?

I dislike however radical feminists (called Femi-Nazi in the USA), regardless if they are men or women, regardless if their actions are racist related or not. I consider them as outsiders and as enemies towards me and my family, and this is what they are.

Johann

[Richard W]

I AM 100% legal thanks.

...

i have male staff as a majority but i also have over 10 service reception girls, barfines are up to them but the majority of them are not barfinable and don't go with customers.

...

You probably will still say i employ prostitutes, i don't really care.

You sound like a man who could answer the following question. In a typical 'bar', i.e. 'takeaway brothel', where and when are the prostitution-related crimes under Thai law committed? Does a lot depend on how the deal is worded? If there is no such thing as a 'typical bar', describe the places on Patpong 1. (They may be more complex; there may be issues with 'side rooms'.)

Incidentally, are there English terms which can distinguish the places primarily retailing drink and the places that seem to primarily retail sex (even if they do make a lot of profit from the drinks)?

in response to your question,

if what you describe is true then i do not own a typical bar,

...

i own a live music club, nothing more, nothing less.

where did you get the dumb idea that the typical bar is a take away brothel?

you obviousley haven't got a lot of knowledge about Thailand.

It is true that I don't have a great experience of Farang-oriented Thailand - most of my drinking in public in Thailand has been done in restaurants or Thai karaoke bars (i.e. predominantly patronised by Thai men and women). I have been shown Patpong twice as that is one of the tourist sights! (My guides were Thai - family on one occasion and family friends on the other. I was none too pleased when the latter tried to get me laid.) I didn't like what I saw of Pattaya, though I gather there are some nice areas.

You laid great emphasis on your business being legal, so I presumed you would have taken care to ensure that the activities of sme of your service reception girls would not get you into trouble or make you liable to extortion, and that you would therefore know the law (or at least, have 'rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty').

Should one use the term 'go-go bar' to describe all the bars that I, for want of a better term, described as 'takeaway brothels'?

[Yohan]

Yohan, read Sheila Jeffreys, Andrea Dworkin, Carol Pateman, Catherine Mackinnon or Germaine Greer

Hi, MsNina,

I wonder, if these publications, which you recommend me so much, are for legal sale in Thailand....be careful, maybe they might be confiscated and you are in trouble....

In Thailand for sure, nobody appreciates this Femi-Nazi crap.....

(Sheila Jeffrey: unknown to me)

(Carol Pateman: political theory, not insulting, moderate....OK)

However - These 3 writers are well-known to me and their products are something like guidebooks for radical feminists...

Catherine Mackinnon: (text from her homepage)

Mackinnon does not really distinguish between rape and psychological coercion; in fact, all heterosexual sex seems tantamount to rape. Mackinnon points out that "freedom of speech" allows the stronger, more dominant speaker to silence the weaker one, and believes that women have been silenced by the speech of men. The racial taunt says, "You are an animal, not a human being," and the sexual taunt says, "You have no identity, no personality-- you are a collection of appealing body parts."

Andrea Dworkin (scandal-writer, promoting incest and bestiality, against heterosexuality):

Intercourse with men as we know them is increasingly impossible. It requires an abortion of creativity and strength, a refusal of responsibility and freedom: a bitter personal death. It means acting out the female role, incorporating the masochism, self-hatred, and passivity which are central to it. Unambiguous conventional heterosexual behavior is the worst betrayal of our common humanity (Dworkin 1974, p.184).

Germaine Greer (Feminazi from Canada)

You can implant an embryo in the body of a man, attached to his bowel wall. What do you want to do? Do you want to really prove that the vagina and the anus are of equal value?

-----

Better keep this radical feminist garbage in the USA .....Do not bring it into Thailand!

For me living in Japan your ideology of feminism just makes me smile.....

Johann

[Stocky]

Arrrrrrrrgh, this stuff does your head in!

What happened to 'I like her and she likes me'?

[tutsiwarrior]

re: MacKinnon, Dworkin, et al...they are lesbian separatists and they have been discredited except within separatist enclaves on the US west coast and their adherants elsewhere.

