rabo

AGAIN ----- This thread is about Will Interpol Act? ---- Aljazeera and the foreign press reports suggest that it is indeed likely that Interpol will act.

More garbage from you. Interpol released a statement yesterday (Friday) saying that they have not even received a request from the Thai government (oops!) and they also said that they will not act on politically motivated charges.

Terrorism charges are different since terrorism is defined as a crime often of a political nature. There was a post earlier in this thread cut from an interpol website stating that acts of terrorism can never be justified or moderated on political, religious, etc., grounds.

Saturday , May 29 , 2010

An open letter to Interpol from a Thai PhD in politics and international relations in UK

NTERPOL

General Secretariat,

200, quai Charles de Gaulle

69006 Lyon

France

28 th May 2010

Dear Sir/Madam,

The Thai Criminal Court has issued an arrest warrant for Thaksin on terrorism charges .........

<snip, full article above>

16 th April 2010: Red shirts bomb attacks at three high voltage electricity pylons in Ayuthaya's Bang Pa-in district were intended to plunge parts of Bangkok into darkness. See http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/security/3...lackout-averted (breach of item 2 as above-listed). On the same day , two high-ranking officers were taken hostage by Red Shirt protesters. See http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/world...i-1225854613652 (breach of item 3).

continued http://blog.nationmultimedia.com/ThaiTalk/2010/05/29/entry-1

All right! He explains the pylons. This one act is near conclusive prove that the whole show was planned from the start, including the assassination of army commanders and shooting of a 100 soldiers on April 10. If all 7 bombs had detonated, nothing would have been recorded that night. Probably the biggest oops of all by the reds.

Right in line with the reds destroying video cameras and shooting out street lights before the crackdown.

'Livinginexile' wanted to see videos of dudes with automatic assault rifles. This is one. They exist. Clearly you can see - it is not only the army or the security forces that are equipped with such kind of weapons, there are also the unknown forces that fire around with assault rifles. The dude in the video is probably one of the terrorists who shot and kill the people.

Ok. Thanks for your explanation. It is certainly plausible.

There are other equally plausible explanations for that video. It was announced multiple times publicly that the government had placed undercover 'spies' amongst the redshirts. If one of those military spies was doing recon and scouting, it would make sense that he would meet a team of soldiers to lead them to a suitable location for an operation. In this case he would need to carry weapons for protection while working with the uniformed soldiers. Later he would discard his weapons and blend back in with the demonstrators to do further recon work.

Part of the the problem is that we see many video clips, but they are without context. The camera can only point to one place at a time and so we are left guessing as to what the real circumstances were. This forces us to speculate. This speculation will lead most people to make conclusions that are in line with their own biases. I am including myself here too. It is an undeniable fact that two rational and highly intelligent people will look at the same evidence and come to very different conclusions.

A random single image out of context, accompanied by false information and an unsubstantiated claim that a person is "probably one of the terrorists who shot and kill the people". This is used to counter without logic another person's valid point that there are many images and videos of of unidentified gunmen.

Note as far as can be seen in this quality video:

1. The mystery guy is wearing baggy spotted camouflage like pants, not shorts, image is black and white.

2. He does not fire a gun.

3. The soldier he is with fires a rubber bullet shotgun weapon down the street, his M16 is at his side.

4. No evidence of live rounds being fired.

So, a white tee shirt is enough to incriminate someone as a terrorist. He is probably just a soldier who's lost his shirt, maybe his lady stole it last night as a souvenir.

Left, first soldier as he progresses, right first and second soldiers coming out the door (what's inside???)

I don't want to use the word propaganda, so I'm at a loss for words to describe this.

If Abhisit would just return to his country of birth and stay there, Thailand could go forward with its long, long reconciliation phase. With the waters polluted with the hi-so hate-speech of Abhisit, Kasit and others, nothing good can happen.

