webfact Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 UK defends Trump state visit offer despite protest By William James and Alistair Smout REUTERS A demonstrator dressed as the Statue of Liberty takes part in a protest against U.S. President Donald Trump in London, Britain February 20, 2017. REUTERS/Toby Melville LONDON (Reuters) - The British government on Monday defended its decision to offer U.S. President Donald Trump a lavish state visit and an audience with the queen this year, defying protests outside parliament and dissent from lawmakers. Prime Minister Theresa May's government wants to reaffirm the "special relationship" with the United States and secure a trade deal as Britain prepares to leave the European Union. "In the light of America's absolutely pivotal role we believe it entirely right that we should use all the tools at our disposal to build common ground with President Trump," junior foreign minister Alan Duncan told parliament. He described state visits as Britain's "most important diplomatic tool", saying Trump's trip would go ahead as planned. The visit has spurred 1.8 million people in Britain to sign a petition saying he should not be given a state visit because it could embarrass Queen Elizabeth. As parliament debated that petition on Monday - a symbolic discussion which has no power to force the government to withdraw its invitation - around 7,000 protesters gathered outside with placards bearing slogans such as "Dump Trump, Fight Bigotry". "It's about the rise of hate and extremism, which is personified by Trump. It's not just about him, but he represents what's happening in the world at the moment," protester Alison Dale, 61, told Reuters. "The invitation was kneejerk, and made us look desperate. Now we're leaving the European Union, it's clear we're just desperate for trade deals, and we look weak." Since taking office in January, Trump has sparked global protests over plans to ban migrants from seven Muslim-majority countries, and from women activists who call him misogynistic. Trump says his immigration orders are aimed at protecting the United States and that his opponents have misrepresented his intentions. Prime Minister May has said she will not consider cancelling the visit. Managing the backlash adds to her diplomatic "to-do" list as she sets about reuniting a country divided over Brexit and negotiating a divorce with European trading partners. RALLYING POINT The debate, hosted in a packed side room of parliament rather than the main debating chamber, gave lawmakers a platform to air a wide range of views on Trump. "It's difficult to know whether to be appalled at the morality of this invitation, or just astonished at the stupidity of the invitation," said Scottish National Party lawmaker Alex Salmond. Previously Trump has clashed with Salmond over his investments in Scotland. Critics focused on accusations of sexism and referred to his immigration policies, while other lawmakers argued Trump should come to Britain, but should not be given the high honour of a state visit, which would involve lavish displays of royal pageantry and a banquet hosted by the queen. Crispin Blunt, head of parliament's Foreign Affairs Committee, said a head-of-government visit by Trump would be appropriate this year but a full state visit should wait until 2020, the 400th anniversary of the Pilgrim Fathers' settlement in New England. "If we don't take the hype out of this debate, with all the people who signed this petition, there is every possibility that of course this visit is then going to become a rallying point for everybody who is unhappy both with the direction of American policy, or British policy or anything else," he said. (Editing by Guy Faulconbridge and Andrew Roche) -- © Copyright Reuters 2017-02-22 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 So much for democracy! This government will do what it damn well wants and hang the consequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughing Gravy Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 (edited) If the government (any) listened every time to a bunch of lefty, liberals when they didn't like something, then nobody would be allowed to visit. As for democracy they had there little protest and signed an online petition. That is it. People stamping their feet like children because they can't get there own way. I still see remoaners using the democracy flag when it suits them. Trump was elected democratically. Start dealing with it. Edited February 22, 2017 by Laughing Gravy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 it's clear we're just desperate for trade deals, and we look weak." Well she right about one thing- the UK is weak. Has been ever since it gave it's empire away ( bet they're sorry about giving the eastern Arabian peninsula away though ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 hour ago, Grouse said: So much for democracy! This government will do what it damn well wants and hang the consequences. There was no majority in favour of banning Trump from the UK. Just a bunch of silly lefty loonies having a whine about something they had no control over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustdevil Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 (edited) As a normal American (i.e., hates Trump) I agree with those who don't want Trump on any state visit. After all, they didn't invite Truman or FDR or even JFK until they'd been in office a while. On the other hand, also as an American, I am not impressed with being "granted" a visit with any ****ing queen. We are not subjects of any monarchy and unlike the self-righteous Canadians, we don't have a state with the name "British" in it. Edited February 22, 2017 by Dustdevil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 minute ago, Dustdevil said: As a normal American (i.e., hates Trump) I agree with those who don't want Trump on any state visit. After all, they didn't invite Truman or FDR or even JFK until they'd been in office a while. On the other hand, also as an American, I am not impressed with being "granted" a visit with any ****ing queen. We are not subjects of any monarchy and unlike the self-righteous Canadians, we don't even have a state with the name "British" in it. LOL. No one is forcing Trump ( or you ) to visit the UK, or see the Queen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 39 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said: If the government (any) listened every time to a bunch of lefty, liberals when they didn't like something, then nobody would be allowed to visit. As for democracy they had there little protest and signed an online petition. That is it. People stamping their feet like children because they can't get there own way. I still see remoaners using the democracy flag when it suits them. Trump was elected democratically. Start dealing with it. You obviously missed the irony in my statement. You never see me "waving the democracy flag" Your beloved Con Party keeps using "democracy" to explain why it will not consider any points however sensible concerning Brexit which was approved by 52% of those who voted. 