How Much Sin-sod Did You Pay?

[SanukJoe]

I never said that!!! I said it's reality that a new husband is allowed (takes the right) to have sex with daughters of the woman. If you noticed well I have repeated that women don't let them do this, not by fighting the men as they would lose, but by hiding their daughters.

What you said was this exactly.

You know that the new (thai) husband of a divorced woman with kids is allowed to have sex with her daughter(s) no matter how old?

Then you started talking about Thai guys raping children at gunpoint (hence the mother can't protect them). Who did you mean it was allowed by? The people in the village? The mother? Surely not the rapist himself because of course he allows himself to do it. Rape by gunpoint is not 'allowed' in Thailand by most people I would have thought. Rape of step children isn't either, though of course it does go on, as murder goes on, and drug dealing goes on etc. I take it by 'allowed' you mean 'accepted' or something along those lines right?

Great Maddy! I admire you for that.

You don't have to admire me for eating with poor people Joe, I'm pretty poor myself and it's all family and friends and we all need to eat. It wasn't a sacrifice for me or anything like that, just day to day life in the village.

Not allowed means it doesn't happen?

Not allowed to kill people, still 18.000 deads per year if I'm well informed. Of course you can close your eyes, as most thai society does, that doesn't it is not happening.

The main message of me was that mothers don't let it happen so they hide their daughters at their parents home.

It was you who said mothers should prevent it. How? By hitting with a pan? By physical violence? Come on.

I asked you to come up and help me with another word for "allowed" but you didn't.

BTW it was all in context of why divorced thai women are not popular with thai men, and why thai men are not popular with thai women!

Joe

[SanukJoe]

I said it's reality that a new husband is allowed (takes the right) to have sex with daughters of the woman. If you noticed well I have repeated that women don't let them do this, not by fighting the men as they would lose, but by hiding their daughters.

Could a Thai person on this forum please comment on this? I've shown it to two so far and they can't believe his ignorance. Joe, you may not be a bad guy, but you are woefully ill-informed about Thailand.

I'm informed by the "inner" Thais, who would usually keep this for them. I'm priviledged to have been accepted by the people in my village, the advantage is that they tell me things they would never tell "just" farangs.

Joe

To be fair Joe I just asked my gf about this earlier as well and she couldn't believe your ignorance either

How long have you known these inner Thais and how long have you spent in the village?

I'd be curious to know since you seem to be able to get information that is apparently hidden from the rest of us 'just' farangs.

I don't like your ironic tone so I will withdraw. I tried to be nice and friendly, you got upset and now you try to make me a fool with help of your girlfriend, whatever that means. Remember one thing: if you don't know something it does not mean I am ignorant, it means you don't know!!

A shame, I thought you had a higher level.

Cheers

Joe

The ironic tone was because you have quite a patronising tone Joe. I offered my gfs opinion only as a Thai persons opinion which cdnvic was asking about.

I would like to know how long you have spent in the village and in Thailand though? Not to bad of a question is it?

Strange enough when a thai woman explained sin sot nobody wanted to hear, when a farang told about his thai brother in law paying sin sot for a divorced woman with kids nobody wanted to hear.

Now suddenly we need thai explanation? And when your GF, I don't know where she is from but you live in BKK, doesn't know then it's not happening, right?

Measuring with two measures right?

Go back to the topic: sin sot

Cheers

Joe

[bkkmadness]

Strange enough when a thai woman explained sin sot nobody wanted to hear, when a farang told about his thai brother in law paying sin sot for a divorced woman with kids nobody wanted to hear.

I listened to all that information, was happy to hear it. Don't confuse me with someone else.

Now suddenly we need thai explanation? And when your GF, I don't know where she is from but you live in BKK, doesn't know then it's not happening, right?

She knows it happens but I think was confused with the allowed terminology as the rest of seem to be. Not sure of another word for it because Im not sure what you mean, 'accepted' perhaps?

[SanukJoe]

The ironic tone was because you have quite a patronising tone Joe.

I didn't mean to sound patronising, if so I'm sorry for that.

I only tell my experiences, in inner Thailand, not BKK or Pattaya, I mean deep down Thailand. I'm not telling bar stories, macho stories, strong farang stories. I only tell what I experienced, I'm a very hungry person as far as learning is concerned, I'm highly interested in thai culture and specially Isaan culture. I read a lot, but I learned most by being there, in my tiny little village, I never found a map that shows the village. There I learned thai culture, thai tradition. There I learned how human beings can live together in happiness, having fun although in western eyes there is little to have fun about. They call it Sanuk, and it's in my name here, as I find it personnally the philosophy of life that suits me very very well. My personal opinion.

Joe

[SanukJoe]

Strange enough when a thai woman explained sin sot nobody wanted to hear, when a farang told about his thai brother in law paying sin sot for a divorced woman with kids nobody wanted to hear.

