Britain says will move to control EU fishing in its waters

[webfact]

Britain says will move to control EU fishing in its waters

 

FILE PHOTO: A fishing boat sails from the harbour as as Britain's Prime Minister Theresa May visits Plymouth fisheries, in Plymouth, May 31, 2017. REUTERS/Leon Neal/Pool/File Photo

 

LONDON (Reuters) - Britain will withdraw from an agreement that allows some other European countries to fish between six and 12 miles from its coast in a move to "take back control" of fishing policy, Environment Secretary Michael Gove said on Sunday.

 

But the European Union's chief Brexit negotiator said the move would make little difference as the agreement in question had already been superseded by the EU's Common Fisheries Policy, which is subject to Britain's exit talks.

 

The British government said it would begin on Monday a two-year process to leave the London Fisheries Convention, an agreement dating from 1964, before Britain joined the European Union, that allows vessels from France, Belgium, Germany and the Netherlands to fish in British waters.

 

"We will have control, we can decide the terms of access," Gove told the BBC Andrew Marr show on Sunday.

 

Gove, a prominent leave campaigner in the EU referendum, also said that once Britain left the trading bloc, it would be able to extend control of its waters to 200 miles, or to the median line between Britain and France or Britain and Ireland.

 

He said that leaving the London Fisheries Convention meant that for the first time in more than 50 years, Britain would be able to decide who could access its waters.

 

"This is a historic first step towards building a new domestic fishing policy as we leave the European Union - one which leads to a more competitive, profitable and sustainable industry for the whole of the UK," he said.

 

The government said an estimated 10,000 tonnes of fish was caught by vessels from France, Belgium, Germany, Ireland and the Netherlands in 2015 within 12 nautical miles of the British coast.

 

But the EU's chief Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier rejected Gove's assertion that Britain would be able to unilaterally dictate terms of access to its waters.

 

"UK denunciation of London Convention=no change: EU law/Common Fisheries Policy had superseded it," Barnier said in a post to his Twitter account.

 

The interest of the remaining 27 countries will be the EU's priority in negotiations on fishing policy, he said.

 

Ireland's minister for agriculture, food and the marine Michael Creed said the move was "unwelcome and unhelpful", but not surprising.

 

"This is a ratcheting up of the temperature around the negotiations," he told Irish national broadcaster RTE.

 

(Reporting by Paul Sandle in London, Alastair Macdonald in Brussels and Conor Humphries in Dublin; Editing by Andrew Heavens and David Evans)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-07-03

[phantomfiddler]

And about time too ! The Spaniards have been nicking my haddock for too long already, why don,t they go fishing off Spain ? Every country should have rights over the fishing in it,s own waters !

[terryw]

There is now hope that for fishing towns such as Grimsby and Fleetwood, there economies will be improved.

[retarius]

Echoing the previous.....yes about time too. The EU killed our fishing industry.

[Caps]

as per the above ^^

[Retiredandhappyhere]

The Eu still seems to think that it can not only dictate terms but also the order in which they must be discussed.

 

Theresa May did, for example, state the conditions in which EU citizens could remain and work in Britain after the UK's exit.  The EU's response was "not enough detail".   Where are the EU's conditions for the UK citizens living and working in the EU?  Before negotiation had even started, the EU claimed that Britain was totally unprepared but that was mere conjecture and propaganda on their part as it simply meant that, prior to negotiations, we had not declared our hand, which is the correct strategy when entering talks.

 

Now they criticise the UK for seeking to take control "unilaterally" of its own waters.   Well, they had better get used to the UK making its own decisions in future, as there is going to be a lot more of it, whether the EU likes it or not.

[rockingrobin]

9 minutes ago, Retiredandhappyhere said:

The Eu still seems to think that it can not only dictate terms but also the order in which they must be discussed.

 

Theresa May did, for example, state the conditions in which EU citizens could remain and work in Britain after the UK's exit.  The EU's response was "not enough detail".   Where are the EU's conditions for the UK citizens living and working in the EU?  Before negotiation had even started, the EU claimed that Britain was totally unprepared but that was mere conjecture and propaganda on their part as it simply meant that, prior to negotiations, we had not declared our hand, which is the correct strategy when entering talks.

 

Now they criticise the UK for seeking to take control "unilaterally" of its own waters.   Well, they had better get used to the UK making its own decisions in future, as there is going to be a lot more of it, whether the EU likes it or not.

The EU citizens proposals have been pulished , and it is the position of the EU that UK citizens in EU member states keep their acquired rights.

 

The London Fishing Convention , was brokered by the UK , and thus article 15 requires the UK to inform the UK that it is terminating the agreement. Basically abrogating a treaty it negotatiated. 

Prior to the UK beoming a member of the EU, it felt it was in the UK's interest to make this treaty, so what has changed.

