What Nationality Is He?

[Dazinoz]

My girlfriend who is from Myanmar but lives in Thailand recently had a baby to me (yes he is mine, had a DNA test done). I am from Australia and baby was born Thailand. The hospital did all the paperwork for us to take to the office to obtain birth certificate. The lady asked for my girlfriends passport but she does not have one. She only has a "Non Thai" ID for Thailand (the pink one). Even that does not have her name correct. The baby was registered in my surname.

 

After about 6 weeks the baby choked on his milk and was rushed to hospital. He has been there 4 weeks with 3 weeks of that in ICU. The hospital bill is over 500k now and we asked doctors about moving him to a cheaper hospital. They asked us to bring the birth certificate in to see where he could take advantage of the Thai system of government hospitals.

 

To their and our surprise he is listed as "No Nationality" and apparently there is another comment that says something like he is not entitled to anything in Thailand. 

 

I am no so worried about entitlements but I am concerned about the no nationality bit. How can he get a passport? And maybe other problems too could arise.

 

Has anyone had experience with this or knows of anyone who has? I am concerned if I get him and Australian passport will he have to do the visa runs, etc.

 

I will eventually contact a lawyer but busy going to and from the hospital several times a day.

[sanemax]

I am in the same situation, I have a three year old born to a Burmese Mother and my Boy has no Nationality at all , at least one Parent has to be Thai before Children can get Thai ID /Nationality .

   If you get him an Aussie PP, Visa issues will only rise after you have taken himm outside of Thailand and then when you bring him back, Children do not get fined or banned if they overstay

[sanemax]

Children with no Nationality can attend Schools and Prayruth recently stated that ALL Children in Thai Schools will be given Thai ID .

   As you are not married, you have no legal Parental rights , you are regarded as just being the Childs mothers boyfreind when She had a baby .

    You will not be able to take your Child out of Thailand without the Mothers and Courts permission, even if the Child has a Aussie Passport

[Puyai]

Children with no Nationality can attend Schools and Prayruth recently stated that ALL Children in Thai Schools will be given Thai ID .
   As you are not married, you have no legal Parental rights , you are regarded as just being the Childs mothers boyfreind when She had a baby .
    You will not be able to take your Child out of Thailand without the Mothers and Courts permission, even if the Child has a Aussie Passport

I had a child in the same circumstances. Saying you cannot take the child out of the country without the documentation is pure fantasy. I have taken my child out of Thailand with his British passport on numerous occasions and never once had any sort of trouble leaving the country.


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[sanemax]

1 minute ago, Puyai said:

 

I had a child in the same circumstances. Saying you cannot take the child out of the country without the documentation is pure fantasy. I have taken my child out of Thailand with his British passport on numerous occasions and never once had any sort of trouble leaving the country.


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    I did mean on the very first time that you take a Thai born Child out from Thailand on a Foreign PP . You cannot just get the Child a PP and then leave Thailand .

   The Child would have no entry stamp in his PP and immigration wouldnt let him leave .

    You would need to obtain legal documents allowing him to be taken out of Thailand and his mothers consent would be required .

This is the procedure for ummarried Fathers, things may be different if you are married to the mother

[Puyai]

 
    I did mean on the very first time that you take a Thai born Child out from Thailand on a Foreign PP . You cannot just get the Child a PP and then leave Thailand .
   The Child would have no entry stamp in his PP and immigration wouldnt let him leave .
    You would need to obtain legal documents allowing him to be taken out of Thailand and his mothers consent would be required .
This is the procedure for ummarried Fathers, things may be different if you are married to the mother

Yes, I had to take my child out of the country for the first time too. You need his birth certificate to show he was born in Thailand. No other letter from the mother or documents from the Amphur were needed.

I am only speaking from personal experience. Other posters I'm sure have had different experiences.




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[brewsterbudgen]

Yes, I had to take my child out of the country for the first time too. You need his birth certificate to show he was born in Thailand. No other letter from the mother or documents from the Amphur were needed.

I am only speaking from personal experience. Other posters I'm sure have had different experiences.




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Correct. My girlfriend (now wife) is Laotian and I am British. Our son was born in Thailand and has a Thai birth certificate. We had no problem in taking him to Laos to visit granny, twice, and then back "home" to Thailand, and only showed the birth certificate at the border.

