Education Visa

[JBBKK]

Hi there, 

I've been in Thailand for quite a while now, doing visa runs by plane to places like Hong Kong and Singapore. However, when I recently landed at the airport, I was told that I had reached my maximum number of stays on a tourist visa. I was aware that I had been pushing my luck somewhat, but was at quite a loss when trying to figure out the exact rules regarding how many times this could be done. I was under the impression that if you were leaving and entering by plane and avoiding the usual places (Cambodia, Laos, etc) then you were fine to keep doing this. Furthermore, I never had any problem at Thai consulates when applying for the 2 month tourist visas or at Chaeng Wattana when applying for 30 day extensions. Unfortunately though, it seems my days are numbered (literally). 

I'd like to continue staying in Thailand and am thinking about applying for an education visa to study Thai. I've studied Thai in Bangkok in the past and, although I do enjoy it, I found the 4 hours per day, 5 days a week, plus homework, quite a heavy workload. The whole idea of me being here is to recover from an illness and to pursue some creative work I do at home. I wonder how strictly the regulations are enforced by different schools regarding the number of hours you study? I'm not looking to scam the system by not studying at all, merely to study with a bit of a lighter workload. I can already speak/read/write Thai to a reasonable level, so would probably satisfy any spot check by the ministry of education (I'm not sure if they actually do this or if it's just a myth?). 

Does anyone have any advice on this or any schools in Bangkok they would recommend I get in touch with? 

Summary: 

1. Looking for a way to stay on in Thailand after being told by immigration that I had exhausted tourist visa limit
2. Thinking of applying for an education visa to study Thai language
3. Am perfectly happy to study Thai, but looking for a lighter schedule than I had in the past. Part time would be ideal. 
4. Looking for advice/recommendations 

Thanks guys! 

JBBKK
 

[ubonjoe]

Have you been getting tourist visas from an embassy or consulate that allow a 60 day entry or have you been getting 30 day visa exempt entries.

[JBBKK]

Thanks for your reply Joe. I've had numerous 60 day tourist visas, followed by 30 days extension at Chaeng Wattana, all granted without comment or problem. Then I exited to Vietnam for a short holiday and came back on the 16th, hoping to get a 30 day visa exempt entry, the reason being that I only plan to be here for a couple of weeks before going to take care of some business in Hong Kong on the 28th of this month. I was referred to someone more senior at immigration on arrival at Don Muang, who clearly wasn't happy with all my stamps. My Thai gf was waiting for me and was called over by the immigration officer. We were told I would be let in but this was the last time and I should consider myself lucky that she was so kind. I was given the normal 30 day stamp but the officer made it clear that the information they had on the computer wasn't looking good for me and I shouldn't try to get in again as a tourist. She advised we get married so that I could get a marriage visa, which is easy for her to say but not quite the right time for us to take that step. The student visa seemed a better option, at least for the time being. 

[ubonjoe]

You were probably pulled to the side because of you were trying to do a visa exempt entry. The officer gets an alert when you have 6 of them.

Just get another tourist visa for your next entry. I advise you to have at least the equivalent of 20k baht in cash when you enter the country.

You could get a single entry non-ed to attend a Thai language school and then you would get 90 day extensions. To get the extension requires attending classes 2 hours a day 4 days a week. You must be enrolled in a course of study of 400 hours to get a total stay of one year.

[JBBKK]

 

Interesting. I do think you're right that trying the visa exempt entry is what did it, based on the fact that I've done countless tourist visa entries and never had a problem. I'm angry with myself now, but there didn't seem any point in getting the 2 month visa if I only wanted to spend a couple of weeks here. 

It would be great if I could just apply for a 2 month tourist visa in Hong Kong and get back in Thailand with that. However, the immigration officer did make it very clear that I shouldn't try to enter again as a tourist and suggested I would be denied entry or banned if I did. Are you aware of cases of people being granted 2 month tourist visas from an embassy abroad, then arriving with 20k baht or more in cash, but still being turned away due to too many stamps? And if the worst does happen and I get turned away, do you think it would result in some kind of ban? 

Really appreciate your help and advice Joe. 