[Epidemiologist Dave]

47 minutes ago, rockingrobin said:

The EU citizens proposals have been pulished , and it is the position of the EU that UK citizens in EU member states keep their acquired rights.

 

The London Fishing Convention , was brokered by the UK , and thus article 15 requires the UK to inform the UK that it is terminating the agreement. Basically abrogating a treaty it negotatiated. 

Prior to the UK beoming a member of the EU, it felt it was in the UK's interest to make this treaty, so what has changed.

Giving in to stupidity and weakness is what has changed.

[the guest]

Only trouble with this scenario, how are they going to enforce their waters? Their navy is so small, that it would be impossible for them to cover all their coastline, as we have seen recently witnessed with illegal immigrants breaching their shores. 

[ilostmypassword]

8 minutes ago, the guest said:

Only trouble with this scenario, how are they going to enforce their waters? Their navy is so small, that it would be impossible for them to cover all their coastline, as we have seen recently witnessed with illegal immigrants breaching their shores. 

Well,the UK could cancel its Trident purchases and buy itself a few hundred useful boats instead.

[nontabury]

3 hours ago, terryw said:

There is now hope that for fishing towns such as Grimsby and Fleetwood, there economies will be improved.

I don't know about Fleetwood, however In regards to Hull and Grimsby. You will find that the boats  out of there, were deep sea trawlers,therefore not effected by any decision regarding the 12 mile limit.

[7by7]

4 hours ago, nontabury said:

I don't know about Fleetwood, however In regards to Hull and Grimsby. You will find that the boats  out of there, were deep sea trawlers,therefore not effected by any decision regarding the 12 mile limit.

Fleetwood was a deep sea trawler port as well.

 

This agreement, signed in 1964, 9 years before the UK joined what became the EU,  did not effect them or any of the other deep sea ports; it was the 'Cod Wars' with Iceland which were the main cause of their decline.

 

Of course, died in the wool Brexiteers aren't interested in facts like that!

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

Fleetwood was a deep sea trawler port as well.

 

This agreement, signed in 1964, 9 years before the UK joined what became the EU,  did not effect them or any of the other deep sea ports; it was the 'Cod Wars' with Iceland which were the main cause of their decline.

 

Of course, died in the wool Brexiteers aren't interested in facts like that!

Forgive me for not knowing that Fleetwood was deep sea,probably, because it was soo small. A great deal of the deep sea fishing was off Iceland, but by no means most. Hull was the largest deep sea fishing port in the world, see first photo. 2nd what remains of the industry now, a museum piece. All thanks to British politicians, who were already planning to sacrifice the fishing industry as a cost of Britains entry in to the EEC. Let's hope we can now regain control of our own waters,and employ British fishermen, instead of buying  our own fish from the Spanish and French.

 

 

[oldlakey]

7 hours ago, the guest said:

Only trouble with this scenario, how are they going to enforce their waters? Their navy is so small, that it would be impossible for them to cover all their coastline, as we have seen recently witnessed with illegal immigrants breaching their shores. 

We are talking the UK here not Thailand, enforcement is King, arrest one illegal fishing boat, give them a good kicking in court, and then witness the change in attitude of our neighbours

Kicking our close neighbours has always worked for us, when deemed necessary 

 

 

[oldlakey]

1 hour ago, nontabury said:

Forgive me for not knowing that Fleetwood was deep sea,probably, because it waso small. A great deal of the deep sea fishing was off Iceland, but by no means most. Hull was the largest deep sea fishing port in the world, see first photo. 2nd what remains of the industry now, a museum piece. All thanks to British politicians, who were already planning to sacrifice the fishing industry as a cost of Britains entry in to the EEC. Let's hope we can now regain control of our own waters,and employ British fishermen, instead of buying  our own fish from the Spanish and French.

 

 

Grimsby deserves a mention as a port that had a decent fleet of far water trawlers as well as north sea vessels

I went through the lock gates a couple of times  at Grimsby when we had a decent catch

Lowestoft our home port all north sea, had 100+ trawlers at one time, mere history now

Edited July 3, 2017 by oldlakey

[7by7]

2 hours ago, nontabury said:

Forgive me for not knowing that Fleetwood was deep sea

Forgive me for enlightening you, and others, after you said

 

8 hours ago, nontabury said:

I don't know about Fleetwood,

 

2 hours ago, nontabury said:

All thanks to British politicians, who were already planning to sacrifice the fishing industry as a cost of Britains entry in to the EEC.

British politicians may be in part to blame for the decline of the UK's deep sea fishing fleet; but the EEC, now EU, had little to do with it!

 

The Cod Wars with Iceland started in 1956, well before the UK joined the EEC, and lasted on and off for 20 years. Iceland, of course, has never been a member of the EEC or EU.