I listened to all that information, was happy to hear it. Don't confuse me with someone else.

Now suddenly we need thai explanation? And when your GF, I don't know where she is from but you live in BKK, doesn't know then it's not happening, right?

She knows it happens but I think was confused with the allowed terminology as the rest of seem to be. Not sure of another word for it because Im not sure what you mean, 'accepted' perhaps?

I asked you as a native english speaker. I'm dutch, my english is not bad but sometimes it needs a native english speaker to solve things. I asked for your help but you didn't react.

Joe

[bkkmadness]

Not allowed means it doesn't happen?

No it happens, but its not accepted/allowed.

It was you who said mothers should prevent it. How? By hitting with a pan? By physical violence? Come on.

I was explaining that a mother could prevent the rape of her children by their step dad although the more money/education they had without money/education is can be almost impossible. The reason money and education is important is because the woman would have more standing within the local community and with the police to get this dealt with. It gives them much more options.

and why thai men are not popular with thai women!

This is a massive generalisation Joe, ask any Thai woman with a Thai bf/husband, there are millions of them in the country. The usual reason farang men get this impression is because at some point they turn around and ask their gf 'why dont you like Thai guys?' and instead of telling them thats they like farang coz of the money, or because the farang man doesn't mind taking a divorced woman etc. they say 'Thai men are all wife beaters, kiddie rapists, drunks, cheaters etc.' and sadly many farang men believe this because its the answer they want to hear.

Sorry Joe, still waiting to hear how long you have spent in Thailand and the village?

[SanukJoe]

and why thai men are not popular with thai women!

This is a massive generalisation Joe, ask any Thai woman with a Thai bf/husband, there are millions of them in the country. The usual reason farang men get this impression is because at some point they turn around and ask their gf 'why dont you like Thai guys?' and instead of telling them thats they like farang coz of the money, or because the farang man doesn't mind taking a divorced woman etc. they say 'Thai men are all wife beaters, kiddie rapists, drunks, cheaters etc.' and sadly many farang men believe this because its the answer they want to hear.

Sorry Maddy, my fault, I should have written why thai men are not popular with thai DIVORCED women. Another reason is that thai men tend to have mia nois or at least sex adventures at karaoke bars. I know quite some divorced (cheated) women who will never want a thai man anymore. Not my opinion, that's what they told me.

Sorry Joe, still waiting to hear how long you have spent in Thailand and the village?

As you keep being curious, ready to nail me down, I have been traveling to Thailand during the last 5 years, first year 4x holiday in Phuket with my (now) wife, then to the village, 4x a year for 5 weeks. Ok?

Joe

[bkkmadness]

I didn't mean to sound patronising, if so I'm sorry for that.

Don't worry Joe, these debates always get a little heated!

[SanukJoe]

I didn't mean to sound patronising, if so I'm sorry for that.

Don't worry Joe, these debates always get a little heated!

Ok mate, I wil get some sleep now, got a 10 hour drive in front of me tomorrow, hate it!

Take care

Joe

[SanukJoe]

I don't like your ironic tone so I will withdraw. I tried to be nice and friendly, you got upset and now you try to make me a fool with help of your girlfriend, whatever that means. Remember one thing: if you don't know something it does not mean I am ignorant, it means you don't know!!

A shame, I thought you had a higher level.

Sounds more like he asked you a pointed question and realising that you are over your head, and your story is starting to unravel, you are now running away from a story you can no longer support.

Maybe the secret Thais can help you out next time.

Sorry mate you missed the nail. Next time better ok?

Joe

[bkkmadness]

As you keep being curious, ready to nail me down, I have been traveling to Thailand during the last 5 years, first year 4x holiday in Phuket with my (now) wife, then to the village, 4x a year for 5 weeks. Ok?

Not ready to nail you down Joe. But I would like to point out (because mainly of the patronising tone earlier to be honest) that maybe you are still a little naive as to what being accepted in the village really is and thinking you have access to information that other farangs don't might be a bit too arrogant considering many of us live here, speak Thai etc.

Despite your arguments with Neeranam earlier the guy has spent 13-14 years living here and most of that in a village so he has got some insights that are worth listening too, I've spent most of my adult life here as well, so though we may disagree about many things you can't discount our thoughts and experiences with yours so easily since you have hardly spent anytime here at all. Not being patronising or rude, just saying listen to others outside your village/circle of friends, you may learn a bit more. I certainly do from all the expats on this board. A wise man is humble.

[cdnvic]

I don't like your ironic tone so I will withdraw. I tried to be nice and friendly, you got upset and now you try to make me a fool with help of your girlfriend, whatever that means. Remember one thing: if you don't know something it does not mean I am ignorant, it means you don't know!!

A shame, I thought you had a higher level.