As I remember Germaine Greer was heckled off the stage during a speech in Berkeley in 1970 by the tattooed bull dyke brigade...she has always been a 'nice face' for feminism.

Prostitution has always been a feminist issue...primarily regarding the right to choose peddling your arse to make a living and not having men control the activity. Which is cool. Politically correct revisionsts that disallow the idea of prostitution do the women involved a huge disservice....and should be identified and shot on sight...

[davethailand]

I AM 100% legal thanks.

...

i have male staff as a majority but i also have over 10 service reception girls, barfines are up to them but the majority of them are not barfinable and don't go with customers.

...

You probably will still say i employ prostitutes, i don't really care.

You sound like a man who could answer the following question. In a typical 'bar', i.e. 'takeaway brothel', where and when are the prostitution-related crimes under Thai law committed? Does a lot depend on how the deal is worded? If there is no such thing as a 'typical bar', describe the places on Patpong 1. (They may be more complex; there may be issues with 'side rooms'.)

Incidentally, are there English terms which can distinguish the places primarily retailing drink and the places that seem to primarily retail sex (even if they do make a lot of profit from the drinks)?

in response to your question,

if what you describe is true then i do not own a typical bar,

...

i own a live music club, nothing more, nothing less.

where did you get the dumb idea that the typical bar is a take away brothel?

you obviousley haven't got a lot of knowledge about Thailand.

It is true that I don't have a great experience of Farang-oriented Thailand - most of my drinking in public in Thailand has been done in restaurants or Thai karaoke bars (i.e. predominantly patronised by Thai men and women). I have been shown Patpong twice as that is one of the tourist sights! (My guides were Thai - family on one occasion and family friends on the other. I was none too pleased when the latter tried to get me laid.) I didn't like what I saw of Pattaya, though I gather there are some nice areas.

You laid great emphasis on your business being legal, so I presumed you would have taken care to ensure that the activities of sme of your service reception girls would not get you into trouble or make you liable to extortion, and that you would therefore know the law (or at least, have 'rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty').

Should one use the term 'go-go bar' to describe all the bars that I, for want of a better term, described as 'takeaway brothels'?

gogo is a better definition.

again my place is not similar in any way to a gogo, there is no skimpy dress, no number and above all no hassling the customers.

[englishoak]

Jerco's a complete waste of sperm guys !

Realy there does seem to be an awful lot of bitches here that would be better off with the kowtoey's Meeeoowww pffft pffft.

[mbkudu]

yohan, you've got some serious issues...  what on earth happened to you that you hate women so?

I do not hate women.....and I NEVER used that word HATE in all my postings...

My wife is 27 years with me and my older daughter is living with us since 25 years, my younger daughter is living in the USA - my mother-in-law is living next door.

How can you say, I hate women?

I dislike however radical feminists (called Femi-Nazi in the USA), regardless if they are men or women, regardless if their actions are racist related or not. I consider them as outsiders and as enemies towards me and my family, and this is what they are.

Johann

Yohan has a good point here. I have nothing against western women myself, but I think many of them don't feel relaxed around men; they have hangups. Thai women feel very shy at times with men but once you get to know them they are quite relaxed and comfortable being feminine women. I know I'll get harassed by women on this forum for my opinion. I know it is a pretty big generalization but my generalization is formed from being around different women from different countries. Many foreign men in Thailand are in Thailand because they are 'escaping' the farang woman, a fact is a fact no matter how much one tries to rationalize.

[mbkudu]

I AM 100% legal thanks.

...

i have male staff as a majority but i also have over 10 service reception girls, barfines are up to them but the majority of them are not barfinable and don't go with customers.

...

You probably will still say i employ prostitutes, i don't really care.

You sound like a man who could answer the following question. In a typical 'bar', i.e. 'takeaway brothel', where and when are the prostitution-related crimes under Thai law committed? Does a lot depend on how the deal is worded? If there is no such thing as a a 'typical bar', describe the places on Patpong 1. (They may be more complex; there may be issues with 'side rooms'.)

Incidentally, are there English terms which can distinguish the places primarily retailing drink and the places that seem to primarily retail sex (even if they do make a lot of profit from the drinks)?