And if so, who is going to help reconcile the society? The man who spent billions teaching them to hate for his own corrupt good? The man who taught them how to burn down cities?

I for one think that a little Western thinking might be just what the doctor ordered. I agree thought that I don't particularly like Kasit, I think they need someone much more professional as FM, maybe someone young and better educated.

Thank God Interpol hasn't been so irresponsible as to give in to weird demands from a third world nation where freedom of speech is barred by the constitution,

Wrong, Thailand does have free speech provisions. Under Thaksin's regime, freedom of the press was squeezed so badly that the Bangkok Post started printing the relevant provision on the top left corner of the front page as a protest.

Please don't make throw away remarks about things you know nothing about.

Thailand currently ranking on 130. of 175 countries on the Press Freedom Index compiled and published by Reporters Without Borders

because in previous years the total number of countries in the list vary lets also compare the Notes/score Thailand got. a lower note indicated more freedom

Year/ note / rank

2009: 44.00 130. of 175 countries

2008: 34.50 124. of 173

2007: 53.50 135. of 169

2006: 33.50 122. of 168

2005: 28.00 107. of 167

2004: 14.00 59. of 167

2003: 19.67 82. of 166

2002: 22.75 65. of 135

http://en.rsf.org/spip.php?page=classement...d_rubrique=1001

Anyway, the right of freedom if the media is part of the constitution. but this is now heavy violated by the current government in power. it has become more worse than under Thaksin.

PS: Please don't make throw away remarks about things you know nothing about. that is something you should obey yourself.

Btw. did you found in the meantime the article about the 'politically motivated case' and Interpols position about it?

edit: added a PS

I won't comment about rsf.org except to say there may be more objective ratings, including Freedom house, the longest and most respected organization for rating press freedoms. They tell a slightly different story. Second, a single ranking is not a good indicator, consider a perfect world where all press is completely free, except for Singapore, , there is little meaning to a ranking of 199/200. See ratings by year here.

http://freedomhouse.org/template.cfm?page=359

Most interesting is that in the late 90s, Thailand was a bright star of press freedom in the region, rated as one of the only 30 some percent of countries with a free press.

By 2004, it is rated as only partially free, but still above all its neighbors, especially countries like Vietnam and Singapore.

Also see world audit, as another. http://www.worldaudit.org/press.htm Thai=85/150 Sing=112 China=138 N. Korea=150

Note, in Suchinda's time, the press was not free at all yet even during the crackdown, papers like the Nation and the unmentionable, which were fiercely against the government at the time, refused to close and printed papers with large blanked out areas to show where the government had censored information.

It was the reds that methodically destroyed or covered up the surveillance cameras throughout the city. The government methodically shut down more radical internet sites, but note that an internet site can lie, cameras don't. For the most part, the government left the media alone, even if it was from pragmatism.

Let's be more objective.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Note: Some empty space trimmed from quoted areas, empty logic left in place.

(not surprising in THailand's current climate of fear)

Current climate of fear?

Care to expand on that?

need some graphic photo of a red shirt protester executed with a head shot by an army sniper?

or read about the arrest of people without any clear evidence:

Chula academics call for "return of justice and academic freedom"

Graphic photo of soldier with part of arm blown off by M79 grenade attack? A picture of the lady who happened to take the BTS at Saladaeng at the wrong time? Back off !

I like the earlier pictures of power pylons blown up with C4 and RPGs targeting jet fuel depots myself, easy to understand terrorism. Throwing out a single image of a red guy getting it as prove of something kind of insults the audience's intelligence.

The "yellows" are not "elite" for the most part. The yellow shirt movement represents far more than just a few families that have power. (The red shirts represent the same type of power families as well -- by the design of who set them up in the first place. The rural poor and people with little understanding of the political situation in Thailand thinking that it is a grass-roots peasant movement notwithstanding. This includes organizations like CNN and BBC etc.) The yellows represent the burgeoning middle-class which is a relatively new demographic in Thailand. They are not just a "few."

