Donald Trump Jr. hires lawyer for Russia probes

[Thakkar]

4 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Skip to 3:00.  Absolutely unreal...and some are supporting them on this?  Incredible.

With apologies to Coleridge:

Burgers, burgers everywhere, and yet they contend, there's not a bite to eat!

 

T

[JHolmesJr]

"potentially"  "implies" "attempted" 

 

thats all Im hearing so far….surely your outrage will produce some clear legal wrongdoing.

 

we will wait….I just had a burger for lunch…a substantial one.

[iReason]

A little history on Natalia Veselnitskaya:

 

Trump Jr. Met Lawyer Who Repped Accused Russian Money Launderer

Donald Trump Jr. and Jared Kushner held a Trump Tower meeting with the attorney of a businessman who allegedly dodged $230 million in taxes in Russia. (sub-title)

 

"The Russian woman who held a secret meeting with a troika of President Trump’s top campaign staff is the chief orchestrator of Moscow’s efforts to overturn one of President Vladimir Putin’s most hated American interventions against his regime."

 

"Natalia Veselnitskaya’s mission is to destroy the Magnitsky Act—a package of U.S. sanctions that targets corrupt Russian officials and their comrades."

 

"The case brought by U.S. Attorney Preet Bharara was unexpectedly settled out of court on the eve of the trial in May, two months after Bharara was fired by Trump."

http://www.thedailybeast.com/team-trump-secretly-met-rep-of-accused-russian-crime-family

(Much more in the link)^^^

 

You might remember N.Y. U.S. Attorney Preet Bharara.

He is the attorney who was fired by the inept one as he was looking into the Russian mob money laundering in N.Y.

[Basil B]

Donald Jr say's he never discussed the meetings with daddy... 

 

suppose we will have 8 years of him evading a polygraph test.  

[iReason]

12 minutes ago, JHolmesJr said:

I just had a burger for lunch…a substantial one.

 

From reading these pages I suspect. 

[craigt3365]

7 minutes ago, JHolmesJr said:

"potentially"  "implies" "attempted" 

 

thats all Im hearing so far….surely your outrage will produce some clear legal wrongdoing.

 

we will wait….I just had a burger for lunch…a substantial one.

Since we're not in trial, that's all we have until a conviction.  Who would have thought we'd be here 6 months ago.  Hardly anybody except a few who realized Trump and crew were liars and cheats.

 

Manafort's gone.  Flynn's gone.  A few more look to be leaving shortly also.  Maybe they're off eating burgers somewhere? LOL

 

P.S. Flynn's pursuing a plea agreement.  Hmmm...maybe doing that while having a burger? LOL

[craigt3365]

Kushner is involved in this.  Let's not forget his father's legal issues.  Very similar?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Kushner#Criminal_conviction

 

Quote

In the summer of 2004, Kushner was fined $508,900 by the Federal Election Commission for contributing to political campaigns in the names of his partnerships when he lacked authorization to do so.^[12] In 2005, following an investigation by the U.S. Attorney's Office for the District of New Jersey,^[13]U.S. Attorney Chris Christie negotiated a plea agreement with Kushner, under which he pleaded guilty to 18 counts of illegal campaign contributions, tax evasion, and witness tampering.^[14] The witness-tampering charge arose from Kushner's act of retaliation against William Schulder, his sister Esther's husband, who was cooperating with federal investigators; Kushner hired a prostitute to seduce his brother-in-law, arranged to record an encounter between the two, and had the tape sent to his sister.

Jared was instrumental in firing US Attorney Chris Christie, supposedly in retaliation for her prosecution of his father.  And Jared was instrumental in the firing of Comey, who was involved with the Russian investigations.  Talk about foxes being in charge of the hen house.  Incredible.

 

Yet some say this is all a great big nothing burger. LOL

 

[Briggsy]

38 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Was Kushner in this chain of events also?  If so...wow.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Kushner

Is there anybody in the White House that isn't involved in these potentially illegal (definitely unethical) dealings? LOL

Mob culture.

 

The only way to get in is to get dirty. That way everybody knows you have something to lose if you decide to be a rat.

 

So the answer to your question is 'no'.

[PattayaJames]

3 hours ago, Thakkar said:

 

Again, even if the campaign directly offered rewards for info, it would not be illegal unless foreigners were involved.

 

In this case, it wasn't the campaign, it was the Super PAC. By law, PACs cannot corordinate with campaigns. This Chinese Wall is flimsy and a joke, but that's the fault of the Republicans who set it up. Take up your complaints with them. The Clinton campaign was following the rules. The Trump campaign, by talking to foreigners, wasn't.

