Thailand: 8 Killed, 13 Injured in One Day in 3 Separate Traffic Accidents

[piewarmer]

I do like 2 things here on the road: merging from side streets is tolerated. They don't mind braking to let you in, it keeps everything flowing.

and lastly drivers rarely honk their horn, that's low stress for all.

[Loeilad]

On 11/26/2016 at 7:45 AM, oldlakey said:

Are you sure its not luck, well I will go to the bottom of our stairs   555555555

Driver puts bus into ravine on road he is not accustomed to and KILLS 18

Father kills himself and two daughters while negotiating a level crossing, why wait until the train has gone ?????

ETC etc etc etc etc etc and of course ETC ETC

Its been a bad week this one

Calling a BAD DRIVER, a bad driver and heaping as much blame on them as possible is justified

It is NOT RACIST or STUPID

Just because you are given enough rope to hang yourself by the authorities, does not make it compulsory

What you are indulging here is confirmation bias - it is not critical thinking it is based on prejudices - amongst which are race and perceptions of superiority.

in fact the incidents you describe can be found in ALL countries, they are not evidence that Thai drivers are racially stupid or subject to fate, luck or divine intervention anymore than anyone else.

 

in a similar post it was claimed that the tragedies of cyclists killed in Thailand is some kind of proof about Thailand not only is this flying in the face of common sense it ignores such things as  the 21,000 cyclists injured or killed in the Uk.......

Looking at individual incidents and allowing confirmation bias to take over only clouds your judgement and leads to  misconceptions about any topic.

Edited November 29, 2016 by Loeilad

[yardrunner]

5 minutes ago, Loeilad said:

What you are indulging here is confirmation bias - it is not critical thinking it is based on prejudices - amongst which are race and perceptions of superiority.

in fact the incidents you describe can be found in ALL countries, they are not evidence that Thai drivers are racially stupid or subject to fate, luck or divine intervention anymore than anyone else.

 

in a similar post it was claimed that the tragedies of cyclists killed in Thailand is some kind of proof about Thailand not only is this flying in the face of common sense it ignores such things as  the 21,000 cyclists injured or killed in the Uk.......

Looking at individual incidents and allowing confirmation bias to take over only clouds your judgement and leads to  misconceptions about any topic.

Yes these things happen in all countries but they seem to happen more often here than in many other countries and nothing seems to be done by means of education or enforcement to reduce the carnage on Thai roads

[Loeilad]

7 minutes ago, yardrunner said:

Yes these things happen in all countries but they seem to happen more often here than in many other countries and nothing seems to be done by means of education or enforcement to reduce the carnage on Thai roads

No that is EXACTLY what I mean by confirmation bias - there is no evidence or figures to back up that conclusion - the fatality rartes in Thailand are due to a multitude of factors - in ALL countries human error is regarded as the same - about 90%, but to single out one or two tragedies  is not accurate, not helpful and not a reasonable premise for that conclusion.

[yardrunner]

14 minutes ago, Loeilad said:

No that is EXACTLY what I mean by confirmation bias - there is no evidence or figures to back up that conclusion - the fatality rartes in Thailand are due to a multitude of factors - in ALL countries human error is regarded as the same - about 90%, but to single out one or two tragedies  is not accurate, not helpful and not a reasonable premise for that conclusion.

 so in the UK fatalities are counted up to 30 days after an accident but in Thailand only on the day but Thailand's fatalities are far higher than the UKs. per head of population.

In the UK crash helmets are mandatory and the law is enforced, any motorcyclist not wearing a helmet would be pulled over at any time and fined and more importantly details would be reported and if the same person was caught again penalties would increase up to seizure of the vehicle and imprisonment.

On heavy goods vehicles and buses drivers hours are limited and drivers and owners of overweight or poorly maintained vehicles are fined and the vehicles are removed from the road until the vehicles are repaired.Here they worry about the damage done to roads and say something will be done to stop the problems but very little seems to be done and nobody worries about the dangers caused to other road users.

Just a few facts for you

[Khun Paul]

1 hour ago, Loeilad said:

What you are indulging here is confirmation bias - it is not critical thinking it is based on prejudices - amongst which are race and perceptions of superiority.

in fact the incidents you describe can be found in ALL countries, they are not evidence that Thai drivers are racially stupid or subject to fate, luck or divine intervention anymore than anyone else.

