No End In Sight As South Thai Rebellion Enters Fifth Year

[Jai Dee]

No end in sight as south Thai rebellion enters fifth year

Brutal killings have reached unprecedented levels in Thailand's Muslim-majority south, experts say, as the region enters the fifth year of a separatist insurgency that is tearing communities apart.

A government policy of reconciliation in the region has backfired, analysts told AFP, with rebels beheading, mutilating and even crucifying victims to try to spark a backlash and create divisions between Buddhists and Muslims.

"They kill in such brutal ways: beheaded, hacked to death, set on fire ... the idea is to provoke a strong reaction of the Buddhist Thais against Muslims," said Sunai Phasuk, a Thailand consultant with Human Rights Watch.

"The Buddhist Thais feel that they have become subject of atrocities, and many of them even feel that ethnic cleansing is going on."

The pace of deadly violence has picked up since militants raided a southern army base on January 4, 2004, reviving long-running tensions and triggering an insurgency along the border region with Malaysia.

About 1,800 people were killed in the first three years of the insurgency. By the end of the fourth that has now risen to more than 2,800.

The south was an autonomous Malay sultanate until Buddhist Thailand annexed it in 1902.

Former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's heavy-handed tactics were widely blamed for exacerbating the unrest in Yala, Pattani and Narathiwat provinces, but he was ousted in a military coup in 2006.

The generals and their interim premier Surayud Chulanont vowed to quell the insurgency with olive branches for rebels, an apology for past abuses, reform of Islamic schools and tougher security.

Instead, they watched as killings grew more frequent and brutal, with both Buddhists and Muslims targeted every day.

An average of 72 people have been killed each month since September 2006, sharply up from 53 deaths per month before the coup, figures from independent monitoring group Intellectual Deep South Watch show.

"Nothing gets better. Everybody is living in fear, both Muslims and Buddhists," said 37-year-old Aeda E-tae, a Muslim food seller in Yala, who has become distrustful of her own customers.

Jan Taeng-on's son was shot dead by insurgents last year, and the 55-year-old Buddhist says she has never seen so much bloodshed.

"It's very scary -- militants have threatened me. They want all Buddhist Thais to move out, otherwise we will get killed," she told AFP.

Because the government's peace-building rhetoric was not backed up by soldiers' actions on the ground, analysts say that instead of suppressing the violence, rebels took advantage and stepped up attacks.

Human rights abuses -- including detention without charge of Muslim suspects and reports of torture during interrogation -- have also continued, heightening Muslims' mistrust of the government.

Buddhist Thais, meanwhile, feel they have been abandoned by the state.

"They failed to protect the Buddhists and they failed to prove to the Muslims that there can be justice for Muslims, so the Surayud government failed on both sides," said Sunai.

Also hampering efforts to resolve the conflict is its murky nature. No one has claimed responsibility for the attacks, or made any explicit demands.

"While some in the insurgent community have indicated that they are interested in dialogue with the Thai government, it remains unclear the extent to which they can claim to speak for the vast majority of the insurgency," said Joseph Liow, from Singapore's S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies.

Thai army spokesman Colonel Acra Tiproach conceded that the 2007 death toll was high, but said he thought violence would ease in the coming year.

"This year has the highest death toll because they have to counter our aggressive operations," he told AFP.

Others, however, are not so optimistic.

An election on December 23 looks set to return Thaksin's allies in the People Power Party (PPP) to government.

"If PPP come into power and somehow fail to learn the mistake of the Thaksin government, then we might see a bloodier south than it is already," said Sunai.

Dorloh Sengmasu, 56, a Muslim village chief, told AFP he had mortgaged his land to buy weapons to protect himself and the village from rebels.

"I have no hope with government measures. It's already four years, but things get worse day by day," he said.

Source: AFP - 04 January 2007

[Jai Dee]

Yala prepared for retaliation against insurgents

The Deputy Governor of Yala, Mr. Kritsada Boonrat (กฤษฎา บุญราช), says the local villagers earlier notified the officials in Yala province that the southern insurgents could be plotting to ambush police and military officers in four tambons of Muang district. The four tambons include Lam Mai, Lam Paya, Pron and Lidol.

Mr. Kritsada has ordered all personnel at all state offices in Yala to be careful and prepared for immediate retaliation against the southern insurgents. He says the insurgents recently lost their ringleader and two other gunmen following the clash with the authority, and they could be planning to carry out surprise attacks as an act of retribution.

Furthermore, the Deputy Governor of Yala says the provincial police officers have seized more than 30 hand grenades in tambon Lidol.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 04 January 2008

[jbowman1993]

I pray every night for a peaceful resolution to this terrible conflict, that affects to many innocents. People are so quick to point out that these people committing these crimes are extremists, but the one thing I don't hear is a loud condemnation from moderate Muslims. If the violence is being done by extremists, why aren't they condemned more by the leaders of Islam.