The only way forward, seems to me, to be crushing the elite controlling group funding the reds --- AND ---- adopt much of the issues that belong to the legitimate (politically and humanitarily) reds that need and deserve a government that listens to them and attempts to provide for them. The rural poor deserve better schools, better welfare systems, more access to creating positive change in their lives. This was NEVER part of TRT or Thaksin's plan. Thaksin is a traditionalist when it comes to Thai politics and culture. He created a patron/client system with him handing out the rewards to those that voted for him. He bought local political machines like Newin and others in the way that such deals have always been done here.

As a respite from these tired platitudes (whether lies or ignorance is difficult to say), here's an intelligent independent viewpoint:

Criteria for terrorism charges are loose, restrictions on civil liberties tight. The violent immediacy of the Red Shirt protests has dulled in the aftermath of eighty-eight dead, but the country's mood still hangs dark. Thailand's democratic façade is chipping away to reveal an ugly autarchic underside.

To top off the recent weeks' extrajudicial killings in Bangkok's streets, the government heightened charges against an already-exiled former premier and dubiously detained a Chulalongkorn University lecturer this Tuesday. Two Red Shirt-affiliated foreigners were arrested Wednesday.

[snip long article, read above ......]

Clearly intelligent and clearly not independent, but professional. Without knowing who wrote it I would guess maybe a Thaksin lawyer but not Amsterdam. There are roughly 100 innuendous words against the "system" and not even a mention of burning, along with near complete omission of wrongdoing on the part of the red organization. Anyone who uses the crazy brit calling for arson and looting as evidence of oppression has a loose screw, or takes his propaganda work seriously.

A reprise form red/yellow? Think not, maybe an escalation. But it is tiring.

The definition of terrorism in this article makes it pretty clear that PAD's seizure was an act of terrorism. 18 months and still not one arrest warrant has been issued. The investigation has been almost 100% complete for more than a year now.

I mean, please try and check the facts before posting, that way you won't impress people as being uninformed.

They have indeed been arrested ...and released shortly after on bail. Since then, the verdict on Sondhi has been delayed 8 times for the reason that he's always on holiday on the date that they set for the verdict. What a coincidence, huh? He should play the lottery, such a lucky guy.

And no, that's not a joke. Look it up, it's true.

And by the way, they didn't just seize the airports in Bangkok and government house, but also airports all around the country:

30,000 protesters, led by the People's Alliance for Democracy, occupied Sundaravej's Government House compound in central Bangkok, forcing him and his advisers to work out of a military command post. Thai riot police entered the occupied compound and delivered a court order for the eviction of protesters.[43] Chamlong Srimuang ordered 45 PAD guards to break into the main government building on Saturday.[44] 3 regional airports remain closed and 35 trains between Bangkok and the provinces were cancelled. Protesters raided the Phuket International Airport tarmac on the resort island of Phuket Province resulting to 118 flights cancelled or diverted, affecting 15,000 passengers.[45]

Protesters also blocked the entrance of the airports in Krabi and Hat Yai (which was later re-opened). Police issued arrest warrants for Sondhi Limthongkul and 8 other protest leaders on charges of insurrection, conspiracy, unlawful assembly and refusing orders to disperse.

Now, put yourself in the shoes of Sondhi here for a second and tell your people to break into the WhiteHouse, remain in there for 8 months, then tell them to take over JFK and LaGuardia airports, then send another group to take over Los Angeles, Dallas and Miami airports.

Of course you would be released on bail shortly after your arrest, the FBI wouldn't dare to arrest you. And the judge would of course allow you to go on holiday for the 8th time just as the verdict is supposed to be read.

There is some good to this point, but .......

