chiang mai Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 1 minute ago, i claudius said: Just collapse in the airport with "chest pains" off to hospital , and then get discharged to the street? just ring the Daily Mail ,they would love it OK understood, you mean you wont get tossed out into the street as long as you can think of a way to scam the system, gottit! Link to comment
i claudius Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 37 minutes ago, chiang mai said: OK understood, you mean you wont get tossed out into the street as long as you can think of a way to scam the system, gottit! Sorry Chiangmai , but if someone has paid in all their lives has to scam the system ,good luck to them , because half the worlds Tom ,Dick and Abdul has been jumping out of the back of a lorry in Dover and doing it for years , does that make it right ?, i suppose not , but now it seems to be the only way for the ordinary guy to fight back ,pity he has to , but thats the way the cards seem to be falling . Link to comment
chiang mai Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 7 minutes ago, i claudius said: Sorry Chiangmai , but if someone has paid in all their lives has to scam the system ,good luck to them , because half the worlds Tom ,Dick and Abdul has been jumping out of the back of a lorry in Dover and doing it for years , does that make it right ?, i suppose not , but now it seems to be the only way for the ordinary guy to fight back ,pity he has to , but thats the way the cards seem to be falling . I hear you and I do understand where you're coming from IC. The sad reality is that this story of people having paid into things all their lives doesn't hold water with anyone any more, not with governement and not with any part of the population, apart from the retirees. Sad indeed but that's the increasing reality of it all. Link to comment
elliss Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 On 1/15/2017 at 8:31 PM, i claudius said: I can't see a problem for some pensioner who spent most of his life in the UK ,was born there and paid tax and NI all his life,just returning home , FYI, paying tax and National contributions into the kitty, all your working life, now means sweet ..... beggar , pauper , immigrants all treated same, as working class . Thank you, socialists . Link to comment
al007 Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 This is a non topic unless of course you are defrauding the UK government, and then you need to be worried and why not I am a retired UK tax payer living here I only claim what I am allowed to, I do not claim winter fuel allowance or RPI increases in UK pension I have a sterling bank account with my Thailand address, I legally am on the postal voters electoral roll, legally I pay no UK tax I have nothing to fear and sleep well If you are fiddling the UK then you get what you deserve, and why should anyone have any sympathy for you I am grateful for what the UK has done for me, and in the event of some catastrophe the UK would still look after me and pay my medical and housing costs, and I would never be left on the streets Link to comment
evadgib Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 1 hour ago, al007 said: If you are fiddling the UK then you get what you deserve As a 'frozen' pensioner do you not see how the UK has fiddled you? Link to comment
thai3 Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 well the NHS just forked out 350 k for another Nigerian health tourist who decided to drop her twins in the UK, she won't be paying it back of course. So would they leave a 70 year old ex pat out on the street? probably, but if he was a Romanian gypsy just arrived with his kids they would have to by law accommodate them. Link to comment
i claudius Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 10 hours ago, al007 said: This is a non topic unless of course you are defrauding the UK government, and then you need to be worried and why not I am a retired UK tax payer living here I only claim what I am allowed to, I do not claim winter fuel allowance or RPI increases in UK pension I have a sterling bank account with my Thailand address, I legally am on the postal voters electoral roll, legally I pay no UK tax I have nothing to fear and sleep well If you are fiddling the UK then you get what you deserve, and why should anyone have any sympathy for you I am grateful for what the UK has done for me, and in the event of some catastrophe the UK would still look after me and pay my medical and housing costs, and I would never be left on the streets You have a right to the way you feel , good for you , as for getting what you deserve , that's what the"fiddlers" are doing getting what they paid for and good for them , As for what the UK has "done" for you well unless you never paid in to the system and got all the benefits free,everything its "done for you" you paid for in taxes all your working life,you, got nothing for free and as for a catastrophe happening , yes it would look after you ,you paid in for it all your life , and yes it would house you i am sure . Link to comment
rockingrobin Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 10 hours ago, evadgib said: As a 'frozen' pensioner do you not see how the UK has fiddled you? No I dont Pensioners who are not in the UK or a country with reciprocal arrangements have never been entitled to uprating. Some may view this as unjust or unfair, but I fail to see how you can construe this as fiddled when there is no entitlement in the first place Link to comment
rockingrobin Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 2 hours ago, i claudius said: You have a right to the way you feel , good for you , as for getting what you deserve , that's what the"fiddlers" are doing getting what they paid for and good for them , As for what the UK has "done" for you well unless you never paid in to the system and got all the benefits free,everything its "done for you" you paid for in taxes all your working life,you, got nothing for free and as for a catastrophe happening , yes it would look after you ,you paid in for it all your life , and yes it would house you i am sure . An attempt to morally justify fraud If a person claims for something that they are not entitled to for financial gain. It is an individuals choice to commit fraud and in doing so should if caught expect the consequences . Link to comment
evadgib Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 11 minutes ago, rockingrobin said: No I dont Pensioners who are not in the UK or a country with reciprocal arrangements have never been entitled to uprating. Some may view this as unjust or unfair, but I fail to see how you can construe this as fiddled when there is no entitlement in the first place It's really quite simple. None of us were aware of it at the start of our compulsory NI obligation & wouldn't know today if it wasn't for Annette Carson and the advent of social media. Link to comment
rockingrobin Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 39 minutes ago, evadgib said: It's really quite simple. None of us were aware of it at the start of our compulsory NI obligation & wouldn't know today if it wasn't for Annette Carson and the advent of social media. The DWP has to comply with UK law , which prohibits the uprating , the fact that an individual is unaware does not relieve the DWP from its obligations. Link to comment
evadgib Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 3 minutes ago, rockingrobin said: The DWP has to comply with UK law , which prohibits the uprating , the fact that an individual is unaware does not relieve the DWP from its obligations. Confirming you were as in the dark as the rest of us. You are of course welcome to your stance :) Link to comment