How would they know if foreigners were involved with an anonymous tip off website. Like they would ignore something that was from foreigners.

And did not the dodgy "Trump dossier" come via a similar route? Again, the person employed to do the investigating was getting info from Russians and passing it back.

[Andaman Al]

2 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

How would they know if foreigners were involved with an anonymous tip off website

so if it's anonymous how were they to be paid for their information?

[Andaman Al]

3 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

And did not the dodgy "Trump dossier" come via a similar route?

The Trump dossier is being proven to be completely credible, story by story. You do recall that the Trump dossier was commissioned by Republicans trying to get dirt on Trump? If the gaining of info for the dossier was illegal then good, jail them all but don't start the 'but but but but'. The dossier does not diminish what the Trumps have been doing. If anything is illegal I am quite sure Mueller will have them jailed, and I don't fancy Kushner's chances or Jr's chances on this, and when we find out the Pres DID know about the meetings and that information WAS handed over at the Jr meetings, then we can jail the lot of them.

[PattayaJames]

8 minutes ago, Andaman Al said:

so if it's anonymous how were they to be paid for their information?

In cash? I don't know, just quoting from the article:

 

Correct the Record, one of the well-funded super PACs Brock founded, is creating a WikiLeaks-style project to pay anonymous tipsters for scoops, which they’re calling Trump Leaks.

 

Also says they are are allowed to coordinate with campaigns:

 

Correct the Record, which is allowed to directly coordinate with the Clinton campaign, has set no financial cap on what they’re willing to pay.

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/democratic-super-pac-pay-trump-dirt-n648591 

Edited July 12, 2017 by PattayaJames

[Andaman Al]

9 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

In cash? I don't know, just quoting from the article:

 

Correct the Record, one of the well-funded super PACs Brock founded, is creating a WikiLeaks-style project to pay anonymous tipsters for scoops, which they’re calling Trump Leaks.

 

Also says they are are allowed to coordinate with campaigns:

 

Correct the Record, which is allowed to directly coordinate with the Clinton campaign, has set no financial cap on what they’re willing to pay.

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/democratic-super-pac-pay-trump-dirt-n648591 

Sounds like fake news to me. Isn't NBC one of the MSM that Trump claims dishes out fake news? But Reps want this story to be real? You boys like having your cake and eating it don't you. Paying anonymous tipsters?? sounds like bolleux. 

[alanrchase]

In cash? I don't know, just quoting from the article:
 
Correct the Record, one of the well-funded super PACs Brock founded, is creating a WikiLeaks-style project to pay anonymous tipsters for scoops, which they’re calling Trump Leaks.
 
Also says they are are allowed to coordinate with campaigns:
 
Correct the Record, which is allowed to directly coordinate with the Clinton campaign, has set no financial cap on what they’re willing to pay.
 
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/democratic-super-pac-pay-trump-dirt-n648591 

You keep forgetting to mention they will only accept stuff that is "procured legaly"

[iReason]

Lawyer Who Met With Trump Jr. Has Ties To Russian Government

 

"In the U.S., Veselnitskaya is best known for fighting to repeal sanctions against Russia signed by President Barack Obama in 2012."

 

"Veselnitskaya has worked to fight the law in Washington, but also to discredit the law's namesake,

Sergei Magnitsky, who uncovered an alleged $230 million Russian corruption scandal."

 

"Magnitsky was then jailed by Russian authorities, and he died in custody a year later, Human rights groups —

including the Kremlin's human rights commission — concluded he had been beaten and denied medical care."

http://www.npr.org/2017/07/10/536478972/lawyer-who-met-with-trump-jr-has-ties-to-russian-government

 

 

"Congress enacted the Sergei Magnitsky Rule of Law Accountability Act of 2012 (title IV, P.L. 112-208; 22 U.S.C. 5811 note)

to require the President to identify the person(s) involved in the detention, abuse, or death of Sergei Magnitsky,

and the ensuing cover-up, or who are "responsible for extrajudicial killings,

torture, or other gross violations of internationally recognized human rights" in Russia."

https://www.hsdl.org/?view&did=798196

 

 

Edited July 12, 2017 by iReason

[PattayaJames]

1 hour ago, Andaman Al said:

Sounds like fake news to me. Isn't NBC one of the MSM that Trump claims dishes out fake news? But Reps want this story to be real? You boys like having your cake and eating it don't you. Paying anonymous tipsters?? sounds like bolleux. 

