May ready for tough talks over Brexit

[SgtRock]

45 minutes ago, sandyf said:

A touch of reality, Phillip Hammond acknowledges that the UK could be hung out to dry.

 

Philip Hammond urged EU countries to “think very carefully about what they want” before hanging Britain out to dry in any post-Brexit settlement.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-eu-negotiations-philip-hammond-does-not-make-sense-splits-tory-a7428046.html

 

Did you miss this part ?

 

Quote

The EU’s hardline stance against the UK in the upcoming Brexit negotiations “doesn’t make a lot of sense”, the Chancellor has said, as he warned that the talks will bring uncertainty to the British economy

 

Remember, NO NEGOTATIONS before A50 is triggered.

 

Therefore everything that appears in the MSM is nothing more than rhetoric.

 

As I have posted over the past 2 days. From an EU perspective, the desperation is growing on a daily basis. It is no longer about trying to set an example to stop other Countries leaving, this has now morphed into a straight fight in trying to stop the rise of the right across the EU.

 

For the benefit of any doubt. I will say it again. The EUrocrats, so desperate to save their gravy train are unable, or unwilling to see what is happening right in front of them.

 

They, ultimately, are responsible for the sh!tstorm that will ensue across the EU.

 

Edited November 21, 2016 by SgtRock

[metisdead]

An post containing inflammatory comments directed at another member has been removed. 

[SgtRock]

4 hours ago, sandyf said:

Looks like the troops are breaking ranks.

 

" No faction, especially here on TV is saying that chaos and conflict is an acceptable scenario. "

 

Of course the collapse of the EU could come peacefully and well organised completely free of chaos and conflict.

The pigs have been refuelled and ready for take-off.

 

Sandy

 

My reply to you seems to have disappeared.

 

So I will try again.

 

No troops are breaking ranks, my stance has not changed one iota since at least March.

 

No, as has been said many, many times, by myself and others. The collapse of the EU will not come peacefully or well organised. It will be carnage. Now ask yourself who is responsible for that ?

 

Is it because of Brexit ?

 

Is it because of the rise of the so called * Far Right * throughout the EU ?

 

The above are merely symptoms not the cause.

 

No. The responsibility and cause,  lies squarely at the door of the EUrocrats, who, despite what is staring them in the face, are determined to keep their collective craniums jammed firmly up their collective posteriors in order to protect their collective feeding trough.

 

I gave a diary date of 04 December for the next Political headache for the EU which will come from 2 sources, Italy and Austria.

 

It seems that a double whammy will be delivers at the same time, not just political, but monetary.

 

Quote

Currency Vigilantes Ready to Strike Again as Italian Vote Looms

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-20/currency-vigilantes-ready-to-strike-again-as-italian-vote-looms

[SgtRock]

It would appear that May has her finger more firmly on the pulse than many give her credit for.

 

Quote

underlining her belief the vote for Brexit was the people’s call for a fairer economy.

 

Quote

That’s the kind of change people voted for -- not just to leave the European Union, but to change the way our country works -- and the people for whom it works -- forever.”

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-21/may-to-say-u-k-business-must-work-to-create-fairer-capitalism

 

I would say that was a fair reflection. Well identified, now put the strategy in place to make it happen.

[petermik]

23 minutes ago, SgtRock said:

 

 

 

No. The responsibility and cause,  lies squarely at the door of the EUrocrats, who, despite what is staring them in the face, are determined to keep their collective craniums jammed firmly up their collective posteriors in order to protect their collective feeding trough.

 

I gave a diary date of 04 December for the next Political headache for the EU which will come from 2 sources, Italy and Austria.

 

It seems that a double whammy will be delivers at the same time, not just political, but monetary.

 

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-20/currency-vigilantes-ready-to-strike-again-as-italian-vote-looms

The pigs with their noses in the trough are squealing because the gravy is drying up 

[SgtRock]

Who recalls these memorable quotes:

 

Quote

Brexiteers are numpties

 

Quote

Try reading the FT

 

Well, what can I say.

