is it possible to live in thailand as long as you like this....

[Happy Grumpy]

4 hours ago, acenase said:

Yes it does guarantee entry.

Completely incorrect. 

[darrendsd]

4 hours ago, acenase said:

 

Yes it does guarantee entry. It is the Thai consulars job to decide if they will issue the Visa or not. If they issue the Visa it means you shouldn't have a problem.

 

If you are denied by IO, then that is called Corruption. 

 

The most they will ask you is to show proof of cash and flight ticket, which anyone should be able to provide. If you can't provide 20k in funds anyways, thats a big red flag and you shouldn't be traveling to Thailand with such limited amount of money anyways and deserve to be turned away.

 

You are totally wrong, having a visa DOES NOT guarantee entry into Thailand 

 

I have just seen the post above which confirms this

[jamieoutlook]

Thanks to all who posted correct and relevant info.

Now i have all i needed to know, and will proceed basically as i planned with visits to embassy's and will keep my 2 land border crossings as an ace up my sleeve.

ADD

Another query.

If one has a visa or a VE can you be refused an extention at imm office?

Or is this one automatic?

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, jamieoutlook said:

Another query.

If one has a visa or a VE can you be refused an extention at imm office?

Or is this one automatic?

They can be refused, but it's highly unlikely it would happen.

[acenase]

19 hours ago, darrendsd said:

You are totally wrong, having a visa DOES NOT guarantee entry into Thailand 

 

I have just seen the post above which confirms this

ONLY IF you DON'T have 20K in funds, you wont gain entry with a valid/un-used Visa.  

Or if you say something suspicious that makes them think you're illegally working. 

 

It is highly unlikey you will get denied entry otherwise. Stop trying to scare people. More times than not if they question you they will ask to provide them 20K in funds and/or a ticket out of Thailand and note that in your Passport. and there should be no problem at all.

 

Show me a time someone has ever been denied entry with an un-used, Valid Visa  and 20K in funds, and return ticket. If you get denied like that it is called CORRUPTION. Period.

Edited September 10, 2017 by acenase

[Tanoshi]

Just now, acenase said:

 Yeah if you have a Visa without 20K in funds you wont gain entry.

 

Show me a time someone has ever been denied entry with a Valid Visa and 20K in funds. If you get denied like that it is called CORRUPTION. Period.

When the IO considers you are spending to much continuous time in Thailand and suspects you are working.

He doesn't need proof, suspicion is enough reason to deny entry.

The onus is on you to prove otherwise.

[darrendsd]

1 hour ago, acenase said:

ONLY IF you DON'T have 20K in funds, you wont gain entry with a valid/un-used Visa.  

Or if you say something suspicious that makes them think you're illegally working. 

 

It is highly unlikey you will get denied entry otherwise. Stop trying to scare people. More times than not if they question you they will ask to provide them 20K in funds and/or a ticket out of Thailand and note that in your Passport. and there should be no problem at all.

 

Show me a time someone has ever been denied entry with an un-used, Valid Visa  and 20K in funds, and return ticket. If you get denied like that it is called CORRUPTION. Period.

Let me remind you of what you said in your first post

 

If you have an unused TV in your passport then you are already accepted to go back, because if they deny you, they would deny your application at Thai consular. If Immigration officer sees the valid Visa in your passport then you will gain entry.

 

You clearly state "you are already accepted to go back" 

 

This is NOT the case, Immigration not the Embassy decide if you are granted entry, what is so hard to understand about this?

 

Having a valid visa DOES NOT guarantee entry into Thailand, it even states this on the Thai Embassy website,

 

– The visa validity is the length of time you are permitted to travel to a port-of-entry in Thailand to request permission of the immigration officer to permit you to enter Thailand. The visa does not guarantee entry to Thailand.

sit.

– Each time you arrive at the port-of-entry, an immigration officer decides whether to allow you to enter and how long you can stay. Only the immigration officer has the authority to permit you to enter Thailand. 

 

 

Which part of "the visa does not guarantee entry into Thailand" do you not understand?

 

Having a valid visa DOES NOT guarantee entry into Thailand, Embassy's will still issue visas even if you are blacklisted from Thailand (as long as you have a new PP) but this does not mean you will gain entry does it?

 

If you wish to think that having a valid visa  does guarantee entry despite numerous people on here and even the Thai Embassy telling you otherwise then you really need to question your intelligence 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2017 by darrendsd

[KiChakayan]

2 hours ago, acenase said:

ONLY IF you DON'T have 20K in funds, you wont gain entry with a valid/un-used Visa.  

Or if you say something suspicious that makes them think you're illegally working. 

 

It is highly unlikey you will get denied entry otherwise. Stop trying to scare people. More times than not if they question you they will ask to provide them 20K in funds and/or a ticket out of Thailand and note that in your Passport. and there should be no problem at all.

 

Show me a time someone has ever been denied entry with an un-used, Valid Visa  and 20K in funds, and return ticket. If you get denied like that it is called CORRUPTION. Period.

Food for thought...