If a US president was impeached or otherwise removed for massive and obvious corruption, violations of human rights resulting in 1000s of deaths, silencing the media, usurping power by ignoring the other powers of government, and illegally selling all the national space assets to foreign powers....

and after removal his people came back to power through voter fraud....

those that protested as you describe might well be treated with greater leniency than Sondhi and his crew.

(meaning Thaksin is screwed on the world stage, to quickly revert to the threads topic)

The photo shopping in Paris where taken by another customer in the store. than it made it to the frontpages in Thailand. 'Thaksin exposed'. Do you think that was a set up by Thaksin, 'leaked' by his PR team? same as the death rumours and so on? so hat the evil master mind has an alibi?

The "international community" of patrons of the beer bars in thailand maybe think it is proven that he is the terrorist. for them Thaksin could do whatever, they always will twisted somehow that he is guilty of everythink.

get real.

Am real, but not invested in the story.

If you believe such trite, oh, just a passer by snapping a photo that now becomes his lawyer's main line of defense, then I have some websites for you to read.

Edit: bold portions of quotation highlighted by poster for emphasis and to maintain quotation in context.

his lawyers main line of defense? where did you get that from?

about the photo:

A Thai residing in Paris was quoted as saying that on 15 May, her Malaysian friend had caught and taken a few photographs of Mr Thaksin while shopping with one of his daughter, Ms Paethongtan, in the mentioned shop in a relaxing mood. The lady said her friend was trying to take more photos of the ex-premier but had been obstructed by his guards.

18 May 2010 (NNT)

http://thainews.prd.go.th/en/news.php?id=255305180009

Cybercitizens have attacked former ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatara on web boards as photos of him shopping in France spread like wildfire on the internet.

The pictures, taken by a Thai expat residing in France showed Mr Thaksin shopping in a Louis Vuitton shop in France's upscale shopping avenue, Champs-Élysées. Mr Thaksin was seen to be smiling, in the store with his daughter Praethongtan Shinawatara. The photos were taken on 15 May 2010 and the National Broadcasting of Thailand (NBT) was the first to retrieve the images.

19 May 2010 (NNT)

http://thainews.prd.go.th/en/news.php?id=255305190022

and you are now saying that the photo and the 'news' about his shopping tour in Paris made it to the Thai TV, the newspapers and the internet 10 days ago was all well planned by Thaksin himself so that he has an alibi for the upcoming terrorism charges?

and you have websites? cool!!! have a link too? please post, i like lunatic conspiracy theories.

I like cats. Now that you are a born again internet believer suggesting we should just believe that which we read, from the very same article comes this----

Meanwhile, Mr Thaksin Shinawatara's financial accounts have been frozen by the Center for the Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES) as he is linked to being a major funder of the United Front of Democracy Against Dictatorship (UDD) demonstrations in the Thai capital since late March 2010.

Good article or not?

How much weight his "disappearance" - which sparked his "death" rumours - will have on the international stage remains to be seen.

Hello?

Wasn't there a lot of photos of Thaksin posted on his facebook page, twitter comments and even a video with reporters in Montenegro. Thaksin telling the public where he is and what he does at the moment.

But the photos where declared to be products of photoshop, the video must have been from long time ago, twitter statements fake and so on and so on. you could read about it in The Nation.

Why do you think Thaksin was doing that? Quite an effort. Especially taking a shopping trip to Paris precisely before the burning of Bangkok began. Now he's telling the international community "See, I was in Paris shopping, so, I'm innocent". Less than one in a million Westerners will buy such arguments.

The photo shopping in Paris where taken by another customer in the store. than it made it to the frontpages in Thailand. 'Thaksin exposed'. Do you think that was a set up by Thaksin, 'leaked' by his PR team? same as the death rumours and so on? so hat the evil master mind has an alibi?

The "international community" of patrons of the beer bars in thailand maybe think it is proven that he is the terrorist. for them Thaksin could do whatever, they always will twisted somehow that he is guilty of everythink.

