OlRedEyes

The first time I came to Thailand, I was amazed at what a mess it was. I'm sure most who first land on these shores observed the same thing. It is just that with time, one gets sorta used to it, so it becomes sort of semi-normal.

You can go book yourself into a 5 star establishment, but quality? C'mon, you should get out more.

The problem i see is that during decades of economic growth, most of the money has been pocketed by the few, and the infrastructure that was built with what was left is of such poor quality that it falls apart pretty rapidly. So come a prolonged, deep downturn, one can just imagine what this place will look like in a few years time.....

You can basically ignore the No's I'd guess. I'm sure there are many, like me, who don't know anybody cancelling, but don't know anyone coming either. I null voted, but I'd imagine many would just vote NO. Doesn't mean No, they're coming.

BANGKOK POST Democrat-led coalition government will stick with Thaksin-style populist polices in tackling the country's economic slump, which it believes could be worse than the 1997 financial crisis.

Now they think they are in trouble, I will agree with them big trouble. Now that it has been advertised in the news, lets see the Real Estate Companies run for cover. Hang on to your money.

I hope this does not happen to thailand, but I think they are a very adaptable people and the families help each other more than in western culture.

They know what it is like to do with out the luxuries. As to the westerners word they could weather the storm but there sense of worth is put on there possetions and are not as resilient as thai people.

So for them having 2 cars and homes bigger than they need and every electronic toy they could have bought maybe cut back and think before they spend.

.

Yup, us western people are very non-resilient. We are lost without our luxuries. God helped us through wars, civil wars, revolutions, recession, plague, the great depression and the great beer disaster, but now He's left us, we are so alone and afraid

Hi mirko, careful because some thaivisa member have a lot of time to spend an nothing else to do then write stupid messages/trolling, complain about everything, also your non perfect english grammar and they think to be very witty. But don't worry about it, you'll find also somebody really friendly and helpful. So, welcome from one of the very few italian writing on Thaivisa!

I'm not Italian, but I'm friendly and helpful

Like ThaiPauly, I've had 3 businesses here in Thailand:

1 - Business No 1 with Thai GF = coffee-shop right by The Emporium shopping center. All looking good until I go to visit the shop 1 day and it's completely cleared out! Everything gone! <deleted>!! I return back to our condo and everything has gone from there also!!! AAAAhhhhhhh.

2 - Business no 2 with new Thai GF = tourist bar on Sukhumvit Road in BKK. Could be ok but staffed with lazy girls and managed by lazy GF. Landlord decides to demolish the building around us and bar has to close

3 - Business No 3 with Thai wife (was the new Thai GF) = busy hotel at Phuket Airport. All looks good, all going great! Then wife goes mental and has to be locked up in the psycho hospital. Upon her release she gets pregnant by a Thai gay-guy and then attacks me with a knife (that's the short story...). I broker a quick divorce and give her the hotel.

4 - Business No 4 (in progress) = me and me alone!!!! (Just like my previous successful businesses in the UK).

So, I'm sure you can have a successful business here in LoS. But maybe it's better not to involve a Thai GF/wife :)

... or is it just me??

Simon

You're a slow learner?

Wealth is never destroyed just redistributed.

And there I wuz measuring my wealth by the number of chicks I got. I thought wealth grows old

Meun gun

Same Same see it just got redistributed to numerous chicks

Ne'er a truer word spoken. The way the world works.

Once this mess is over, I wonder just how much "real wealth" is in the world and what it will be measured in?

Wealth is never destroyed just redistributed.

And there I wuz measuring my wealth by the number of chicks I got. I thought wealth grows old

Yikes, this never stops does it. Round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and and round and round and round and round round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and and round and round and round and round round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round

This post is at least as useful as any other political post in the last few months. Don't dare delete it!!

She's at least pretty.

I'd be very cautious in considering any statistics from Thai sources, official or not, as hard evidence.

See, I can be diplomatic

Personally I would tell them to mind their own business.

...in a very undiplomatic way indeed.

Maybe a Madoff rescue package is in order?

Seems he was just joining in the general ambiance set by the banks.....

The big question in that scenario is what comes after? It is highly unlikely to be a new democratic government. I do get the impression that this is the last chance parliament is allowed at getting it "right" with "right" defined as what the real power brokers want. In that scenario the new government may last longer than we think but to avoid what may come next as much as anything else.

Thailand has never had a democracy. There has never been any intention to allow it a democracy, only the superficial trappings to keep the masses quiet, and gain face in the world IMHO.

Thaksin stirred all these quiet, harmonious waters up. The question now is how much has really been awakened here. Has it started a groundswell beyond the Thaksin bogeyman, or not. If it has, turmoil lies ahead, irrelevant of Thaksin. We cannot really know, as a free press and free speech is not allowed here. The generally held 'truths' may be way off. This could be a pressurized bottle on the point of shattering, or it could simply die down to placid waters again, for a while.