My opinion - Islam is not the religion of peace, that is professes to be. I'd love to be proved wrong, but the beheadings, and the silence from Islamic religious leaders are proving otherwise.

[Jai Dee]

Southern Discomfort: Thailand's Insurgency Enters Year Five

Narathiwat, Thailand. Friday, 4 January, marks the 4th anniversary of the start of the insurgency in Southern Thailand. To date, more than 2,700 people have been killed, 8,000 wounded. There have been more than 850 bombings, and many more failed or aborted bombings, including six bombs on New Year’s Eve in the border town of Sungai Golok, that wounded 32. There have been more than 600 arson attacks, including well over 250 schools. Militants have assassinated nearly 1,400 people. The death toll includes 133 soldiers, more than 150 police, nearly 1,300 civilians, roughly 70 teacher, five monks, 210 headmen/local officials, and more than 40 government officials and civil servants. Militants have beheaded more than 35 people, and there have been almost twice the number of attempted or botched attempted decapitations. The arson attacks on schools and murder of teachers has led to the shutdown of the education system in the deep south for months at a time. Buddhist communities have been cleansed from the countryside.

By June, at the peak of the violence, an average of five people a day were being killed, making the conflict in southern Thailand the single most lethal conflict in Southeast Asia. In late June, the Thai military, in response to attacks with larger IEDs that were killing a record number of Thai soldiers, launched its own “surge,” Operation Southern Protection, and has stepped up a more aggressive counter-insurgent campaign.

Without a doubt, the daily rate of killing has fallen by half. Yet the “surge” is problematic for two main reasons. First, rather than assigning troops from the 1st and 3rd Armies (which hail from different regions of Thailand) to augment 4th Army troops spread across the provinces of Narathiwat, Yala, Pattani and Songkhla, the plan is to assign each army a province. Thus the newly deployed troops will have no local operating experience, network of contacts or any language skills. Even with the increase in the number of troops, they are barely visible in the south, confined to barracks and rarely out on patrol.

Second, the military has stepped up an aggressive campaign of arrests, roughly 2,000 in 2007, alone, but the violence continues. While some militants are clearly being detained, as evident in the decline in violence, mass arrests are usually counter-productive, and are fodder for the militants. Most of those arrested are released after 28 days due to insufficient evidence, often exacerbated by poor cooperation and intelligence sharing amongst the police and military. The insurgents often recruit those who are released. Few if any leaders have been detained in these sweeps.

Other problems involve the rampant use of poorly armed and trained, and often very ill disciplined paramilitary forces. They have appalling human rights records, often kill innocent civilians, but yet, their deaths are not a cause for alarm by the Thai Army brass, they are cannon fodder.

Yet the real problem in countering the insurgency has been the government’s unwillingness to confront the true nature of the militants. For years they were dismissed as drug dealers, criminals, doped up teenagers. August bodies such as the National Reconciliation Commission refused to label the militants as either secessionists or religiously motivated. The 19 September 2006 coup leader, general Sonthi Boonyaratglin, refused to see any religious ideology in the insurgency.

Analysts have often noted that no group has publicly claimed responsibility or stated their position or goals. They do, but in a very primitive manner: leaflets. The leaflets fall into several broad categories: threats to the Buddhist community, often to leave the region - either collective or individual; “Beware of harm” documents addressed to the Muslim community, outlining what they have to do to not get killed or in trouble with the militants; directives to village headmen; reportage of facts that reveal violence towards the Muslim community by security forces that go un-reported in the Buddhist-centric national media; and editorial cartoons. These leaflets routinely state their goal of establishing an independent Islamic state (Pattani Darulislam), their vehemently sectarian agenda, and their desire to establish Islamic institutions. But few bother to collect or analyze these leaflets, and few Thai officials take them seriously.

While analysts such as Peter Chalk, have noted that the insurgents have failed to get a broader base of support from the local population, such analysis ignores two key points. Of course they haven’t tried to win a broader base of support from the local community. They are Islamist militants, who seek to cleanse their community of shirk, bida, and murtad leaders who hold back the implementation of the sharia. Only then will the Muslim community be strong enough to take on the Thai state. To date over 55 percent of their victims have been fellow Muslims. They are more Islamist than their constituency and are systematically eliminating political rivals or moderates who seek accommodation with the Thai state. At the same time, they seek to destroy secular institutions and force people, often at great inconvenience, into parallel social networks that they control. They are not Maoist insurgents trying to establish a broad united front.