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, JBBKK said:

Are you aware of cases of people being granted 2 month tourist visas from an embassy abroad, then arriving with 20k baht or more in cash, but still being turned away due to too many stamps? And if the worst does happen and I get turned away, do you think it would result in some kind of ban? 

The are have been a couple of topics about people being denied entry but it is rare. If you have the 20k baht to show and financial proof you are not working here you would not be denied entry.

You would not be banned because there  is no rule or regulation that could be used to do it.

[darrendsd]

OP avoid Airports and get your next SETV at Vientianne or Savannakhet (sp) you will have no problems in re entering over a land border

 

 

[Matt199]

I'm no expert, but I can't imagine that those warnings coming from IO are recorded in any way i.e. note in the system saying "don't let this guy in again" (?)

 

You could have a problem next time on a visa-exempt entry or not at all (no one can predict). As others replied already it's best to get SETV & have 20k baht or equivalent in major currency on you. 

 

One thing that I read in other threads is that having thai girlfriend helps. Have her at the airport waiting for you, or at least on dial so you can call her if problem arises again. 

 

[JackThompson]

9 hours ago, JBBKK said:

...when I recently landed at the airport, I was told that I had reached my maximum number of stays on a tourist visa.

There is no such rule, but some Immigration officials who control airports and the Poipet border crossing think such a limit should exist, and have been known to tell people arbitrary numbers of days, visas, etc.  They have told applicants that this is why they won't be let in, but then stamp a 'real' cause for denial of entry in the denied-person's passport - sometimes in direct contradiction to the facts at hand (had money, but the stamp says otherwise), and other times 'suspicion' without any evidence, and no way for the person denied to prove otherwise (don't "intend" to work illegally).  At the Poipet/Aranya crossing, they also believe the people with Multi-Entry Non-O visas should not be allowed to leave and return there, and have told those with these visas they "must fly in" to return. 

 

Since we foreigners cannot do anything about these particular cliques of IOs, the best strategy is avoidance - don't enter they country by air or use the Poipet/Aranyaprathet border crossing if you have a long-stay history here and intend to enter using a Tourist Visa or Visa Exempt entry.  Multiple-Entry Non-O visa holders should be OK by air (I would still carry 20K Baht worth of cash or travelers checks), but should avoid the Poipet/Aranya crossing.

 

Quote

I was aware that I had been pushing my luck somewhat, but was at quite a loss when trying to figure out the exact rules regarding how many times this could be done.

The only rules are those which are published as laws and police-orders.  There are none which limit how many days one can legally stay in Thailand on Tourist Visas, provided you abide by the terms of the visa (not working, overstaying, etc).

 

5 hours ago, JBBKK said:

... followed by 30 days extension at Chaeng Wattana, all granted without comment or problem

The authorities at Chang Wattana follow the laws as written.  For this reason, they are one of the best places to do any business with Immigration.  This applies not only to 30-day extensions, but 60-day extensions for married people, conversions of Tourist to Non-O, and for 1-year extensions.  Some other immigration offices may create "extra paperwork needed" problems for any of these services - documents not required at Chang Wattana and not shown in the official Immigration lists of required documents to apply.

 

9 hours ago, JBBKK said:

Am perfectly happy to study Thai, but looking for a lighter schedule than I had in the past. Part time would be ideal.

In order to increase payoffs from those who obtain these visas but do not study Thai, the rules were changed to increase the required hours/wk.  The cost to stay here a year on ED visas is now approximately 40K to 50K Baht/yr.  This should include a a package, available at some schools, which includes handling your "now more difficult" extensions for you.  We can figure some of that money goes to the same place as "agent" money, which thousands of foreigners use to get retirement or marriage extensions without meeting the financial requirements. 

 

These "extra fees" are often paid even by those who genuinely want to learn Thai and attend all their classes, just to avoid the stress of dealing with Immigration for extensions - a factor which depends on policies and attitudes which differ by the Immigration Office that serves the area where one lives.  Unfortunately, even where your local office is honest, you still must follow the new 2-hours/day 4-days/wk class-attendance rules - though you may be able to avoid the 'no hassle extension' fees.

 

As there is no "agent" system to be tapped for Tourist Visas, these visas are understandably unpopular with those who financially-benefit from the other schemes.