Some of the people on this topic need to get off thir moral high horses. Bar owners are in business. Are they responsible for the trade? Of course they are; they are responsible for how well their employees are treated and how honestly they operate their businesses. Businesses like this are run all over the world. You could walk into a strip club in Honolulu and see women pole dancing with less clothing than women in Patpong. As long as there are willing participants there will be business. I do agree that it should be regulated.

One of the reasons why Thailand has such a notorious reputation is because the women in this trade are so much better looking and accomodating than women in America or Europe who do this work. Yes I call it work. They are much more accesible for friendly conversation and general fun.

I must hand it to DaveThailand; he's taking quite a thrashing and enduring quite well. Don't let'em get you down.

[mbkudu]

I dont know about all this HAIRY, FAT , OLD, BOOT WEARING FEMALES,,,,, And to be FEMMINIST too,,,,,, Thailand should crack down on these undesirable charactors entering the KINGDOM.......

If I was into hairy birds, I'd might as well sleep with men.

[davethailand]

they won't get me mbkudu.

some members know my place already and they know what kind of place it is.

i'm comfortable with the fact that i can hold my head up to both other posters and the police and government and say i'm running a clean, legal, sex free business.

the business opened 3 years ago as a gogo/ live music bar and 2 years ago we scrapped the gogo image and gradually changed the image of the place and we now have a good clean bar with a good atmosphere that suits couples young and old as well as singles. obviously we have freelancers in the bar , but they are customers, if they want to pull a bloke thats drinking in there, up to them.

i cannot control who drinks in the place.

one turning point for me was when my mum and family spent 3 weeks here for my wedding. she felt completely at ease and comfortable being in the bar and she liked the fact she could stay in there, drink and dance etc without going near the gogo scene.

[meemiathai]

MsNina,

I think it is very nice to have you here in this forum. I have read a few of your inputs and found them quite true and sensible. There are some quite rude people here (perhaps me as well), but I hope it won't stop you from posting in the future.

Welcome!

[Yohan]

Yohan has a good point here..............

I know I'll get harassed by women on this forum for my opinion. I know it is a pretty big generalization but my generalization is formed from being around different women from different countries............

I am already accustomed to harassments made by Femi-Nazis, no problem, I will help you out with arguments.....

Men often remain silent, when accused by radical feminists and do not know, how to respond....Otherwise they would be considered impolite towards high educated ladies....

But I think, we should not feel ashamed to talk about, which is true....

Femi-Nazis will neither consider you as a man, nor will they consider your Asian girl-friend on your side as a woman...Femi-Nazis strongly oppose international/interracial marriage -

Femi-Nazis never care about any Filipina or other poor off woman - this is human garbage in their eyes...

When my friend married a Thai (she has very dark skin and is from Mukdahan), who was working in Europe in such a household, he received the following angry comment from the feminist employer:

*Who says, this is a man? Hopeless obtuse, and what he calls his wife......this brown piece like a shit out of a toilet bowl was not supposed to be eaten.....*

I felt so sorry for this regretable European power-lady:

Some days to brush your own shoes, to wash your own plates and to clean your own ash-tray......

No maid to serve you, how your unlucky life is full of problems and hardship.

Johann

[Yohan]

i'm comfortable with the fact that i can hold my head up to both other posters and the police and government and say i'm running a clean, legal, sex free business.....

obviously we have freelancers in the bar , but they are customers, if they want to pull a bloke thats drinking in there, up to them.

I cannot control who drinks in the place..............

To return to the topic:

For Davethailand

First of all, you need not justify your business, it is your business and not anybodys else business.

There are always some people, who do not like to watch anything which has to do with entertainment......they do not enjoy their lives and do not know what makes fun....

the music is too loud, the lights too dark, the customers are strange, a bar is supporting alcoholism, causing lung-cancer because of smoking cigarettes, husbands getting sexual excited as the girls have too short mini-skirts and so on...

Nobody will find this somewhat interesting, if your bar would be in the States or in Europe.....and nobody will care if a man meets a woman there....

But your bar is in Thailand:

A bar with music, maybe even dimm lights = a brothel! Maybe even sold children inside...... customers are whores, or sexy-pig losers, even dancing together and the owner is obviously tipping off the police to keep his dangerous unclean immoral house running......