Second, despite the fact that the insurgents do not have mass support, neither does the Thai state. Their abusive policies, mass arrests, reliance on death squads, overt protection of Buddhists but not Muslims and overall failure to prevent the violence, has alienated the local population. They get little meaningful support from the local Muslim community that identifies itself first and foremost as Malays or Muslims than they do Thai. People in the south have little trust or faith in the Thai state.

And sadly, even with the restoration of democracy with last month’s elections, there is likely to be any change in the south. For one thing, the violence remains geographically contained, in the south, and the Bangkok-centric political elite cares little of what happens outside of the capital. During the election, no party made the south a prominent issue or came up with any new ideas or policies for ending the insurgency. Second, the south remains one of the two strongholds of the opposition Democrat Party (the other being Bangkok). With the likely government run by the People’s Power Party (PPP), the reincarnation of ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra’s Thai Rak Thai Party which was disbanded in May 2006, there is likely going to be much in the way of bipartisanship. The PPP’s victory in the polls was a humiliation for the military, which sought to invalidate Thaksin and the legacy of the Thai Rak Thai. The PPP has pledged to not punish the generals for the September 2006 coup, and will likely continue to let the military run its campaign in the south without much political interference.

The Thai insurgency remains the most violent conflict in the region, with no end in sight. It remains a low priority for Bangkok, the locus of inter-agency infighting, and an intelligence failure. The conflict clearly has the potential to grow both in scope and lethality as it enters year five.

Source: Counterterrorism Blog By Zachary Abuza - January 2, 2008

[HobbsTheFerociousTiger]

More proof that Thaksin was right after all. The scum needs to be taken care of once and for all.

[Scott]

The problems in the south are tragic, but they also reflect the overall state of the Thai gov't. The level of corruption, the weak enforcement of laws, the lack of independently functioning institutions such as the Courts, exacerbate the problems in the South. It isn't only in the South that the police are hated, feared or completely distrusted--it's pretty much nationwide.

When you add these problems to the obvious Bangkok-centered nature of the gov't, you get problems.

The strong support for Thaksin in the North and Northeast is further weakening the established power elite and as they try to 'control' this, there will be less resources for the South.

[sriracha john]

New government urged not to use force against insurgents

Academic: Current strategy is the best way to fight them

The elected government will have to stick to the current strategy of using only peaceful measures in dealing with the southern violence if it wanted to reassure Muslim countries that it was in favour of a peaceful solution to the region's problems, said an academic yesterday. Samart Thongpheu, a political scientist at the Prince of Songkhla University in Pattani, said the new administration must demonstrate its determination to solve the problems in the southernmost provinces in a peaceful way to gain the sympathy of Muslim countries. ''The (new) government will have to show the Muslim world that it too was not in favour of settling the region's problems through the use of force if it wanted to look good in their eyes and win their confidence,'' he said on the website of Deep South Watch, an independent agency monitoring the southern situation.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/06Jan2008_news06.php

[jumnien]

It seems odd that you would approach men who behead buddhist monks and elderly folks on a regular basis with anything other than violence. I suppose you could politely ask them to cut down on the head removal if it doesn't inconvenience them, but I don't think that will solve the problem.

[jts-khorat]

Until Thailand relinquishes its claim to sovereignty over the Southern provinces the violence will continue.

This remark is utter nonsense; nobody in his right mind is #really# hung up on an issue where even the grandparents have no real-life experience any more. This was 1902 for gods sake!

This is the same as if I as a German would say, 'let's get back the borders from 1880, including Kenya and Togo' or a British guy dreaming of getting back the 'Empire' because it was so 100 years ago.

That Thailand annexed this piece of land 100 years ago is now used for political propaganda reasons, but nobody would be incensed over the fact in itself.

That Malaysia of course finances their little borthers in faith on the other side of the border, well, that might have much more weight than dusted and old stuff form the history books.

So, as long as nobody stops Malaysia to give money for bombs and guns, the violence will continue. Sounds more true to me...

[Gravelrash]

I think when you consider how many islamic insurgencies have ended peacefully that the soft approach really is a pipe dream. Also it would seem that the violence stakes have been raised to the level that even if islam moderates agreed to a compromise the hard line would continue anyway. And believing the moderates would turn in the fanatics in the name of peace is a fantasy.

And for those suggesting the Thais hands back the south to Malaysia, consider the likelihood of the USA handing a few states to Mexico, or Australians setting up an Aboriginal state. States don't don't give up territory easily. I suppose all those that live in the south and are happy to be Thai would love that idea, let alone the massive loss of national face.

The south will probably fester along until something too vile to ignore occurs and a government decides to take off the gloves completely.

I find it interesting that the response cannot offend the delicate sensitivities of Islamic organisations or countries, even though they observe the atrocities carried out by their brethren without batting an eyelid.