-Abhisit appears to be a docile puppet. He has been waiting in the wings for years to be handed power. Will he have the strength to hold on to it? Power is NEVER given, it is taken. Deduction: he has no power, therefore he is irrelevant. Others will run the show. Who are they, and what are their policies?

-The coalition seem to be a truly weird one. How long it will hold together should be interesting to watch. Don't think there are many who believe it can survive.

Thai business may show great confidence in him, but from what i see in the international media that is not shared by the rest of the world. We all know the Thai tendency to paint everything as rosy in a desperate attempt to make bad things go away. Time will tell, but I don't share the optimism. I think international business is a little more realistic, the Thai political and economic scene doesn't look very stable for years to come.

Very good points

Regarding the bold "power" sentence......... I'd say that power can also be "achieved" and then the achiever has some prospect of holding on to it on the basis of "deserving" it. But, in this case, I think few can really argue with the point that Abhisit/Dems have been handed power - IMO that's just the political reality of what's going on here. To state the obvious - what was given so easily by the power-brokers can just as easily be taken away by them.

My thinking is more that whoever allows 'power' to be 'achieved', or hands someone 'power', actually holds the power. The 'power' given is simply an act of temporary delegation. No real power is given. The real power holds the reins and calls the shots. He will be directed to do their bidding, or the 'power' will simply be taken back.

Which is, when all is said and done, how Thai 'democracy' has operated all along, and which is the main cause of the past few years' turmoil, as Thaksin tried to take real power. His corruption et al was never a problem. He wanted power, and that was a big no-no.

Thai business may show great confidence in him, but from what i see in the international media that is not shared by the rest of the world.

Not a wonder...

Meet Sam Moon, Mr Thaksin's PR man and long-time Economist and BusinessWeek partner:

Sam Moon has lived in and worked across Asia for the past 23 years working for The Economist, Dow Jones and his own company in partnership with BusinessWeek.

Based mainly in Hong Kong, Sam spearheaded the effort of two global media companies, namely The Economist Group and Dow Jones, in transforming their respective conference activities into an actual growth-oriented and profitable business units. While in The Economist Group, Sam was also made responsible for The Economist Group’s conference business for the United States and Latin America, with the aim of facilitating a similar business turnaround for The Economist brand.

Sam holds a 'Bachelor of Arts' degree from the University of Tennessee, United States.

www.buildingbetterfuture.org

I get your point, but whatever the source of the image, the fact is the image is there. Personally I don't think the image of Abhisit has been created by unfriendly PR. He hasn't really been a real player for long has he. He does come across as a bit of a lamb, which is fine in a stable environment, but not if there are so many wolves out hunting.

I am no high-flying international businessman, schooled and experienced in international investment, but even I ask myself these questions about the Thai political and economic scene, and it's leaders. I'd imagine anyone with millions/billions to invest would take an even more careful look at where he/she wants to invest.

BTW, my image of Abhisit is/was not created by itnl. media. I've liked the guy for a long time, but I have never thought of him as a strong man.

Snippets from a business perspective:

-Business leaders have overwhelmingly welcomed the selection of Abhisit Vejjajiva of the Democrat party as the country's next prime minister, saying they hope to see major changes in politics to help the country move forward.

-Santi Vilassakdanont, the chairman of the Federation of Thai Industries (FTI), said he believed public confidence would vastly improve with the change in the main governing party.

-"We are not sceptical about the qualifications of candidates from the Democrat Party," said Pramon Suthivong, chairman of the Thai Chamber of Commerce. "What we are concerned about is the candidates from the coalition.

-"What the private sector wants to see is teamwork among economic ministers," he said. "We are feeling better now that we've heard that Mr Abhisit will also lead the economic team of the new government."

www.bangkokpost.com/161208_Business/16Dec2008_biz30.php

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-Abhisit will have a chance to shine at the Asean Summit, which has been rescheduled for February.

-Restoring confidence among the international community is equally important. Foreigners and foreign governments do not understand the complex political situation in Thailand.

-Abhisit has nothing before him except to serve the Thai public. This call is a noble one, and he has been raised to do this.

-Unlike most politicians, he does not have business connections or vested interests he needs to protect.

-It is time to make history.

www.nationmultimedia.com/2008/12/16/business/business_30091082.php

-Abhisit appears to be a docile puppet. He has been waiting in the wings for years to be handed power. Will he have the strength to hold on to it? Power is NEVER given, it is taken. Deduction: he has no power, therefore he is irrelevant. Others will run the show. Who are they, and what are their policies?

-The coalition seem to be a truly weird one. How long it will hold together should be interesting to watch. Don't think there are many who believe it can survive.

Thai business may show great confidence in him, but from what i see in the international media that is not shared by the rest of the world. We all know the Thai tendency to paint everything as rosy in a desperate attempt to make bad things go away. Time will tell, but I don't share the optimism. I think international business is a little more realistic, the Thai political and economic scene doesn't look very stable for years to come.

But its not the foreign media's opinion who is important, but the opinion of the Thai public.