6 times as many people petitioned to stop a STATE visit for Trump as those in favour. (You do understand the difference between on official visit and a state visit) Anyway, I look forward to seeing your man Trump addressing both houses with no TelePrompTer and then facing 30mins of questions! Can one purchase seats? I trust you've been listening to the House of Lords. How refreshing to hear rational, reasoned debate.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitrevie Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: There was no majority in favour of banning Trump from the UK. Just a bunch of silly lefty loonies having a whine about something they had no control over. Perhaps we need to hold a referendum to see if the majority of British people support this decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 7 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: There was no majority in favour of banning Trump from the UK. Just a bunch of silly lefty loonies having a whine about something they had no control over. You need to get your facts straight The petition was about a STATE visit. Why should the Queen be forced to forced to ride in a golden carriage down The Mall with this novice, imbecile? Nobody cares about an official visit or a game of golf.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 11 minutes ago, Grouse said: You obviously missed the irony in my statement. You never see me "waving the democracy flag" Your beloved Con Party keeps using "democracy" to explain why it will not consider any points however sensible concerning Brexit which was approved by 52% of those who voted. 6 times as many people petitioned to stop a STATE visit for Trump as those in favour. (You do understand the difference between on official visit and a state visit) Anyway, I look forward to seeing your man Trump addressing both houses with no TelePrompTer and then facing 30mins of questions! Can one purchase seats? I trust you've been listening to the House of Lords. How refreshing to hear rational, reasoned debate.... I once had the misfortune to be in a hospital bed that had only parliament channel on it's bedside radio ( a very long time ago, but I doubt things have changed much ). I never realised that politicians were such a bunch of juveniles till then. IMO Trump sounds like a great statesman when he gives a speech in comparison to the ( IMO ) childish banter of the buffoons that inhabited parliament benches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: I once had the misfortune to be in a hospital bed that had only parliament channel on it's bedside radio ( a very long time ago, but I doubt things have changed much ). I never realised that politicians were such a bunch of juveniles till then. IMO Trump sounds like a great statesman when he gives a speech in comparison to the ( IMO ) childish banter of the buffoons that inhabited parliament benches. I have nothing to add to that; you summarise your position beautifully ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 20 minutes ago, Grouse said: You need to get your facts straight The petition was about a STATE visit. Why should the Queen be forced to forced to ride in a golden carriage down The Mall with this novice, imbecile? Nobody cares about an official visit or a game of golf.... I have no doubt that the Queen has had to be near to some appallingly evil human beings in her time as head of state. Such is the world that we live in- evil men become head of state and politics dictates that one government must welcome another's head of state ( another reason why I hate politics ) no matter how evil. While Trump may be vulgar and petulant, he has yet to prove himself evil, to my satisfaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sungod Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 In recent years the UK has had numerous state visits from Middle Eastern Countries who suppress women's rights, and China who suppress everyone's rights? Where were all these people then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughing Gravy Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 hour ago, Grouse said: You obviously missed the irony in my statement. You never see me "waving the democracy flag" Your beloved Con Party keeps using "democracy" to explain why it will not consider any points however sensible concerning Brexit which was approved by 52% of those who voted. 6 times as many people petitioned to stop a STATE visit for Trump as those in favour. (You do understand the difference between on official visit and a state visit) Anyway, I look forward to seeing your man Trump addressing both houses with no TelePrompTer and then facing 30mins of questions! Can one purchase seats? I trust you've been listening to the House of Lords. How refreshing to hear rational, reasoned debate.... I didn't quote you firstly, so do not take it personally. It was a general statement about those claiming democracy but don't want allow an democratically elected President to visit the UK. Yes I do know the difference in state and official difference more than you know. How dare you call me a lover of the conservatives. I have never, ever voted for them. They are in power now and will stay there because the poor and disgraceful state Labour are in and the way Tony Blair and Gordon Brown ensured they were unelectable after there time in downing street. IMHO As for Trump he is not my man. if I had a choice I would have gone for Ron Paul but I was not a HC fan. He is the president of the USA and it doesn't if you like him or not. I think he has some good points and some bad ones. He certainly is not a traditional politician. Regardless he is the president and the UK will and should do business and keep the relationship with the US that we were used to. Much better than Brussels who dictate and demand. As for the house of lords, yes I have been watching it. If you mean the likes of Kinnock, Mandelson, Heseltine and Ashdown, then it has been watching 4 'duffers', who are seeing their gold plated pensions, go down the drain. It also reiterates that the House of Lords, needs reforming quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughing Gravy Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 hour ago, pitrevie said: Perhaps we need to hold a referendum to see if the majority of British people support this decision. it seems to be the way now for everything when people don't like a result or until they get the answer they were after. Ireland, Holland as examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said: I have no doubt that the Queen has had to be near to some appallingly evil human beings in her time as head of state. Such is the world that we live in- evil men become head of state and politics dictates that one government must welcome another's head of state ( another reason why I hate politics ) no matter how evil. While Trump may be vulgar