[apetley]

I have commented before that I can't help thinking of parallels with what was once the situation in Northern Ireland.

Over the years the violence there got steadily worse, hatred from each 'side' for the other became more intense and this was all despite huge numbers of troops in the province and for some time a shoot to kill policy of the 'known' players. It solved nothing.

What worked was dialogue between all those involved, political and paramilitary.

Nothing will be solved in the south of Thailand by further oppressing an already downtrodden majority. Maybe now some of the politicians in Bangkok realise this and if they ever get back into parliament can begin the dialogue.

Maybe they can try some form of devolved government in the south. It has helped immensely in Northern Ireland but it does not happen overnight.

It takes vision and moral courage on both sides of the religious divide, something that has been sadly lacking in recent years.

[Briggsy]

Some posters are under the mistaken opinion that the goal of the insurgents is to have the southern provinces annexed to modern-day Malaysia. Nothing could be further from the truth. The stated goal of the various groups repeated in numerous studies is to set up an Islamic state of Pattani. The borders would include not only the Muslim majority areas but also Satun and all of Songkhla province. The last thing they want to do is join a sectarian Malaysia. And Malaysia wouldn't want them.

[seonai]

The way I see it is that the southern Muslim Thai people are mainly a bunch of quiet, lovely people but there are some amongst them who want to raise issues of not being treated as proper citizens in Thailand. And in recent years there are young, perhaps, extremists who want to fight for a state of

Pattani or whatever. BUT one has to remember that a huge %age of the Buddhist police force and the army in Thailand have been told to fight these guys and regain control in the south. A lot of the Muslim fighting comes from the fact that the Buddhist (ha ha) police and army have oppressed these Muslims for years and now the young are fighting back.

I am not saying any one party is right but just presenting two sides of the story.

I hate violence of any sort and I don't care a hoot about religion per se but this is a serious problem that won't go away and needs to be discussed properly

[geriatrickid]

I think we all have a good idea at what's driving the recruiting here. Lots of idle youth with limited economic opportunities. It breeds anger, resentment and disillusionment with the status quo. When you are 16 -21, which is the average age of most of the bombers, you are susceptible to notions of righteous causes, particularly when there is nothing that counters such sentiments. Sadly, just as intellectually challenged people are recruited to carry out suicide bomb attacks in Afghanistan, Iraq and Gaza, it's happening in the south as well.

The more one hammers on the situation, causing collateral damage to non implicated parties, the more the resentment is fed. The central government had a disjointed effort at times, and only this year has come to the realization that what is needed is targeted and pinpoint accuracy. That's why that old general that crushed the communists back in the 70's was dragged out of mothballs and put back to work. Give him time along with the general staff to work with the population to identify the key people and then watch the results as they dispose of them. It's a tough job and requires patience.

Where the strategy may fail is if the quiet time that will result is squandered. The targeted actions must be accompanied by specific investment to provide the necessary economic opportunities and to give the kids that are being exploited something else to do. The terrorists understand this and that is why they are doing their utmost to murder anyone and everyone that can deliver those opportunities, with special emphasis on teachers, public health workers and government service employees.

In a magical world we could simply vaporize those foreign nations that have been inciting these problems, but we can't. So until then it's a proxy war against the people that we indirectly fund through our addiction to oil, with the unfortunate victims being the local population which doesn't want the violence.

[Jai Dee]

Gunmen killed religious teacher in Yala

Insurgents with 9mm handguns gunned down an Islamic religious teacher in the southern border province of Yala last night (January 6th).

The murdered teacher was indentified as Mr. Hirae Dorloh (ฮิเระ ดอเลาะ), aged 38. The unidentified gunmen shot dead Mr. Hirae in front of his residence in Raman district of Yala province last night.

Mr. Hirae was an Islamic religious teacher in one of the ponoh schools in Raman district. The police believed the insurgents were plotting to create another unrest situation in the restive South.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 07 January 2008

[Jai Dee]

Seven police officers arrested for allegedly spying for Muslim insurgents

Pattani - Seven police officers have been arrested for allegedly spying for Muslim insurgents in the three southern border provinces, a well-informed police source said Monday.

The source said the seven officers were arrested following the arrest of three army intelligence officers.

The source said the seven police offices and three army officers were suspected of providing all details of operations to Muslim insurgents.

The seven police officers have been being detained and interrogated at the army base in Pattani.

All of the ten officers are Muslims.

Source: The Nation - 07 January 2008

[h90]

I pray every night for a peaceful resolution to this terrible conflict, that affects to many innocents. People are so quick to point out that these people committing these crimes are extremists, but the one thing I don't hear is a loud condemnation from moderate Muslims. If the violence is being done by extremists, why aren't they condemned more by the leaders of Islam.