 

Iceland eventually won due to it's threat to withdraw from NATO, close it's waters to NATO shipping,  and close the NATO base at Keflavik. It was this action which finally caused the UK government, under pressure from the US government, to acquiesce to Iceland's demands for a 200 mile fishing limit.

 

The result being a terminal blow to the UK's deep sea fishing industry.

 

So how is the EU to blame for any of this?

 

Finally, is the UK's fishing industry in as poor a state as some claim?  From Is the EU ‘pinching our fish’?

Quote

The UK’s share of the overall EU fishing catch grew between 2004 and 2014. In 2004 the UK had the fourth largest catch of any EU country at 652,000 tonnes, by 2014 this had grown to 752,000 tonnes and the second largest catch of any country in the EU.

 

[anon4546543]

As an Australian, I can assure you that Spanish and Japanese trawler fleets have no respect for shorelines.  The simple fact is that Britain along with EU countries may be able to manage their own fish stocks.  They may be able to manage their own migration, defence, economy, finance and so on.  You do not need to kowtow to EU strictures. Simple self management and some treaties look after  the rest. As long as you look after your own country first. As long as you look after your own citizens first. This is what a sovereign country is all about. Not kowtowing to France and Germany in their little enclave in Brussels. The only good thing to come out of Brussels was sprouts, though there may be many kids to  disagree with me.

[Thongkorn]

7 hours ago, 7by7 said:

Fleetwood was a deep sea trawler port as well.

 

This agreement, signed in 1964, 9 years before the UK joined what became the EU,  did not effect them or any of the other deep sea ports; it was the 'Cod Wars' with Iceland which were the main cause of their decline.

 

Of course, died in the wool Brexiteers aren't interested in facts like that!

The cod war was political, and Grimsby fishermen got sold out , Iceland told America to remove there listening devices, unless they put pressure on the British government to stop British fishermen, fishing in Iceland's 200 mile fishing ground, 

[7by7]

3 hours ago, Thongkorn said:

The cod war was political, and Grimsby fishermen got sold out , Iceland told America to remove there listening devices, unless they put pressure on the British government to stop British fishermen, fishing in Iceland's 200 mile fishing ground, 

Indeed, see my post 16 above.

[JAG]

As an Australian, I can assure you that Spanish and Japanese trawler fleets have no respect for shorelines.  The simple fact is that Britain along with EU countries may be able to manage their own fish stocks.  They may be able to manage their own migration, defence, economy, finance and so on.  You do not need to kowtow to EU strictures. Simple self management and some treaties look after  the rest. As long as you look after your own country first. As long as you look after your own citizens first. This is what a sovereign country is all about. Not kowtowing to France and Germany in their little enclave in Brussels. The only good thing to come out of Brussels was sprouts, though there may be many kids to  disagree with me.

They're jolly nice cooked slowly in garlic butter. Sprouts that is...

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, JAG said:

They're jolly nice cooked slowly in garlic butter. Sprouts that is...

Could say the same about the Bureacrats in Brussels.

[sirineou]

yes but what the Brits dot realize is that they will also not be able to fish in the shores of such countries a Austria, Slovakia, Hungary. etc

[nontabury]

9 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

 

 

British politicians may be in part to blame for the decline of the UK's deep sea fishing fleet; but the EEC, now EU, had little to do with it!

 

The Cod Wars with Iceland started in 1956, well before the UK joined the EEC, and lasted on and off for 20 years. Iceland, of course, has never been a member of the EEC or EU.

 

Iceland eventually won due to it's threat to withdraw from NATO, close it's waters to NATO shipping,  and close the NATO base at Keflavik. It was this action which finally caused the UK government, under pressure from the US government, to acquiesce to Iceland's demands for a 200 mile fishing limit.

 

The result being a terminal blow to the UK's deep sea fishing industry.

 

So how is the EU to blame for any of this?

 

Finally, is the UK's fishing industry in as poor a state as some claim?  From Is the EU ‘pinching our fish’?

 

As you correctly state,this dispute carried on for 20yrs, finally resolved (sacrificed) at the time of the U.K. entry into the EEC. It was all about pressure. The Heath government were intent on getting us into the EEC at any cost. And the EEC was sold to the British people as a trading block. Or should I say, the Brittish people, were CONNED  into thinking it was a trading block. We now know differently.

  Regarding the fishing industry,hopefully more jobs will be created ( though not in London) when we are fully out of this so called Union. 

 

[whatawonderfulday]

Well I hope they  do a better job of it than they achieved during the Cod war with Iceland

Edited July 4, 2017 by whatawonderfulday

[JAG]

2 hours ago, JAG said:

They're jolly nice cooked slowly in garlic butter. Sprouts that is...

 

1 hour ago, nontabury said:

Could say the same about the Bureacrats in Brussels.