Whatever. Go research it further if you wish.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correct_the_Record

BTW I thought calling fake news was not allowed on this forum?

Edited July 12, 2017 by PattayaJames

[Andaman Al]

6 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

Whatever. Go research it further if you wish.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correct_the_Record

BTW I thought calling fake news was not allowed on this forum?

Well you have called fake news enough. AH yes for research, off to Wiki. Do you know you can go into the page and amend it to read what you want, or you can just write the page yourself. Then the whole world are supposed to believe it is a point of reference?

 

Do some real research. All 'correct the record' ever did was publish positive messages about Clinton in response to claims Clinton was a crook etc. Think of all the people that have dirt on Trump from all the law suits. Don't you think one of them out of tens of thousands would have fronted up for some money if it were true. I smell BS.

[PattayaJames]

22 minutes ago, Andaman Al said:

Well you have called fake news enough. AH yes for research, off to Wiki. Do you know you can go into the page and amend it to read what you want, or you can just write the page yourself. Then the whole world are supposed to believe it is a point of reference?

 

Do some real research. All 'correct the record' ever did was publish positive messages about Clinton in response to claims Clinton was a crook etc. Think of all the people that have dirt on Trump from all the law suits. Don't you think one of them out of tens of thousands would have fronted up for some money if it were true. I smell BS.

There you go again with your condescending attitude.

I am not interested in researching it any further, when I was originally researching it the other day it was covered by loads of news sites. In fact I specifically used the NBC link to try to avoid any fake news accusations, and before you try, no I am not saying NBC is a particularly great news source. I  just thought that it would be one accepted by the anti Trump brigade.

However, I was not accounting for you who just likes to argue endlessly, on the smallest detail.

Feel free to research it further yourself and report back any evidence you find that it is BS.

And while you are at it please provide a quote where I have called something fake news. 

[Silurian]

8 hours ago, PattayaJames said:

Meeting someone who says they have info on your opponent in politics is not a crime. Thus far that is all we have here, and all there looks to be.

 

In this case, it was the meeting with a foreign national that is considered illegal and the solicitation of the information.

 

The statute in question is 52 USC 30121, 36 USC 510 — the law governing foreign contributions to US campaigns:

A foreign national shall not, directly or indirectly, make a contribution or a donation of money or other thing of value, or expressly or impliedly promise to make a contribution or a donation, in connection with any Federal, State, or local election.

 

Legal experts say Donald Trump Jr has just confessed to a federal crime

https://www.vox.com/world/2017/7/10/15950590/donald-trump-jr-new-york-times-illegal

 

If you think solicitation without getting anything in return is not illegal, I would point you to police sting operations and the ilk. Yes, you can be arrested for trying to solicit sex from a prostitute or trying to solicit drugs from a drug dealer. You went with intent. Whether or not you actually received any goods or services is a separate issue. 

 

[iReason]

 

When Donnie Jr was approached by agents from a long time foreign adversary with information on a political rival, he responds:

"I love it".

 

'nuff said.

 

 

Edited July 12, 2017 by iReason

[Pinot]

8 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

It is a crime.  It's part of the election laws. As for your last comment, credible links, please.  Otherwise it's a conspiracy theory.

You beat me to it. Complete BS. Hillary was looking to pay...come on. Only in a world where Breitbart gets press credentials. 

[iReason]

GOP Campaign Veterans Say They Wouldn’t Have Met With Foreign Agent Offering Dirt

“Senior presidential campaign officials don’t take meetings with nameless people.” (sub-title)

 

"Trump Jr. and other White House allies on Monday defended the sit-down by attempting to characterize it as a normal campaign exercise ―

as if every presidential campaign were willing to accept help from a nameless foreign agent."

 

“I’ve been involved in 9 presidential campaigns ... never happened, never would happen for all kinds of reasons,” said GOP consultant John Weaver, who advised the White House bids by Ohio Gov. John Kasich and Sen. John McCain of Arizona."

 

"Rick Tyler, a former top aide to the presidential campaign of Sen. Ted Cruz Texas,

said he would have called the FBI if approached by a foreign agent from an adversarial nation like Russia."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-meeting-russia-campaign_us_5963a7a0e4b0615b9e936e06

 

 

Chief White House ethics lawyer for Pres. George W. Bush:

 

 

[Thakkar]

3 hours ago, PattayaJames said:

How would they know if foreigners were involved with an anonymous tip off website. Like they would ignore something that was from foreigners.