My opinion - Islam is not the religion of peace, that is professes to be. I'd love to be proved wrong, but the beheadings, and the silence from Islamic religious leaders are proving otherwise.

all that religions which belive that there is one god and only their god is the right one, not just the muslims

[sriracha john]

As to Thailand's claim of sovereignty over the region remaining the major factor, in 2005 a Commission was set up for National Reconciliation. Its findings were to be implemented by the Thaksin Government, however the Privy Council intervened with Prem stating "We cannot accept that (the recommendations) as we are Thai. The country is Thai and the language is Thai... We have to be proud to be Thai and have the Thai language as the sole national language".

REALITY CHECK:

The entity that was empowered to actually do something and for whom the Report was created for was... The Government.

This was the group that was actually in a position to implement the recommendations. The Government's Reaction was....

The Nation / Published on Jul 21, 2006

NRC report needs a government worthy of it

A valuable set of recommendations on the deep South remains shelved as PM focuses on his own political survival

The problem with the current caretaker Thaksin government is that it no longer cares about anything except its own political survival. The Cabinet and the entire state bureaucracy are now geared toward ensuring that Thai Rak Thai leader Thaksin Shinawatra maintains power at all costs. So, when the National Reconciliation Commission (NRC), which Thaksin himself appointed, completed its report last month, the government simply shelved it without even bothering to pass comment on the contents, let alone trying to implement some of the recommendations it contained.

The beleaguered leader showed his true colours - that he does not care about improving the situation in the strife-torn deep South. It is an open secret that he has exploited the conflict in the region to his own advantage all along.

We sympathise with NCR Chairman Anand Panyarachun and his 48-member commission who painstakingly put together the report on the conflicts in southern Thailand. Admirably, they made it a point to come up with a well-balanced report that also contains doable recommendations. The report is the first of its kind in Thai history to explore ways to heal a centuries-old conflict through reconciliation, peace and justice.

Anand was right in saying that there is no hope that Thaksin will take this report seriously. That explains why the rest of government organisations remain cool to the recommendations. But such a genuine effort should not be wasted because any sensible government in the future would certainly look into some of the worthy recommendations in this report and put them into practice. It is better to have a government that truly believes in reconciliation and peace to implement the report than having a demagogic one pretending to care.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Nation / Published on Jun 12, 2006

What chance of reconciliation in the South?

The report of the National Reconciliation Commission (NRC) on the southern violence is possibly the most important product of the second Thaksin government and potentially a milestone in a long and now very ugly conflict.

Thaksin was reported as "not very interested". Deputy Prime Minister Chidchai Vanasatidya said his eyes were too tired to read it. Commentary was minimal.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

U.S. Department of State - Thailand Country Reports - 2006 / Published March 6, 2007

In June the NRC released its final report and recommendations. The NRC determined that the violence in the South stemmed from economic and cultural factors, as well as from "unconstrained abuses of administrative power" and "injustices arising from the existing judicial process and administrative system." The NRC further determined that religion was not the cause of violence but that it was used as a justification by some militants to "legitimize their violent methods." The report offered a wide range of recommendations for the government to address the problems in the South and promote reconciliation including: passage of an act that would create administrative mechanisms to unify government strategy and strengthen civil society; establishing an unarmed community security force composed of civilians, military, and police; engaging in dialogue with militants; and encouraging the government to "deal decisively with state officials against whom abuse-of-power complaints have been made." The Thaksin government acknowledged receipt of the report, but took no actions specifically to address NRC recommendations.

Edited January 7, 2008 by sriracha john

[sriracha john]

As if things weren't complicated enough in the region.... we have police.... working for the insurgents...

Thai police officers arrested for spying for insurgents

BANGKOK -- Seven Thai police officers and three army intelligence men have been arrested for allegedly spying for insurgents in Thailand's three southernmost provinces, local news network The Nation reported on Monday.

The network quoted a southern well-informed police source as saying that the seven officers were arrested following the arrest of three army intelligence officers.

The source said the seven police offices and three army officers were suspected of providing details of operations to insurgents.

The seven police officers have been being detained and interrogated at the army base in Pattani Province.

According to the newest statistic, more than 2,800 people have been killed during the past three years in Thailand's southernmost provinces of Narathiwat, Yala and Pattani. All the three have been troubled with insurgency-related unrest since early 2004.

- Xinhua

[sriracha john]

As to Thailand's claim of sovereignty over the region remaining the major factor, in 2005 a Commission was set up for National Reconciliation. Its findings were to be implemented by the Thaksin Government, however the Privy Council intervened with Prem stating "We cannot accept that (the recommendations) as we are Thai. The country is Thai and the language is Thai... We have to be proud to be Thai and have the Thai language as the sole national language".