Now he has a British passport and is included on my Extension of Stay, as is my wife.

We've already visited the UK twice and he's still not 2 years old.

[sanemax]

1 minute ago, Puyai said:

 

Yes, I had to take my child out of the country for the first time too. You need his birth certificate to show he was born in Thailand. No other letter from the mother or documents from the Amphur were needed.

I am only speaking from personal experience. Other posters I'm sure have had different experiences.

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   Was this recently ?

I believe that immigration have implemented new rules in the last few years in efforts to clamp down on child trafficking .

 

[Puyai]

 
   Was this recently ?
I believe that immigration have implemented new rules in the last few years in efforts to clamp down on child trafficking .
 

August 2015.

Since then I have been back to Thailand 3 times with my child.


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[sanemax]

4 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

 

Correct. My girlfriend (now wife) is Laotian and I am British. Our son was born in Thailand and has a Thai birth certificate. We had no problem in taking him to Laos to visit granny, twice, and then back "home" to Thailand, and only showed the birth certificate at the border.

Now he has a British passport and is included on my Extension of Stay, as is my wife.

We've already visited the UK twice and he's still not 2 years old.

 

 

   Yes, but his Mother was there , so that is her giving permission , I was talking about if the Mother wasnt there and didnt give any permission .

    Very different circumstances to a Father taking a Child  out at an airport without the Mother to a Mother taking her Child back to a neighboring Country for a short visit

[Dazinoz]

2 hours ago, sanemax said:

 

   As you are not married, you have no legal Parental rights , you are regarded as just being the Childs mothers boyfreind when She had a baby .

    

 

Thanks for the info.

 

So does this apply if a father, like you and me, in this situation leaves the girlfriend and baby he is not legally required to pay child support?

 

Before anyone gets upset about the question, thats all it is a question for interest sake.

[sanemax]

3 minutes ago, Puyai said:

 

August 2015.

Since then I have been back to Thailand 3 times with my child.


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  August 2015 was the first time that you took your Child out of Thailand ?

Only the first time is relevant 

[sanemax]

10 minutes ago, Dazinoz said:

 

Thanks for the info.

 

So does this apply if a father, like you and me, in this situation leaves the girlfriend and baby he is not legally required to pay child support?

 

Before anyone gets upset about the question, thats all it is a question for interest sake.

 

   Nope, not legally required to pay any child support at all

[brewsterbudgen]

 
   Yes, but his Mother was there , so that is her giving permission , I was talking about if the Mother wasnt there and didnt give any permission .
    Very different circumstances to a Father taking a Child  out at an airport without the Mother to a Mother taking her Child back to a neighboring Country for a short visit

Absolutely. I don't believe the OP is considering that.

[sanemax]

2 hours ago, Puyai said:

 

Yes, I had to take my child out of the country for the first time too. You need his birth certificate to show he was born in Thailand. No other letter from the mother or documents from the Amphur were needed.

I am only speaking from personal experience. Other posters I'm sure have had different experiences.

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    Just to confrim tht we are talking about the same thing and wires havent been crossed along the way :

   You were not married to your childs mother and therefore had no legal rights at ll over the child .

   You didnt go to Court to obtain any legal rights over the child

You just got your child a passport, took him to the airport and flew away without any permission from the childs legal guardian or the Courts .

    Immigration at the airport accepted a birth certificate and they didnt question why he didnt have an entry visa in his passport .

Even though legally you were not the childs guardian and you had no legal right to the child and therefore the child isnt legally yours, the child belongs solely to its mother , you were still able to take someone elses child out of Thailand with just an empty passport and a birth certificate ?

   Is that correct ?

     

[Puyai]

 
    Just to confrim tht we are talking about the same thing and wires havent been crossed along the way :
   You were not married to your childs mother and therefore had no legal rights at ll over the child .
   You didnt go to Court to obtain any legal rights over the child
You just got your child a passport, took him to the airport and flew away without any permission from the childs legal guardian or the Courts .
    Immigration at the airport accepted a birth certificate and they didnt question why he didnt have an entry visa in his passport .
Even though legally you were not the childs guardian and you had no legal right to the child and therefore the child isnt legally yours, the child belongs solely to its mother , you were still able to take someone elses child out of Thailand with just an empty passport and a birth certificate ?
   Is that correct ?
     

