bradiston

29 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

What? This is about Israel and Hamas not the IRA. I could relay a few personal accounts of the IRA incidents including the last major London attacks where tubes and buses were hit. However unlike you I am not going to derail of disrupt the topic at hand.

The topic at hand is "'blatant disregard for basic humanity' in Gaza warfare". The article makes it clear this refers to Israel and it's recent (one of many) orders for large sections of Gazans to relocate. I don't see anyone's come close to countering that accusation throughout these 12 pages of comments. Just a lot of "stand up for Israel" comments, and the Arabs had it coming, just desserts, serves them right. The Israelis screwed up. They got caught napping, off guard, whichever way you write it. By all accounts, Hamas went way over the top, and also way past "a basic regard for humanity". But now we're here. Trying to eliminate Hamas at this point without injuring or killing hundreds of civilians and non combatants, is not going to work. The Israelis need to rethink this whole plan, which presumably they hatched given what looked like a golden opportunity. But it's all gone wrong. There are no command centres under hospitals. In fact it's possible there are no Hamas fighters left at all. The bombing is indiscriminate by it's very nature. There are no legitimate targets. Just houses and hospitals. It's a lost cause, Benjamin. See you in court.

18 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

I am from the UK and what Hamas did on 7th Oct makes the IRA pale into insignificance

So if you passed the hat round in a Boston bar collecting for Hamas, you don't think people would oblige? You amaze me. As the old cliché goes, one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. Ireland was partitioned. Catholic and Protestant, Jew and Arab. The US, in particular, Bill Clinton, were heavily involved in the Good Friday Agreement. But it seems they can't bring themselves to lift a finger towards solving the Palestine problem. Just tip $4 billion a year into Israel's defense coffers. A bit one sided? I guess not having any Arab ancestry in any recent potus doesn't help their cause.

41 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Perhaps pro Palestianian protesters wrapped in Hamas flags hard a part to play in that

In the UK we lived through over 20 years of proper terrorist violence. By the heavily US backed IRA. They bombed buses, trains, parks. What does Hamas do? Lobs a few rockets over occasionally. When they do launch a totally uncharacteristic style of attack, the whole world goes mad, and leaders from the west queue up to hand pat and shake.

Now of course they're all grinning sheepishly as the death toll rises. Blinken has announced sanctions against Israeli settlers using violence against Palestinian land owners trying to force them off their land. A complete visa ban.

Is the wheel turning? I hope so.

1 minute ago, Yellowtail said:

Has anyone banned it? 

Yes. Musk has. A member of Congress was censured for using it. And also in the UK parliament. Banned in Bavaria. Everywhere it's being refashioned as hate speech implying the destruction of Israel. But Saar, Netanyahu and Ariel all use(d) it with impunity. The dice are loaded. There's only one way to vote. It's that kind of game now.

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

All them explanations on the background etc. appearing in the link are immaterial. The popular usage of the phrase now implies something pretty clear.

 

It is used by both Arabs and Jews. It's a complete nonsense to ban it. Half a dozen of one, 6 of the other.

7 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Another bit of nonsense which was already done to death on previous topics. Spin it as you may - the popular application and usage are nothing like the kumbaya version. Give it a rest.

Objection! I have no idea what you're talking about. The guy quoting it suggests it implies killing all Jews. My link gives a bit of background and context. I don't intend to give it a rest, but I'm happy to leave this thread. It's going nowhere. The Israelis are still committing atrocities in Gaza as we speak. The Final Solution is well under way.

7 hours ago, Purdey said:

Most Palestinians don't want a two state solution, they want to kill all Jews "from the river to the sea". 

When someone wants your utter annihilation, there aren't many choices. 

Outrageously warped.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_the_river_to_the_sea

2 hours ago, bradiston said:

As providing cause for retaliation. Don't dodge the issue. You know what I'm talking about. Israeli settlers taking over Palestinian held land. Why do you think Hamas attacked Israel? Certainly one of the reasons. Alongside many others. People no longer seem able to tell right from wrong. Shelling hospitals? Cutting off water and power supplies? 6000 children killed. Is this justifiable?

So the tally is, in answer to "Is the killing of 15,000 civilians and 6,000 children justifiable?" 1 confused, 1 thanks, 2 highly amusing. A very bizarre forum indeed!

41 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

 

We might possibly have some agreement regarding the UN, insomuch as I was only using the Ali Bahreini appointment to highlight the impotency and meaninglessness of that corrupt organisation.

 

The UN was originally conceived as a well intended organisation, but it has morphed into a pointless relic. The UN Security Council comprises of 15 countries,10 of which are rotating members, with 5 permanent members. Any of the five permanent members, the USA, Russia, France, China, and the UK, can veto any resolution put forward even if the other 14 members support it.

 

In the last couple of years, Russia has vetoed 4 resolutions regarding Ukraine, and China vetos any resolution regarding their illegal expansionism in the South China sea.