REALITY CHECK:

The entity that was empowered to actually do something and for whom the Report was created for was... The Government.

This was the group that was actually in a position to implement the recommendations. The Government's Reaction was....

The Nation / Published on Jul 21, 2006

NRC report needs a government worthy of it

A valuable set of recommendations on the deep South remains shelved as PM focuses on his own political survival

The problem with the current caretaker Thaksin government is that it no longer cares about anything except its own political survival. The Cabinet and the entire state bureaucracy are now geared toward ensuring that Thai Rak Thai leader Thaksin Shinawatra maintains power at all costs. So, when the National Reconciliation Commission (NRC), which Thaksin himself appointed, completed its report last month, the government simply shelved it without even bothering to pass comment on the contents, let alone trying to implement some of the recommendations it contained.

The beleaguered leader showed his true colours - that he does not care about improving the situation in the strife-torn deep South. It is an open secret that he has exploited the conflict in the region to his own advantage all along.

We sympathise with NCR Chairman Anand Panyarachun and his 48-member commission who painstakingly put together the report on the conflicts in southern Thailand. Admirably, they made it a point to come up with a well-balanced report that also contains doable recommendations. The report is the first of its kind in Thai history to explore ways to heal a centuries-old conflict through reconciliation, peace and justice.

Anand was right in saying that there is no hope that Thaksin will take this report seriously. That explains why the rest of government organisations remain cool to the recommendations. But such a genuine effort should not be wasted because any sensible government in the future would certainly look into some of the worthy recommendations in this report and put them into practice. It is better to have a government that truly believes in reconciliation and peace to implement the report than having a demagogic one pretending to care.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Nation / Published on Jun 12, 2006

What chance of reconciliation in the South?

The report of the National Reconciliation Commission (NRC) on the southern violence is possibly the most important product of the second Thaksin government and potentially a milestone in a long and now very ugly conflict.

Thaksin was reported as "not very interested". Deputy Prime Minister Chidchai Vanasatidya said his eyes were too tired to read it. Commentary was minimal.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

U.S. Department of State - Thailand Country Reports - 2006 / Published March 6, 2007

In June the NRC released its final report and recommendations. The NRC determined that the violence in the South stemmed from economic and cultural factors, as well as from "unconstrained abuses of administrative power" and "injustices arising from the existing judicial process and administrative system." The NRC further determined that religion was not the cause of violence but that it was used as a justification by some militants to "legitimize their violent methods." The report offered a wide range of recommendations for the government to address the problems in the South and promote reconciliation including: passage of an act that would create administrative mechanisms to unify government strategy and strengthen civil society; establishing an unarmed community security force composed of civilians, military, and police; engaging in dialogue with militants; and encouraging the government to "deal decisively with state officials against whom abuse-of-power complaints have been made." The Thaksin government acknowledged receipt of the report, but took no actions specifically to address NRC recommendations.

Yes John, the Thaksin administration was instructed not to implement the findings of the Commission by the Privy Council.

Please provide some verification of that. Thank you.

Edited January 7, 2008 by sriracha john

[Jai Dee]

Seven police on spying charges

Seven police officers were arrested yesterday on espionage charges for allegedly supplying intelligence information - together with three military officers arrested earlier - to militants in the deep South.

The seven officers were detained for questioning in a military compound in Pattani.

Authorities believe there might be other higher-ranking officers involved in the case, according to Police Colonel Phumphet Piphat-phetphum, Yala's Muang district police chief.

Previously authorities had detained and interrogated Lt-Colonel Adul Alatae, a member of the Fourth Army Region's Intelligence De-partment, Command Sergeant Major Sulaiman Suanil and a civilian, Aran Sriprachon.

It was claimed that the seven police officers had spied on military operations and supplied intelligence to militants.

Officials had closely monitored the movements of these officers for some time after a detained militant said he got a tip-off about military operations from senior officials in the Army.

Information about military operations since 2004 was found in computers belonging to the head of a militant cell, Phumphet said.

Lt-Colonel Adul and Sergeant Sulaiman have wide connections among police and civilian officials in the deep South, and most of those contacts are Muslim officials, he added.

Since the beginning of 2004 violence in the predominantly Muslim region has killed more than 2,700 people.

The authorities have failed to contain the insurgency as they do not know about the movements of the militants, who seem to know much about the movement of security officials. Militants have successfully attacked and ambushed military and police units on many occasions, while officials have been unable to prevent or bring an end to the cycle of violence.

In a typical incident, a roti vendor was seriously injured in a gun attack in front of a school in Yala's Muang district at lunchtime yesterday. One of two men on a motorbike fired at Ong-art Bounsri, 28, three times before riding away.