And did not the dodgy "Trump dossier" come via a similar route? Again, the person employed to do the investigating was getting info from Russians and passing it back.

 

How would they know if foreigners were involved with an anonymous tip off website. Like they would ignore something that was from foreigners.

 

Eventually, the same way donations are vetted, many times after the fact, and then returned. In the case of info, it's source would be vetted before using, if for no other reason than the Clinton campaign were skilled political operatives who knew that hasty/wrong/mis use of info or info illegally obtained or maliciously planted could easily come back to bite them. Unlike the Trump campaign, the Clinton campaign was not run by neophytes for a neophyte candidate.

 

And did not the dodgy "Trump dossier" come via a similar route? Again, the person employed to do the investigating was getting info from Russians and passing it back.

 

The people who hired the British ex-spy were, initially, Republicans (Americans), Then the DNC (also Americans). Steele did not obtain his info through means that would be illegal in America, such as hacking.

 

Don Jr. Was ready to get info directly from a foreign person representing a hostile regime that was under US sanctions. Do you see the difference?

 

Furthermore, the encounter becomes more incriminating when Kushner fails to disclose the meeting as required by law. Especially so when you consider that high level appointees Flynn and Sessions (and Kushner, again) ALSO failed to disclose, as required, their meetings with other Russians. Not to mention numerous denials (which turned out to be lies) by Campaign chairman Manafort about meetings with Russian operatives.

 

Any one of these by itself, though serious, could be chalked up to forgetfulness, inexperience, excessive enthusiasm in the heat of the campaign—whatever. But ALL of them, and against the background of known Russian attempts to interfere in the elections as determined by all major American intelligence agencies? That's a pretty substantial burger—otherwise the FBI wouldn't have been investigation possible collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia.

 

T

 

[Silurian]

4 minutes ago, Thakkar said:

Furthermore, the encounter becomes more incriminating when Kushner fails to disclose the meeting as required by law. Especially so when you consider that high level appointees Flynn and Sessions (and Kushner, again) ALSO failed to disclose, as required, their meetings with other Russians. Not to mention numerous denials (which turned out to be lies) by Campaign chairman Manafort about meetings with Russian operatives.

 

Why the heck does Kushner still have a security clearance? He failed to disclose any foreign contacts on his security clearance form SF-86. It isn't even known that he updated the SF-86 form since it came out that he had these foreign contacts. At a minimum his security clearance should be suspended until a full review of his background is completed. If it was anyone else, their security clearance would have been yanked. Congressmen and Senators should be demanding it be suspended.

[Thakkar]

11 minutes ago, Silurian said:

 

Why the heck does Kushner still have a security clearance? He failed to disclose any foreign contacts on his security clearance form SF-86. It isn't even known that he updated the SF-86 form since it came out that he had these foreign contacts. At a minimum his security clearance should be suspended until a full review of his background is completed. If it was anyone else, their security clearance would have been yanked. Congressmen and Senators should be demanding it be suspended.

You're asking the wrong question. The real question the failing NYTimes should be asking is, why didn't Obama protect 3 American citizens from being compromised by Russia?!

 

Not to mention Obama's TOTAL failure to prevent the birth of an idiot son like Don Jr.

 

Thanks, Obama!

 

T

[mesquite]

Yet another play by Trump, this time Jr., to give the press and the "resistance" something to talk about and get their hopes up about throwing him out of office. 

 

Ain't gonna happen.

[craigt3365]

3 minutes ago, mesquite said:

Yet another play by Trump, this time Jr., to give the press and the "resistance" something to talk about and get their hopes up about throwing him out of office. 

 

Ain't gonna happen.

So you are saying it's ok for Junior to meet with foreign officials illegally and then to later lie the meetings never happened?

 

This administration has lost all credibility now.

[mesquite]

2 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

So you are saying it's ok for Junior to meet with foreign officials illegally and then to later lie the meetings never happened?

 

This administration has lost all credibility now.

I'm saying Trump will serve a total of eight years as president.  This issue will go away and be replaced by something else.

Edited July 12, 2017 by mesquite

[JHolmesJr]

1 hour ago, iReason said:

 

When Donnie Jr was approached by agents from a long time foreign adversary with information on a political rival, he responds:

"I love it".

 

'nuff said.

 

 

 

you get excited at things that have no clear meaning….. i love it…..can mean a number of things.

[Thakkar]