 

Quote

Italy’s referendum holds the key to the future of the euro

 

Quote

On December 5, Europe could wake up to an immediate threat of disintegration

 

https://www.ft.com/world/europe

 

The FT is THE PUBLICATION to trust. So how can they print such drivel 

[SgtRock]

And the hits just keep on coming

 

Quote

Finance executives planning to shift operations out of the U.K. because of Brexit have been told by European Central Bank officials not to rush as there will be no first-mover advantage when it comes to gaining regulatory approvals, according to people briefed on the discussions.

 

Could this possibly be PC talk for the excrement is quite possibly about to hit the fan in the EZ and stay where you are ?

 

Quote

Grandfathering the risk models would be the most logical approach," said Jan Putnis, a partner at law firm Slaughter and May in London. "There is no real alternative in the short term. 

 

It might just be sensibility setting in

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-21/brexit-banks-told-to-relax-ecb-won-t-give-first-mover-advantage

Edited November 22, 2016 by metisdead
Oversize font reset to normal, please discontinue posting using large fonts for emphasis.

[SgtRock]

On 11/20/2016 at 1:37 PM, SgtRock said:

One more Jihadi spectacular in either France or Germany, prior to their upcoming elections and it is game over. Politicians will stay well clear of mentioning this for obvious reasons. I am willing to wager somewhere during the Christmas period there will be a single, or a series of booms.

 

For those that have tried various methods at trying to ridicule most of what I post on this thread.

 

Breaking news:

 

Quote

French police break up a terror ring plotting "a coordinated attack aiming to target several sites simultaneously".

 

Quote

The announcement comes five days before the opening of the famed Christmas market in Strasbourg - which was the target of a failed extremist plot in 2000.

 

http://news.sky.com/story/police-foil-planned-terror-attack-in-france-10666046

 

Thankfully, on this occasion the French Security Services were on the ball.

[sandyf]

Teresa May has reserved a place in the history books for the greatest act of social vandalism in recent times. Brexit will be held up to the world as a lesson on how to divide a nation in one easy move.

UK tourism will probably die a death and Brits worldwide become social outcasts. Or course that is of little consequence to those that do not recognise the symptoms or go anywhere. How can anyone be in favour of action that will alienate all non UK citizens, what kind of future is that. 

Brexiteers will continue to pontificate about a failing EU as, like the customer that never reads the instructions, the problems dividing the country have nothing to do with them.

[stevenl]

20 hours ago, SgtRock said:

And the hits just keep on coming
 

Quote

Finance executives planning to shift operations out of the U.K. because of Brexit have been told by European Central Bank officials not to rush as there will be no first-mover advantage when it comes to gaining regulatory approvals, according to people briefed on the discussions.

 
Could this possibly be PC talk for the excrement is quite possibly about to hit the fan in the EZ and stay where you are ?
 

Quote

Grandfathering the risk models would be the most logical approach," said Jan Putnis, a partner at law firm Slaughter and May in London. "There is no real alternative in the short term. 

 
It might just be sensibility setting in
 
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-21/brexit-banks-told-to-relax-ecb-won-t-give-first-mover-advantage

Of course that is no polite talk from the ECB to ....
Even if they were to share your sentiments they would still want them to move to the Euro zone.
As usual you're seeing something that is not there.

Sent from my ROBBY using Thaivisa Connect mobile app
 

Edited November 22, 2016 by metisdead
Please do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes or wording.

[SheungWan]

5 hours ago, SgtRock said:

Who recalls these memorable quotes:

 

 

 

Well, what can I say.

 

 

 

https://www.ft.com/world/europe

 

The FT is THE PUBLICATION to trust. So how can they print such drivel 

 

(It is worth noting that the FT is a subscription newspaper so links do not always work)

The job if the FT is to identify risk in order for market participants to assign percentage risk to headwind events. They will then try to hedge against that risk....unlike many junk websites or opinions which assign a likelihood of an event happening as either 1 or 0.

[AlexRich]

A bit like predicting a nuclear holocaust, as you are sitting on the wasteland with rats and cockroaches, regaling these new "friends" with how you were right all along! 

 

Pre-internet we had people walking the streets with sandwich boards predicting the end is nigh, now they have all transferred to bulletin boards and You Tube with their catastrophe predictions ... Google "financial meltdown" and put in a random year, you'll no doubt find a prediction that this year is the "big one".