But the real international community, the sober state official, diplomats and media dudes aren't so easily convinced by this silly logic of the arguments and conspiracy theories and bar talks of the true thailand 'experts'.

get real.

Am real, but not invested in the story.

If you believe such trite, oh, just a passer by snapping a photo that now becomes his lawyer's main line of defense, then I have some websites for you to read.

Edit: bold portions of quotation highlighted by poster for emphasis and to maintain quotation in context.

My point exactly. Most everyone here has burnt there birdges to there home country. As for you working here since your mid twentys. I feel sorry for you. But it is your choice. Not to have a retirement and if things go wrong you are screwed. You have nothing to go home to. As with 99% of all farang that live here. What a bunch of bumb asses in my opion. I live here and with no rights i say who gives a shit. If i had rights then ok. I will be vocal about them and try to change things.

But since I do not and every farang does not have rights here. If you come here for a life and burn all your bridges you are one bumb ass.

Thailand is not a place to put all your eggs. If you do then you are stupid.. Plain and stupid.

If they change the laws. Which will not happen. Then i would buy property here and think about perminent retirement. But IF you come here and have nothing and no rights and then complain about what is happening because if it does implode you will be forced to go home to nothing. I think is just crazy.

It is your prerogative to view life this way.

However, I and probably many other foreigners who live and work in Thai society may well have more influence than many Thais. Thais have a lot of respect for foreigners who have come to understand their ways and can talk with them rather than at or about them.

So I can't vote. Half of the population in the West doesn't bother to vote.

How much weight his "disappearance" - which sparked his "death" rumours - will have on the international stage remains to be seen.

Hello?

Wasn't there a lot of photos of Thaksin posted on his facebook page, twitter comments and even a video with reporters in Montenegro. Thaksin telling the public where he is and what he does at the moment.

But the photos where declared to be products of photoshop, the video must have been from long time ago, twitter statements fake and so on and so on. you could read about it in The Nation.

Why do you think Thaksin was doing that? Quite an effort. Especially taking a shopping trip to Paris precisely before the burning of Bangkok began. Now he's telling the international community "See, I was in Paris shopping, so, I'm innocent". Less than one in a million Westerners will buy such arguments.

Foreign Governments and courts will decide if Thaksin is handed over to Thai Courts, But you only have to look at the countries he clings to ,Montenegro, Cambodia etc. not exactly bastians of upholding the law. Interpol are insignificant in this.

What is wrong with Montenegro?

Thaksin was recently spotted also in France, Sweden, Russia, UAE and reported to travel to the UK.

Meanwhile Interpol called Thaksins conviction in the conflict of interest case "politically motivated".

And the charges brought up against him after last years military 'clean up' of the red shirts protest on songkran didn't made Interpol to move on or any any foreign country to extradite him.

Do you expect that the 'foreign opinion' will change after the death of so many red shirt protesters in the last two month?

Yes. Westerners are anesthetized to body count, they read that every day, but the attempted destruction of major cities will get their attention. Something most people have never seen, except maybe the World Trade Center disaster, the New York one I mean, not the Thai one. Still it's not a shoe in but the equation has changed.

heres a little copy and paste from interpol.... now do they stand by their claims? is another story all together... but pretty much goes along with the situation:

REITERATES that criminal acts intended or calculated to provoke a state of terror in the general public or in a group of persons or particular persons for political purposes, cannot be justified under any circumstances, irrespective of considerations of a political, philosophical, ideological, racial, ethnic, religious or other nature that may be invoked to justify them;

That is certainly clear. A crime committed to terrorize for political purposes cannot be justified on any political grounds.

Probably why Thaksin said it doesn't apply to him, it's what he fears the most.