Source: The Nation - 08 January 2008

[sriracha john]

Yes John, the Thaksin administration was instructed not to implement the findings of the Commission by the Privy Council.

Please provide some verification of that. Thank you.

I already did in my earlier post.

"We cannot accept that (the recommendations) as we are Thai. The country is Thai and the language is Thai... We have to be proud to be Thai and have the Thai language as the sole national language". - Prem Tinsulanonda on behalf of the Privy Council

The comment was directed at the NRC's suggestion that Malay should be used as a working language to encourage reconcilliation in the region.

"The NRC, chaired by former prime minister Anand Panyarachun, had proposed in its final report that was submitted to government on June 5 that using Malay as a working language could help to reconcile people in the region, the majority of whom are ethnic Malay."

http://nationmultimedia.com/2006/06/25/hea...es_30007268.php

From a generalized personal comment on a solitary issue of the report's recommendations, it has become the "Privy Council insisting that the Government not implement any recommendations?" That's a bit of a .... errrrr... stretch.

The article you quoted, however, does contain the passage:

Thaksin Shinawatra's government vowed to adopt many of the NRC proposals but has not yet move to seriously implement any so far.

which re-inforces the multiple other quotes above that the Thaksin administration did nothing with the expert-Commission that they themselves appointed.

Also, nothing about how the government was instructed not to do so by the Privy Council.

To assume that it was all to be taken by the Government as some unspoken innuendo from Prem's personal opinion (no where does it say he was speaking for the entire Privy Council, btw)... is too much of an assumption, which is why I asked for something to link to what you are inferring.

Edited January 8, 2008 by sriracha john

[younghusband]

Yes John, the Thaksin administration was instructed not to implement the findings of the Commission by the Privy Council.

Please provide some verification of that. Thank you.

I already did in my earlier post.

"We cannot accept that (the recommendations) as we are Thai. The country is Thai and the language is Thai... We have to be proud to be Thai and have the Thai language as the sole national language". - Prem Tinsulanonda on behalf of the Privy Council

The comment was directed at the NRC's suggestion that Malay should be used as a working language to encourage reconcilliation in the region.

"The NRC, chaired by former prime minister Anand Panyarachun, had proposed in its final report that was submitted to government on June 5 that using Malay as a working language could help to reconcile people in the region, the majority of whom are ethnic Malay."

http://nationmultimedia.com/2006/06/25/hea...es_30007268.php

From a generalized personal comment on a solitary issue of the report's recommendations, it has become the "Privy Council insisting that the Government not implement any recommendations?" That's a bit of a .... errrrr... stretch.

The article you quoted, however, does contain the passage:

Thaksin Shinawatra's government vowed to adopt many of the NRC proposals but has not yet move to seriously implement any so far.

which re-inforces the multiple other quotes above that the Thaksin administration did nothing with the expert-Commission that they themselves appointed.

Also, nothing about how the government was instructed not to do so by the Privy Council.

To assume that it was all to be taken by the Government as some unspoken innuendo from Prem's personal opinion (no where does it say he was speaking for the entire Privy Council, btw)... is too much of an assumption, which is why I asked for something to link to what you are inferring.

I am afraid that "evidence" in this case is rather more than linking to English language press articles, in any event often startlingly unreliable.Nobody disputes that the Thaksin administration was criminally incompetent in the South, and that the Junta's puppet government - despite a promising start - has failed to have an impact on the problem.Equally anyone familiar with the mindset of traditional Thai elite thinking (notwithstanding progressive thinking from statesmen like ex-PM Khun Anand) would understand the resistance to adaptation of Yawa as an official language (along with Thai) in the Southern provinces.One lives in hope for some intellectual rigour and honesty on this subject, but realistically one will not find it from the juntophiles.

[sriracha john]

To keep it specific on the matter at hand, is there any evidence in any form in any language to the specific question posed?

Edited January 8, 2008 by sriracha john

[Jai Dee]

10 insurgents arrested in Yala after 10-minute gunfire

Police, military and security forces have arrested 10 insurgents after both sides clashed for over 10 minutes in Bannang Sata district of Yala province. The officials have also seized explosive materials from the culprits.

Earlier today (January 8th), a group of insurgents opened fire at the police, army and security officials, and the gunfire took place for more than 10 minutes. Following the clash, all officials were unharmed, but the gunmen decided to run off. At the moment, 10 of them have been found and arrested together with their explosive devices and weapons.

The captured insurgents were taken to a military camp in Nong Jik district of Pattani province for further interrogation.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 08 January 2008

[sriracha john]

To keep it specific on the matter at hand, is there any evidence in any form in any language to the specific question posed?

