Bandersnatch

I came back to my BYD Seal yesterday to see 3 young Thai guys studying the back of my car. Turns out they were looking for the exhaust pipe, the pickup truck that they had arrived in had a particularly large after market one. I explained that it was electric. “But it has an engine as well?” “er no, just electric” ”what happens when the electricity is empty” ”we fill it up at home from solar or on a trip many pump stations have electric chargers” They didn’t look convinced. I was surprised that they had never heard of a BEV.

As I said above, the bigger your bill the bigger the savings My Main Components (at todays prices) - doesn’t include installation 20,000 Watts of PV @ ฿5/W = ฿100,000 36kWh Batteries @ ฿5k/kWh = ฿180,000 20kW of Inversion @ ฿5k/kW = ฿100,000 Total = ฿380,000 Savings: PEA saving ฿4,000/month Fuel saving for 2 drivers and 2 vehicles and 1 motorbike ฿4,000/month (based on Previous usage for ICE) = ฿96,000/Year saving Payback = 4 Years Based on what I paid a few years back my actual payback is closer to 6 years.

Tier one solar panels are already at ฿6.5/Watt Inverters are already as low as ฿4K per kW 5kW of Solar = ฿32,000 5kW Inverter = ฿20,000 Total cost for main components= ฿52,000 You will need various comments like brackets and rails to fit the panels, Cables and breakers etc. Then you will need someone to fit the system. The prices for all of these will vary. Most people just get a quote for supply and fit which will be more expensive. Solar will ramp up during the day here is a graph for one of my 5kW inverters

Payback is a popular financial analysis tool because it’s simple to understand, but it’s not very sophisticated. For example a single 500W panel and matching inverter will never produce more power than you can use so no curtailment (wasted power) such a system could produce a payback of less than a year but the savings would be very small. The bigger the system, the bigger the savings and the longer the payback. You said you wanted to include opportunity cost and cost of capital, these are different tools so have to be applied separately. A 10 year payback is an investment that is producing a 10% return on investment. The opportunity cost is cost of the lost opportunity. So if Daft Coin made 20% last year, not investing in it this year potentially lost you 20%. I have an off-grid system (no meter) Due to the diminishing returns with solar, the closer you get to 100% covering your electric bill the bigger your system needs to be. Batteries are expensive, but adding a small (say 5kWh) battery means that you will get more value from your system as the battery acts as a buffer for times when solar production drops. The bigger your current electric bill is, the bigger the potential savings are. I have 2 EVs and an electric motorbike and my solar system powers them and my house without a meter. I do use my EV for extra backup power. My payback is 6 years.

OK we won't

That is not the case. EV subsidies tend to be introduced to pump prime EV demand then they are phased out. There are no direct subsidies in mature EV markets like Norway and the UK. Thailand has a plan for both tax and non-tax incentives from 2022 until 2025. Don’t forget the Diesel subsidies in Thailand far exceed EV subsidies “the Oil Fuel fund is in the red about 100 billion baht from subsidising the diesel price” https://www.nationthailand.com/thailand/policies/40036725

So you’re happy to continue to drive your slow, noisy, dirty fossil wagon for another 10 years because you think EVs will be better then. Of course they will be better, but I will be on my 4th EV by then having had the pleasure of driving fast, quiet, clean cars all that time.

Then you clearly don’t know too much about Chinese EV manufacturers many of which have premium brands. Denza, BYD’s JV with Mercedes-Benz Is one and here is another

BYD is the top seller of EVs in Thailand and the batteries are LiFePO4 as are the std range Teslas and many other EV manufactures are also making the transition. You are thinking of Cobalt mining in the DRC. You are obviously unaware that petrol and diesel have to be refined with cobalt catalysts that reduce sulphur and nitrous oxide emissions. https://www.cobaltinstitute.org As for Lithium the top source in the world is Australia with very little environmental damage. Most EV charging in Thailand is either from solar or using half-price overnight TOU electricity. “the Oil Fuel fund in the red about 100 billion baht from subsidising the diesel price” https://www.nationthailand.com/thailand/policies/40036725 “Perception” exactly. My first Chinese EV is over 3 years old now and has been faultless, I wouldn’t have bought another one if it had been otherwise. A number of forum members have bought the BYD Seal which was my second EV and have compared it favorable with BMWs, MBs and Porsches that they have owned. The companies that run them run them at a profit. Buy an MG or BYD EV and every dealership has chargers in every province. As an EV owner I only need to use one on a journey over 600km. You can’t buy a H2 car in Thailand and if you could there are no public filling stations. “U.S. Hydrogen Car Sales Are Collapsing. They were already a tiny fraction of the market. Then, last quarter, sales dropped 91%.” https://insideevs.com/news/725999/us-hydrogen-car-sales-2024q2/ Do some research. Test drive my car a BYD Seal AWD Performance and then come back and you will find that you are treated with a bit more respect. https://www.reverautomotive.com/en/locator/dealer-station In the meantime you can watch one of my videos - don’t worry the channel isn’t monetized

MG brought a coupe version of the MG Cyberster to test at Goodwood this week the MG Cyber GTS The only video I could find of it is in Spanish!