Sounds more like he asked you a pointed question and realising that you are over your head, and your story is starting to unravel, you are now running away from a story you can no longer support.

Maybe the secret Thais can help you out next time.

Sorry mate you missed the nail. Next time better ok?

Joe

So you are basing the serious accusations you've leveled at Thai men on your vacations? And you still haven't explained this apparent inner circle of Thais who decide what mere farangs get to hear about, and what they don't.

You've made some pretty fantastic claims here and you dance around explaining them. My initial impression is that you've got a little experience with Thailand, have read or heard about a few things here and there, and extrapolate that into being an expert and wise to the point that the inner circle of Thais are willing to take you into their confidence and tell you secrets that they keep hidden from the rest of the farang rabble.

Forgive me if I'm jaded but over the years I've read alot of posts from people who, lonely planet in hand, declare themselves as sages and try to advise people of far more experience about the ins and outs of Thai culture and society.

[cdnvic]

I should have waited... maddness says it so much more politely than I do

[SanukJoe]

As you keep being curious, ready to nail me down, I have been traveling to Thailand during the last 5 years, first year 4x holiday in Phuket with my (now) wife, then to the village, 4x a year for 5 weeks. Ok?

Not ready to nail you down Joe. But I would like to point out (because mainly of the patronising tone earlier to be honest) that maybe you are still a little naive as to what being accepted in the village really is and thinking you have access to information that other farangs don't might be a bit too arrogant considering many of us live here, speak Thai etc.

Despite your arguments with Neeranam earlier the guy has spent 13-14 years living here and most of that in a village so he has got some insights that are worth listening too, I've spent most of my adult life here as well, so though we may disagree about many things you can't discount our thoughts and experiences with yours so easily since you have hardly spent anytime here at all. Not being patronising or rude, just saying listen to others outside your village/circle of friends, you may learn a bit more. I certainly do from all the expats on this board. A wise man is humble.

You're absolutely right about that and I'm the first to listen to guys with more experience. Like I said, I'm hungry to learn, that's in me, so I love to learn. However what I cannot stand if people tell me I'm a liar or what I tell is not true. I'm very careful with giving information as I know how dangerous it is to give half information or rumours.

Wit Neeranam it distilled itself after he agreed on the point of 2 kinds of sin sot: traditional sin sot and money making sin sot. He was all the time generalising sin sot, later on it came out we mean the same, he just didn't separate it.

Some guys spend years in Thailand and still don't know anything. It's not about how long you stay here, it's about how much you learned in the time you are here. Some learn more in 2 years than others in 5 years, consider me as the first category, I learn fast and I want to learn. I can assure you that I learned a lot in the time I was in the village, giving me a basis to discuss items. Believe me, I'm not patronising and if it looks like it I'm sorry for that. In this thread I'm really upset about the lack of knowledge and the offensive language of those who are against paying sin sot. I wrote several times: respect each other! But they keep on insulting and shouting, based on lack of knowledge.

That's why I'm a terrier here, I defend my wife, who should never be called a prostitute, I defend Isaan women as they are highly discriminated, I defend Isaan province and culture as that is my area, my province and the culture I adopted.

Take care, if you ever come to Udon Thani let me know, we can meet and have one.

Joe

[HenryB]

I said it's reality that a new husband is allowed (takes the rig

I'm informed by the "inner" Thais, who would usually keep this for them. I'm priviledged to have been accepted by the people in my village, the advantage is that they tell me things they would never tell "just" farangs.

John and other's

Have they said anything about you joining local Mason Lodge. When I was living in a village in Lao the locals invited me to be a Mason. I now known more secrets they you however I can't tell them to bad for you

[jackmuu]

so you must be educated then.Can you please tell us exactly what sin sod means to you?

Yes, I am. Sin sod to me is a gift to the parents' of my wife, they can put this money away and it will be a form of pension for them in the future, but in reality, whatever they want to do with it then it is up to them. A gift / gesture, whatever you want to call it, it also allows them to see that I have the means to provide for their daughter in the future, after all, if someone wanted to marry my daughter and he couldn't lay his hands on a few thousand pounds then it would be a worry for me how he would keep her.

If I was on a Thai salary or an expat package then fine, I would not even consider to stretch myself too much for face, but my wife is well aware how much I get paid and to be honest I think I would be a meanperson not to pay such a dowry. I am sure the family will be very happy with the money and I am happy to give it.

Wife is an accountant so not exactly high society, but for those of you who say hi so don't do sin sod, my ex gf was a hi so Thai with government parents, and I was looking at a 2 million baht sin sod for that one. Now I did think that was excessive, however, 2 years ago a Thai friend of mine paid almost 2 million for his sin sod and I know a family (relatively poor) in Nakorn Phanom, where the husband (Thai) paid 200,000.

So as a well paid westerner I do not feel that 600,000 is too much.