 

in a similar post it was claimed that the tragedies of cyclists killed in Thailand is some kind of proof about Thailand not only is this flying in the face of common sense it ignores such things as  the 21,000 cyclists injured or killed in the Uk.......

Looking at individual incidents and allowing confirmation bias to take over only clouds your judgement and leads to  misconceptions about any topic.

, I agree there are misconceptions based on race here, however after over 30 years in law enforcement, and seeing so many accidents blamed either on faulty maintenance or drivers allegedly not knowing the road, one can come to only one conclusion that drivers here are not trained , nor are they experienced and the companies fail to maintain the vehicles correctly. A good driver would never take a badly maintained vehicle on the road and a good company would not allow it either. So it just goes to show that enforcement is practically zero on many counts and the passengers, and the innocent suffer and die . +

[Loeilad]

2 hours ago, Khun Paul said:

, I agree there are misconceptions based on race here, however after over 30 years in law enforcement, and seeing so many accidents blamed either on faulty maintenance or drivers allegedly not knowing the road, one can come to only one conclusion that drivers here are not trained , nor are they experienced and the companies fail to maintain the vehicles correctly. A good driver would never take a badly maintained vehicle on the road and a good company would not allow it either. So it just goes to show that enforcement is practically zero on many counts and the passengers, and the innocent suffer and die . +

OK, but you are just offering random explanations - you need to read the Swedish road safety paper "Vision Zero"  which analyses the nature of road safety and the misplaced emphasis on blame. "'The Accident Is Not the Major Problem'

 

 

The point is that this is a "road safety" problem - it involves ALL aspects of road use - not just car drivers....it involves the drivers, the police the engineers the emergency services the design of vehicles and the nature of vehicle using the road OTHER ROAD USERS - pedestrians sam-lor and elephants etc. It involves a MAJOR reconstruction and redesign of all roads - even the newest motorways and  a major rethink of every aspect of road safety. Then it requires the setting up of protocols to examine every road traffic related incident and then microscopically record every detail, every "accident" (misnomer) needs to be properly analysed by experts NOT the local BIBs.

N.B.. - the 5 tenets of road safety - Education Enforcement, Engineering Emergency and Evaluation

 

Thailand doesn't do any of this.

 

BUT - those TV members who read about a "crash" and then decide it justifies all their prejudices about Thailand are simply too ill-informed to see how wrong they are. whether it's confirmation bias or Dunning Kruger effect or a combination of both - they back it up with false syllogisms (my cat has 4 legs) and think they are making a point

 

Just because you drive a car, or anything else for that matter doesn't mean you are a road safety expert, any ore than having been at school makes you a teacher or being sick makes you a doctor....and the plural of anecdote is not data.

Edited November 29, 2016 by Loeilad

[yardrunner]

4 hours ago, Loeilad said:

OK, but you are just offering random explanations - you need to read the Swedish road safety paper "Vision Zero"  which analyses the nature of road safety and the misplaced emphasis on blame. "'The Accident Is Not the Major Problem'

 

 

The point is that this is a "road safety" problem - it involves ALL aspects of road use - not just car drivers....it involves the drivers, the police the engineers the emergency services the design of vehicles and the nature of vehicle using the road OTHER ROAD USERS - pedestrians sam-lor and elephants etc. It involves a MAJOR reconstruction and redesign of all roads - even the newest motorways and  a major rethink of every aspect of road safety. Then it requires the setting up of protocols to examine every road traffic related incident and then microscopically record every detail, every "accident" (misnomer) needs to be properly analysed by experts NOT the local BIBs.

N.B.. - the 5 tenets of road safety - Education Enforcement, Engineering Emergency and Evaluation

 

Thailand doesn't do any of this.

 

BUT - those TV members who read about a "crash" and then decide it justifies all their prejudices about Thailand are simply too ill-informed to see how wrong they are. whether it's confirmation bias or Dunning Kruger effect or a combination of both - they back it up with false syllogisms (my cat has 4 legs) and think they are making a point

 

Just because you drive a car, or anything else for that matter doesn't mean you are a road safety expert, any ore than having been at school makes you a teacher or being sick makes you a doctor....and the plural of anecdote is not data.