A new version of the MG HS/ HS PHEV (Honda CRV sized car) has been announced in RHD for the UK, so we should be getting it here as well. The PHEV gets a bigger battery, more performance and all models get a new interior and some tweaks to the exterior

“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” ― Daniel Patrick Moynihan Your opinions are not based on direct experience so are worth less than those of us with that direct experience. You have demonstrated that you don’t even process basic facts about ICE cars let alone EVs but you have demonstrated a…

ZEEKR X with 2 models. Officially launched in Thailand. ZEEKR X Standard : 1,199,000 บาท ZEEKR X Flagship : 1,349,000 บาท

Do have a supporting reference for that figure of 20 years or did you just make it up? "What’s the Average Life of a Car? In the past, the average lifespan of a car was significantly lower than it is today. Now, you can expect a standard car to last around 12 years or about 200,000 miles. More advanced vehicles like electric cars can go even longer, up to 300,000 miles." https://cascadecollision.com/what-is-the-average-life-of-a-car

I agree with you, just looking for an excuse to post the truck sales figures

฿2.6 per kWh doesn’t sound expensive to me but I still prefer my free solar power after I have powered my house

Won’t argue with you on that one

I have solar, 2 EVs and an electric motorbike. Unlike you I don’t have an electric bill as I don’t have a meter Unlike you I don’t have fuel bills for my vehicles as I charge them from solar unless the journey is over 600km You carry on paying your bills like a good little sheeple

The voice of experience? Teslas don’t need to be serviced and so don’t have a servicing requirement. My BYD has servicing requirement but it’s free for 8 years! I watched the last service and it consisted of checking the torque setting on some of the bolts. My 2 EVs run a full system check every time you switch them on and report on any problems. So far the only problem being reported is low tire pressure, a problem I was able to fix myself without

While we’re discussing registration figures looks like Thais are putting off buying a pickup until they can buy an electric one 😎

I agree. I haven’t added any window film as I felt it wasn’t necessary. Having the cooled seats is a real bonus.

Total car registrations in the 100% electric vehicle group (BEV: Battery Electric Vehicle) in June 2024 total 5,773 cars (accounting for 13.1% of the total car registrations in Thailand, R.Y.1 total 43,147 cars) Top 15 highest registrations in June 2024 BYD Atto3 819 cars BYD Dolphin 754 units ChangAn Deepal S07 703 units Aion Y Plus 587 units Tesla Model 3 457 units NETA V 437 cars MG 4 Electric 425 units BYD Seal 249 cars ORA Good Cat 238 units Volvo EX30 120 cars Volvo EC40 111 cars MG EP 105 cars GWM ORA 07 103 cars 97 Tesla Model Ys Aion ES 90 units

One factor is that electricity is cheap in Thailand - too cheap in my opinion. EGAT has ฿1.3B of debt due to subsiding electricity prices for all. I feel that subsidies should only be directed to the poorest. Of course EGAT’s debt is nothing compared to the Oil Fuel fund which in the red about 100 billion baht from subsidising the diesel price. Solar prices are falling. 6 years ago this panel was ฿20/W you can now pay ฿6/W Inverter and batteries are also getting cheaper This is the first quote I got for a Li battery ฿26,785/kWh! If you can charge your EV at home during the day, then solar definitely makes sense.

Yes you are correct. The daily demand is known as the duck curve. I haven’t found figures for Thailand but it probably looks similar to the UK. The idea is to try and flatten the curve and reduce the need for the most expensive and polluting peaker plants coming online. Unfortunately in Thailand the feed-in rate is a flat ฿2.2/kWh throughout the day so there is no incentive for arbitrage.

They always wheel out Nissan Leafs with CHAdeMO connectors when they talk about V2G, unfortunately Nissan has now moved to CCS a standard which has not been approved for V2G. I currently use V2L from my EV to power my house at night sometimes. My inverters are Hybrid Off-Grid meaning that they can import from the Grid (if I had a meter) but cannot export. You need an on-grid inverter which synchronizes to the Grid to be able to export. Thailand has excess energy at night that is why it offers half price TOU rates In the UK companies like octopus energy offer a number of rates at different times of the day which is great for people with EVs to charge their cars and for people with solar and batteries to sell back at peak demand I would need a simple export on-grid inverter to sell power back from my EV to the Grid, but PEA prevents me doing that: they only allow a maximum of 5kW of PV on single phase and your inverter needs to be on their approved list.