This can be only in Thailand, and nowhere else.....

Do not care about anybody, who wants to investigate something.... church, feminists, environment protectors or whoever -

Keep your business running, and wishing you much success.....

Johann

[MsNina]

meemiathai, thanks for the welcome!

Yohan, your change in language from using the term 'radical feminist' (though admittedly, you used this term without actually understanding what it means) to 'femi-nazi' is indicative of your deep-seated hatred of women. True, you have never used the word hate in your posts here, but the lack of respect you have for intelligent, assertive women is indicative of your true of opinion of women and their place in this world.

BTW, Rush Limbaugh refers to feminists as femi-nazis - 'femi-nazi' is not what feminists are generally called in the USA. Furthermore, this is a highly offensive term, not just to Jewish people but to all people who abhor Nazism and what happened during the Holocaust. I would have thought that you as an Austrian would be a little bit more sensitive to that than you are.

And Germaine Greer is Australian not Canadian!!

And I'm Australian too, not American.

[davethailand]

i'm comfortable with the fact that i can hold my head up to both other posters and the police and government and say i'm running a clean, legal, sex free business.....

obviously we have freelancers in the bar , but they are customers, if they want to pull a bloke thats drinking in there, up to them.

I cannot control who drinks in the place..............

To return to the topic:

For Davethailand

First of all, you need not justify your business, it is your business and not anybodys else business.

There are always some people, who do not like to watch anything which has to do with entertainment......they do not enjoy their lives and do not know what makes fun....

the music is too loud, the lights too dark, the customers are strange, a bar is supporting alcoholism, causing lung-cancer because of smoking cigarettes, husbands getting sexual excited as the girls have too short mini-skirts and so on...

Nobody will find this somewhat interesting, if your bar would be in the States or in Europe.....and nobody will care if a man meets a woman there....

But your bar is in Thailand:

A bar with music, maybe even dimm lights = a brothel! Maybe even sold children inside...... customers are whores, or sexy-pig losers, even dancing together and the owner is obviously tipping off the police to keep his dangerous unclean immoral house running......

This can be only in Thailand, and nowhere else.....

Do not care about anybody, who wants to investigate something.... church, feminists, environment protectors or whoever -

Keep your business running, and wishing you much success.....

Johann

thank you for your reply johan,

i thought about that after i posted, why am i defending my life or my business, they are both great.

[mbkudu]

meemiathai, thanks for the welcome!

Yohan, your change in language from using the term 'radical feminist' (though admittedly, you used this term without actually understanding what it means) to 'femi-nazi' is indicative of your deep-seated hatred of women. True, you have never used the word hate in your posts here, but the lack of respect you have for intelligent, assertive women is indicative of your true of opinion of women and their place in this world.

BTW, Rush Limbaugh refers to feminists as femi-nazis - 'femi-nazi' is not what feminists are generally called in the USA. Furthermore, this is a highly offensive term, not just to Jewish people but to all people who abhor Nazism and what happened during the Holocaust. I would have thought that you as an Austrian would be a little bit more sensitive to that than you are.

And Germaine Greer is Australian not Canadian!!

And I'm Australian too, not American.

BFD

[MsNina]

BFD

big enough deal for you to bother replying to it...

[elsie]

thank you for your reply johan,

i thought about that after i posted, why am i defending my life or my business, they are both great.

And I will stop by at your place soon

[mbkudu]

BFD

big enough deal for you to bother replying to it...

I read it, pushed 4 buttons, BFD.

[Duckthai]

Hello

Could we look at another perspective concerning the Topic (I have noticed that on this Forum replies to Postings tend to drift of the ssbject).

Lots of replies have already been writted as regard to attitude of the infamous BG, perhaps we should look at Bar Owners anbd there thirst for profit, perhaps the attitiude of the BG is because of pressure to the BG.

Example the Bar Owner has told the BG to get a drink out of every (stupid farrang) that comes into the Bar. Get bar fined regularly and if its for a week or so to make sure that he comes back into there Bar and spend money.

Just a thought.