I agree with you that driving a car does not make you a road safety expert but if you have been driving for any length of time you should be able to evaluate how others are driving and be able to avoid most accidents (defensive driving) and you are then entitled to an opinion and it should be an informed opinion.

when you see a driver in the fast lane of a dual carriageway who is making an U turn stop in the fast lane instead of pulling in to the slip lane causing other vehicles to swerve to avoid the vehicle that is bad driving in which ever country you see it

[metisdead]

An inflammatory post has been removed:

 

7) You will respect fellow members and post in a civil manner. No personal attacks, hateful or insulting towards other members, (flaming) Stalking of members on either the forum or via PM will not be allowed.

[oldlakey]

13 hours ago, Loeilad said:

What you are indulging here is confirmation bias - it is not critical thinking it is based on prejudices - amongst which are race and perceptions of superiority.

in fact the incidents you describe can be found in ALL countries, they are not evidence that Thai drivers are racially stupid or subject to fate, luck or divine intervention anymore than anyone else.

 

in a similar post it was claimed that the tragedies of cyclists killed in Thailand is some kind of proof about Thailand not only is this flying in the face of common sense it ignores such things as  the 21,000 cyclists injured or killed in the Uk.......

Looking at individual incidents and allowing confirmation bias to take over only clouds your judgement and leads to  misconceptions about any topic.

This is my second attempt at answering your comment

I have only dealt  in published accident figures and published news stories

If thats your idea of a post based on prejudices - amongst which are race and perceptions of superiority so be it

I have no wish to argue over these figures or how they are interpreted, because they are factual

Just to put your mind at ease my comment about luck in an earlier post was tongue in cheek

Edited November 29, 2016 by oldlakey

[Loeilad]

15 hours ago, yardrunner said:

I agree with you that driving a car does not make you a road safety expert but if you have been driving for any length of time you should be able to evaluate how others are driving and be able to avoid most accidents (defensive driving) and you are then entitled to an opinion and it should be an informed opinion.

when you see a driver in the fast lane of a dual carriageway who is making an U turn stop in the fast lane instead of pulling in to the slip lane causing other vehicles to swerve to avoid the vehicle that is bad driving in which ever country you see it

No Seeing is not believing- as said this is confirmation bias and  the plural of anecdote is not data. People's perception of road safety is fundamentally floored - in fact your statement above is an oxymoron. your put forward a premise and then immediately contradicted it.

Edited November 30, 2016 by Loeilad

[Loeilad]

11 hours ago, oldlakey said:

This is my second attempt at answering your comment

I have only dealt  in published accident figures and published news stories

If thats your idea of a post based on prejudices - amongst which are race and perceptions of superiority so be it

I have no wish to argue over these figures or how they are interpreted, because they are factual

Just to put your mind at ease my comment about luck in an earlier post was tongue in cheek

"I have no wish to argue over these figures or how they are interpreted, because they are factual"

Sorry byut this just shows you don't understand how figures are either collated or used. you need to look closely at what you consider "factual" - 

[marko kok prong]

Just do not understand why Thailand is so bad for traffic accidents,the Philippines is 139th on the list and less developed than Thailand,but when i was there the attitude was 100% different,common sense mostly prevailed,people let others into the traffic flow or gave way,vigorous tooting of horns to let those in front know you where approaching,ect,must be the Thai personality,i find the cutting of corners the most annoying,like 'nothing could possibly be coming the other way',another thing i did not see in the Phili's.So i guess i have answered my own question.

[Loeilad]

1 hour ago, marko kok prong said:

Just do not understand why Thailand is so bad for traffic accidents,the Philippines is 139th on the list and less developed than Thailand,but when i was there the attitude was 100% different,common sense mostly prevailed,people let others into the traffic flow or gave way,vigorous tooting of horns to let those in front know you where approaching,ect,must be the Thai personality,i find the cutting of corners the most annoying,like 'nothing could possibly be coming the other way',another thing i did not see in the Phili's.So i guess i have answered my own question.

"Just do not understand why Thailand is so bad for traffic accidents," - actually relatively it's not - you'll probably find they are just about the same. Where Thailand  loses out is the number of deaths per 1000000...in actual incidents there has apparently been a drop of 1/3 in the last decade.

However the nature of the 2 countries is radically different - Thailand is actually quite a large nation with almost all of it on a mainland. Long straight badly built roads etc but the traffic in Thailand is characterised by the highest 4 wheel vehicle ownership in ASEAN. It is also accompanied by a massive number of motorcycles - this is a deadly combination.