 

Europe has problems (as does the U.K.), but it's not the first time and it won't be the last ... this too shall pass.

Edited November 21, 2016 by AlexRich

[dick dasterdly]

22 hours ago, SgtRock said:

 

Sandy

 

My reply to you seems to have disappeared.

 

So I will try again.

 

No troops are breaking ranks, my stance has not changed one iota since at least March.

 

No, as has been said many, many times, by myself and others. The collapse of the EU will not come peacefully or well organised. It will be carnage. Now ask yourself who is responsible for that ?

 

Is it because of Brexit ?

 

Is it because of the rise of the so called * Far Right * throughout the EU ?

 

The above are merely symptoms not the cause.

 

No. The responsibility and cause,  lies squarely at the door of the EUrocrats, who, despite what is staring them in the face, are determined to keep their collective craniums jammed firmly up their collective posteriors in order to protect their collective feeding trough.

 

I gave a diary date of 04 December for the next Political headache for the EU which will come from 2 sources, Italy and Austria.

 

It seems that a double whammy will be delivers at the same time, not just political, but monetary.

 

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-20/currency-vigilantes-ready-to-strike-again-as-italian-vote-looms

Agree entirely that if the EU collapses it will be entirely the fault of the Eurocrats.

 

Unfortunately if it does collapse - it will result in major problems for many countries .

 

The UK would probably be in a slightly better position, having not to worry about negotiating with the EU - but that doesn't negate the hardship caused to ordinary people in other EU countries.

[SheungWan]

Theresa May promises CBI that she won't send UK business over a cliff.

[dick dasterdly]

22 hours ago, SgtRock said:

It would appear that May has her finger more firmly on the pulse than many give her credit for.

 

 

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-21/may-to-say-u-k-business-must-work-to-create-fairer-capitalism

 

I would say that was a fair reflection. Well identified, now put the strategy in place to make it happen.

Fingers crossed - but politicians are politicians and welded to the 'corporate' money as its in their own financial interest.

 

We'll see, but 'interesting' times ahead....

[Grouse]

8 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Theresa May promises CBI that she won't send UK business over a cliff.

 

She's going to construct a ramp of temporary arrangements.

 

It's still a long steep drop!

 

Norway is still on a "temporary agreement".

[SgtRock]

6 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Agree entirely that if the EU collapses it will be entirely the fault of the Eurocrats.

 

Unfortunately if it does collapse - it will result in major problems for many countries .

 

The UK would probably be in a slightly better position, having not to worry about negotiating with the EU - but that doesn't negate the hardship caused to ordinary people in other EU countries.

 

Yes, it will indeed result in major problems for many Countries.

 

It also will not negate the hardship caused to ordinary people either. Take a good look and you will find that politicians very rarely consider the ordinary people in their decisions and it is ALWAYS the ordinary people who suffer, never a politician.

 

It is quite unnerving, on this thread and many others, that it appears that so many people have never heard of the expression

 

                     Plan and prepare for the worse case scenario and anything better is a bonus.

 

The evidence is plentiful that the EU is teetering on a knife-edge, those same people would much rather try and ridicule posters, slam sources or otherwise deny and obfuscate rather than face what is certainly a very real threat.

 

It does not help matters when it appears that the EUrocrats only answer is more EU, immediate denial that the EU and its EUrocrats are actually a big part of the problem.

 

Should the worst come to the worst, the UK will not be immune, but the more it can insulate itself from the potential fallout, the better it will be for the UK.

[Grouse]

Be interesting to see Hammonds Autumn statement.

 

Apparently, he wants UK to be "match fit" for Brexit

 

He plans to achieve this with massive corporation tax cuts

 

Paid for by more austerity measures so that average families are worse off

 

No surprises there then ?

[SgtRock]

I am not going to search for it. Although I am fairly certain that on this thread there was a bit of a to-do regarding the recent court case on Brexit.

 

There was a couple of posters who were strenuously denying that the court case was anything to do with a concerted effort to get the Brexit result overturned.

 

Make up  your own mind whether that is the case or not.

 

Quote

Richard Branson Backing Drive to Block Brexit, Independent Says

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-21/richard-branson-backing-drive-to-block-brexit-independent-says

[AlexRich]

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

Agree entirely that if the EU collapses it will be entirely the fault of the Eurocrats.