[elviajero]

 

1 hour ago, darrendsd said:

Having a valid visa DOES NOT guarantee entry into Thailand, it even states this on the Thai Embassy website,

 

– The visa validity is the length of time you are permitted to travel to a port-of-entry in Thailand to request permission of the immigration officer to permit you to enter Thailand. The visa does not guarantee entry to Thailand.

sit.

– Each time you arrive at the port-of-entry, an immigration officer decides whether to allow you to enter and how long you can stay. Only the immigration officer has the authority to permit you to enter Thailand. 

 

Which part of "the visa does not guarantee entry into Thailand" do you not understand?

You are correct that a visa doesn't guarantee entry, but if you are quoting the ThaiEmbassy.com website it proves nothing. That is not an official website. If not please quote the source as I've never seen an official statement.

 

The proof that a visa doesn't guarantee entry is the simply fact that IO's have the power to deny entry to anyone under Section 12 of the Immigration Act.

 

1 hour ago, darrendsd said:

... Embassy's will still issue visas even if you are blacklisted from Thailand (as long as you have a new PP) but this does not mean you will gain entry does it?

Although it is possible for someone that's blacklisted to get a visa, the Embassies do have access to such information so it's not a given, even with a new passport. They would not issue a visa to someone known to them to be blacklisted.

[darrendsd]

13 minutes ago, elviajero said:

 

You are correct that a visa doesn't guarantee entry, but if you are quoting the ThaiEmbassy.com website it proves nothing. That is not an official website. If not please quote the source as I've never seen an official statement.

 

The proof that a visa doesn't guarantee entry is the simply fact that IO's have the power to deny entry to anyone under Section 12 of the Immigration Act.

 

Although it is possible for someone that's blacklisted to get a visa, the Embassies do have access to such information so it's not a given, even with a new passport. They would not issue a visa to someone known to them to be blacklisted.

A quick Google search shows this from the Thai Embassy in Canada, I believe it's a official website?

 

Section 10

 

http://www.thaiembassy.ca/en/visiting-thailand/visas/general-visa-info

 

Of course Embassy's would not issue a visa to someone who was blacklisted if they knew they were blacklisted but how many actually check? For example Vientianne can get up to 800 applications a week, they don't check each one do they,

 

Vientianne is just a example by the way

[elviajero]

6 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

A quick Google search shows this from the Thai Embassy in Canada, I believe it's a official website?

Section 10

http://www.thaiembassy.ca/en/visiting-thailand/visas/general-visa-info

Yep, that would do it. Now you've got something official to quote.

[darrendsd]

3 minutes ago, elviajero said:

Yep, that would do it. Now you've got something official to quote.

Pretty amusing coming from yourself, well done 

[elviajero]

8 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

Of course Embassy's would not issue a visa to someone who was blacklisted if they knew they were blacklisted but how many actually check?

I was simply correcting your definitive statement that "Embassy's will still issue visas even if you are blacklisted from Thailand (as long as you have a new PP)". Having a new passport doesn't guarantee ("will still issue") anything. I agree, in most cases, it would. 

[BritTim]

37 minutes ago, elviajero said:

Although it is possible for someone that's blacklisted to get a visa, the Embassies do have access to such information

I believe that is incorrect. Immigration, of course, have that information, but (unless you can show a source that suggests otherwise) the Ministry of Foreign Affairs (under whose auspices the consulates operate) does not. Those generally regarded as reliable sources of information have stated this several times.

[elviajero]

23 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

A quick Google search shows this from the Thai Embassy in Canada, I believe it's a official website?

Section 10

http://www.thaiembassy.ca/en/visiting-thailand/visas/general-visa-info

It's on the MFA website too, which is where the Canadian Embassy is quoting from.

[darrendsd]

10 minutes ago, BritTim said:

I believe that is incorrect. Immigration, of course, have that information, but (unless you can show a source that suggests otherwise) the Ministry of Foreign Affairs (under whose auspices the consulates operate) does not. Those generally regarded as reliable sources of information have stated this several times.

I also believe that Embassy's do not have direct access to the Immigration database however I am more than happy to be proved wrong by Elviajero linking to a official website 

 

 

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

I also believe that Embassy's do not have direct access to the Immigration database however I am more than happy to be proved wrong by Elviajero linking to a official website 

They don't have direct access. The would have to contact immigration to find out and that might take a few day to do.

The delay is why they don't do it for visa applications.

 

[elviajero]

10 minutes ago, BritTim said:

I believe that is incorrect. Immigration, of course, have that information, but (unless you can show a source that suggests otherwise) the Ministry of Foreign Affairs (under whose auspices the consulates operate) does not. Those generally regarded as reliable sources of information have stated this several times.

I suggest you get those "reliable sources" to prove their statements too then. If you believe that there is no communication between Thai Immigration, the MFA, and Embassies you are wrong. Exactly what information is communicated to each Embassy, how up to date it is, isn't known by you, me, or your 'reliable sources'. The fact that Embassies can access 'the blacklist' is a fact!

 

 

[elviajero]

8 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

I also believe that Embassy's do not have direct access to the Immigration database however I am more than happy to be proved wrong by Elviajero linking to a official website 

I didn't say anything about "direct access". 