Tooting of horns is and example of the cultural history of road transport in each country - Thailand hooting is rare - too rare in my opinion - but hooting comes from US, Spanish influences. You'll notice in Cambodia hooting is very common.

Thai driving culture does not have it's roots in the horse and cart like westerners do - it is roote4d in river transport and this accounts for a lot of strage (to us) behaviour like cutting corners and counterflow driving.

 

the conclusion has to be that with Philippines and  Thailand you are comparing apples with lemons there are just too many differences - demographics, culture, topography etc to be able to make a  direct comparison.

[oldlakey]

9 hours ago, Loeilad said:

"I have no wish to argue over these figures or how they are interpreted, because they are factual"

Sorry byut this just shows you don't understand how figures are either collated or used. you need to look closely at what you consider "factual" - 

Let me get this correct are you actually saying that the worldwide published figures are incorrect, and that approx 70 people a day DONT die in Thailand on the roads each day

You are correct I dont understand how these figures are collated or used but I suspect counting the DEAD and injured might get a look in somewhere down the line, do you think, and then mentioning to somebody that they are definitely DEAD hence  25,000 plus road fatalities

When you are DEAD you are DEAD it does not get anymore FACTUAL than that, so that is what I would consider FACTUAL as regards this thread, to the tune of 25,000 plus per year

How they collate those figures and how they use them is of no interest to me, my concern is for the dead, only the innocent dead though and their families , hence its only the final years total that is of interest to me

As far as I am aware there is no medical term for being HALF DEAD although I have felt that way at times after a session

If you dont mind I will stick with the WHO for my facts and figures on worldwide road deaths if thats OK with you

If you or others wish to defend the indefensible thats your right, but please try and keep to the indisputable FACTS

You are welcome to interpret the figures as it suits you but dont try and deny the actual DEATH TOTAL

 

Edited November 30, 2016 by oldlakey

[brling]

39 minutes ago, oldlakey said:

Let me get this correct are you actually saying that the worldwide published figures are incorrect, and that approx 70 people a day DONT die in Thailand on the roads each day

You are correct I dont understand how these figures are collated or used but I suspect counting the DEAD and injured might get a look in somewhere down the line, do you think, and then mentioning to somebody that they are definitely DEAD hence  25,000 plus road fatalities

When you are DEAD you are DEAD it does not get anymore FACTUAL than that, so that is what I would consider FACTUAL as regards this thread, to the tune of 25,000 plus per year

How they collate those figures and how they use them is of no interest to me, my concern is for the dead, only the innocent dead though and their families , hence its only the final years total that is of interest to me

As far as I am aware there is no medical term for being HALF DEAD although I have felt that way at times after a session

If you dont mind I will stick with the WHO for my facts and figures on worldwide road deaths if thats OK with you

If you or others wish to defend the indefensible thats your right, but please try and keep to the indisputable FACTS

You are welcome to interpret the figures as it suits you but dont try and deny the actual DEATH TOTAL

 

 

 Exactly, But the Thai apologist dont want facts like "actual DEATH TOTAL". Wise up apologists and if this thread is too negative, then avoid it. 

[oldlakey]

8 hours ago, marko kok prong said:

Just do not understand why Thailand is so bad for traffic accidents,the Philippines is 139th on the list and less developed than Thailand,but when i was there the attitude was 100% different,common sense mostly prevailed,people let others into the traffic flow or gave way,vigorous tooting of horns to let those in front know you where approaching,ect,must be the Thai personality,i find the cutting of corners the most annoying,like 'nothing could possibly be coming the other way',another thing i did not see in the Phili's.So i guess i have answered my own question.

The main and overriding reason for such a horrendous death toll on Thailands roads can be laid fairly and squarely at the door of the powers that be

From the very top to the rank and file at the bottom, they have completely abdicated their responsibilities that they owe to the Thai population at large

We all need guidance and protecting from ourselves at times

Lack of enforcement of the road laws encourages even level headed citizens into silly actions, this of course manifests itself in a very sad death toll

There are without doubt other contributors to this toll, but the main reason is a almost complete lack of enforcement

Bad roads play a part for sure, as for all the motorbikes, four wheel drive vehicles, overloaded vehicles etc etc,they are just that, its not the mode of transport that kills its the manner of its operation, bad / dangerous drivers are just that in any vehicle in any location

 

 

Edited November 30, 2016 by oldlakey

[yardrunner]

18 hours ago, Loeilad said:

No Seeing is not believing- as said this is confirmation bias and  the plural of anecdote is not data. People's perception of road safety is fundamentally floored - in fact your statement above is an oxymoron. your put forward a premise and then immediately contradicted it.

