PVC Help Please !!!

[luudee]

 

Hi Guys,

 

I have a PVC valve that is starting to leak pretty badly. I would like to replace

it, but to the left of it is no pure piping left, there is immediately a L unit.

 

To the right I have space to play with, and the right hand side in general

would be easier to replace than to redo the entire left hand side ...

 

Any ideas/suggestion, how to remove it in a way so I can put a new one there ?

 

Attached a picture of it ...

 

Many Thanks !

rudi

 

 

 

[bankruatsteve]

Ouch.  There doesn't appear to be much leeway to do a "simple" cut/replace.  Suggest you find a "pro" that knows how to heat and remove the valve without hurting the PVC.  (a technique that evades my attempts at doing it.)

[RichCor]

33 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

Suggest you find a "pro" that knows how to heat and remove the valve without hurting the PVC

 

+1 this,

 

...or carefully grinding off the outer covering of the failing valve (leaving the underlying pipe to attempt a reweld (glue weld) of a replacement valve, 

 

...or cut out the valve completely, as close to the valve AND the next Tee to the right, then carefully grind out the L 90 and opposing Tee joints until they once again allow a normal pipe fit. Then refit your replacement section. 

[carlyai]

Even if you get that valve unstuck, there doesn't seem to be much flexibility of the pipes on either side of the valve to get it out. Maybe your "pro" can use a grinder and cut thru the vertical reducer connection, without cutting the pipe, to make it easier. So cut thru the reducer, free the pipe, then unstick the valve.

Maybe some CRC squirted into the valve may dislodge grit causing the leak?

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[luk AJ]

Cut valve out as suggested, heat up the left elbow and you can force out the piece of pipe stuck in the elbow. Put a screwdriver between the piece of pipe and the elbow. It a long work and the pipe will come out in bits and pieces but the job can be done


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[eyecatcher]

I would suggest a slightly different method.

 

We all agree cutting out the rhs is easy, its the elbow that is the problem.

 

After managing to slide a hack saw blade between the ball valve and the 90 and cutting it off you are left with the bit stuck inside the pipe.

 

Rather than use a blow torch to heat up which potentially is going to melt the whole lot...the best idea is to firstly use a small hacksaw blade to cut inside the obsolete pipe.

Then apply the solvent cement to the inside of the pipe; same as it was fixed with in the first place,

 

The solvent will heat up and melt the old solvent.
 

If you can get a screwdriver in between the 90 bend wall and the piece you want to remove then great, if not some long nosed pliers to grip on the old pipe. and it will eventually pull out,

it will take patience and confidence but you can do it in a few minutes.

 

looking at your pipes again it would be much easier to cut it off below the reducer. its going to be putting less stress on all the other joints as you try to pull and twist and access for you will be easier.

 

fittings are only 3,4,5bt a piece so not earthshattering to start again

[CGW]

5 hours ago, bankruatsteve said:

Ouch.  There doesn't appear to be much leeway to do a "simple" cut/replace.  Suggest you find a "pro" that knows how to heat and remove the valve without hurting the PVC.  (a technique that evades my attempts at doing it.)

The technique to remove the fittings after being glued totally evades me as well! maybe there is a way? but I havnt mastered it, the pipe seems to "melt" into the union and become one with the fitting!! (solvent "welded, not glued!) 

I would just start again, probably not what you wont to hear, but next time leave some room for repairs, a lot of the Thai "plumbers do this, maybe they can get it off? though for the price of a few fittings may not be worth finding out!

Good luck.

Edited February 14, 2017 by CGW

[RichCor]

"The technique to remove the fittings after being glued totally evades me as well! maybe there is a way? but I havnt mastered it, the pipe seems to "melt" into the union and become one with the fitting!! (solvent "welded, not glued!)  "

 

The ability to take the connection apart with heat probably depends on how much "Glue" (solvent) was used to make the fitting. Connections where just barely enough solvent was used to make the joint the connection may pop apart easily. 

 

Even though small size PVC connectors can be fairly inexpensive, the larger one definitely are not, and having to replacing all of those fittings because of one ball-joint valve failed wouldn't make me happy camper ...and I like doing PVC pipe work. 

[Crossy]

I've become quite adept at re-using PVC fittings, with a bit of practice it's quick and reasonably easy.

 

The trick is to heat the inside of the pipe you want to remove, if you use a blowtorch don't breathe the smoke. Heat it just enough to soften the pipe (and not the fitting) so you can get a screwdriver in the gap, I then use long nose pliers to wind the pipe smaller and it just comes unglued. A quick clean up with abrasive paper and you're good to go :)

 

It's actually easier than it sounds in writing, maybe I'll make a video if I get a few minutes (yeah, I wonder where those minutes are coming from).

[wayned]

IMHO replacing the valve where in situ is impossible even if you successfully removed the old pipe pieces using heat.

 

What I would do is cut the pipe between the valve and the elbow and the valve and the "T" and remove the pipe in the elbow  and the "T"using heat, a screwdriver and needle nose pliers.  I would then clean the fittings and glue an  elbow pointing up to the existing elbow and an elbow pointing up to the "T".  Once those are fitted I would run pipe up the wall a little and come up with some "Rube Goldberg"  connection of pipes and fittings to install a new valve leaving enough room so that the valve can be replaced later without the same problems.  I'm good at "Rube Goldberg" contraptions

[CGW]

3 hours ago, Crossy said:

I've become quite adept at re-using PVC fittings, with a bit of practice it's quick and reasonably easy.