In the many hours that I spent around the fighting and protests I never witnessed any tension or hostilities between the protesters and the ambulance personnel -- they were shoulder to shoulder like brothers in arms. I have video footage on the night of May 14th at Soi Rangnam where Vajira Hospital medical personnel attempted to rescue a dead person and being shot at multiple times, taking great risk, but made it out. On the very next day a person from the same Hospital crew was shot in the head and killed by the army, I believe in the same location. It seems to be an indication of media manipulation to say that Reds and Army "alike" were anti-medical personnel. Apparently this is a lie to cover up the truth.

Somtumtiger and hammerred, your comments show your lack of honesty as well as where your loyalty lies, duly noted.

Did you see the soldier who sighted his rifle and shot the person in the head? How far away was he? I do not ask as a propagandist demanding absolute proof, you are certainly entitled to you opinion that soldiers may have shot someone. I only ask because it is such a critical question. I would really like to know. I find it hard to believe the Army would be behind such systematic killing of so many rescue workers. If there is more than circumstantial evidence I think it should be clearly stated. If it seemed to be the soldiers, without proof, that too should be stated.

Same same. Don't be so 1 sided.

Did you see a red-shirt who sighted his rifle and shot the person in the head? How far away was he? I do not ask as a propagandist demanding absolute proof, you are certainly entitled to you opinion that red-shirt may have shot someone. I only ask because it is such a critical question. I would really like to know. I find it hard to believe the red-shirt would be behind such systematic killing of so many rescue workers. If there is more than circumstantial evidence I think it should be clearly stated. If it seemed to be the red-shirts, without proof, that too should be stated.

I never made such a statement, but chantorn, your English is impeccable.

I see Tony is trying to play the semantics game on page one. In Thailand the official reading of the charges and indictment happen when the suspect is taken into the court for the first time. The suspect must be present.

The warrant itself with substatiating evidence listed (not presented) is enough for extradition for trial. Tony is trying to make a case for the extradition of a convicted fugitive and this is not the case. The matter at hand is the extradition of a wanted criminal. Any state can request that and it does NOT require more than the warrant.

Interpol will be in a tricky situation should they fail to work with the Kingdom's government in this case as there is the possibility that the Kingdom will refuse to aid them in the future. Granted, Interpol has screwed up several cases here in Thailand in recent history and has a bit less credibility due to that.

They may chose (Interpol) not to help in facilitating an arrest but I rather doubt that. Helping with extradition? Who knows if the Kingdom actually WANTS Thaksin extradited to Thailand?

I'm sure that Interpol would be quaking in their boots if Thailand threatened not to aid them anymore!

Get real. Thailand has no clout in the world whatsoever

Quite the contrary, I would guess they have more pull than most because Thailand is a favorite destination for the criminal minded and others on the run. They also have a good record of cooperation.

Its still a bit early in the game to be making any claims, no? for starters.. There has been nothing released regarding the financial transactions to the red shirt leadership, but its pretty much gauranteed that several groups have made such transactions, unless you honestly believe that the group was self supporting ... As any semi consious person could draw the conclusion that thaksin was the majority supporter, but at this point in time its all speculation. But the financiers will be exposed in the weeks to come....

We all know the score here, and I for one am not saying that Thaksin did not give money to the boys in Bangkok, we know he did but the government has to prove it, the prosecution needs real evidence but hearsay is not evidence, well, certainly not in a court of law in the west.

Interpol in their wisdom will take all this into account before reaching a decision, and will most certainly see that the charge of terrorism is not only politically motivated but a way to get Thaksin. They will see the government here is "using" the "law" simply as a means to capture their political rival.

The knowledge and information available at TV is astounding, don't know why I didn't join earlier.

On a technical point, I think "politically motivated" implies that the accused did not commit the crime in question and the charge is bogus. It does not mean the accused committed the crime while he was involved in a political squabble. Burning down major cities is not a legal response to a political problem.