 

As you say, the UN are unable to bring any real pressure to bear on Israel (or on Hamas, although they aren’t even attempting that)  … they remain a corrupt, biased, paradox of their founding charter.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_veto_power#:~:text=As of May 2022%2C Russia,cast in the Security Council.

Mostly the US vetoing any condemnation of Israel. And here's the result.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_Nations_resolutions_concerning_Israel

There are any amount of analyses of the USA's insane love affair with Israel. See Hitchens and Chomsky. They're very revealing. And you see it all the time here, on this forum, in the press. Israel, can do no wrong. Everybody else, can do no right. It's utterly childish, bigoted, stupid, ignorant. The whole Arab world is just a collection of terrorists trying to destroy the world... Etc etc etc

19 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Getting one's knickers in a knot over a 2 day social forum? That was sure scraping the barrel since that aspect wasn't mentioned. One could have been forgiven for thinking he had some influence over policy decisions.

I don't think he bothered to read that far. Just give him the "I can't believe you didn't know" gaslighting treatment he's so fond of. People use it repeatedly as a means of calling into question other people's intelligence. A stock tactic on any forum.

17 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

So, you now know about the appointment of Ali Bahreini, something which you astonishingly didn’t know about an hour ago; and now you expect me to explain to you the irony of appointing the Ambassador of Iran to chair a UNHRC social forum …..

Now you're being a pita. You failed to mention he was elected in the absence of any other candidate, and that it was for a 2 day forum. I know Iran's record on women's rights. You're not talking to 3 year olds. But I don't see the relevance of your waving this flag about it. Yes, the irony is stark. So is this part of your critique of the UN , or what?

My point was the UN is unable to bring any pressure to bear on Israel to halt it's indiscriminate bombing of civilians. Naturally, you can argue about whether it's indiscriminate or just unfortunate. Either way, 1000s of innocent people are being herded into a ghetto and slaughtered. Warsaw Mk II. The Israelis should recall that. But Israel is in the hands of fanatics, just like Iran.

Cue the confused and sad emojis. Are people hiring these obnoxious lurkers?

19 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

 

Did I say the UN is one man ? you were obviously doubting that Ali Bahreini had been appointed to chair the UNHRC, and I have provided a link that is not behind a paywall. Astonishing that you didn’t already know this. Obviously another one on here with no interest in the issues of the ME.

Yes, I found the Reuters article, and read it, which you apparently haven't. He was elected in the absence of any other candidates. And for a 2 day forum. So what's your point?

36 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

Are you saying that you actually did not know that Ali Bahreini, Ambassador of Iran had been appointed to chair the 2023, UN Human Rights Council (UNHRC) Social forum. It is well publicised common knowledge. I can find a link if you really can't confirm it yourself. Amazed however, that you didn’t know.

It was a 2 day meeting. No other candidate was put forward. Then all the western do nothings started whingeing.

https://www.reuters.com/world/irans-appointment-chair-un-rights-meeting-draws-condemnation-2023-11-02/

1 minute ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

This would be the same UN that recently appointed Ali Bahreini, Ambassador of the Islamic Republic of Iran and Permanent Representative to the United Nations, to chair the 2023 United Nations Human Rights Council (UNHRC) Social Forum.

 

The same UN whose UN Women, made no condemnation whatsoever of the multiple rapes, mutilations and slaughtering of Israeli women by Palestinians on 7th October, until very recently when they were forced to do so under International pressure.

Links please

13 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

 

Now tell us all that you’re not antisemitic; go on, it will make you feel better, and a warm feeling of impartiality will wash over you; but it won’t fool anyone else.

 

 

Conflating antisemitism with criticism of Israel. Incredible.

1 hour ago, Morch said:

 

Civilian death and destruction are part of almost any war in carried out in urban settings. They are not universally labeled 'atrocities'. Same goes for Israel's actions.

 

A 'few' IDF soldiers? You knowledge seems to be lacking, there IDF is in strength at the Gaza Strip, and been that way for weeks.

 

You count of 'atrocities' seems to include only one side to this conflict.

They are by the UN. Same in Ukraine. The double standards are mind boggling.

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

No Israeli settlers in the Gaza Strip.

 

Who mentioned the Gaza strip? It's hardly the chosen spot for Israeli settlers, is it?

5 hours ago, bignok said:

Id rather be German.

Be careful what you wish for!

37 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Maybe in your biased, warped version of things. Spin it as you may, Hamas did not 'snap', this was carefully planned quite a while ago. All this 'back yard' nonsense doesn't amount to anything much, just an oversimplification of things when one can't deal with complicated issues.

 

Current events are a direct result of the Hamas 7/10 attack. Attempts to spin, minimize and justify it are vile.

Is that all you've got to say?

1 hour ago, animalmagic said:

Perhaps true to an extent, but I don't think even a yank would break into their house, kill men, women and children with indiscriminate gunfire, burnings and beheadings.  Nor would they use rape as a form of warfare or kidnap old women and young children that live there.

I was referring to the Israeli settlers, not Hamas.