The Thaksin government vowed to implement the recommendations. However, the recommendations were vigorously opposed by Prem Tinsulanonda, the President of King Bhumibol Adulyadej's Privy Council, who stated "We cannot accept that [proposal] as we are Thai. The country is Thai and the language is Thai... We have to be proud to be Thai and have the Thai language as the sole national language"

www.bookrags.com/Anand_Panyarachun

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, upon receiving the NRC report, has agreed to the plan and assigned deputy PM Gen.Chidchai Wannasathit , to implement the NRC’s proposals immediately if possible while the private sectors question the possibilities of 1. Making Yawi a second language 2. Set up unarmed, joint peacekeeping forces 3. Allow Sharial Law and 4. Support the negotiations and dialogues.

Privy Council chairman Gen Prem Tinsulanonda, on June 25, rejected the NRC’s proposal on using Yawi as a second official language citing the US as an example, despite the fact that a number of languages are widely spoken there, English is the sole official language. This idea was confirmed by Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra when he said, on June 26, that Thailand’s official language must be Thai only, although the use of other languages would be promoted.

Thank you for your efforts, but still nothing that Privy Council directed the Government to not implement the Commissions' recommendations.

What we have above are words, without ANY action EVER, by the Government to implement the plan...

and Prem voicing his own personal opinion on the Commissions' findings, without any reference that he directed the Government to follow his own personal opinion.

Still, thank you for trying.

Edited January 8, 2008 by sriracha john

[younghusband]

To keep it specific on the matter at hand, is there any evidence in any form in any language to the specific question posed?

The Thaksin government vowed to implement the recommendations. However, the recommendations were vigorously opposed by Prem Tinsulanonda, the President of King Bhumibol Adulyadej's Privy Council, who stated "We cannot accept that [proposal] as we are Thai. The country is Thai and the language is Thai... We have to be proud to be Thai and have the Thai language as the sole national language"

www.bookrags.com/Anand_Panyarachun

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, upon receiving the NRC report, has agreed to the plan and assigned deputy PM Gen.Chidchai Wannasathit , to implement the NRC’s proposals immediately if possible while the private sectors question the possibilities of 1. Making Yawi a second language 2. Set up unarmed, joint peacekeeping forces 3. Allow Sharial Law and 4. Support the negotiations and dialogues.

Privy Council chairman Gen Prem Tinsulanonda, on June 25, rejected the NRC’s proposal on using Yawi as a second official language citing the US as an example, despite the fact that a number of languages are widely spoken there, English is the sole official language. This idea was confirmed by Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra when he said, on June 26, that Thailand’s official language must be Thai only, although the use of other languages would be promoted.

Thank you for your efforts, but still nothing that Privy Council directed the Government to not implement the Commissions' recommendations.

What we have above are words, without ANY action EVER, by the Government to implement the plan...

and Prem voicing his own personal opinion on the Commissions' findings, without any reference that he directed the Government to follow his own personal opinion.

Still, thank you for trying.

Talk about changing the goalposts when you have lost the argument.Nobody said anything about a Privy Council direction.The point made was relating to Prem's clear rejection of Yawi as an official language.The subject has already been covered on this forum back in 2006 when Plus, while acknowledging Prem's rejection of the NRC proposal, quite correctly put me right on Thaksin's position which I had misunderstood to be favourable to the proposal.There's nothing controversial about this except perhaps to the unreconstructed juntophiliac.

[sriracha john]

Talk about changing the goalposts when you have lost the argument.Nobody said anything about a Privy Council direction.

For those with reading difficulties, original statement in question reprinted in bold and red.

Yes John, the Thaksin administration was instructed not to implement the findings of the Commission by the Privy Council.

Please provide some verification of that. Thank you.

Still remains without verification. Next?

Edited January 8, 2008 by sriracha john

[younghusband]

Talk about changing the goalposts when you have lost the argument.Nobody said anything about a Privy Council direction.

For those with reading difficulties, original statement in question reprinted in bold and red.

Yes John, the Thaksin administration was instructed not to implement the findings of the Commission by the Privy Council.

Please provide some verification of that. Thank you.

Still remains without verification. Next?

Do you have any remote idea of how these things are done at the Thai policy level? On the evidence, not at all. The key point is Prem's clear rejection of Yawi as a working language.As far as I know,though this is not the major issue, Privy Council minutes are not available for farang visa runners' perusal.Actually it probably wasn't even minuted.

[sriracha john]

So then, a simple request to provide verification for a huge and suspicious assumption that is stated goes unverified.

It could have simply been answered with a brief "no," but instead it's dragged out over an entire day of lengthy posts... with the end result being "no."

There is no "key point" other than the statement above *in bold red* that was questioned. If a clarification for any otther key point was sought, it would have been asked.

Thank you for your invaluable contributions.