In the many hours that I spent around the fighting and protests I never witnessed any tension or hostilities between the protesters and the ambulance personnel -- they were shoulder to shoulder like brothers in arms. I have video footage on the night of May 14th at Soi Rangnam where Vajira Hospital medical personnel attempted to rescue a dead person and being shot at multiple times, taking great risk, but made it out. On the very next day a person from the same Hospital crew was shot in the head and killed by the army, I believe in the same location. It seems to be an indication of media manipulation to say that Reds and Army "alike" were anti-medical personnel. Apparently this is a lie to cover up the truth.

Somtumtiger and hammerred, your comments show your lack of honesty as well as where your loyalty lies, duly noted.

Did you see the soldier who sighted his rifle and shot the person in the head? How far away was he? I do not ask as a propagandist demanding absolute proof, you are certainly entitled to you opinion that soldiers may have shot someone. I only ask because it is such a critical question. I would really like to know. I find it hard to believe the Army would be behind such systematic killing of so many rescue workers. If there is more than circumstantial evidence I think it should be clearly stated. If it seemed to be the soldiers, without proof, that too should be stated.

1. You take the best lawyer, who is willing to take the case, I think many may not be willing.

2. You take the best lawyer that you perceive to be the best, who is willing to take the case.

3. With equal legal effort, the best lawyer can not erase the truth of the matter.

4. Thailand has more to spend than Thaksin, especially if the terrorist charge helps to freeze T's overseas money.

Reading Amsterdam's resume, I don't see a top notch lawyer, more like a Madoff of the legal world.

Number 3 is the most important point you make and the point that most seem to be missing.

As for Thaksin's defense that it was all politically motivated ----

"Yes, that's right sir. I killed them and burnt down the capital because they threw me out for corruption."

"Yes, that's right sir. I am from Thailand. I was a politician."

Interpol will make decsions based on technical legal reasons not politics. It will be a time in coming as first certain things must go through the Thai legal system and then be passed on. This isnt something that interpol will decide on today based on what newspapaers, a single Thai police officer, a government spokesperson, Amsterdam or Thaksin say and they also wont be influenced by any of that. It will depend upon the papaerwork being done correctly and the evidence and critically the financial evidence.

some people on here seem to think interpol will get him because he said they won't, a bit sad really, some people have been in thailand too long and think the thai way of doing something is the same in the civilised world They forget that in the west rule of law is observed and it is observed based on hard evidence. Interpol can not extradite anyway, they can arrest him in a country and then he is handed to that country, thailand then has to try for extradition, and considering he was ousted in an illegal coup it is highly likely that they will see this as politically motivated, especially after amsterdam gets his teeth into them (despite many on here thinking he is clueless, he is a dam_n good lawyer, just because he goes agaisnt what many on here think does not make him clueless, and lets not forget he is privy to more facts than any of us on here)

Agree with most of this, overwhelming indication of political motivation. Mind you I'm wondering how the RobertA effect is seen. For me it's close to an admission of guild, clearly misinformation, obfuscation, suggestions and insinuations are needed to help mr. T. And please notice in the list I'm not talking about lies being needed :-)

if you have money you employ the best lawyer for the job, it is no good employing a lesser one to appear not guilty when that lesser one will not be as good, and before you know it you are stitched up because the lesser lawyer missed something.

1. You take the best lawyer, who is willing to take the case, I think many may not be willing.

2. You take the best lawyer that you perceive to be the best, who is willing to take the case.

3. With equal legal effort, the best lawyer can not erase the truth of the matter.

4. Thailand has more to spend than Thaksin, especially if the terrorist charge helps to freeze T's overseas money.

Reading Amsterdam's resume, I don't see a top notch lawyer, more like a Madoff of the legal world.