thai3 Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 2 hours ago, rockingrobin said: No I dont Pensioners who are not in the UK or a country with reciprocal arrangements have never been entitled to uprating. Some may view this as unjust or unfair, but I fail to see how you can construe this as fiddled when there is no entitlement in the first place You must be blind then, why should you get the increase every year if you live in the Philippines and not here? the reciprocal tax agreement is just an excuse not to, not a just reason. Link to comment
thai3 Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 2 hours ago, rockingrobin said: An attempt to morally justify fraud If a person claims for something that they are not entitled to for financial gain. It is an individuals choice to commit fraud and in doing so should if caught expect the consequences . Not giving the increase to some while giving it to others is morally unjustified. Link to comment
Savilesghost Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 17 minutes ago, thai3 said: Not giving the increase to some while giving it to others is morally unjustified. Well the European Court of human rights disagrees with you by a 6 to 1 judgement and that was back in 2008 Link to comment
thai3 Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 what do you expect from them, soon they will be irrelevant to the UK anyway. Link to comment
al007 Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 Amazing Thailand, I think the majority would agree I used to think the majority of people were law abiding and honest I also like to sleep peacefully Having to live by illegally claiming what one is not entitled to, I find difficult, on the other hand for a very large number of Uk people living in Thailand, there appears to be the view they are entitled to it So on the same logic if some people have more money than them I suppose it is OK to steal it, explain where the line is drawn However if people stole from them they would be upset Most of these people are probably miss-fits at best I doubt the laws have been changed on them retrospectively, and they should have investigated properly before coming here I am very contented here so long as I stay away from this low life element, I personally would send them all home, and Thailand would be better without them Come on immigration give us a hand And maybe the DHSS should cooperate with immigration and lock up these individuals Well that should spark some fury ! !! !!! !!!! Link to comment
rockingrobin Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 35 minutes ago, thai3 said: You must be blind then, why should you get the increase every year if you live in the Philippines and not here? the reciprocal tax agreement is just an excuse not to, not a just reason. Your argument is a false dichotomy. The UK enters into such agreements not for the sole purpose of pensions uprating. Link to comment
Savilesghost Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 15 minutes ago, thai3 said: what do you expect from them, soon they will be irrelevant to the UK anyway. Er the British high court ruled exactly the same way as the EU court of human rights back in 2003 The case was escalated to EU court because of the high court desision in the UK Are you even aware of these proccedings or are you just blowing hot air and bile ? Link to comment
Savilesghost Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 58 minutes ago, thai3 said: You must be blind then, why should you get the increase every year if you live in the Philippines and not here? the reciprocal tax agreement is just an excuse not to, not a just reason. If one is really that hard up for the cash , that you really need the increases, maybe move to thd Phillipines then ? Link to comment
Savilesghost Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 2 hours ago, rockingrobin said: The DWP has to comply with UK law , which prohibits the uprating , the fact that an individual is unaware does not relieve the DWP from its obligations. As the old maxium goes.. ".ignorance is no excuse " Link to comment
Savilesghost Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 3 hours ago, evadgib said: It's really quite simple. None of us were aware of it at the start of our compulsory NI obligation & wouldn't know today if it wasn't for Annette Carson and the advent of social media. Dont belive they had social media back in 2003, thats the year the high court judgement was first made on frozen pensions Link to comment
Jeffrey346 Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 On 1/9/2017 at 2:48 PM, thai3 said: UK and overseas bank accounts: From this year it receives information from banks in more than 60 countries. I wonder if that includes Thailand? I'm sure it does as the US has been doing it for years. If my account here in Thailand is $10,000 or more, a notice goes out to the IRS. Link to comment
Savilesghost Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 8 minutes ago, Jeffrey346 said: I'm sure it does as the US has been doing it for years. If my account here in Thailand is $10,000 or more, a notice goes out to the IRS. As stated previously, Thailand is not signatory to this agreement with the UK, and will not send mass data of British citizens holding Thai accounts at this point in time what a Thai bank does with a US citizen and the IRS is irrelevant to this topic and you will start confusing people Link to comment
i claudius Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 Well the European Court of human rights disagrees with you by a 6 to 1 judgement and that was back in 2008 Is that the same court of human rights that Blair signed up to so his wife could earn a fortune? And the same one that makes Britain keep criminals,one of whom had a cat,so it was against his uman rights to reporter him,etc etc etc,,Sent from my ASUS_T00J using Tapatalk Link to comment
Enoon Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 Don't worry folks, if you're reading this you are of no interest to HMRC. Link to comment
Eff1n2ret Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 1 hour ago, rockingrobin said: Your argument is a false dichotomy. The UK enters into such agreements not for the sole purpose of pensions uprating. That's true, but if you read the EC judgement (I wonder if anyone has except me!) you will see that one of the UK Government's arguments was that they couldn't start paying increases in "non-reciprocal" countries because that would inhibit their ability to conclude further reciprocal agreements in the future - but they also admitted that they had announced in the mid-1990s that they had no intention of seeking any further reciprocal agreements. You can call that "false dichotomy" if you like. I would call it chicanery. They could pay the increase everywhere if they wanted to. But I don't expect they ever will. Link to comment
i claudius Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 5 hours ago, rockingrobin said: No I dont Pensioners who are not in the UK or a country with reciprocal arrangements have never been entitled to uprating. Some may view this as unjust or unfair, but I fail to see how you can construe this as fiddled when there is no entitlement in the first place Actually if i am not mistaken , it was brought in by Maggie Thatcher ,when the only pensioners who lived abroad were very well off ones ,unlike todays ,who cant afford to live in the UK Link to comment
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