Family Immigration To The Uk

[manjara]

Hi,

I have been in Thailand as a representative of my company over the last year or so. They have finally got around to getting me a work permit, after being on a business visa for long enough!

Since I came to Thailand I have met and fallen in love with my Thai GF with whom I have recently had a baby. I am listed as the father of the baby and it has/will have my surname. Due to the pressures of work, our attempts to get married have never been completed and now we have the baby. We have lived together for over a year now, although there are no records which have both our names on them, I could get a dozen people to attest to it.

My GF also has a daughter (5 yrs) from a previous boyfriend (Thai) who lives with her grandparents.

I earn a good living and have a house in the UK, and sufficient funds in the UK to support her. I have also bought a condo in Bangkok in her name.

Assuming we do get married here, in the near term, what are the complications in getting UK nationality for my daughter and for getting settlement visas for my wife and daughter as well as (possibly) my stepdaughter?

Reading the website for the UK embassy it says that for children born out of wedlock nationality is discretionary, which scares me a bit!

[Richard W]

Assuming we do get married here, in the near term, what are the complications in getting UK nationality for my daughter and for getting settlement visas for my wife and daughter as well as (possibly) my stepdaughter?

Reading the website for the UK embassy it says that for children born out of wedlock nationality is discretionary, which scares me a bit!

Marrying your girlfriend will legitimate your daughter, and she therefore becomes automatically entitled to British citizenship. You will have three options for bringing her over - on a British passport, on a Thai passport with a certificate of entitlement to right of abode (in the UK), on a settlement visa with your wife. I can't comment on the hassle / cost merits of the three options. (I don' t imagine you would contemplate bringing your daughter home but leaving your wife behind.)

Your biggest problem will be bringing your stepdaughter over. Which grandparents is she with? There may be an issue over whether she has had 'sole custody' of her elder daughter. My feeling is that to make immigration more certain, she should be living with you and your girlfriend with, even if she is with your girlfriends' mother. If she's with her father's mother, you may have problems. There was a concession over that for children under twelve, they could come to the UK with either parent, but that has been withdrawn. The problem vanishes if you can prove that the father is dead or if you also have an EU nationality other than British (e.g. Irish) - you can then bring her over on an 'EEA family permit'. (You could bring them all over on a 'EEA family permit if you had this other nationality, but I think the settlement visa route is better.)

If you have worked abroad in EU, that might qualify your family for an EEA family permit.

[manjara]

Thanks a lot for the quick response.

My fiancees other daughter lives with her parents, in her house (not sure about the title laws in thailand, but I am told the house belongs to my fiancee).

When we registered the birth, she had to get some documents from here hometown, so I have a feeling that she is still 'registered' there. I have not been able to clearly determine this with her.

As far as EEA permit, I worked in Europe (ex UK) for about 6 years from 94-2000, since then I have been based in the UK until last March when I came to thailand.

My mother was Danish, but I never had dual nationality. I understand there was recently a precedent set in Denmark that a child with a Danish mother could claim citizenship without the usual required period of residency, however I would have to be in Denmark to claim it and it may not help anyway!

I feel a bit more reassured about the legitimation of my daughter as I thought that may have turned into a problem, but I am concerned that if we apply to go to the UK as a 3 person family, that may preclude my stepdaughter from coming to live with us at a later date, for example if my fiancees parents were to die (they are both around 65-70).

To be honest, we do not intend to settle in the UK for good, just for up to a couple of years until I can sort out my finances enough to return to Thailand without my current level of salary. However I know from other friends who have taken a similar route, that a couple of years can turn into 6-7 and before you know it, the kids are at Uni and demanding a car for their 21st. Maybe I should just go up North now and grow sticky rice for a living!

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Well grow rice anyway. Sticky is a way it is cooked. Go on in to the Embassy and talk over your situation with an immigration officer. Yours is a complex one, but solveable

[Richard W]

Hi,

We have lived together for over a year now, although there are no records which have both our names on them, I could get a dozen people to attest to it.

...

I have also bought a condo in Bangkok in her name.

Her bearing you a child and your living in her condo are evidence of a relationship! Is she registered as living in the condo? What address are you recorded as living at?

Well grow rice anyway.

Don't! It's a reserved occupation (prohibited work). Only Thais can grow rice.

I've frequently heard uncooked 'glutinous rice' called 'sticky rice'. After all, that's what ข้าวเหนียว means literally, and the sack in our pantry is labelled ข้าวเหนียหอม.

[somtaamgaiyang]

Your daughter automatically qualifies for a british passport. As for you girlfriend soon to be wife, as you seem to satisfy the financial requirements, you should be granted a "marriage" visa which will allow your wife to enter the UK.

This is usually valid for one year at which point you will return to the home office and they will grant her another longer term visa. This is to check if she disappears or not. Once you have the longer term visa, normally 3 years, she can then apply for a brit passport.

I am living here with a thai wife now, however, one of her cousins has been through this process with a bloke she met after he came here on holiday. I was a little surprised that they got thru the whole process so easily, but it can be done. Whether it has changed at all in the last 19 months I am not sure.

As for your step daughter, I am not sure, however, there is a lot of information about this on the home office/immigration dept and i remember reading that just about anything is possible as long as you convince the embassy that you are genuine and that all your papers are absolutely in order.

Bear in mind that if everything meets their requirements, they are honour bound to give the visa. Discretion is very rarely used if everything is in order.

rgds,

sgy

[hotshot]

Well....why not marry your GF? And then adopt her daughter?

Then they'll both for sure be granted a visa!

About the Danish possibility...well then you also have to deposit 50.000 Danish Kroner (appx. 300.000 Baht) to apply for your wife to join you. The Danish Immigration are hard to deal with!

[Richard W]

Well....why not marry your GF? And then adopt her daughter?

Then they'll both for sure be granted a visa!

I believe this would only serve to demonstrate sole custody. Thai adoptions are not recognised by the UK, and the UK www.ukvisas.com pages state that the UK will ignore an adoption carried out to get round the immigration rules. (It's a good job primary purpose has gone - many of us only married our spouses in the first place because that was the only way we could live together.)

I would have said that the best way to achieve this effect would be for the four of them to live together NOW.

About the Danish possibility...well then you also have to deposit 50.000 Danish Kroner (appx. 300.000 Baht) to apply for your wife to join you. The Danish Immigration are hard to deal with! 

I don't believe that what you say is relevant to this case. If they went to live and work in Denmark, the husband would go under the free movement of labour provisions, and the family would go under an 'EEA family permit' or its Danish equivalent. The latter is free (by EU law), and I don't believe Denmark can request a deposit from holders of EU non-Danish citizenships.

The Danish option we were discussing was for Manjara to acquire Danish citizenship and use that to bring his family to England. However, that would be a fallback if the stepdaughter were denied access under a malicious reading of the 'sole custody' requirement. If the four of them have been living together when they come to go to the UK, I would expect the Thai members of the family to be allowed in under a settlement visa.

Incidentally, UK settlement visas no longer require marriages, planned or actual. Cohabiting for long enough (two years, I believe) is now good enough. The key issue here is evidence that the cohabitation has lasted for the requisite period.