[Mid]

I defend Isaan province and culture as that is my area, my province and the culture I adopted.

interesting ,

what happened to being a guest ?

[Donz]

so you must be educated then.Can you please tell us exactly what sin sod means to you?

Yes, I am. Sin sod to me is a gift to the parents' of my wife, they can put this money away and it will be a form of pension for them in the future, but in reality, whatever they want to do with it then it is up to them. A gift / gesture, whatever you want to call it, it also allows them to see that I have the means to provide for their daughter in the future, after all, if someone wanted to marry my daughter and he couldn't lay his hands on a few thousand pounds then it would be a worry for me how he would keep her.

If I was on a Thai salary or an expat package then fine, I would not even consider to stretch myself too much for face, but my wife is well aware how much I get paid and to be honest I think I would be a meanperson not to pay such a dowry. I am sure the family will be very happy with the money and I am happy to give it.

Wife is an accountant so not exactly high society, but for those of you who say hi so don't do sin sod, my ex gf was a hi so Thai with government parents, and I was looking at a 2 million baht sin sod for that one. Now I did think that was excessive, however, 2 years ago a Thai friend of mine paid almost 2 million for his sin sod and I know a family (relatively poor) in Nakorn Phanom, where the husband (Thai) paid 200,000.

So as a well paid westerner I do not feel that 600,000 is too much.

good for you son

[HenryB]

so you must be educated then.Can you please tell us exactly what sin sod means to you?

Yes, I am. Sin sod to me is a gift to the parents' of my wife, they can put this money away and it will be a form of pension for them in the future, but in reality, whatever they want to do with it then it is up to them. A gift / gesture, whatever you want to call it, it also allows them to see that I have the means to provide for their daughter in the future, after all, if someone wanted to marry my daughter and he couldn't lay his hands on a few thousand pounds then it would be a worry for me how he would keep her.

So as a well paid westerner I do not feel that 600,000 is too much.

I have seen the light you are right why stop at 600,000 try harder and give 6 million sin sod.

At 10 million I have sister please email for details.

[jackmuu]

so you must be educated then.Can you please tell us exactly what sin sod means to you?

Yes, I am. Sin sod to me is a gift to the parents' of my wife, they can put this money away and it will be a form of pension for them in the future, but in reality, whatever they want to do with it then it is up to them. A gift / gesture, whatever you want to call it, it also allows them to see that I have the means to provide for their daughter in the future, after all, if someone wanted to marry my daughter and he couldn't lay his hands on a few thousand pounds then it would be a worry for me how he would keep her.

So as a well paid westerner I do not feel that 600,000 is too much.

I have seen the light you are right why stop at 600,000 try harder and give 6 million sin sod.

At 10 million I have sister please email for details.

For 10 mil, I want twins...

[solo siam]

You ever been to a poor family? Being invited to have dinner? I did.

I was so embarrased as they had hardly food for themselves and I was eating there. I made it up silently by sending lots of food anonimously after that.

Sorry but no Thai family I have ever heard of, regardless of how poor they where had a problem with enough food - After all it's pretty easy to catch frogs, crabs, beetles etc... and rice costs next to nothing. If they invited a farang for dinner and had no food then it just doesn't make sense, why would any Thai lose face by purposely inviting a farang to dinner and not having anay food? why invite you? In regards to education, 65%+ of the villagers can't even read Thai, how could you even suggest that the rate of education in Bangkok is teh same as a village where by 12 years old most kids are expected to be looking aftre family, farming etc...

You should learn the difference between not any food and hardly any food. I meant they spent all they had on that day with me and my wife. Maybe you find it normal, I was embarrassed, I felt guilty. The way you talk about poor people gives me goose pimples, go away!

I didn't say the level of education in BKK is the same! Read and understand! I said poor villages is one word, uneducated people is another word, they even exist in BKK, which is true, ok?

You've been to all poor villages to know the percentage of people who cannot read thai? Maybe they speak Lao, Suay or Khmer. Remember that Lao is spoken by 19 million people in Isaan, so be careful with your unfounded remarks as an "expert".

The way you confuse no and hardly gives me the right idea about your skills.

Joe

READ not SPEAK, very different things.

Why would you feel guilty at being treated to a meal by someone?, regardless of if they where rich or poor - they wanted your company, they wanted you to share their food. It speaks more about you than me that this would embarrass you somehow, you talk about poor people as if they all need to be saved - whereas in my experience they often have quite a nice life - theres something to be said for living from day to day, eating what you catch and everyone sleeping under one roof - not worrying about where the next car payment or electricity bill is going to come in.

[scapegoat]

I defend Isaan province and culture as that is my area, my province and the culture I adopted.

interesting ,

what happened to being a guest ?

The guest became a daft <deleted>.

[jayenram]

I think this has gone on long enough.