 

The trick is to heat the inside of the pipe you want to remove, if you use a blowtorch don't breathe the smoke. Heat it just enough to soften the pipe (and not the fitting) so you can get a screwdriver in the gap, I then use long nose pliers to wind the pipe smaller and it just comes unglued. A quick clean up with abrasive paper and you're good to go :)

 

It's actually easier than it sounds in writing, maybe I'll make a video if I get a few minutes (yeah, I wonder where those minutes are coming from).

I can see this being possible, but doing trying to remove "fitting" in situ as OP wants (or needs!) to do, I'm thinking that is not realistic!

[Crossy]

1 minute ago, CGW said:

I can see this being possible, but doing trying to remove "fitting" in situ as OP wants (or needs!) to do, I'm thinking that is not realistic!

 

I actually did one in-situ last weekend, very similar to our OP, cut off pipe just proud of the fitting, heat etc, clean up, new bit of pipe. Job's a good-un :)

 

Followed by CRAMP!! (it was in an uncomfortable position)

 

The OP is going to have problems getting it all back together as others have noted, not much room for flex in the pipework

[luudee]

 

Thanks for all the replies guys !

 

The right-hand side can be easily redone, it's less involved ....

 

Another option I am considering it to just seal off the elbow/reduction

piece, as this link is really not required. (It is used to manually top-of the

pool, even though we have an overflow tank which is automatically topped-of

and I can also use a garden hose if all fails).

 

Thanks !

rudi

[CGW]

9 minutes ago, Crossy said:

Followed by CRAMP!! (it was in an uncomfortable position)

Yep, I know what you are saying! when I evaluate any job I look at cost, time frame & physical effort involved! then workout easiest way to accomplice the task, as I age the comfort factor gets higher consideration factor!

[wayned]

I also under stand the cramp.  I have two new bathroom faucets and a new kitchen faucet gathering dust in the shop.  Every time I see the drip I think that today's the day but it hasn't happened yet.  When I do it I have to remember to take my mobile phone with me as I might have to call someone to come "extract" me!

[carlyai]

Ridii that's going to make a lot of difference to the method you use as you should have more flexibility in the pipes without that second pipe.

I think the total combined consulting fee is approaching B 1000000. Thank goodness for TV. [emoji26]

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[carlyai]

sorry for misspelling your name. [emoji21]

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[luudee]

11 hours ago, carlyai said:

Ridii that's going to make a lot of difference to the method you use as you should have more flexibility in the pipes without that second pipe.

I think the total combined consulting fee is approaching B 1000000. Thank goodness for TV.

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And do not forget the dozens of videos I watched on youtube, lol !!

 

I donate my first born, is that acceptable ?!

 

Oh, and it's "Rudi" if that's supposed to be my name there ... 555

 

 

rudi

 

[luudee]

 

Just wanted to follow up, and share my success, lol !

 

I decided to start by cutting the defective valve in half and try to remove the left-hand

side of it from the small PVC pipe. I figured if that fails, I can still try to remove the elbow, etc ....

 

I made a cut in the remaining piece of the valve, so I could jam in a screwdriver in.

 

Then I used an industrial hot air gun to heat up the PVC left from the valve. I almost gave

up it didn't look like it would separate, but after waiting a bit longer, it started to come apart

and I was able to remove it on the first trial. Big relief !!!

 

Then I redid a portion of the right-hand side plumbing so I could fit in two unions.

 

It's looking and working great now, no leaks! Yay !!!  :)

 

Two pictures for your amusement!

 

Thanks again for all the suggestions, and of course hours of utube, lol 

 

rudi

[wayned]

Wow!  looks great, I never thought that you had any hope of removing the old valve and installing a new one in situ. 

[luudee]

2 hours ago, wayned said:

Wow!  looks great, I never thought that you had any hope of removing the old valve and installing a new one in situ. 

 

I had very little hope as well :)

 

The key I think was to sand off the old glue and then let the new glue sit and

work itself in the old plastic for a minute or so and then glue the union on to it.

I was surprised it came off as easy as it did. Patience was the key !

 

rudi

 

[KMartinHandyman]

Congratulations. There are specific reaming bits for pvc fittings fwiw.

[Crossy]

10 hours ago, KMartinHandyman said:

Congratulations. There are specific reaming bits for pvc fittings fwiw.

 

I've heard of those not seen them here, how well do they actually work?

 

There are several qualities of PVC available with different wall thickness, since the OD is fixed the ID varies somewhat with the different pipe quality. Can the reamer beasties handle that?

[luudee]

On 3/2/2017 at 8:19 PM, KMartinHandyman said:

Congratulations. There are specific reaming bits for pvc fittings fwiw.

 

 

 

Learning something new every day ! Thanks Martin !

 

rudi

[Pib]

Me no use plastic (PVC) values....they are cheap for a reason.   I use metal valves whenever possible and that has been always so far....metals valves for basic piping are really not that expensive and last a lot, lot longer than plastic valves.  But I realize a person inherits piping with plastic valves many times.

 

But outstanding job on getting that plastic removed without having to do semi-major repiping to fit a replacement valve.

[KMartinHandyman]

 
I've heard of those not seen them here, how well do they actually work?
 
There are several qualities of PVC available with different wall thickness, since the OD is fixed the ID varies somewhat with the different pipe quality. Can the reamer beasties handle that?

Crossy, there's a few configurations of that tool and the lead is tapered as to self center and adjust to the varying pipe ID then you try to send it in parallel.
Usually I've used them to get the pipe out of tee's or 90's that are behind cabinets and concealed in walls. A little rudimentary but priceless when you're in those predicaments.