Oh i misunderstood, you are worried about grammar and will not except any information that you think is not grammatically correct, you are obviously not bothered about road safety 

[Loeilad]

13 hours ago, oldlakey said:

Let me get this correct are you actually saying that the worldwide published figures are incorrect, and that approx 70 people a day DONT die in Thailand on the roads each day

You are correct I dont understand how these figures are collated or used but I suspect counting the DEAD and injured might get a look in somewhere down the line, do you think, and then mentioning to somebody that they are definitely DEAD hence  25,000 plus road fatalities

When you are DEAD you are DEAD it does not get anymore FACTUAL than that, so that is what I would consider FACTUAL as regards this thread, to the tune of 25,000 plus per year

How they collate those figures and how they use them is of no interest to me, my concern is for the dead, only the innocent dead though and their families , hence its only the final years total that is of interest to me

As far as I am aware there is no medical term for being HALF DEAD although I have felt that way at times after a session

If you dont mind I will stick with the WHO for my facts and figures on worldwide road deaths if thats OK with you

If you or others wish to defend the indefensible thats your right, but please try and keep to the indisputable FACTS

You are welcome to interpret the figures as it suits you but dont try and deny the actual DEATH TOTAL

 

Sorry way to simplistic and naive for me....you need to review the reality of the gathering of stats.

Numbers are NOT facts (al;though many people may be discomforted by this) and deciding who is dead from an RTA is not as simple as you appear to imagine. do you really think that all stats gathwred around the world are reliable???

 

..and again the deaths per 100000 are only one way to look at and interpret road safety - please try to be more critical of the information you encounter.

Edited December 1, 2016 by Loeilad

[Loeilad]

3 hours ago, yardrunner said:

Oh i misunderstood, you are worried about grammar and will not except any information that you think is not grammatically correct, you are obviously not bothered about road safety 

How is that "grammar"?

i think you are now reducing the arguyment to a ridiculous level - my guess is it is because you don't actually understand what is going on?

[Loeilad]

12 hours ago, oldlakey said:

The main and overriding reason for such a horrendous death toll on Thailands roads can be laid fairly and squarely at the door of the powers that be

From the very top to the rank and file at the bottom, they have completely abdicated their responsibilities that they owe to the Thai population at large

We all need guidance and protecting from ourselves at times

Lack of enforcement of the road laws encourages even level headed citizens into silly actions, this of course manifests itself in a very sad death toll

There are without doubt other contributors to this toll, but the main reason is a almost complete lack of enforcement

Bad roads play a part for sure, as for all the motorbikes, four wheel drive vehicles, overloaded vehicles etc etc,they are just that, its not the mode of transport that kills its the manner of its operation, bad / dangerous drivers are just that in any vehicle in any location

 

 

As I said you can't tackle this problem on a single issue - it doesn't work and thinking there is one single major factor is just the result of a non-critical  approach to the issues.

[MiKT]

Just back from another 4000k round trip to Singapore taking in a few bits of Malaysia like Ipo, KL, Melaka and Penang on the way there and back.

 

One of many times I have made similar journeys and I am still convinced that Thai driving is actually better than Malaysian / Singaporean, but actual standard of road construction for the many motorways and cross connecting network of major roads  helps to reduce the number of accidents in Malaysia.

 

Certainly Thai drivers are much more considerate than the Malays and Singies who are incredibly selfish and impatient drivers.

 

If you want more hooting go to India or Bangladeshi and you will be driven crazy with the non stop unnecessary hooting.

 

You cannot compare places like the Philippines where it once took me 6 hours to travel 17km on a major rout the road was so bad. Manila traffic is even worse than Bangkok and its a far more dangerous place to live/drive. Cambodia, Laos or Vietnam cannot be compared at all as they have so few roads and cars.

 

China is even worse for road deaths and accidents.

 

None of which white-washes the situation here, but its not half as bad as the "All thing Thai are bad" mob which takes anything bad that happens here and magnifies it out of all proportion.

 

No I am not a road traffic expert, but as somebody has pointed out above, if you actually drive enough in many different countries, you do get a good idea of which is the best place to drive.