 

Unfortunately if it does collapse - it will result in major problems for many countries .

 

The UK would probably be in a slightly better position, having not to worry about negotiating with the EU - but that doesn't negate the hardship caused to ordinary people in other EU countries.

 

No one will benefit from that event ... and the UK will not be in a better position. The negotiations and the in-fighting would get so much worse and be extremely complicated ... no winners, just losers. 

 

[AlexRich]

43 minutes ago, SgtRock said:

I am not going to search for it. Although I am fairly certain that on this thread there was a bit of a to-do regarding the recent court case on Brexit.

 

There was a couple of posters who were strenuously denying that the court case was anything to do with a concerted effort to get the Brexit result overturned.

 

Make up  your own mind whether that is the case or not.

 

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-21/richard-branson-backing-drive-to-block-brexit-independent-says

 

It was less about getting Brexit overturned and more about the Brexit plan being subject to parliamentary scrutiny. To ensure that the 16m plus have some representation in the process and don't get dragged into the most extreme Brexit by the three amigos.

 

 

[dick dasterdly]

1 minute ago, AlexRich said:

 

No one will benefit from that event ... and the UK will not be in a better position. The negotiations and the in-fighting would get so much worse and be extremely complicated ... no winners, just losers. 

 

Impossible to know, but I still think the UK  would be in a slightly better position.

 

Even so, it would harm so many ordinary people in EU countries that its far from a 'desired' result.

[SgtRock]

1 minute ago, AlexRich said:

 

It was less about getting Brexit overturned and more about the Brexit plan being subject to parliamentary scrutiny. To ensure that the 16m plus have some representation in the process and don't get dragged into the most extreme Brexit by the three amigos.

 

 

 

As I have already pointed out and provided the corresponding link previously.

 

It does not really matter what the UK Court comes up with. The EU have already decided that it will be a hard Brexit.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/nov/19/europes-leaders-force-uk-hard-brexit-farage-le-pen

 

I already gave you a diary date of the 04 December for more woes to beset the EU. Both Politically and Monetary.

 

I will give you another one, you might want to ditch any euro's that you might be holding before the Fed raises interest rates in December.

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/gadfly/articles/2016-11-21/dark-days-for-the-euro-await-in-trump-s-1-trillion-plan

 

The euro is about to take a pounding.

 

 

 

 

[AlexRich]

3 minutes ago, SgtRock said:

 

As I have already pointed out and provided the corresponding link previously.

 

It does not really matter what the UK Court comes up with. The EU have already decided that it will be a hard Brexit.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/nov/19/europes-leaders-force-uk-hard-brexit-farage-le-pen

 

I already gave you a diary date of the 04 December for more woes to beset the EU. Both Politically and Monetary.

 

I will give you another one, you might want to ditch any euro's that you might be holding before the Fed raises interest rates in December.

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/gadfly/articles/2016-11-21/dark-days-for-the-euro-await-in-trump-s-1-trillion-plan

 

The euro is about to take a pounding.

 

 

 

 

 

As stated previously, I'm looking forward to the Italian referendum, for purely personal reasons, a lower Euro relative to GBP would help me also. 

 

But given all of that ... these predictions are based on the notion that EU politicians are incapable of pulling the hand break and changing course ... something that is much more likely to happen should their positions be threatened. Europe will change because it has to ... adapt, change and move forward. 

 

 

 

[SgtRock]

9 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

these predictions are based on the notion that EU politicians are incapable of pulling the hand break and changing course ... something that is much more likely to happen should their positions be threatened. Europe will change because it has to ... adapt, change and move forward. 

 

Adapt, change and move forward. Amen to that.

 

You have also highlighted the very thing that will kill the EU. It's inability to adapt, change and move forward.

 

It only has one gear. Crawling forward very, very slowly towards more EU, which it sees as the only answer to every EU problem. 

 

They are not interested in pulling the hand brake and changing course because that challenges their very existence and the very deep feeding trough.

 

Now, I can concede, that the full Monty of total Integration into a EUSuperstate would indeed, alleviate some of the EU's current problems. The problem with that is twofold.