and petulant, he has yet to prove himself evil, to my satisfaction. You're avoiding the point. What is wrong with an official visit (probably including tea with Her Majesty - or a stand in double). Why all the pomp and circumstance of a state visit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 19 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said: I didn't quote you firstly, so do not take it personally. It was a general statement about those claiming democracy but don't want allow an democratically elected President to visit the UK. Yes I do know the difference in state and official difference more than you know. How dare you call me a lover of the conservatives. I have never, ever voted for them. They are in power now and will stay there because the poor and disgraceful state Labour are in and the way Tony Blair and Gordon Brown ensured they were unelectable after there time in downing street. IMHO As for Trump he is not my man. if I had a choice I would have gone for Ron Paul but I was not a HC fan. He is the president of the USA and it doesn't if you like him or not. I think he has some good points and some bad ones. He certainly is not a traditional politician. Regardless he is the president and the UK will and should do business and keep the relationship with the US that we were used to. Much better than Brussels who dictate and demand. As for the house of lords, yes I have been watching it. If you mean the likes of Kinnock, Mandelson, Heseltine and Ashdown, then it has been watching 4 'duffers', who are seeing their gold plated pensions, go down the drain. It also reiterates that the House of Lords, needs reforming quickly. I would urge caution before ditching all that wisdom and experience to rely solely upon the many twits and cynical b*st*rds in the commons! It's worked well for a VERY long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughing Gravy Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Just now, Grouse said: I would urge caution before ditching all that wisdom and experience to rely solely upon the many twits and cynical b*st*rds in the commons! It's worked well for a VERY long time. I sad reforming Grouse not ditching. I would like to see less political party alignment and also less hereditary peers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 8 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said: I sad reforming Grouse not ditching. I would like to see less political party alignment and also less hereditary peers. Do they still have bishops? They should be removed Don't want any pawns though ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomerangutang Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Message to House of Lords, House of Commons, and the British Royalty: You're all soiling yourselves by honoring Trump, .......for too many reasons to list here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rijb Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 26 minutes ago, boomerangutang said: Message to House of Lords, House of Commons, and the British Royalty: You're all soiling yourselves by honoring Trump, .......for too many reasons to list here. honoring? It's not personal, just business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 12 minutes ago, rijb said: honoring? It's not personal, just business. So why not an official visit? Why do we need a state visit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elgordo38 Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 The "we the people" statement does not mean Jack S**t anymore. Its all political schmoozing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rijb Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 4 minutes ago, Grouse said: So why not an official visit? Why do we need a state visit? pomp and circumstance? face? Whatever will seal the deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitrevie Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 2 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said: it seems to be the way now for everything when people don't like a result or until they get the answer they were after. Ireland, Holland as examples. What you mean like the British referendum where the EU declared within hours that they respected the decision of the British people and that they should go as soon as possible and which I heartily agree with. However to my knowledge we haven't yet held a referendum on whether to invite Trump for a State visit but I give my solemn pledge if we do I will respect the result, how about you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanrchase Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 As a normal American (i.e., hates Trump) I agree with those who don't want Trump on any state visit. After all, they didn't invite Truman or FDR or even JFK until they'd been in office a while. On the other hand, also as an American, I am not impressed with being "granted" a visit with any ****ing queen. We are not subjects of any monarchy and unlike the self-righteous Canadians, we don't have a state with the name "British" in it.You do have a "New England" though if I remember correctly. Sent from my SM-A500F using Thaivisa Connect mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 I understand that HM is going to great lengths to ensure the trip is a success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 5 hours ago, Grouse said: So much for democracy! This government will do what it damn well wants and hang the consequences. What nonsense. A small percentage of the population object to Trump making a state visit. The usual left wing PC rent-a-crowd who protest anyone they don't consider to be PC to their ideology. Did you see the interviews with some of them? Talking drivel. Perhaps you think we should have a referendum on it? But to be serious, none of these "democracy" lovers protested when the Chinese dictator, who represents an authoritarian non elected regime, where free speech and democracy are oppressed, where people are persecuted because of their religion or ethnic origin and that occupies another sovereign state by force and is currently expanding in areas the International Courts say it has no rights too. No sir, he's welcomed with open arms. Even the clown of a speaker of the House of Commons who publicly stains the office and speaks out against Trump was filmed welcoming him in the most grovelling way! Seems like it's o k to be non democratic, non elected, oppressive and dictatorial as long as your're on the left. And that is the joke, the 'democracy" of the left. Only applies to themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 45 minutes ago, rijb said: pomp and circumstance? face? Whatever will seal the deal. 45 minutes ago, rijb said: pomp and circumstance? face? Whatever will seal the deal. Like prostitution? I doubt Her Majesty will kiss Trump on the lips though ? The UK lost "face" ever since Suez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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