Police expect Trump to lift limits on surplus military gear

[webfact]

Police expect Trump to lift limits on surplus military gear

By DAVID DISHNEAU

 

HAGERSTOWN, Md. (AP) — If president-elect Donald Trump keeps his promise, surplus military grenade launchers, bayonets, tracked armored vehicles and high-powered firearms and ammunition will once again be available to state and local U.S. police departments.

 

National police organizations say they'll hold Trump to that promise.

 

President Barack Obama issued an executive order restricting that access in 2015 amid an outcry over police use of armored vehicles and other war-fighting gear to confront protesters in Ferguson, Missouri, after the fatal shooting of Michael Brown. Since then, federal officials have recalled more than 1,800 items, which have been destroyed through target practice or otherwise disposed of, officials say.

 

But state and local police organizations have protested, insisting that military-style vehicles and gear help protect officers' lives and public safety — for example, a privately manufactured, tracked armored vehicle played a key role in the police response to the mass shooting at a county government building in San Bernardino, California, in December 2015.

 

During his campaign, Trump sided with the police. In September, he promised to rescind the executive order in a written response to a Fraternal Order of Police questionnaire that helped him win an endorsement from the organization of rank-and-file officers.

 

"The 1033 program is an excellent program that enhances community safety. I will rescind the current executive order," reads the response posted on the group's website.

 

"We take him at his word," Executive Director James Pasco said in a recent telephone interview.

 

The Trump transition team did not respond to questions from The Associated Press about the executive order.

 

National Sheriffs' Association Executive Director Jonathan F. Thompson said his group has pressed the topic in discussions with Trump's transition team. And William J. Johnson, executive director of the National Association of Police Organizations, said he was encouraged by his conversations with Trump representatives before the Nov. 8 election.

 

"The feeling that we got is they absolutely hear us and they share our concerns," he said.

 

Obama's order was triggered partly by police use of military-style gear and vehicles in response to the 2014 unrest in Ferguson. The order prohibited the federal government from providing grenade launchers, bayonets, tracked armored vehicles, weaponized aircraft and vehicles, and firearms and ammunition of .50-caliber or greater to state and local police agencies.

 

Since then, the Defense Logistics Agency has recalled 138 grenade launchers, more than 1,600 bayonets and 126 tracked vehicles — those that run on continuous, tank-like tracks instead of wheels — that were provided through the military's 1033 program, agency spokeswoman Michelle McCaskill said.

 

Peter Kraska, a professor at Eastern Kentucky University's School of Justice Studies who has studied the militarization of police, said Obama's executive order has had little effect because there was relatively little demand for the prohibited items to begin with.

"It was more symbolic politics than anything substantive," he said.

 

The order also added requirements for record-keeping, local oversight and training for the acquisition or use of other surplus military equipment such as wheeled armored vehicles, but those hurdles apparently have not deterred agencies from obtaining the gear. McCaskill said 183 law enforcement agencies have received mine-resistant, ambush-protected vehicles or MRAPs, through the 1033 program so far this year. That's more than the 165 MRAPs that were distributed in 2013.

 

Nevertheless, Kraska said, there's nothing to justify most police departments having such equipment.

 

"It just ramps up the probability that this kind of kind of high-end military hardware is going to be misapplied," he said.

 

But Cass County, North Dakota, Sheriff Paul Laney said the executive order is aimed at urban areas and ignores the usefulness of tracked vehicles in rugged terrain.

 

"They fail to realize the dilemma it puts sheriffs in who live in the rural areas, the desert areas, the mountain areas," he said.

 

Oakland County, Michigan, Sheriff Michael Bouchard, whose tracked vehicle was recalled, said rescinding the order would restore police access to equipment they've been denied for what he called "purely optic" reasons.

 

Groups on both ends of the political spectrum have expressed concern about police militarization, from civil-rights organizations such as the NAACP and ACLU to the libertarian Cato Institute.

 

Raed Jarrar, government relations manager for the American Friends Service Committee, a Quaker group committed to peace and social justice, said the executive order wasn't effective but rescinding it would send a message that "rather than attempting to curb militarism, the president-elect is planning to continue on that path."

 

The Charles Koch Institute, founded by its conservative billionaire namesake, considers the restrictions under Obama's executive order "a decent start," said William Ruger, vice president of policy and research.

 

"We don't want local police departments to be incentivized to get the types of equipment that in most cases are a better fit for the war zone," he said.

 

-- © Associated Press 2016-12-12

[55Jay]

Seems like a reasonable program and I personally don't mind a police or sheriff's dept having a non-tracked, APC type vehicle to move into actual or potential gun fire and/or suspected IED areas.

But I would also draw the line at tracked vehicles, grenade launchers (excluding perhaps M79 "Thumpers" for CS applications in crowd control) and bayonets.   Da funk they going to do, shishkabob protestors and looters?  Really?    