 

1. MONEY. They do not have enough.

 

2. 27 COUNTRIES, 28 If you count the UK, are never, in a million years going to agree to this.

 

Putting aside our past differences, because squabbling, although at times makes for a bit of fun and banter, achieves precisely nothing. Given what I have said above, I am more than interested in what your views are on how the EU can adapt, change and move forward.

 

 

[AlexRich]

4 minutes ago, SgtRock said:

 

Adapt, change and move forward. Amen to that.

 

You have also highlighted the very thing that will kill the EU. It's inability to adapt, change and move forward.

 

It only has one gear. Crawling forward very, very slowly towards more EU, which it sees as the only answer to every EU problem. 

 

They are not interested in pulling the hand brake and changing course because that challenges their very existence and the very deep feeding trough.

 

Now, I can concede, that the full Monty of total Integration into a EUSuperstate would indeed, alleviate some of the EU's current problems. The problem with that is twofold.

 

1. MONEY. They do not have enough.

 

2. 27 COUNTRIES, 28 If you count the UK, are never, in a million years going to agree to this.

 

Putting aside our past differences, because squabbling, although at times makes for a bit of fun and banter, achieves precisely nothing. Given what I have said above, I am more than interested in what your views are on how the EU can adapt, change and move forward.

 

 

 

A lot would depend on what actually happens in the near future of the next two to three years. They could pool resources and sort out Greece, Italy and others (reduce debt burdens and recapitalise banks) ... that would involve a German wealth transfer. They might also reduce the Eurozone to countries whose economies are more in synch with each other. They might also roll-back Brussels centralisation of power ... a more devolved Europe ... and they could put some limits on free movement and clamp down on migrants or at least make Europe less attractive to them. If Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq could settle down they could repatriate a big chunk of the people who have arrived. 

 

When you are looking into the abyss it tends to focus your mind on solutions. 

 

 

[SheungWan]

'Canada quashes hopes of quick UK trade deal after Brexit' (FT)......Commonwealth to the rescue, not.

[SgtRock]

2 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

A lot would depend on what actually happens in the near future of the next two to three years

 

IMO it will not.

 

What happens in the next 1-3 years is a product of the EU's inability to adapt, change and move forward.

 

4 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

They might also reduce the Eurozone to countries whose economies are more in synch with each other. They might also roll-back Brussels centralisation of power ... a more devolved Europe ... and they could put some limits on free movement and clamp down on migrants or at least make Europe less attractive to them. If Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq could settle down they could repatriate a big chunk of the people who have arrived. 

 

So many might's, could's and if's in that paragraph that it is not even worth talking about. I do not live my life on might's, could's or if's and I hope you do not either.

 

5 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

When you are looking into the abyss it tends to focus your mind on solutions. 

 

I do not know who many times I have to say this. The EUrocrats craniums are stuck so far up their collective posteriors that they cannot see anything, never mind he abyss that everyone else can see and is warning about.

[dick dasterdly]

Just now, AlexRich said:

 

A lot would depend on what actually happens in the near future of the next two to three years. They could pool resources and sort out Greece, Italy and others (reduce debt burdens and recapitalise banks) ... that would involve a German wealth transfer. They might also reduce the Eurozone to countries whose economies are more in synch with each other. They might also roll-back Brussels centralisation of power ... a more devolved Europe ... and they could put some limits on free movement and clamp down on migrants or at least make Europe less attractive to them. If Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq could settle down they could repatriate a big chunk of the people who have arrived. 

 

When you are looking into the abyss it tends to focus your mind on solutions. 

 

 

I'd add getting rid of the waste of funding EU members money on the highest salaries and pensions possible/the ridiculous way bureaucratic empires are built/ and many other ridiculous EU idiosyncracies that waste a lot of  EU money.

 

I'm suprised that the eruocrats haven't already changed policies to head off a likely defeat in other EU countries.  Perhaps they really believe that brexit was an aberration and they can continue in the same way?

[SheungWan]

It must be quite irritating for the Hard Brexiteers screaming about the EU abyss non-stop, while smiling wanly as Theresa May seemingly having to concede promises to the CBI and business leaders that she isn't going to drop them in it. Or 'er rather, out of it.