Is Permanent Residency based on married to Thai but without Work Permit possible?

[Yggdrasil]

May I, as a 70 year old Scandinavian pensioner with life-long state pension (abt. 100,000 baht per month) apply for Permanent Residency?

I now have 4 consecutive one-year extensions (marked 'Retirement ') of my Non-Imm B visa and have paid full taxes on my pensions for the last six years (tax average abt. 110,000 bath per year). I have been married to my Thai wife for 10 years and have lived continously for 23 years in Thailand as a 'Tax Resident' based on consecutive Non-Imm B visas.  Now, as a pensioner I no longer work and therefore no longer have a Work Permit.

Can I still apply for Permanent Residency?

I will be very thankful for any response to my question.

[ubonjoe]

You have to be working with a work permit for 3 years to apply for permanent residency.

Since 2008 while you were working you could of applied for Thai nationality by meeting the same requirements to apply for permanent residency.

[glegolo]

I am VERY curious .....  Have you paid taxes on your pension to Thailand??? I hope you are NOT a swedish citizen.. Because you pay your taxes in Sweden on your pension nowhere else... OR is it different for you...

 

Hope you do not mind me askng...

 

Glegolo

[Yggdrasil]

13 minutes ago, glegolo said:

I am VERY curious .....  Have you paid taxes on your pension to Thailand??? I hope you are NOT a swedish citizen.. Because you pay your taxes in Sweden on your pension nowhere else... OR is it different for you...

 

Hope you do not mind me askng...

 

Glegolo

Of course I don't mind you asking! I am happy to respond:

As a Norwegian, the tax agreement between Thailand and Norway gives me the option either to pay a flat 15% tax (on pensions) to Norway or declare and pay the tax here in Thailand on whatever part of my pension that is transferred to my bank in Thailand. As I live here the whole year (and therefore formally is a tax resident here) I chose to pay my taxes here in Thailand. Due to 'old man' deductions of 190,000 etc my present effective tax rate is about 8%.

The Norwegian tax authorites are very strict; unless I provide them with the yearly 'Tax Certificate' and 'Certificate of Tax-Residence' issued by Thai Revenue Department (in English) the Norwegians will automatically withdraw 15%. 

 

May I add that the famous Thai Smile is all over when I come to declare my pension; they even offer me coffee and help with everything....and, if I am short of cash they give me a couple of months credit! Very nice people at the revenue department!

 

Finally, I believe that the tax agreement between Thailand and Sweden does not offer the same choices and that taxes have to be paid to Sweden.

 

[YetAnother]

Why is permanent residency tied to a work permit or working at all?

We pay way more than our share of taxes,

Support families Etc

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, YetAnother said:

Why is permanent residency tied to a work permit or working at all?

We pay way more than our share of taxes,

Support families Etc

I cannot answer the question other than that is the rules. It was possible if married to a Thai at one time but that was changed about 2009.

It is has been discussed in other topics so no need start another one.

[glegolo]

52 minutes ago, Yggdrasil said:

Of course I don't mind you asking! I am happy to respond:

As a Norwegian, the tax agreement between Thailand and Norway gives me the option either to pay a flat 15% tax (on pensions) to Norway or declare and pay the tax here in Thailand on whatever part of my pension that is transferred to my bank in Thailand. As I live here the whole year (and therefore formally is a tax resident here) I chose to pay my taxes here in Thailand. Due to 'old man' deductions of 190,000 etc my present effective tax rate is about 8%.

The Norwegian tax authorites are very strict; unless I provide them with the yearly 'Tax Certificate' and 'Certificate of Tax-Residence' issued by Thai Revenue Department (in English) the Norwegians will automatically withdraw 15%. 

 

May I add that the famous Thai Smile is all over when I come to declare my pension; they even offer me coffee and help with everything....and, if I am short of cash they give me a couple of months credit! Very nice people at the revenue department!

 

Finally, I believe that the tax agreement between Thailand and Sweden does not offer the same choices and that taxes have to be paid to Sweden.

 

Thank you so much for sharing your life. I myself are swedish, and yes you are 100% right... Our taxagreement is that I have to pay taxes where the money was earned. So for me personally I am living in Thailand full time, and I have "signed out" of Sweden for good. We have something called SINK-tax, which now is 20% on all income..

 

But great to know how your norwegians have it.... I must say,,, 8 % is great really..... Good luck..

 

Glegolo

[Yggdrasil]

20 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I cannot answer the question other than that is the rules. It was possible if married to a Thai at one time but that was changed about 2009.

It is has been discussed in other topics so no need start another one.

As I am quite new to this blog, I hope you can please tell me where to find more info.

Does in fact the new regulations state that Work Permit is a requirement even for a pensioner paying taxes in Thailand on life-long pensions? It's quite confusing as some websites state that you need 3 extensions of Non-Imm visa, either B or based on marriage or/and retirement. Sorry to ask so much and thank you for your responses.

[ubonjoe]

11 minutes ago, Yggdrasil said:

As I am quite new to this blog, I hope you can please tell me where to find more info.

Does in fact the new regulations state that Work Permit is a requirement even for a pensioner paying taxes in Thailand on life-long pensions? It's quite confusing as some websites state that you need 3 extensions of Non-Imm visa, either B or based on marriage or/and retirement. Sorry to ask so much and thank you for your responses.

Here is the list of required documents for permanent residency if married to a Thai. http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/doc/residence/residence_th_sponser_en.pdf 

There is no list for retirees since it is not possible. See: http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/en/base.php?page=residence

You will find number 1 on that page is a from the immigration commision dated 2003 that is no longer valid. There is this category that has been eliminated "3.3 Qualification of applicant for humanitarian reasons in each circumstance:".

[Yggdrasil]

7 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Here is the list of required documents for permanent residency if married to a Thai. http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/doc/residence/residence_th_sponser_en.pdf 

There is no list for retirees since it is not possible. See: http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/en/base.php?page=residence

You will find number 1 on that page is a from the immigration commision dated 2003 that is no longer valid. There is this category that has been eliminated "3.3 Qualification of applicant for humanitarian reasons in each circumstance:".

Thank you so very much for your kind follow up and for the links you have given! Greatly appreciated despite the disappointment I must admit I feel; I have been so keen to prepare everything for my application later this year but perhaps I should just follow the good piece of advise given by an other wise visitor on this forum: to just relax and keep my blood pressure at 120/70 and forget about the PR!

Thanks again!

[Get Real]

1 hour ago, YetAnother said:

Why is permanent residency tied to a work permit or working at all?

We pay way more than our share of taxes,

Support families Etc

So, you consider your family a tax burden. How nice of you.

[glegolo]

YetAnother

Why is permanent residency tied to a work permit or working at all?

We pay way more than our share of taxes,

Support families Etc

3 minutes ago, Get Real said:

So, you consider your family a tax burden. How nice of you.

The answer is that he is NOT saying at all what you claim... Not at all..

Read again and read correct..

 

Glegolo

[Get Real]

3 minutes ago, glegolo said:

YetAnother

Why is permanent residency tied to a work permit or working at all?

We pay way more than our share of taxes,

Support families Etc

 

The answer is that he is NOT saying at all what you claim... Not at all..

Read again and read correct..

 

Glegolo

No, no, no! I read again. If you say that you pay more than your share of taxes, and bring up support for family as an example.
How should you read that? Anyway, You gave me a good laugh! Thanks!