The foreign media plays a very large part in how potential foreign investors and tourists see Thailand. Which plays a very large part in Thailand's economic performance. Which plays a very large part in Thai opinion of their govt.'s performance.

As much as the Thai, and their unflinching admirers, like to stick their heads in the sand with misplaced pride (which is a weird combination) in Thailand's perceived independence from world opinion, the game has long ago changed, permanently, and Thailand is not the island they wish to believe anymore.

The evil foreigners, and their stupid opinions, have and will continue to have great influence on every single Thai's life now and into the future. Live with it.

The press outside the US was always against Bush, but he won 2 elections. And it didn' stop any foreign investors even he made a war where all the world was against. Also this did not stop and foreign investement.

And your point is? The Thai and US economies are in the same league?

How many Thai men / farang women marriages would be affected if the courts simply re-worded the relavent acts to be equal - but at the less farang freindly terms.

That is indeed a good point. A Thai court could only say that the rules must be equal for men and women. Not that the rules for Thai men would have to be applied for Thai women married to a foreigner too.

The Thai human rights commission is an option and is free. They will come with a stetement and present it to parlement. Then it would be up to parlement to do something.

But I'm interested in why the attempt George mentioned failed.

I cannot be arsed to get involved, call me whatever you want, but I never litigate. I can however see that it is an important issue to many, and I personally think that it could be addressed, albeit with a lot of effort and money put in.

Thailand, as far as I know, is a signatory to the UN human rights agreement. Now I know that the South African constitution forbids the splitting of families, therefore the spouse of a South African national must be given SA citizenship as long as he/she has no criminal record. I don't know if this flows from the UN charter or not, but I'd imagine the UN charter should contain something re the splitting of families.

What I am saying is that it may be better to take that route? Seems to me that to fight for years and then coming up with a result that is equal for male/female, but still effectively leaves them running around for visas for the rest of their lives (even if slightly easier) is not worth the effort.

So does anyone have any idea if Abhisit's government will meet the PAD criteria and if they dont what the PAD will do or are we just going to turn this thread into another degenerate mutant where without reading the thread title it is impossible to know the subject by just reading the insults, flames, rants and sanctimonious outrage?

The PAD has served it's purpose. They will be leashed or put to sleep, depending upon whether their masters think there may be a need for it again in the near future.

Sounds about right to me for now. Not sure what the red guys will do but I doubt they can be as effective as the PAD and I think ordinary people would like to see an end ot protests.

I'd guess the redshirts will be dealt with very firmly. How that will play out I'd hesitate to guess. Depends how docile they are after centuries of brainwashing.

So does anyone have any idea if Abhisit's government will meet the PAD criteria and if they dont what the PAD will do or are we just going to turn this thread into another degenerate mutant where without reading the thread title it is impossible to know the subject by just reading the insults, flames, rants and sanctimonious outrage?

The PAD has served it's purpose. They will be leashed or put to sleep, depending upon whether their masters think there may be a need for it again in the near future.

Leashed, I'd say, probably till after the b(u)y-elections that should be held in Jan.(?) I think?

But its not the foreign media's opinion who is important, but the opinion of the Thai public.

The foreign media plays a very large part in how potential foreign investors and tourists see Thailand. Which plays a very large part in Thailand's economic performance. Which plays a very large part in Thai opinion of their govt.'s performance.

As much as the Thai, and their unflinching admirers, like to stick their heads in the sand with misplaced pride (which is a weird combination) in Thailand's perceived independence from world opinion, the game has long ago changed, permanently, and Thailand is not the island they wish to believe anymore.

The evil foreigners, and their stupid opinions, have and will continue to have great influence on every single Thai's life now and into the future. Live with it.

Sorry if this is unrelated to this thread but as this is the Koh Samiu forum, ....

I will be staying at a reasonably expensive (5500 baht/night after discount) hotel on a beach in the North of Samui that has wireless internet access.

As I have an active drilling oil and gas exploration well to follow during this period, how reliable will the connection be, will it be up and running 24 hours a day?

I'm sure it will be.

Good to see the Samui forum is still living down to it's reputation.

Anyways guys, no fear, things are still cool and rosy here in cloud cuckoo land

I hope he has the strength to be a leader and not just someones puppet. He comes across as an intelligent, thinking man. How honest he is I have no idea, time will tell. My main concern is that I think he is a rather passive person, and may not have the backbone required from a leader, especially in such a volatile time, politically and economically. I wish him well. Can't see any better choice available.

Honestly guys, go find your balls. You are 50% of the union and as such, are entitled to have your views (not panderings) heard with equal voice as the Thais. Respect where respect is due but you also need to be shown respect and you will never get any if you back off and offer your rear for their amusement.

How true.

It has long been recommended to leave ones brains at the airport, seems most leave their balls there as well.

Ok i have just read the above and starting at number 8 (i just picked a number from 1 to 13 and high lighted it) it would be interesting to hear from people who agree or dissagree about this statement, or any other 1 - 13 statements come to that

Unfortunately, in this democracy , the primary statements may not be discussed.