Interpol will make decsions based on technical legal reasons not politics. It will be a time in coming as first certain things must go through the Thai legal system and then be passed on. This isnt something that interpol will decide on today based on what newspapaers, a single Thai police officer, a government spokesperson, Amsterdam or Thaksin say and they also wont be influenced by any of that. It will depend upon the papaerwork being done correctly and the evidence and critically the financial evidence.

some people on here seem to think interpol will get him because he said they won't, a bit sad really, some people have been in thailand too long and think the thai way of doing something is the same in the civilised world They forget that in the west rule of law is observed and it is observed based on hard evidence. Interpol can not extradite anyway, they can arrest him in a country and then he is handed to that country, thailand then has to try for extradition, and considering he was ousted in an illegal coup it is highly likely that they will see this as politically motivated, especially after amsterdam gets his teeth into them (despite many on here thinking he is clueless, he is a dam_n good lawyer, just because he goes agaisnt what many on here think does not make him clueless, and lets not forget he is privy to more facts than any of us on here)

As a country larger than France, with all the same institutions, I think that Thailand knows this. It is perhaps only some TV posters who know far more than all of Thailand that think otherwise.

Anyway, the point can be seen the other way around, if in fact Mr. Thaksin was guilty of these acts, then the truth will eventually out thus interpol and other governments will take the correct actions. This is by your own admission that the civilized world will follow the law. We shall wait and see.

Ballpoint's point that you completely ignored concerned your current location and your hijacking of the thread. If these are points you are unable to or unwilling to respond to, better to not quote him i would suggest.

Ballpoint wasn't talking to me anyway and i wasn't talking with you. so what is the problem?

in case you don't know, the harassment in my right of information doesn't mean that the internet not offers certain workarounds.

why don't focus on the provided content instead of starting pointless guesswork about my current location or kind of internet connection? does that change anything of what was written?

don't like the message, shoot the messenger tactic. low style arguments.

A completely irrelevant point, as you would thus know the link was not accessible by us, but you didn't.

Thought you told me the internet was useless anyway?

Are there any countries who even care what the heck the Thai gov't 'wants?'

The US. Long term allies, biggest trading partner, the only quasi democracy in the region. Thais catch some big terrorists and have been good at intercepting illegal arms shipments, including those from North Korea.

If Thaksin actually stands trial, it seems to me that it should be in the Hague.

Let's be reasonable and stop putting Thaksin at the same level of Milosevic or a Nazi, but if the Thaksin would face trial at the Hague, the Thai Govt would have a hard time to prove its case.

When Thaksin or his mates were in power, they did not use the army to disperse the PAD, even when they took over the airports [act which falls into the terrorism].

This Govt/PAD DID use the lethal force and the burning of some buildings is was a "natural" consequence.

Thaksin did not call the PAD terrorists, while this Govt is cracking down everyone with some links to the reds, calling them terrorist

The list goes a long way....and we are talking of facts!

OK, let's be reasonable. Many, including western bodies were already comparing Thaksin to the likes of Milosevic even before the coup for his his human rights violations linked to the death of thousands.

So lets stop putting Thaksin at the level of a few thousand yellows who (illegally) occupied an airport for 8 days, cleaning up after they left to the satisfaction of Airport staff, to protest an illegal government that was thrown out days later by the courts.

Could it be that the protest was a "natural" consequence of Thaksin's human rights abuses?

IF you want double standards, I say, double standards for all!

Just take his money away. Nothing is worst than a rich person losing all his money.

Dont ya think that he is keeping ALL of his assets within TH but not somewhere in Swiss/Japs/HKs accounts? And even more - don't you think that he is not awared/prepared for this step long ago and already moved all his values somewhere...mmm...else, far away from any official's eye?

I really doubt that the officially known part of his money is the all of his money. I bet that it is just a top of the iceberg, where the rest is never-to-be-known by us nor by TH officials. Losing thу part of official assets he is not even cried.

Thus, splitting him from his assets IN FULL - is simply and technically impossible IMO.

Back to the well documented rumor of the two passenger aircraft packed with 114 large suitcases and trunks that Thaksin took with him for his 2 week visit to Europe 2 days before the coup.

you can google "thaksin 2006 coup 58 56 suitcases aircraft",