 

Was a time when you could safely do 250+kmph on the Autobahns in Germany without anybody pulling out of the slow lane to impede your progress. Not any more and the number of accidents in Europe is getting worse.

 

NB Just in case anybody is planning a trip down south, the road past Hua Hin has roadworks for over 700 km on the Southbound carriageway all the way to Hay Yai with stretches of 20km at a time reduced to single line traffic with no chance to overtake, so the journey is even more tedious than usual. However, the North bound carriageway is much better and the resurfacing is about 70% complete now, so less roadworks.

 

Also choose carefully the time you try to get into Singapore, we unwittingly arrived on a Saturday afternoon during a major school holiday so it took more than 3 hours at the Woodlands check point to get in and on the way out the next day the second causeway was equally jammed up on the inbound side.

 

Not  many accidents as nobody was going anywhere.

 

 

 

 

 

[oldlakey]

11 hours ago, Loeilad said:

Sorry way to simplistic and naive for me....you need to review the reality of the gathering of stats.

Numbers are NOT facts (al;though many people may be discomforted by this) and deciding who is dead from an RTA is not as simple as you appear to imagine. do you really think that all stats gathwred around the world are reliable???

 

..and again the deaths per 100000 are only one way to look at and interpret road safety - please try to be more critical of the information you encounter.

Please try and be more critical of the information you encounter, OK good advice so I will give that a go , so here goes

There has been several strange utterances on here in defence of the BAD DRIVERS who populate THAI roads

But this particular one takes the biscuit, even by Thaivisa standards 

The reason that Thai drivers CUT CORNERS and drive against the TRAFFIC FLOW is because their driving culture is rooted in boat navigation, not in the horse and cart as is the case in the western world

5555555555555555555555555555555555

I hope that is not too critical for you

As John McEnroe often said    YOU CANT BE SERIOUS

 

[kingalfred]

If they really cared, they could reduce the carnage on the roads.....but hey.........!

Absolutely! The country doesn't care at all! Mai pen rai


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[oldlakey]

35 minutes ago, MiKT said:

Just back from another 4000k round trip to Singapore taking in a few bits of Malaysia like Ipo, KL, Melaka and Penang on the way there and back.

 

One of many times I have made similar journeys and I am still convinced that Thai driving is actually better than Malaysian / Singaporean, but actual standard of road construction for the many motorways and cross connecting network of major roads  helps to reduce the number of accidents in Malaysia.

 

Certainly Thai drivers are much more considerate than the Malays and Singies who are incredibly selfish and impatient drivers.

 

If you want more hooting go to India or Bangladeshi and you will be driven crazy with the non stop unnecessary hooting.

 

You cannot compare places like the Philippines where it once took me 6 hours to travel 17km on a major rout the road was so bad. Manila traffic is even worse than Bangkok and its a far more dangerous place to live/drive. Cambodia, Laos or Vietnam cannot be compared at all as they have so few roads and cars.

 

China is even worse for road deaths and accidents.

 

None of which white-washes the situation here, but its not half as bad as the "All thing Thai are bad" mob which takes anything bad that happens here and magnifies it out of all proportion.

 

No I am not a road traffic expert, but as somebody has pointed out above, if you actually drive enough in many different countries, you do get a good idea of which is the best place to drive.

 

Was a time when you could safely do 250+kmph on the Autobahns in Germany without anybody pulling out of the slow lane to impede your progress. Not any more and the number of accidents in Europe is getting worse.

 

NB Just in case anybody is planning a trip down south, the road past Hua Hin has roadworks for over 700 km on the Southbound carriageway all the way to Hay Yai with stretches of 20km at a time reduced to single line traffic with no chance to overtake, so the journey is even more tedious than usual. However, the North bound carriageway is much better and the resurfacing is about 70% complete now, so less roadworks.

 

Also choose carefully the time you try to get into Singapore, we unwittingly arrived on a Saturday afternoon during a major school holiday so it took more than 3 hours at the Woodlands check point to get in and on the way out the next day the second causeway was equally jammed up on the inbound side.

 

Not  many accidents as nobody was going anywhere.

 

 

 

 

 

Compared to THAILAND there never is many accidents even if people are going somewhere

AND thats a FACT

Edited December 1, 2016 by oldlakey

[oldlakey]

11 hours ago, Loeilad said:

As I said you can't tackle this problem on a single issue - it doesn't work and thinking there is one single major factor is just the result of a non-critical  approach to the issues.