 

This program sounds like it morphed into a "kid in a candy store" so, IMO, Obama did the right thing in dialing it back a bit.   Sheriff Michael Bouchard (quoted in the article) comes off as a bit too cavalier about the mere "optics" of possessing and using this kind of gear.  An educated man who's dabbled in politics as well, but they too can lose the plot, and require a sanity check.

[Emster23]

Seems like there is lots of surplus military gear while at the same time politicians holler about how weak US military has become, how have no supplies, have to hold bake sales, etc. The military-industrial-congressional complex (as Eisenhower originally called it) often force feeds the pentagon more "goodies" than they want.

[sgtsabai]

Great, more military gear for the para-military forces. I'm sure it will never be used on unarmed people, water protectors and the such, yea NOT! Should be a few surplus M-60's around, don't forget where the C-Rat can goes so you can shoot more unarmed protesters without the jams. I'm glad my mom, dad and grandparents, especially Judge Ray, my favorite, are not around to see what has happened to our country.  

 

A bit off, but yes, more gear than they want or need, often doesn't even work the way it should. Prime example, F-35, can't fly, can't fight, can't bomb. But it sure can make money.

[boomerangutang]

Trump is building defenses around himself as we would expect from a dictator.  He knows there will be large demonstrations against him and his harmful-to-America policies.  He knows he will need beefed-up policing to protect himself.  Therefore:  military-grade piles of added weaponry for police.

[NickJ]

Thank God...

Maybe with luck all will work out and we don't have to revolt in the streets after the liberal clean up..

[wwest5829]

This is what the American people decided they wanted. Give them what they want. Sometimes you have to hit some folks across the forehead to get their attention. As they are rather slow in learning (Americans don't need no stinking history), in the meantime buy military supplier company stocks. Oh, that's fight you poor working poor, we will not be raising the minimum wage. We don't want you to have any excess funds for that stock "investing".

[NeverSure]

I'll pass out the tinfoil hats now. Geez.

 

As for the comment about tracked vehicles, the US is huge and much of it can be reached only by going "off road." Tracked vehicles are the cat's meow for that and a sheriff is quoted as pointing all of this out. I can't understand why anyone would be intimidated by a tracked vehicle when many farmers plow with them and bulldozers and excavators are tracked so they won't get stuck in civilian use.

 

I grew up on a rural wheat and cattle ranch in rural US and wheeled tractors weren't safe due to rollover concerns on hillsides. All plowing and discing (Yes, a disc is spelled that way) was done with bulldozers.

 

Today many farmers put track kits on farm tractors and many Bobcat skid steers are tracked.

 

Cheers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Stargeezr]

Well it does not make the USA weaker to have a well armed and ready police' force, after all most people in the US are armed and some are dangerous as well.    Maybe the Donald is going to be okay after all.  For those in doubt, just ask your selves if Hillary and her hubby would have been all that honest and really, really  good  for that country.  I  kind of doubt  it.

Geezer

[ilostmypassword]

3 hours ago, Stargrazer9889 said:

Well it does not make the USA weaker to have a well armed and ready police' force, after all most people in the US are armed and some are dangerous as well.    Maybe the Donald is going to be okay after all.  For those in doubt,  just ask your selves if Hillary and her hubby would have been all that honest and really, really  good  for that country.  I  kind of doubt  it.

Geezer

You mean that it wasn't until Trump proposed arming police with military gear that you weren't sure about Trump? That sounds believable.

And I did just ask myself if Hillary and her hubby would have been good for the country. And the answer was "yes". I also asked myself if Donald and his wifey would be good for the country. And I called myself a sexist piece of sh*t for even asking the question.

I will say that the one thing that did scare was Clinton doing something really evil like tapping the number 2 person at Goldman Sachs to head the National Council of Economic Advisers. Or making a 2nd generation Goldman Sachs guy and banker who illegally foreclosed mortgages on thousands of people the head of the Treasury Dept.  Or choosing for Secretary of Labor a fast food honcho who thinks that it's okay to deny someone who earns less than 24,000 per year the right to overtime pay and is against any substantial raise in the minimum wage.

[crankshaft]

15 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

Trump is building defenses around himself as we would expect from a dictator.  He knows there will be large demonstrations against him and his harmful-to-America policies.  He knows he will need beefed-up policing to protect himself.  Therefore:  military-grade piles of added weaponry for police.

 

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

10 hours ago, NeverSure said:

I'll pass out the tinfoil hats now. Geez.

 

As for the comment about tracked vehicles, the US is huge and much of it can be reached only by going "off road." Tracked vehicles are the cat's meow for that and a sheriff is quoted as pointing all of this out. I can't understand why anyone would be intimidated by a tracked vehicle when many farmers plow with them and bulldozers and excavators are tracked so they won't get stuck in civilian use.

 

I grew up on a rural wheat and cattle ranch in rural US and wheeled tractors weren't safe due to rollover concerns on hillsides. All plowing and discing (Yes, a disc is spelled that way) was done with bulldozers.

 

Today many farmers put track kits on farm tractors and many Bobcat skid steers are tracked.

 

Cheers.

 

 

Apropos of nothing.

 

Typically incompetent attempt to divert away from the actual issue.