Yes that is correct. We do have the same surnames and I am named as the father on the birth certificate.


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[brewsterbudgen]

Yes that is correct. We do have the same surnames and I am named as the father on the birth certificate.


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Was the child's mother travelling with you?

[Puyai]

Was the child's mother travelling with you?

No she wasn't. I thought that was obvious from my previous replies, and considering what the topic is about..


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[brewsterbudgen]

No she wasn't. I thought that was obvious from my previous replies, and considering what the topic is about..


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No, it wasn't clear. Thanks for clarifying. I had always believed that a letter from the legal parent was required. It's interesting that this is not always the case.

[sanemax]

4 hours ago, Puyai said:

Yes that is correct. We do have the same surnames and I am named as the father on the birth certificate.


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   Thanks for the info, just one more thing .

Which documents did you meed to get your child a UK passport ?

(Yes the required documents are listed on the UK Gov website , but some of the required documents do not exist, like the mothers birth certificate and Trendy house said that all stated needed documents are not all necessary, so, I was just wondering which documents you provided to get your child a UK PP . I was going to apply to get my son a UK PP, but all I have is my PP and his birth certificate , which has my name on it)

[Dazinoz]

22 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

 

Absolutely. I don't believe the OP is considering that.

 

 

You are correct I have never considered taking the baby away from his mother. I am just concerned about his legal future with no nationality.

[Puyai]

From what I remember I only had his birth certificate, translation, my pp, my birth certificate and a copies of his mothers Id and passport.


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[brewsterbudgen]

 
   Thanks for the info, just one more thing .
Which documents did you meed to get your child a UK passport ?
(Yes the required documents are listed on the UK Gov website , but some of the required documents do not exist, like the mothers birth certificate and Trendy house said that all stated needed documents are not all necessary, so, I was just wondering which documents you provided to get your child a UK PP . I was going to apply to get my son a UK PP, but all I have is my PP and his birth certificate , which has my name on it)

My girlfriend doesn't have a birth certificate, only a Lao passport and (translated) Lao ID card. You will need your long-form birth certificate to prove you are "British otherwise than by descent".

[catman20]

read the first sentence and thought straight away, now here is a relationship built on trust.    

Edited December 6, 2016 by catman20

[AJBangkok]

On 12/4/2016 at 5:55 PM, Dazinoz said:

 

You are correct I have never considered taking the baby away from his mother. I am just concerned about his legal future with no nationality.

 

As you are Australian you can apply for citizenship by descent for the child immediately. Your GF not having a passport may make filling the form out a bit tricky but if you have DNA evidence I can't see the embassy giving you too much trouble . 

[LukKrueng]

58 minutes ago, catman20 said:

read the first sentence and thought straight away, now here is a relationship built on trust.    

yes, I wondered how come no one so far commented on that... I was just about to ask the op WHY...

[StevieAus]

If you wish to apply for an Australian passport for your child you will first have to obtain citizenship which we have just completed for our daughter who was born here in Thailand

This can be obtained through the Australian Consulate in Bangkok who have a section there and I found them very helpful

I would suggest that you call them on 02 344 6300 to clarify the issue of "no nationality" appearing on the birth certificate

[cyberfarang]

It makes no difference where a child is born, the child is the nationality of the parents, either registered in the nationality of one parent or can have duel nationality if each parent are of different nationalities. For example; if my father is British, my mother German and I am born in Russia, that doesn`t make me a Russian. 

[calbear09]

Why the DNA test? Just be careful if you aren't in Thailand full-time. Many women even with children with a foreigner have thai boyfriends if the man is not around full time.

[Krataiboy]

Re the traveling with a child aspect, the attached link (there are others on Google along the same lines) will help clarify things. Not carrying the recommended letter risks problems not on leaving Thailand but on arriving elsewhere. Better safe than sorry.

 

I took a letter of consent to travel from my wife when I visited the UK just over a year ago with our eight-year-old daughter who has dual Thai/British nationality. The Immigration Officer who dealt with us at Heathrow ignored me completely but asked my daughter about whom she was traveling with. She said: "My dad". I told the officer I had a letter of consent and she said "It's OK, just checking" and waved us through.

 

https://photos.state.gov/libraries/.../164203/.../sample_letter_of_consent_to_travel.pdf