[BritTim]

3 minutes ago, elviajero said:

The fact that Embassies can access 'the blacklist' is a fact!

Source please. Not being argumentative, really wish to have this demonstrated.

[elviajero]

4 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Source please. Not being argumentative, really wish to have this demonstrated.

You are being argumentative, because you know there is no "source" to quote. Anyone can contact Thai Immigration to find out if a person is on the blacklist!

 

Read the thread. I was simply correcting the assertion from @darrendsd that a new passport ensures someone on the blacklist can get a visa. And all I said was that Embassies have access to the blacklist. 

[darrendsd]

13 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Source please. Not being argumentative, really wish to have this demonstrated.

Yes I would like to see a source also, always nice to see facts backed up by a official source, saves any misunderstanding 

[darrendsd]

5 minutes ago, elviajero said:

You are being argumentative, because you know there is no "source" to quote. Anyone can contact Thai Immigration to find out if a person is on the blacklist!

 

Read the thread. I was simply correcting the assertion from @darrendsd that a new passport ensures someone on the blacklist can get a visa. And all I said was that Embassies have access to the blacklist. 

I'm not sure if "anyone" can just contact Thai Immigration to find out if a person is on the blacklist?

 

Sure there are companies who will get you that info for a fee but anyone?

 

Are you saying that John Smith can contact Immigration to see if Jon Doe is on the blacklist and Immigration will just give out the info without question?

 

 

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, elviajero said:

You are being argumentative, because you know there is no "source" to quote. Anyone can contact Thai Immigration to find out if a person is on the blacklist!

 

Read the thread. I was simply correcting the assertion from @darrendsd that a new passport ensures someone on the blacklist can get a visa. And all I said was that Embassies have access to the blacklist. 

 

But not directly and it would take a few days.

So anyone with a new passport, no previous stamps and being issued a Visa within 20 minutes, has hardly been checked, so they would be issued a Visa, even if actually being blacklisted, which was the point being made by darrendsd.

[darrendsd]

3 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

 

But not directly and it would take a few days.

So anyone with a new passport, no previous stamps and being issued a Visa within 20 minutes, has hardly been checked, so they would be issued a Visa, even if actually being blacklisted, which was the point being made by darrendsd.

Exactly correct, thanks for reading my post correctly

 

Although to correct you most visas are not issued within 20 minutes they are issued next day which still isn't enough time to check unless Embassy's have direct access to the Immigration database 

[jeab1980]

Apart from my next statement i know nothing about regulations or orders or if diffrent departments talk to each other.

My brother for his sins belived he had been blacklisted however how he thought this or why i have no idea and really do not wish to know.

He contacted me two years ago asking if i would on his behalf enquire at my local immigration office if he was indeed black listed. I got him to write a letter and to give me power of Attorney. He did this i went to Immigration and enquired about it with one of the older Immigration officers who was outside having a fag. I didnt need the letter or power of Attorney just 2k. He returned outside about 45 mins latter armed with three A4 printed papers with my brothers details and dates ect of his teips to thailand totalling 5 years (back to 2010 last time he was here. Not blacklisted not even a warning as border hops were all the ragethen. 18 mth over stay before he left in 2010 paid his 20k and left he presumed wrongly he had been blacklisted.

So yes tom can get to see harry's info for a small contribution.

[Tanoshi]

2 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

Exactly correct, thanks for reading my post correctly

 

Although to correct you most visas are not issued within 20 minutes they are issued next day which still isn't enough time to check unless Embassy's have direct access to the Immigration database 

 

As the topic is about Tourist Visas, my quote to being 'issued within 20 minutes', was based on applications for Tourist Visas in one's own Country and not the wider spectrum of all Visas.  

[The manic]

On 02/09/2017 at 8:41 AM, urbanmoe said:

What is bar talk ? .

Serious?

[darrendsd]

1 minute ago, Tanoshi said:

 

As the topic is about Tourist Visas, my quote to being 'issued within 20 minutes', was based on applications for Tourist Visas in one's own Country and not the wider spectrum of all Visas.  

Fair enough, I have not applied for a visa in my home country for a very long time so was incorrect as to how long it takes

[darrendsd]

12 minutes ago, jeab1980 said:

Apart from my next statement i know nothing about regulations or orders or if diffrent departments talk to each other.

My brother for his sins belived he had been blacklisted however how he thought this or why i have no idea and really do not wish to know.

He contacted me two years ago asking if i would on his behalf enquire at my local immigration office if he was indeed black listed. I got him to write a letter and to give me power of Attorney. He did this i went to Immigration and enquired about it with one of the older Immigration officers who was outside having a fag. I didnt need the letter or power of Attorney just 2k. He returned outside about 45 mins latter armed with three A4 printed papers with my brothers details and dates ect of his teips to thailand totalling 5 years (back to 2010 last time he was here. Not blacklisted not even a warning as border hops were all the ragethen. 18 mth over stay before he left in 2010 paid his 20k and left he presumed wrongly he had been blacklisted.

So yes tom can get to see harry's info for a small contribution.

Fair enough, I stand corrected