The single issue I would like to see get tackled is the HORRENDOUS DEATH TOLL, and in a meaningful way , as in being greatly reduced, POST- HASTE

The secondary issues can come to the fore at a later date

You see there I go again a total lack of critical thinking, I actually despair at times will I ever learn

A helpful hint here for you, the line directly above this one is a  TONGUE in CHEEK statement

 

 

[oldlakey]

On 26/11/2016 at 7:01 AM, piewarmer said:

I do like 2 things here on the road: merging from side streets is tolerated. They don't mind braking to let you in, it keeps everything flowing.

and lastly drivers rarely honk their horn, that's low stress for all.

In most countries but not all the horn is used as a driving asset, to be used to WARN other road users of their PRESENCE

This correct use of the horn invariably helps to cut down on the accident rate

There will always be some who use it as a weapon to try and intimidate unfortunately

Using the horn in Thailand can be a bit of a gamble, resulting in unwanted consequences, that should explain the reason for the low stress for all

Merging is common practice in more than one SE Asian country

I find that drivers of such cars as Mercedes, BMW, Bentleys etc etc are very amenable to my need to merge

 

[MiKT]

58 minutes ago, oldlakey said:

Please try and be more critical of the information you encounter, OK good advice so I will give that a go , so here goes

There has been several strange utterances on here in defence of the BAD DRIVERS who populate THAI roads

But this particular one takes the biscuit, even by Thaivisa standards 

The reason that Thai drivers CUT CORNERS and drive against the TRAFFIC FLOW is because their driving culture is rooted in boat navigation, not in the horse and cart as is the case in the western world

5555555555555555555555555555555555

I hope that is not too critical for you

As John McEnroe often said    YOU CANT BE SERIOUS

 

 

But, you have to consider if cutting corners and driving against what you ASSUME is the traffic flow (and may not be in Thailand) contribute to accidents when ALL the locals and some expats actually understand is the normal way of driving here and thus are not a surprise, it is just accepted as the way to drive.

 

You can't bring your supposedly highly regulated your overseas driving experience here and expect it to be the same.

 

The high death toll here is mostly due to Drink and Driving especially for motorcyclists. But the police are getting better at stopping and checking people, so that should improve matters.

 

 

 

[oldlakey]

2 minutes ago, MiKT said:

 

But, you have to consider if cutting corners and driving against what you ASSUME is the traffic flow (and may not be in Thailand) contribute to accidents when ALL the locals and some expats actually understand is the normal way of driving here and thus are not a surprise, it is just accepted as the way to drive.

 

You can't bring your supposedly highly regulated your overseas driving experience here and expect it to be the same.

 

The high death toll here is mostly due to Drink and Driving especially for motorcyclists. But the police are getting better at stopping and checking people, so that should improve matters.

 

 

 

I am beginning to wonder just what actually does cause all these accidents /deaths  / and injuries in Thailand

After reading the plethora of excuses put forward on here I think I will put my money on the MAN in the MOON

At even money a good bet indeed

I know exactly what the RTP are improving and its NOT the accident rate

 

[oldlakey]

2 hours ago, MiKT said:

 

But, you have to consider if cutting corners and driving against what you ASSUME is the traffic flow (and may not be in Thailand) contribute to accidents when ALL the locals and some expats actually understand is the normal way of driving here and thus are not a surprise, it is just accepted as the way to drive.

 

You can't bring your supposedly highly regulated your overseas driving experience here and expect it to be the same.

 

The high death toll here is mostly due to Drink and Driving especially for motorcyclists. But the police are getting better at stopping and checking people, so that should improve matters.

 

 

 

Cutting corners and driving against the traffic flow were terms that were used earlier by an apologist in his defence of the road toll, I was just quoting him for maximum effect, and then of course we get your contribution 5555555555

It was his contention that Thai drivers did this because their driving culture was rooted in boat navigation

Absolutely nothing to do with my supposedly highly regulated overseas driving experience, HONEST 5555555555

If all the TRAFFIC is coming towards me, leaving me nowhere to go I think I would be justified in thinking I had made a cock-up somewhere along the line, DONT YOU, let me assure you I would not do that as a matter of course

Hopefully you are now beginning to understand how difficult it is to defend the indefensible