Indeed, but even a small quantity of the latter can lead to constipation, a lack of motion, and eventually loss of control of movement.

In other words a right pain in the arse!

[robblok]

54 minutes ago, nontabury said:

As you correctly state,this dispute carried on for 20yrs, finally resolved (sacrificed) at the time of the U.K. entry into the EEC. It was all about pressure. The Heath government were intent on getting us into the EEC at any cost. And the EEC was sold to the British people as a trading block. Or should I say, the Brittish people, were CONNED  into thinking it was a trading block. We now know differently.

  Regarding the fishing industry,hopefully more jobs will be created ( though not in London) when we are fully out of this so called Union. 

 

Quite a few companies (been in the Dutch news a few times and I had people contacting me from the UK about setting up Dutch companies because of leaving the UK so its quite real) are leaving the UK and resettling in the Netherlands. We were also in line to get your trade banks (nice high profit jobs) but because we have strict limitations to the amount of flexible bonus of salaries those trade banks might not come but go to other European countries. So its ok for you guys to have a few fishery jobs. We will take the more high tech jobs from you once you leave the union. 

 

I do wonder however if a 6 to 12 mile is going to make that much of a difference and what you guys lose in fishing grounds that you won't be allowed to fish anymore. Don't think there are only benefits. 

 

 

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

Quite a few companies (been in the Dutch news a few times and I had people contacting me from the UK about setting up Dutch companies because of leaving the UK so its quite real) are leaving the UK and resettling in the Netherlands. We were also in line to get your trade banks (nice high profit jobs) but because we have strict limitations to the amount of flexible bonus of salaries those trade banks might not come but go to other European countries. So its ok for you guys to have a few fishery jobs. We will take the more high tech jobs from you once you leave the union. 

 

I do wonder however if a 6 to 12 mile is going to make that much of a difference and what you guys lose in fishing grounds that you won't be allowed to fish anymore. Don't think there are only benefits. 

 

 

Well, being one of the Dutch people,who is not prepared ( at the Moment) to see the alternative,and to believe in scare stories,I can understand your answer. Were you one of the 62% of the Dutch electorate who voted NO  in the  referendum in 2005,regarding further EU integration. To then see your democratic vote completely ignored.

What happened re Brexit, is that the British electorate voted to leave this so -called Union. And we will not be over ruled by the political and big business establishment. Hopefully you too, will come to see the follie of Brussels, and join an ever increasing number of your own people seeking to exit the EU.

And then perhaps to re-establish the EEC as it was first envisaged, a trading block.

 

[robblok]

15 minutes ago, nontabury said:

Well, being one of the Dutch people,who is not prepared ( at the Moment) to see the alternative,and to believe in scare stories,I can understand your answer. Were you one of the 62% of the Dutch electorate who voted NO  in the  referendum in 2005,regarding further EU integration. To then see your democratic vote completely ignored.

What happened re Brexit, is that the British electorate voted to leave this so -called Union. And we will not be over ruled by the political and big business establishment. Hopefully you too, will come to see the follie of Brussels, and join an ever increasing number of your own people seeking to exit the EU.

And then perhaps to re-establish the EEC as it was first envisaged, a trading block.

 

Just telling you how it is.. how other countries are benefiting from the Brexit. Our economy is great much better than that one of the UK. Freedom has a price and the Brits are  paying it. I like the Euro and European union (within limits). Your politicians have blamed all their failings on the EU (easy to do), then you get a Brexit vote that sunk the pound even more.  I am one of the people who sees that the EU has its faults but that staying in it has great benefits too. 

 

If you guys had lived up to EU fire codes there might not have been so many problems over there. They wanted to lower the fire codes even.. that was before the fire. 

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/22/government-backed-red-tape-group-eu-fire-safety-rules-grenfell-fire

 

Such a bad organisation the EU..

[dick dasterdly]

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

 

If you guys had lived up to EU fire codes there might not have been so many problems over there. They wanted to lower the fire codes even.. that was before the fire. 

I suspect that the UK had EU fire codes in place (and abided by them) before this horrifying fire that resulted in so many deaths.

 

If this is not the case, then provide evidence to support this on the appropriate thread.  Otherwise, it just sounds like a HORRENDOUS  deflection.

[Grouse]

https://www.opendemocracy.net/can-europe-make-it/griffin-carpenter/eu-common-fisheries-policy-has-helped-not-harmed-uk-fisheries-0

 

I know nothing about fishing so read up a bit

 

https://fullfact.org/europe/what-does-leaving-eu-mean-fishing/

 

https://fullfact.org/europe/eu-pinching-our-fish/

 

Interesting

 

Good to see cod stocks reviving! Yorkshire fish n' chips (with scraps) is unbeatable!

 

What about Dover sole? Will there still be sole meunière for tea?

 

 

Edited July 4, 2017 by Grouse